Doubts and Discussions from the Ramayan II - Page 75

Thanks a lot Khalrika for the detailed information. There is one other information I would like to know.

What does the Gita press translation say about the birth of the four princes Ram, Bharat, Lakshman and Shathrugan? Were they really born on the same day as all the shows and movies protray?

Whenever you get time, can you please refer and post here?

Originally posted by: Vibhishna

I couldn't agree with that fact, that's why I thought Sita was created. Just because Sita could survive in a box or under the Earth did not imply she was not born the normal way.

Taking an example from an era ahead, Jarasandh was born as two half babies and reunited by a demoness Jara. That didn't mean he wasn't born of normal birth. If a baby could survive, when he was born in half and then become a complete human being when reunited, but still be of normal birth why should Sita alone be a non - uterine birth?

Coming back to the same time lines, Hanuman could survive his journey to the Sun and the Sun's brilliance and still be normally born child, why couldn't Sita be a child born the normal way and survive in a box or underground?

Unless Janak was sure she was not born the normal way, he wouldn't say so. There are so many descriptions that he was a Brahma gnyani himself.



By the way, your signatures and avi are too good.

Originally posted by: Vibhishna

Thanks a lot Khalrika for the detailed information. There is one other information I would like to know.

What does the Gita press translation say about the birth of the four princes Ram, Bharat, Lakshman and Shathrugan? Were they really born on the same day as all the shows and movies protray?

Whenever you get time, can you please refer and post here?

Originally posted by: _LalithaJanaki_

Hmm, that makes sense, but from what I understood, it was apparent by how old and rusty the box was that it had been under the Earth for a long time, so that's why I came to this theory.

But in Valmiki Ramayan, Ramji is portrayed as human being rather than God, so would Sitaji be portrayed as a divine child while Ramji was portrayed as human?

Does VR actually say anywhere whether Sita appeared from the ground or whether Janak found her while ploughing the ground? This is an interesting debate....

Thanks! I love the avis too, some of the best scenes in RS's Ramayan and Shri Krishna of our mytho mommies.😳 Glad you like the sigs.😊

So how have you been?

That's a good question. Judging from her birth and her ability to lift the Shivdhanush, she is portrayed to be divine just like Ram who, in spite of being portrayed as a human, was able to free Ahalya from the curse and lift the Shivdhanush himself when so many other failed.

It does make a good topic for debate - whether Sita appeared from the ground or whether she was found as the media shows.

I do have doubts in Valmiki Ramayan but these doubts are few compared to the number of doubts I get when I read the other versions. The main problem is that I do not know Hindi or Sanskrit to read and find out myself and hence I have to rely on the translations. As far as I know, I don't think any mention of a box exists in VR when Sita makes her entrance in the epic.


I've been too busy to come online, other than that I'm doing well. How have you been? When I come to this Forum, it feels like I come back home after a long journey and I savour the experience each time 😊

Originally posted by: _LalithaJanaki_

No, all 4 brothers were born on a different day under a different Nakshatra.

Ramji was born in Punarvasu Nakshatra, under Karkataka Lagna.

Bharat in Pushyami Nakshatra, under Meena Lagna.

Lakshman/Shatrugna in Aaslesha Nakshatra, Karkataka Lagna (Lakshman was the first to come out, thereby the oldest of the twins).

I don't have the citation from Gita Press, but I'm pretty sure this is what is written.

I don't know much about astrology, so I don't know whether different Nakshatras mean a difference of days or even months, but I don't think the 4 brothers were born on the same day, most likely they had days or even months age gap. Most likely the serials show them born on the same day because it would be too long to show each of them born a different day and the audience would lose interest.

Thanks Lalitha Janaki.


I have read that the four brothers were born under different Nakshatras and lagnas and that's why I wondered if they were born on the same day as portrayed by the serials and movies.

I really wish they had shown it separately. It would have been so much fun to see Kaushalya Mata tending to the other two wives of King Dasarath with a baby Ram in her hands and the queens Sumitra and Kaikeyi playing with Ram even before their own sons were born. Things could be made interesting if desired but it would mean a lot of work and I am not complaing for the shorter versions they show. Only problem with this is that most of the people rely on the serials and movies to learn our scriptures and believe that all four were born on the same day.


My knowledge of Astrology is limited but as far as I know, a day can have the influence of two Nakshatras and not more than that. Also I read in somewhere that Bharat may be the youngest of the four as he was born 11 months after Ram. There was also the fact that in the movies and the serials Lakshman, Shathrugan and Bharat refer to Ram only as elder brother in spite of the fact they were born on the same day which makes it too ideal. In the books I read, sometimes they address the eldest prince as "O Rama!" (not always, just sometimes)

I really don't know if the gap between their births was months, weeks or days but I do know they were not years apart.

Originally posted by: Khalrika

1) According to Valmiki, Sita was found on the earth. She just appears on the ground as Janak is ploughing the land just like they showed in the recent Ramayan. I would, personally, go with the Valmiki version as he is the original.

I too thought so. I tend to follow Valmiki Ramayan for the same reason.

Originally posted by: Khalrika

2) Ramji is born on Navami, 9th lunar day, on Punarvasu nakshatra. Bharat was born next. Bharat was born when the constellation Pushya is in the ascendant. Lakshman and Shatrughan are born last when constellation Aslesha is in the ascendant. So they were not born on the same day.

Thanks a lot. Any idea what was the gap between their births?

Originally posted by: Khalrika

3) Vibs and Lalitha, Valmiki is very clear, right from Balkand, that Ramji is an incarnation of Vishnu. He says that Rama is 1/2 of Lord Vishnu, Bharat is1/4 of Lord Vishnu, Lakshman and Shatrughan are 1/6th each of Lord Vishnu. Altogether (all 4 of them) make up the whole. Throughout the Ramayan, Valmiki does stress that Ramji is Narayana himself though he portrays him as a human avatar. The only difference being, Valmiki does not drip devotion like Tulsidas in Ram Charit Manas. However, he stresses throughout that Ramji is Narayana himself.

/Bharat is one - fourth but I read that Lakshman and Shathrugan were halves of the remaining one fourth or one - eighth each of Lord Vishnu.

Originally posted by: Khalrika

4) As far as Ahalya is concerned, in Valmiki, she does not turn into a stone. According to Valmiki, Ahalya knows that it is Indra and willingly has a relationship with him. Gautama catches Indra leaving his cottage when he returns from the river and curses both of them. The curse for Ahalya is (Gita Press Canto 48), "You will stay here for many thousands of years without food or drink, living on air alone, and remain lying on ashes full of remorse. You will dwell in the hermitage unperceived by all created beings." He then goes on to say when Rama visits the hermitage, she (Ahalya) will be absolved of all sin.

When Rama enters Ahalya's hermitage and his eyes fall on her she becomes visible to all once again. Rama and Lakshman fall at her feet and get her blessings. She gives them water to wash their feet "and other hospitality (Gita Press Canto 49)." Ramji accepts it. When Ramji accepts her she becomes purified.

This is something I should have noticed but never realised that Ahalya did not turn into stone as depicted in the serials. Now that you mention it, I remember I've read this before.

Originally posted by: Khalrika

I hope this helps!

It does help a lot. Thank you so much.

🤗🤗🤗

Originally posted by: Khalrika

Vibs, u r welcome!

There is no mention of the gap between the birth of the brothers. I guess we have to input all the info in the software that gives ancient dates according to the input of the star formation in the heavens at that time.

Vibs, I too thought that Lakshman and Shatrughan were 1/8 each. Gita Press says 1/6th each.

Ramji is 1/2

Bharat is 1/4th

Lakshman and Shatrughan are 1/6th each according to Gita Press.

Altogether it should be equal to 1 (Vishnu as whole). So, let's see if I am correct in my calculations. If I am wrong in simple math 🤣, math geniuses, please correct me.

1/2 + 1/4 + 1/6+ 1/6

6/12 + 3/12 + 2/12 + 2/12

13/12 does not make one.

If we do 1/2 + 1/4 + 1/8 +1/8

then

4/8 + 2/8 + 1/8 + 1/8

8/8 does make 1. So Gita Press is wrong here. Probably a typo or a mistake made while translating.

Probably ...

Atleast you are better than me in Math 😆 😆 😆

Thanks for the info Vibs and Khalrika.