Superb Questions by Krishna

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MeeraXD

@MeeraXD

Voyager

+ 2

Posted: 15 years ago

#71

WaTeVeR U sAiD I ToTaLlY AgRee To It... like 100% agree.

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@-SilverAngel-

Stunner

+ 4

Posted: 15 years ago

#72

greatly put kool......bas ab koi yeh baat Pratigya ji ko samjhaye

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tanthya

@tanthya

Inactive

+ 5

Posted: 15 years ago

#73

Hi KST,

As usual a very good post rooted on pragmatism...even I don't understand this so called modern trend of Non-consummating of marriage , this despite having a lengthy courtship period .. May be we belong to the dinosaur age .

However I do beg to differ in Kriya's case ... The marriage was not a normal marriage, the procedures of a normal marriage was followed but the intentions and motives for this marriage was not normal..

This is a perfect catch-22 situation, Both of them are right when seen from their perspectives..

Why indeed did Krishna Marry Pratigya ? to get a companion, who will share with him every happiness and sadness and who will be there to support him..or to have a sex toy ! unfortunately Krishna for that matter the whole Thakur's think that wife is for ONE purpose only, to be their bed partner's ...I think this soch of Krishna has to change, Baba has to realize that Marriage doesn't mean automatic conjugal rights...Marriage means a journey of life with your chosen companion...Sometimes I am confused by Baba reaction, Is it really love [ I have strong doubts about that ] ...I feel that it is Passion, Pure and simple...He still is not in love with Pratigya...He is passionately attracted towards Pratigya ..This is what I believe.

second, we are lauding Krishna's patience..let me say a hunter when on hunt will display enormous patience, perseverance and cunning to catch his prey ...and Krishna too is displaying the same tactics...The hall mark of good hunter is his patience and presence of mind to turn the situation to his advantage and Krishna has demonstrated this aplenty .😊

seen from Pratigya's point of view, This marriage was just a unswappable deal...it was a poison that she could neither drink nor swallow ..previously she positively loathed him, Now the circumstance has changed and she knows that he is not responsible for all the calamity that befell her...that doesn't mean that she will immediately fall in love with him..right now she has an open mind and is willing to give this marriage a try...note she is still ambiguous towards Krishna.so far she has seen him and his action's negatively only ... and if she were to accept his demands for conjugal bliss, then it would be a mere satisfaction of your physical needs [lust] without any emotional contentment..Her denial of consummation at this juncture is right !

Next we will take Nitin, Nitin was chosen by her darling Papa..instinctively she approves of him [Papa knows the best] , after the engagement, she was getting to know him..so when the first night arrives, she is not meeting a complete stranger but is meeting a guy with whom you have already established a rapport ..in that Consummation will be a natural process.

She is beginning to look at Krishna as a human now , she is getting interested in him and much more importantly she is opening herself to him...the day they reach a common ground . will be the day for the union to happen ..not until then .

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Sam

@Love-u-all

Rocker

Posted: 15 years ago

#74

Originally posted by: -Maahii-
I respect yr opinion. However, I choose to disagree, simply because marriage is NOT just a certificate to allow consummation. This coming together of two people or souls, does not require a marriage certificate and is not mandatory once a marriage certificate is issued.

Marriage is meant to be a beautiful bond, which grows and evolves over time. I do not think its a mechanism wherein you complete a given list of personal and societal tasks.

Again, this is merely my opinion.

Wow what a wonderful discussion this thread has generated. 👏 But relevance to Krishna's question got lost some where but still got to learn various important POVs regarding marriage, love and when to consummate it. 👏

Coming back to the topic and Maahii's post : Well said that marriage is not not just a certificate to allow consumation. This coming together of two people or souls, does not require a marriage certificate and is not mandatory once a marriage certificate is issued. Marriage is meant to be a beautiful bond, which grows and evolves over time.

Here in the context of the story line, up till the last episode this beautiful bond was non-existent.. So its a no brainier as to why Pratigya was reluctunt to consummate. For her, she married her Panchvii fail stalker to take revenge form him and she hated him with a passion. Why she hated him is a long story and ample topics can be found in this forum if any one wants to see exactly what happened with various POVs.

Krishna during the suhag raat clearly told Pratigya about the efforts and planing he hatched to leave her no option but to marry him. She had seen so many dreadful events believing that those were also hatched by Krishna, not knowing that another goon did all and framed Krishna. So the first night was a night of victory for Krishna and he left no stone unturned to show his emotions and tried to force himself on her.

Pratigya told him clearly that you have succeeded in forcing her into this marriage but you will never be able to win her love, This angered him to the point that he manhandled her resulting in further straining their relations. This went on and the entirse thakur family joined in to make this house a living hell for Pratigya. I remember the terms every one was using in the earlier days for the entire Thakur clan, Not to mention another attempt to commit marital rape, beating, holding gun to her head, tying her with rope is enough humiliation for any woman to hate this man.

Then the main misunderstanding regarding her kidnapping ended. Pratigya stopped hating him but still couldn't forget the humiliation she suffered at the hands of Krishna. Nonetheless she was convinced by her parents to accept Krishna, as in their views he is not bad at heart though his ways to express his love were wrong. She reluctantly agreed to give this marriage a chance and went to her susral. As the hate factor was gone she was nice to Krishna and tried to adjust with an effort to make things work. This very night Krishna seeing the changed behavior pounced on he opportunity and tried to get intimate. What happened afterward is still fresh in everyone's memory who watched today's episode so no need to give recap here.

Now tell me how could she get intimate suddenly when this is the first day when she is trying to develop feelings for Krishna and excepting him as husband, Her excuse to be friends, call this friendship or a lame excuse by her to buy some time to develop "this beautiful bond, which grows and evolves over time." Shouldn't Krishna give her some time since he sensed a change
in her attitude and let her get closer to him first. ??

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vidhya

@boredsoul

Inactive

Posted: 15 years ago

#75

hi kool

bang on target👏

i really pity the creatives who think a modern girl/women thinks and acts as their leading ladies in serials . well i think pratigyas ideologies are from stone age and not from our practical times.

i really want to see how prats will react when after she has understood krishna so well he becomes too old to do anything ( though i doubt it , look at his dad at this age and with a limp leg )

and why is it shown that only men want to consummate a marraige , doesnt women have those feelings? and when girls like komal speak their mind on having a relationship with her husband why is she portrayed like she is crass . please cvs its time for you guys to wake up and make prats a real educated , practical , sensible and todays women.

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soapbubble

@soapbubble

Inactive

+ 7

Posted: 15 years ago

#76

Kool,
just a couple of reactions to your basic premise - I meant to read through all the pages but didn't so sorry if I'm repeating stuff that people have said.

You talk of "faaltu feminism" and 'nakhras' that seem to be the trend in serials these days. Well, first of all, sorry I find that a bit offensive. No, I'm not a rabid feminist and don't think that a whole series of unreasonable attitudes should be okayed under the Feminist stamp. But I find it very perturbing when women don't or refuse to understand issues that affects their own gender or are callous about feminine fears or points of view.

Yes, you're right. Arranged marriages in India are not accompanied by great sensitivity. Girls are married off to men they don't know or even to men they don't like. They are not expected to have a say in when consummation occurs. They are expected to be ready and to get on with it. In most cases they do so. They live, they breed, they die. BIG DEAL. I'm paraphrasing you here - but this is what I felt you said.

But thanks to feminism (I'm not talking of the great movement and hoopla here - just the idea that a woman has a voice which can express her feelings), things are changing. Pooja Gor said in an interview that the name of the serial was very significant. She said Man ki Awaaz refers to the fact that women in our country are obliged to keep quiet in most cirmcumstances - they almost NEVER say what is in their heart. That the name of the serial was a salute to a woman who listened to her 'man ki awaaz'.

I think we all accept that men and women have different attitudes to sex. Men are almost always ready, less particular about who, where or even why. It is not necessarily an emotional act. With most women, it is an emotional bond. They have more to lose. Some women are more sensitive than others. If they want to wait till they feel comfortable, what is wrong with that? Surely it's reasonable? And if the man in question is a good man, a man who is concerned with his wife's feelings - he will be ok with it. Where is the problem? If he is not and forces her before she is ready, she will resent him, fear him. It's a simple matter of sexual trust, isn't it - the very foundation of a loving marriage?

Someone said on this thread that Krishna is even more noble, even more of a man because he's willing to wait. I agree wholeheartedly. He has tried to force her, yes, but he has held back because at one corner of his mind, he knows that he wants Pratigya to succumb fully, with her mind, body and heart - only conquering her body before SHE is ready is not enough for him.

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Binita

@...Binny...

Rocker

+ 2

Posted: 15 years ago

#77

I can understand your POV and I am even willing to accept that Krishna has waited which say's a lot for a man brought up in an atmosphere where he was taught that women are mere objects for the pleasure of men and have no existence otherwise. But, I don't understand the comparison between kriya marriage and an arranged marriage. in an arranged marraige a women marries a man without knowing whether he was good or not, she has nothing against him, and so far he has not done anything to make her feel as if he was not a good person. Now for the most part even arranged marraiges have been modernized (I don't live in India but I'm sure that this has not taken place everywhere but in some places) where parents encourage the couple to get to know one another before their marraige. And in this case isn't that forming a friendship important for any relationship.

Let's just look at the traditional arranged marriage for the sake of this discussion, it's easier for a women to begin a relationship with a man she has no feelings at all for, and extremely difficult to deal with a person a women despises. The kriya marriage was not any normal marriage nor was it an arranged marraige. She was also not oblivious to Krishna's personality, before their marraige she had seen too many negative shades to him that any normal women would keep her distance. It would be difficult to just consummate the marraige with a man who made her as well as her family go through so much humiliation before their marraige. Pratigya's hatred had kept her from understanding Krishna, so what is the problem with her in the current situation trying to understand the man she married.Just because he did not kidnap her does not mean we should forget the mistakes he has made, pratigya should get credit for taking the first step and trying to make her marraige work. I read on one post she should have taken care of this before marraige, seriously she should have gotten to know the person that nearly killed her fiance and kidnapped her according to her misunderstandings.

Now let's talk about Nitin, pratigya's marraige to him could have been compared to an arranged marraige. She did not know him too well, but she has spent enough time with him to realize that he was a good person. She did not love him, but followed her father's wishes, and so this scenario also can't be compared to the kriya marraige. pratigya's reaction would not have been the same to Nitin as it was to Krishna because she did not hate him. It will take some time for pratigya to understand and see krishna's other side, which has been portrayed realistically for their situation. As for Krishna I understand he has waited longer then most men would, but their relationship has just started the way it should have and he should give her some time to open up to him. I know it's not realistic for a man to wait that long, but their marraige is unique as well, so he should take advantage of this time and get to know her better.

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Pooja Menon

@pooja-menon

Trailblazer

+ 7

Posted: 15 years ago

#78

Originally posted by: tanthya

Sometimes I am confused by Baba reaction, Is it really love [ I have strong doubts about that ] ...I feel that it is Passion, Pure and simple...He still is not in love with Pratigya...He is passionately attracted towards Pratigya ..This is what I believe.

Yeah...as much as I want to believe that Krishna loves Pratigya a lot...even I sometimes feel whether it is physical attraction....what quality attracted Krishna to Pratigya that he fell unconditionally in love with her that he went to all these limits??..😕...I remember Piyasia telling amma one time that Krishna is being obsessed and restless about Pratigya coz they haven't had their physical union yet.....this makes me wonder whether he is running after her just coz of this...what will happen to krishna's "love" once they have consummated the marriage?😕...will he be as restless and support her around his family after that??....will he throw her away after that?? I don't want the consummation to happen until both are absolutely and truly in love with each other.

I could be totally wrong here and I want to be wrong. Seriously I want to believe that Krishna truely and absolutely lubs Pratigya😳😳
😳

Edited by SaacheeSyna - 15 years ago

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lighthousepier

@lighthousepier

Inactive

Posted: 15 years ago

#79

Maahii,

Thanks for your thoughts. You are right Sex is not just about marriage and marriage is not just about sex. But a marriage without sex is like a teabag without tea leaves - you can add all the hot water, milk and sugar you want but it still comes out empty

QUOTE=-Maahii-]I respect yr opinion. However, I choose to disagree, simply because marriage is NOT just a certificate to allow consummation. - You bolded the wrong word - it is the JUST that you should have emphasized. There is a difference between a roommate and a spouse!

Marriage is meant to be a beautiful bond, which grows and evolves over time. - Relationships and feelings grow and evolve over time (and sometimes deteriorate over time - Prats better be careful because by the time she is in friendship/ in love/ in lust over Krish, he may be fed up with her). Marriage starts the day you take your vows and get married.

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koolsadhu1000

@koolsadhu1000

Stunner

+ 3

Posted: 15 years ago

#80

Originally posted by: -Maahii-
I respect yr opinion. However, I choose to disagree, simply because marriage is NOT just a certificate to allow consummation. This coming together of two people or souls, does not require a marriage certificate and is not mandatory once a marriage certificate is issued.

Marriage is meant to be a beautiful bond, which grows and evolves over time. I do not think its a mechanism wherein you complete a given list of personal and societal tasks.

Again, this is merely my opinion.

'Marraige is meant to be a beautiful bond which grows and evolves over time .'

That bond is EMOTIONAL AND SPIRITUAL ...........the one that you described . This emotional bond develops over a period of time only , that is exactly what I said in MY post too . And thats the reason I asked , what is this 'I need time' thing , is there any specific limitation to it , a time period to it , a date for it ? No ! The real fact is women like Pratigya and Varsha themselves have no answer for it coz they themselves don't know ! It is a very vague statement ...........I need more time , in which they expect a man to wait like a saint indefinetely for them , 'till they come around' and I find that grossly unfair as when a man gives this same treatment to a woman , she feels horribly insulted . Is the woman going to come around in two years ? I mean , AFTER the marraige takes place ? Or Five years ? Or Three years ? When does 'the time become right ' ? And if she needed Time and this was the answer she was going to give her husband after the marraige , why did she get married in the first place ? She shud have taken Allll the time BEFORE the marraige ! { am talking of a general woman here] . Once u give the commitment that means you are ready .

Infact even when a woman is 60 and her husband is 65 she finds that the bond is still evolving . The exploring each other is still there . That mystery never ends. But because the bond is still evolving , she has not procrastinated love making , having children , various levels of marraige . She is pragmatic enough to realise that the evolving involves all this too , you cannot seperate the two .

My POV purely . It is from a pragmatic POV that I talked .

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