~| Whatever you want to argue about |~ - Page 62

Originally posted by: NoraSM

@FlauntPessimism

Vaisampayana said, 'Asked by Dhritarashtra to give his opinion, Bhishma replied, 'O Dhritarashtra, a quarrel with the Pandavas is what I can never approve of. As thou art to me, so was Pandu without doubt. And the sons of Gandhari are to me, as those of Kunti. I should protect them as well as I should thy sons, O Dhritarashtra! And, O king, the Pandavas are as much near to me as they are to prince Duryodhana or to all the other Kurus. Under these circumstances a quarrel with them is what I never like. Concluding a treaty with those heroes, let half the land be given unto them

https://www.sacred-texts.com/hin/m01/m01206.htm

Read this link

Read the link. What was it about? We all know that Bheeshm suggested the partition of the kingdom

Originally posted by: NoraSM

Krishna was born in same year as Arjuna, How old are we considering Arjuna during Draupadi's Swayamvar?

If they were interconnected enough to have same Gurus, I think its possible that they met before but Pandavas being Kurus and Kunti not liking her mayka, didn't leave a good impression of that side of the family for Pandavas

They didn't know Krishna, their cousin who is same age as Arjuna,.can help them. Krishna wasn't a King and From what I read Yadavas had their own problems

After Swayamvar, Krishna helped them financially, This was a huge ehsan on Pandavas, they were obviously in better terms with Krishna after this

No guru drona is not krishna balram guru. Sage sandipani is guru of krishna balram.

Originally posted by: NoraSM

Krishna was born in same year as Arjuna, How old are we considering Arjuna during Draupadi's Swayamvar?

If they were interconnected enough to have same Gurus, I think its possible that they met before but Pandavas being Kurus and Kunti not liking her mayka, didn't leave a good impression of that side of the family for Pandavas

They didn't know Krishna, their cousin who is same age as Arjuna,.can help them. Krishna wasn't a King and From what I read Yadavas had their own problems

After Swayamvar, Krishna helped them financially, This was a huge ehsan on Pandavas, they were obviously in better terms with Krishna after this

Drona and Kripa had nothing to do with Krishna and Balram. Krishna was taught by Sandipani. Chandogya Upanishad says by Ghora Angirasa.

Krishna was already quite famous by the time of lac house. If Pandavas didn't seek help from him for at least a year, it was because they didn't know they could. Ie, they didn't know him personally.

I mean, after the scene, they never as much sneezed without asking Krishna. The one time they did (dice hall), it ended in disaster.

Originally posted by: FlauntPessimism

Read the link. What was it about? We all know that Bheeshm suggested the partition of the kingdom

I didn't know it, I read it today only

In this Bhishma is saying he likes both Pandavas and Kauravas equally

Satyaki and some people from Yadavas trained with Pandavas under Drona

Chilli said it in one of her replies, I was referring to that and Bhima trained under Balaram

They were interconnected through their Gurus

Originally posted by: HearMeRoar

Drona and Kripa had nothing to do with Krishna and Balram. Krishna was taught by Sandipani. Chandogya Upanishad says by Ghora Angirasa.

Krishna was already quite famous by the time of lac house. If Pandavas didn't seek help from him for at least a year, it was because they didn't know they could. Ie, they didn't know him personally.

I mean, after the scene, they never as much sneezed without asking Krishna. The one time they did (dice hall), it ended in disaster.

Why were Pandavas hiding after Lac house incident?

Did they have a spy or a way to reach out to Krishna? They were presumably dead

They didn't ask any one for help not only Krishna

I am not saying Pandavas and Krishna were buddies but they must have met before Swayamvar and Chilli provided citation where Bhima trained under Balaram before Lac house incident

Originally posted by: NoraSM

Why were Pandavas hiding after Lac house incident?

Did they have a spy or a way to reach out to Krishna? They were presumably dead

They didn't ask any one for help not only Krishna

I am not saying Pandavas and Krishna were buddies but they must have met before Swayamvar and Chilli provided citation where Bhima trained under Balaram before Lac house incident

Where? There is no citation which mentiona Krishna in MBh before swayamvar.

Pandavas got help from Vidura during lac house. A year later, they got help from Vyasa. They did not contact Krishna at any point.

https://www.sacred-texts.com/hin/m01/m01141.htm

https://www.sacred-texts.com/hin/m01/m01142.htm

I think I'm beginning to see the problem. The 2nd link is where Chili mentions Bheema being Balram's student.

See the same 2 sections in CE:

Heartbroken, Drupada lived in a capital named Kampilya, in the region known as

Makandi, on the banks of the Ganga, with its towns and countryside. He ruled over the

southern part of Panchala, up to the banks of the river Charmanvati. Thinking about his

enmity with Drona, he could find no peace. He did not see any way of vanquishing Drona

with Kshatriya power and he knew himself to be inferior to the strength of Brahmana power.

Therefore, he bore his grievance, waiting for the birth of a son. O king! Drona lived in

Ahichhatra, which had towns and a countryside, and was won in battle by Partha and handed

over to him.’

129

Vaishampayana said, ‘On seeing that Bhimasena had become extremely strong and

Dhananjaya extremely skilled, the evil Duryodhana was tormented. Then, Vaikartana Karna

and Subala’s son, Shakuni, tried to kill the Pandavas through various means. However, the

Pandavas, slayers of enemies, discovered all of them. But because of Vidura’s advice, they

refrained from revealing these plots.

‘O descendant of the Bharata lineage! On seeing that the sons of Pandu were blessed with

all the qualities, the citizens began to speak about their qualities in squares and assemblies.

“Lord of men, Dhritarashtra, though possessing the sight of wisdom, could not inherit the

kingdom then because he was blind. How can he be king now? Shantanu’s son, Bhishma, is

rigid in his vows and is devoted to the truth. Having given up the kingdom earlier, he will

never accept it now. The eldest Pandava is young, but has the conduct of the old, is truthful

and compassionate and has knowledge of the Vedas. With due ceremonies, it is up to us to

crown him. Since he follows the path of dharma, he will certainly worship Shantanu’s son

Bhishma and Dhritarashtra and his sons and give them objects for sustenance.” The evil

Duryodhana heard these words of affection for Yudhisthira and burnt in grief. Burning thus,

the evil-souled one could not condone such talk

The entire part about Bheema studying under Balram is omitted by CE. Here, guru dakshina war is followed by lac house. No intervening part of Bheema training in Dwaraka.

I was getting confused as hell.😆

Even if go by KMG, Pandavas didn't go as a unit to Dwaraka. BHEEMA went to BALRAM. Krishna never met any Pandava with the possible exception of Bheema before swayamvara.

Nor were they friends or they would've thought of approaching him for help.

Originally posted by: NoraSM

I didn't know it, I read it today only

In this Bhishma is saying he likes both Pandavas and Kauravas equally

Oh ok got it, this is about that day's discussion

Well he always said that, but actions always speak louder than words, and his actions do suggest that either he despised both the sets or the characterization I had put