Mahabharat Retelecast Discussion Thread 3 - Page 29

Originally posted by: HearMeRoar

Dhrishtadyumna was responsible for each and every war formation of the Pandavas which eventually gave them victory. Arjuna himself admits he owes Dhrishtadyumna and Shikhandi. The commander's responsibilities are different from that of an archer. No one would say Eisenhower was a bad warrior because he wasn't on the ground during WWII.

No one could doubt his CIC responsibilities, He remained intact for 18 days while his opponents needed 5 of them. No war could be won without the CIC. That he isn't considered as important in Mahabharata as Drona or Ashwathama is a suprise for me

I was saying about the fighting skills. He wasn't very good at it, so to have impressed Drona enough to teach him advanced skills. Or else simply maybe Drona didn't teach him realising that he os leaning to kill Drona himself

Originally posted by: Poorabhforever

Most of drapaudi s temple has krishna. There is karaga festival where drapaudi is the main deity and krishna helps her . Plus i have said this earlier too radha is someone who has been shown as part of krishna s life in vrindavan and drapaudi s past life before meeting drapaud is conveniently omitted getting the drift

Just to say, could it be that Radha was real and she was adopted by Drupad later

Originally posted by: Poorabhforever

Most of drapaudi s temple has krishna. There is karaga festival where drapaudi is the main deity and krishna helps her . Plus i have said this earlier too radha is someone who has been shown as part of krishna s life in vrindavan and drapaudi s past life before meeting drapaud is conveniently omitted getting the drift

Karaga festival is in a temple where Draupadi is with Pandavas, Krishna is there with Adishakti, it doesn't show Draupadi and Krishna as Sri-Narayana, This temple is 800 years old

I started reading Mahabharata in March and in June, I know that Draupadi is described as Goddess Laxmi, so people who have been reading it for years and years, didn't realized that Draupadi is Goddess Laxmi?

Originally posted by: naq5

Draupadi's flaws are not very visible(she would have flaws) like the pandavas their flaws were quite visible & led to the war actually

IMO, Panchali's major flaw (if you can call it that) was her refusal to give an inch to the incompetent nincompoop who was the emperor. She bluntly calls him a drunk gambler and a lunatic at various points. Actually, I won't even call this a flaw. Why should she have catered to his whims? Yeah, it likely led to a lot of insecurities on his part which might or might not have led to dice hall events. But his insecurities were his responsibility not hers.

Re: the dislike towards Panchali. The major reason I see is something I've come to call the mother-in-law syndrome. 😆 The attitude seems to be "arrey, how can a woman speak like that to my laadla hero Karna/Yudhishtira/Bheema/Arjuna/Nakula/Sahadeva/Duryodhana/Tom/Dick/Harry? Irawati Karve, whom I otherwise enjoy, showed this precise attitude. She actually said Panchali should have begged Bheeshma for help instead of lecturing him on dharma. It would've been expedient, but why should a woman be asked to sacrifice her sense of right from wrong? Because she is a woman? In fact, Yudhishtira does ask her to come to the dice hall in bare minimum clothing and cry to the elders.

Fact is that Vyasa outright states Panchali was not nice to Yudhishtira. Bheema was putty in her hands. She insults Arjuna left and right a few times. The twins were generally ignored. She calls Karna an insignificant man. AND... forgive me for saying this Arjuna-Panchali shippers, I don't believe it existed on her part except for a brief attraction in the initial days of marriage. In fact, everything after Arjuna's return from exile shows angst on his part, not hers. She most certainly doesn't cry over him which some seem to want her to. So yeah... that wouldn't go over well with shipping type readers who in large part seem to want her to be his trophy.

The worst of all... she won in the end! Yes, she sacrificed a lot, but she knew going in there would be sacrifices. This enrages the mothers-in-law even more. Kunti was actually firmly on Panchali's side, but the modern MILs clearly aren't.

The other reason is her stature in the empire as opposed to the other characters - men and women - in the epic.

This is the year 2020, and people, including women, have a hard time adjusting to the idea of a woman in a powerful role. They do the "I'm a feminist but--" argument. ie, Feminism Lite.

Here is a quote from Dear Ijeawele, or A Feminist Manifesto in Fifteen Suggestions (Author: Chimamanda Ngozi Adichie): "But here is a sad truth. Our world is full of men and women who do not like powerful women. We have been so conditioned to think of power as male that a powerful woman is an aberration. And so she is policed. We ask of powerful women: Is she humble? Does she smile? Is she grateful enough? Does she have a domestic side? Questions we do not ask of powerful men, which shows that our discomfort is not with power itself, but with women. We judge powerful women more harshly than we judge powerful men. And Feminism Lite enables this."

Originally posted by: FlauntPessimism

Just to say, could it be that Radha was real and she was adopted by Drupad later

Are you trolling me ?? 😆

But om a serious note that is what i am trying to implying that only since radha is too deeply engraved in our culture said to very important to krishna radha is part of krishna s earlier life. Drapaudi s earlier is conveniently removed and she is to be born out of "fire" krishna and krishnaa are obviously very close i am trying to understand why go to such extreme length to completely remove a important portion of someone s life ???

Originally posted by: NoraSM

Radha-Krishna temples are relatively new

Old temples have Krishna with Rukmini, Radha is not in these temples

Subhadra is worshipped in Jagannath Puri because she was Lord Krishna's sister, Balaram is worshipped too

There has to be a reason why even though Draupadi is mentioned as Goddess Laxmi, She is not worshipped

First two describe Krishna's relationship with Arjuna too, He is said to be his devotee and they had non divine friendship, I don't see how a patriarchal society plays a role here because Krishna is Lord and Draupadi should have been worshipped as Goddess

Something is missing

People are simply uncomfortable with the idea as can be seen from this thread.

Originally posted by: NoraSM

Karaga festival is in a temple where Draupadi is with Pandavas, Krishna is there with Adishakti, it doesn't show Draupadi and Krishna as Sri-Narayana, This temple is 800 years old

I started reading Mahabharata in March and in June, I know that Draupadi is described as Goddess Laxmi, so people who have been reading it for years and years, didn't realized that Draupadi is Goddess Laxmi?

Karaga festival is celebrated all over Karnataka and who said that don't know. There is difference between knowing and consiously accepting it. Even today many will attack you with all kind of weapons the moment you mention this well written fact. Why just because they were not married as if while taking incarnation all the god and goddess thought were when will they get "married". I would like to believe that these higher being had a better purposes to serve more responsibilities to fullfilll

Originally posted by: HearMeRoar

People are simply uncomfortable with the idea as can be seen from this thread.

People are not comfortable with Draupadi being wife of 5 Pandavas, but it is a common knowledge

If it was a common knowledge as it is given in Mahabharata then people being uncomfortable doesn't matter, they would have worshipped Draupadi as Goddess Laxmi

Its just unfair that she doesn't get the recognition, she deserves

^^^this reminded me of the statement of a local minister (female) after the Nibhaaya episode. She literally said that the girl should have allowed them to do what they wanted to then probably they wouldn't have been brutal to her

Originally posted by: HearMeRoar

IMO, Panchali's major flaw (if you can call it that) was her refusal to give an inch to the incompetent nincompoop who was the emperor. She bluntly calls him a drunk gambler and a lunatic at various points. Actually, I won't even call this a flaw. Why should she have catered to his whims? Yeah, it likely led to a lot of insecurities on his part which might or might not have led to dice hall events. But his insecurities were his responsibility not hers.

Re: the dislike towards Panchali. The major reason I see is something I've come to call the mother-in-law syndrome. 😆 The attitude seems to be "arrey, how can a woman speak like that to my laadla hero Karna/Yudhishtira/Bheema/Arjuna/Nakula/Sahadeva/Duryodhana/Tom/Dick/Harry? Irawati Karve, whom I otherwise enjoy, showed this precise attitude. She actually said Panchali should have begged Bheeshma for help instead of lecturing him on dharma. It would've been expedient, but why should a woman be asked to sacrifice her sense of right from wrong? Because she is a woman? In fact, Yudhishtira does ask her to come to the dice hall in bare minimum clothing and cry to the elders.

Fact is that Vyasa outright states Panchali was not nice to Yudhishtira. Bheema was putty in her hands. She insults Arjuna left and right a few times. The twins were generally ignored. She calls Karna an insignificant man. AND... forgive me for saying this Arjuna-Panchali shippers, I don't believe it existed on her part except for a brief attraction in the initial days of marriage. In fact, everything after Arjuna's return from exile shows angst on his part, not hers. She most certainly doesn't cry over him which some seem to want him to. So yeah... that wouldn't go over well with shipping type readers.

The worst of all... she won in the end! Yes, she sacrificed a lot, but she knew going in there would be sacrifices. This enrages the mothers-in-law even more. Kunti was actually firmly on Panchali's side, but the modern MILs clearly aren't.

The other reason is her stature in the empire as opposed to the other characters - men and women - in the epic.

This is the year 2020, and people, including women, have a hard time adjusting to the idea of a woman in a powerful role. They do the "I'm a feminist but--" argument. ie, Feminism Lite.

Here is a quote from Dear Ijeawele, or A Feminist Manifesto in Fifteen Suggestions (Author: Chimamanda Ngozi Adichie): "But here is a sad truth. Our world is full of men and women who do not like powerful women. We have been so conditioned to think of power as male that a powerful woman is an aberration. And so she is policed. We ask of powerful women: Is she humble? Does she smile? Is she grateful enough? Does she have a domestic side? Questions we do not ask of powerful men, which shows that our discomfort is not with power itself, but with women. We judge powerful women more harshly than we judge powerful men. And Feminism Lite enables this."

I skimmed through a question on Quora which stated something about Bhishma not stopping Draupadi when she was misbehaving with him or someone, I didn't read it 😆 I mean the dude didn't have nerve to say anything to anyone, he better shut his mouth in front of her