The Party & its hangover! - Page 21

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sashashyam thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
I loved that, Janhvi, your cunning, not the argument. 😉😉

Since when have defending attorneys bothered about the court's time? If I had been Sachin, I would have put her on, crying buckets effortlessly, and let the judge have it with both barrels. It is all for emotional impact., and in fact the point that she does NOT testify looks strange. Sachin must have known when the judge started summing up that Arjun was never going to make it, and so why not use the second string to his bow?

But then Sachin would give a clod an inferiority complex. Someone was complaining that Manav should not, out of solidarity with his daughter, have let him defend Onir. What I think is that he must have deliberately let him do it to make sure that Onir did not get off by some chance!😉

If nothing else, Purvi could have got up and said something between sobs from where she was; the judge would have shushed her, but there would have been some effect, including on Onir.

If I had had a wife who does nothing but cry while I am going down the tubes for something that is 75% her fault,then comes up when I am feeling like crawling into a hole and pulling it in after me and puts a tentative hand on my shoulder like a compassionate passer by, and finally, when I come back from wherever, I see her crying all over her first and only love., I would have been more than disappointed.

I agree that she meant nothing wrong in that scene, but it would look VERY odd to anyone in the court, and all the more so to anyone conversant with their past history. Most husbands would have cut up very rough, whatever the nature of the marriage.

And as for Manav, if he thought it was not reprehensible, I would be much surprised. Knowing their past history, how on earth, Janhvi, would he think that it is innocent?A married woman in India does not cry all over a man in public unless he is her brother or father or equivalent thereof. And what was Arjun thinking of? The minute he gets near her he starts holding her hand, and she does not have the good sense to pull away.

If I were not convinced that she is not immoral, I would not believe that this touching scene was innocent either. I only hope that, as with that gandharva vivah in the shack, she does not make me fall flat on my face once again. And you as well.

And where, o where was the ever vigilant Soham, who was looking on as Onir came down from the box, with a despairing look on his face? Why was he not there at hand to prevent that touching scene between his pyaari behna and his bete noire? Should he not have been there to grab Arjun by the collar and summarily boot him out, and then offer his own shoulder for the distraught lady to weep on? Very curious.

I would also have liked to see Onir's reaction if he had come back in time to see it, and find out if nature, red in tooth and claw, would have triumphed over his eternal 'understanding'. I would have respected him more if it had, and his Mishti would also have had a salutary lesson in the limits of tolerance and the constraints imposed by marriage.

That Manav listens to Damodar later does not mean that he thinks Arjun and Purvi are not guilty. It only means that he wants Ovi's marriage not to fail (the typical traditional track) and he wants to pull back the erring son in law. I am sure that he would not be as accommodating if it was an erring daughter in law. She would have been thrown out on her ear pronto!

Shyamala

Originally posted by: soapwatcher1



Gotcha! 😆 "Hang him not, innocent " vs "hang him, not innocent", you must have heard that one?
I knew exactly what you meant with moving on 😃 but I was expanding and cautioning you not to move on in Ovi fashion. 😉 Yes, have read a few of Dorothy Sayers' but do not remember reading that scene or book at all.

Purvi should have, would have, could have 😆, Sachin is her attorney, he has already asked for Arjun to testify, the party that was harmed.

The court already has proof that Purvi instigated Onir to switch the babies, it was her idea, the CD stands testimony to that. The judge while rendering his judgement makes the statement that while he realizes the intent was good and done for the benefit of someone, the act was wrong and hence no jail time but revoking of the license for Onir. Purvi had no "new and further" testimony to provide on the stand, reiterating what was on the CD could possibly have been interpreted as a frivolous waste of the court's time.



Originally posted by: sashashyam

Janhvi, my Janhvi.

What all do you make me do - in this instance backtrack on what I wrote just hours ago! Well, let me at least save some face by keeping it brief.

- Varsha was just an example and not the core and even less the sole basis of the argument. What I stressed was in the highlighted part:

And one makes such efforts in a crunch situation, whether one believes they will work or not, because one cares.

Purvi did not need to make a scene or a lot of nose, you know. In her place, I would have insisted that I testify, and in simple and telling language, I would have made clear to the judge that I was the moving force behind the swap, that Onir had voiced reservations that I had overridden, that I had done this out of purely altruistic motives, and that he had done it, despite his initial reservations,as he was ultimately convinced that it was the morally right thing to do. That might have made an impression on the judge, who was already convinced that Onir had not done this for any nefarious reason. It might thus have led to a limited, and not an open-ended suspension of his medical licence.

As things turned out, she did not even make an attempt, which I find unbelievable in a loyal and caring wife. No, I do not think that she did nothing so Onir could remain behind bars, any more than I think that there was anything shady in her crying in Arjun's arms. But she should never have done that, it would have been most inappropriate anywhere, and all the more so in the courtroom. If Onir had happened to come back just then, I am sure even his fabled tolerance and understanding might have failed

And she does not even try to comfort him with a hug -and it is not as though she does not hug him - but there perhaps your guilt argument would be more applicable.

Shakti was wonderful in that little scene as he descends from the box and comes up to her. He does not look at her at all, he is in a private web of misery of his own as he looks up at the ceiling and then lowers his head on to his hand. She cannot reach him at all, and she does nor really try.

Janvhi, do you read Dorothy Sayers and her Peter Wimsey mystery novels? There is one last scene in, I think, Busman's Holiday, where Peter Wimsey, who gets badly affected by acute feelings of guilt whenever a criminal he has helped nail is hanged, retreats into a shell where his wife can no longer reach him. In the end scene in the book, his wife is sitting in her room at the top of the stairs (in those days, husband and wife always had separate bedrooms) as he comes up them dragging his leaden feet. She holds her breath, and thinks to herself that if now he does not come in to her for comfort, she has failed completely as a wife. The door does open, he comes in, kneels at her feet, and buries his head in her lap as she cradles it and holds him close.

Purvi might have to pass some such test soon. It is high time she stops viewing her husband merely as an eternal support and lightning rod, and realises that he too has his vulnerabilities, and badly needs support and reassurance right now. She has to be clear-eyed and strong for him of she is to pull him out of his depression, and not the kind of eternal watering pot festooned with umpteen wigs that she has become.

Finally, the Ovi reference is " I, like Ovi, am moving on"and not " I am moving on like Ovi". The difference, and it is a huge one, is in the syntax and the commas!😉

Shyamala



Edited by sashashyam - 12 years ago
soapwatcher1 thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
Did I say I just ❤️ you! You are too funny, poor Sachin, give a clod an inferiority complex, indeed! And Manav is quite calculating if he has done this on purpose knowing his son's horrible courtroom presence 😉 Loved Vasu's poke at that bhalaiyi defense of his😆

I truly hope I do not fall flat on my face, I will have to eat crow and then some if the CVs go down the route of an illegal pagal rishta. I too did not like Arjun putting his arm around her, but then he is Canada raised and in the western world it is common to hug someone in distress even if the person is of the opposite gender, and he does hesitate a bit, and they were lovers once but still friends, yada, yada 😃 and patidev would not have blinked an eye, ever understanding that he is, his Mishti is a devi and would never cheat on him! 😊

New argument just for you - maybe Sachin was expressly forbidden by baba Manav to put Purvi on the stand as he did not want the whole sordid truth to be any more probed into and bandied about, how is that?😆
soapwatcher1 thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago

Originally posted by: pallavi25


Thanks, Jahnvi, for opening this post and giving us an opportunity to discuss the absurdities of Pavitra Pasta! I have read your posts before and have always appreciated your clarity in these arguments!
I am enjoying the highly intelligent and humorous discussions here. Good fodder for the brain!
After a long time, I am participating in discussions like these and having a good time!
Thanks again! 😃


Dear Pallavi, welcome! And I have been reading your posts and have been very pleasantly surprised at the even tone and logical way with which your present your point of view. It is fun to tear these reel people apart and see what makes them tick, we will never be right as none of them bear any semblance to reality. 😃
Me_Harini thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
bang on post jhanvi di...
very nice random observations u have done...👏👏👏

sashashyam thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
Jahnvi,

First sentence, delighted! Love you too!🤗

Last para.The whole shebang had come out anyway from conversation in the nursery between Onir and Purvi, when she says that the baby would be with her asli pita. But maybe the judge and the audience might not have noticed that, and focussed instead on the part in the hospital room where Purvi talks of giving hamara bachcha to Ovi and Arjun.

But then, Janhvi, they could have stuck to the same line when she was on the stand, could they not? I do not suppose the prosecuting attorney is a Perry Mason clone and he would never have thought of going down that road. If by some chance he had, why thenit would have strengthened the case for bhalaayi!😉

Shyamala

Originally posted by: soapwatcher1

Did I say I just ❤️ you! You are too funny, poor Sachin, give a clod an inferiority complex, indeed! And Manav is quite calculating if he has done this on purpose knowing his son's horrible courtroom presence 😉 Loved Vasu's poke at that bhalaiyi defense of his😆


I truly hope I do not fall flat on my face, I will have to eat crow and then some if the CVs go down the route of an illegal pagal rishta. I too did not like Arjun putting his arm around her, but then he is Canada raised and in the western world it is common to hug someone in distress even if the person is of the opposite gender, and he does hesitate a bit, and they were lovers once but still friends, yada, yada 😃 and patidev would not have blinked an eye, ever understanding that he is, his Mishti is a devi and would never cheat on him! 😊

New argument just for you - maybe Sachin was expressly forbidden by baba Manav to put Purvi on the stand as he did not want the whole sordid truth to be any more probed into and bandied about, how is that?😆

soapwatcher1 thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
Vasu, so very well written and explained. You are spot on in everything that you have said.
soapwatcher1 thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago

Originally posted by: harini_arvi

bang on post jhanvi di...

very nice random observations u have done...👏👏👏


Thank you!🤗
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Posted: 12 years ago

Originally posted by: archis_2013

Tiyali, First of all, thank you of responding to my points. I am a new to writing on the forum and have only 18 posts to my credit but far less responded to even in that lot!

My posts was mainly about Ovi ( less references of Arjun and almost none on Purvi) was a point by itself - that It is always portrayed that her issues are attributed to everyone else but her. That Ovi needs to look inwards for her to lead a good life with or without Arjun in future. And unlike any other normal marriages, Ovi fully was aware of Arjun-Purvi's relationship, under what circumstances she got married to Arjun and what was her own role to play in that. Hence my reference to the trust between couples who are aware of each other's past relationships.

Lets ask the question- who tried making the biggest adjustment to their lives with this marriage? If you are honest, you would admit that it was Arjun. Ovi had nothing more to adjust apart from being a good wife and enjoying the life she wanted.

When Arjun agreed to marry Ovi, he did not love her but she was still his best friend. Few hours later, the equation has changed - he finds out that Ovi was his best friend who had not cared a hoot about his feelings for Purvi and had hit Purvi at her weakest point to get him. Anyone would have turned hostile to their partner at this point. But Arjun had still respected the institution of marriage and attempted to adjust to his new life. Should she not have understood that the guy had a heart and more to be done from her end other than serving breakfast at his table? That she expected this man to remember and celebrate their one month anniversary tells me that she did not believe he had a heart. (Neither did Purvi as she too had similar expectation of Arjun to keep Ovi happy). Is this not female chauvinism?

And who pushed whom to frustration in their marriage, it is a vicious cycle. Ovi kept making scenes whenever she found Purvi in Arjun's vicinity and Arjun willingly went back to her every time and kept the charade up. While Ovi tries to escape from the harsh reality of what their marriage had turned into, by meeting her high-5 friends and drinking (Archana-Ovi conversation), Arjun's escape route was by thinking about the pleasant memories with Purvi from the not-so distant past.

Their marriage was not on solid ground from the beginning as it was not based on truth and understanding. Neither tried putting a full stop to it before it was too late. That they both decided to bring a baby on without trying to reconcile with each other looked like a foolish decision but the marriage was looking like it was going to work with the baby on the way.

I am not sure why you all conclude that Arjun loved Pari just because she was his off-spring with Purvi. Did he not care about the baby before he knew the truth, did he not thank Ovi profusely after they came back from hospital and later at the office event? Though women are more emotional than men on these matters, I agree that it was strange that he was not shown to feel for his dead baby Arjun not comforting his wife over the dead baby does sounds callous but the guy did not get his chance between him knowing that Ovi knew the truth in the party and him being asked to leave when he got the chance to meet Ovi.

I would refrain from going on in length on the kaands as you call it. Arjun and Purvi are shameless doing the act before marriage but it would have been their own business if Ovi was not shameless in going behind a man who did not love her.

With that my friend. I have indulged in a longer reply than I have planned to because I respect your efforts in responding to my earlier post. I have said all I could about Ovi in many a post and nothing more to add.


Again, thank-you for responding. Long essays ( to me these are) are a pain in the derriere, so I appreciate that. I do understand you POV though not agree with it.😳 Its only through PR I get to meet such diverse people with unique POVs. I too have nothing more to add except that lets agree to disagree and a promise from me to read all your posts, cuz I do think you have a wonderful yet very simple way of explaining things.


Enjoy!
pallavi25 thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago

Originally posted by: archis_2013


You can call me Vasu (not Vaasu, I am a female). Another Wow factor in your favour that you have watched Ekta's serials before! You might be surprised to know that this is my first soap ever - hindi or tamil (my mother tongue). I have watched few episodes of one or two tamil soaps and few episodes of SRK in Fauji ( I believe that was what it was called) back in Doordarshan when I was in school 😊. I have watched couple of Korean soaps ( Jewel in the palace and Dong Yue) I would recommend them if anyone likes stories based on history and empowerment of women (unheard of in those days). The forum has been taking a lot of my time lately but I think I will continue to participate in the exchanges till atleast the novelty wears off. Hope not ..


Hi Vasu,
Wow, this is your first Ekta soap, welcome to Ektaland! 😃
I have been a diehard fan of SRK since Fauji days. Only recently he has been getting on my nerves. 😆 especially after JTHJ and Ra.One.
I have heard a lot of good things abt Korean soaps but never watched one. Did u watch them online with subtitles? Korean music is also very good!
Forum discussions are certainly time-consuming and thats why I had stopped discussing shows last year as I was busy with other things.
The points you have made abt Ovi-Arjun marriage are right on target! Arjun did try to make the marriage work after his fury at Ovi died down (regarding her devious deal) but she kept on accusing him and suspecting him of carrying on with Purvi. She is just so insecure and unstable, I dont think anyone can be happy with her!
She was horribly mean to Purvi even recently when she asked Archu to throw out a pregnant Purvi from Deshmukh house just because she could not stand her presence! Ovi was obnoxious to Onir as well in Kolkata, refusing to get treated by him. She should have been relieved to see Purvi married to Onir but she was still insecure inspite of her pregnancy and Purvi's too.

I like the term "female chauvinism" that you have used. Both Purvi and Ovi are shown as female chauvinists, expecting the men to jump through hoops at their commands!
I think Ekta and her writers feel it should be that way but thats the opposite of real life, isnt it?
These shows are made for female audience and it gives us vicarious pleasure to see these strong, powerful women running men's lives... whereas in real life, Indian women have to deal with male chauvinists! 😆
sashashyam thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
Well, my dear ladies (or girls, if you prefer that),

Let us move away from all these esoteric analyses and move on to the nitty gritty of PR today, The highlights were as follows:

-Purvi and Onir are moving further on the jeevansaathi track, which is apparently going to be played out next on the pavements of Mumbai. The key motto for the CVs now seems to be (this came up first at the 1000th episode shindy) Jaise ArMan, waise PuNir.

So Purvi, after having stretched the truth to the breaking point by telling her alarmingly uncomplaining spouse that Kahin na kahin, yeh sab meri wajah se hua hai(??!!??) , adds with great determination that she will live wherever he lives, even if it is on the pavements, but she will NEVER leave him. She then clinches this saintly declaration by putting her head on his chest, whereupon he embraces her rather tentatively, poor chap. He is probably wondering what worse fate awaits him next.😉

At this point, there was a great crash, accompanied by a sound of a multitude of fragile objects breaking. It took me a minute to make out that these were thousands of hearts breaking. No need to mention the provenance of the aforesaid hearts.

To drive the point home, Varsha then turns up and states unequivocally that Onir and Purvi reminded her of her Archu tayi and her Manav jeeju, stressing that they had been there for each other when the whole family was against them, and had triumphed. She concludes by adjuring them to always be with each other no matter what.

At this point, I could hear sounds like broken glass being trodden underfoot.

Purvi and Onir leave the K chawl, after having fitted all their earthly belongings into half of one carry bag (it is undoubtedly equipped with Hermione's Undetectable Extension Charm) , in stately slow motion, while in the distance. Sulochana aaji gives a passable imitation of a goldfish.

- Ovi is haunted by the crying of a non-existent Pari. She might well have gone to the Kirloskar mansion and cuddled her if Manav had not mucked things up by preaching to her about the need for her to accept Pari, and forgive Arjun for her sake. Her reaction could have been predicted by anyone with and IQ of 60+. Manav's is apparently 59. She promptly announces that she is resuming her modelling career.

While I was getting ready to clap at this, she surfaces at the Kirloskar mansion, where the 'top businessman' has not been able to locate a decent nanny as yet. Hearing the baby's wails, she races upstairs and picks her up and ticks off the butler for leaving Pari alone. I thought that it was all in the bag and mamta,even udhar ki mamta, so to speak, had triumphed.

But I had counted without the distilled idiocy of Arjun Kirloskar, who turns up most inopportunely just as Ovi is rocking the baby back to calm. The interesting thing here is that Pari recognises Ovi and quietens down at once.

Any man with an ounce of commonsense would have made himself scarce and allowed the rebonding process to proceed undisturbed. But not our AK, oh no! He materialises next to Ovi like a jack in the box, and tells her that he knew she would come back as she would not be able to stay away from Pari. Boom!

Ovi puts Pari back on the bed and storms out with her bag, after announcing in no uncertain terms that

(a) she would never accept him or Pari, the nishaani of his mahaan pyaar with Purvi (a variation she produces after he protests against her initial, and technically accurate description of the baby as naajaayaz), and that he could get either an ayah or Purvi to care for the baby

(b) that if anything was naajaayaz in all this, it was Arjun's rishta with herself, and he could end it any time he wanted to, and that

(c) she was restarting her modelling career.

AK, having mucked things up with his usual felicity, was left with Pari, who had started bawling again. His problem is that he started drooling over her big time only after he learnt about her maternal lineage, so Pari has not had enough time to soak in all this extra doses of paternal affection. She is used only to Ovi, who was always carrying her around like a mother bear with her cub. So she stopped crying when Ovi picked her up, and once Ovi left, Pari started where she had left off.

The banner under the frames announced that Pari will be kidnapped, but the candidate of choice for the kidnapper is not yet clear. It might be Ovi seeing that she hears the (non-existent) baby's wailing even in her sleep. But then what of the modelling career?

Arjun will immediately go looking, not for Pari but for Purvi, to cry on her shoulder. In this quest, he will be handicapped by his not knowing on which pavement in Brihanmumbai she and her spouse are currently parked.

Much excitement obviously awaits us, and I for one am holding my breath in anticipation!!😉

I hope the above was at least a bit more entertaining than PR!!

Shyamala
Edited by sashashyam - 12 years ago

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