Allaudin Khilji and his 'heart' - Page 8

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Eggon_Snow thumbnail
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Posted: 7 years ago
#71

Originally posted by: Sarah007


I'm pretty sure they changed her personality to make her more submissive and meek so that we do not sympathise with Khilji.

That being said, I do have a question: why does he slap Malik khafur in the scene where he is helping him get dressed? That scene really caught me off guard and I was trying to figure out what caused our Khilji to get so offended :-/


Kafur said that Hitaat is plotting to be the Sultan. Khilji got angry at Hitaat and Sultan even being used in the same sentence. And then he says" aasmaan ka har sitaara chaand banna chahta hain, par ban nahin sakta". He was angry that Kafur could even imply that Hitaat is capable of stealing the throne from him.

I think you saw the online version where that dialogue is missing.😆

The slapping was not related to Padmavati, because after Khilji slaps him and says that aasman dialogue, Kafur says " Haan jaise main aapke itne kareeb hoon, par Padmavati ki jagah nahin le sakta" to which Khilji replies "Rani Padmavati" and lovingly reprimands him.

Damn, I know the dialogues by heart😆
Edited by Eggon_Snow - 7 years ago
Sarah007 thumbnail
Posted: 7 years ago
#72

Originally posted by: Mallika-E-Bhais

^^History says he did love Kafur & it was Kafur who didn't & was using him all along to finally have the throne to himself.. Considering how Khilji made him into an eunuch... Idk how much to blame him but he did instantly kill Khilji's sons so he was as cruel as his lover-mentor. Who knows what history reveals & shades but your explanation makes sense. I do Feel that is what he felt & why Kafur used to question him & why he isn't ever threatened by Mehrus presence.


Yeah I've read about that. Some accounts read that he blinded his sons and some say that he murdered Allaudin in order to take over the throne... Man! Would love to see a sequel of this! :-D

We should have a prequel called "Allaudin Khilji" and a sequel called "Malik Khafur"! :P :P

Originally posted by: Eggon_Snow

[

Kafur said that Hitaat is plotting to be the Sultan. Khilji got angry at Hitaat and Sultan even being used in the same sentence. And then he says" aasmaan ka har sitaara chaand banna chahta hain, par ban nahin sakta". He was angry that Kafur could even imply that Hitaat is capable of stealing the throne from him.

I think you saw the online version where that dialogue is missing.😆

The slapping was not related to Padmavati, because after Khilji slaps him and says that aasman dialogue, Kafur says " Haan jaise main aapke itne kareeb hoon, par Padmavati ki jagah nahin le sakta" to which Khilji replies "Rani Padmavati" and lovingly reprimands him.

Damn, I know the dialogues by heart😆



Ah! I rest my case :-)

"Damn, I know the dialogues by heart"...lol! I know the scenes by heart! :P




return_to_hades thumbnail
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Posted: 7 years ago
#73

Originally posted by: Sarah007

Sometimes it's the sense of attachment that is misconstrued as love. Real love has no room for abuse or violence.

But true! Complex villains aren't born in a vacuum. I kinda wonder what his childhood or early years were like? Why was he imprisoned? Who raised him? What was his relationship to his guardians like?


I am currently watching Law and Order True Crime: Menendez Murders.

The defense lawyer says of the brothers "We know they did it, but why. You don't wake up one day and commit that level of violence. There is a story behind it" (I have paraphrased the gist)

What makes a villain? It is a tantalizing question. There are branches of psychology, psychiatry, and sociology all dedicated to understanding why some people become violent criminals.

It is a common theme in Star Wars. How did the innocent Anakin Skywalker become Darth Vader? And now, how did Ben Solo - the son of Han and Leia, nephew of Jedi master Luke - become Kylo Ren the dark Sith Lord.

Exploring the creation of a villain often humanizes a villain. It evokes a certain level of sympathy and understanding for a heinous character. It is easy to do in fiction because the atrocities of the villain are not real. No human being has actually suffered at the hands of the villain.

Doing so for a real-world villain is a tricky subject. It is one thing to write a thesis paper in strict academic confines. But to present a popular culture story that may make viewers feel sympathy for a mass murderer or terrorist is ill-advised. They are real villains. Their atrocities are real. Real people have suffered. Real people have experienced PTSD or other mental health issues or physical suffering due to the villain. No matter how authentic the story - if it evokes even a smidge of sympathy - it will be met with ire and controversy.

But another interesting facet of human psychology is that we are OK humanizing in-group villains but humanizing out-group villains upsets people.

For example take the "The McVeigh Tapes: Confessions of an American Terrorist". It was narrated by liberal flag bearer Rachel Maddow. Although met with resistance - most Americans accepted the documentary that painted McVeigh as a disillusioned American and somewhat of a martyr. Can you imagine a similar documentary on a Muslim bomber?

Compare and contrast the narrative around unarmed innocent black men being shot and white nationalist mass shooters.

Black men will be depicted through frightening mug shots. They will delve into all the negative parts of their history. They will be depicted as dangerous. A lot of effort is made to demonize them so that the shooting doesn't seem totally unjustified.

White mass shooters will be depicted through innocent photos from friends and family. They will delve into all the good parts of their history. They will be depicted as soft-spoken or introverted. A lot of effort is made to humanize them and create justified violence narratives.

So don't expect a Khilji prequel on why he was such a deranged person - unless its one that shows he was a born psychopath. Because not only is Khilji real - in India he is an out-group villain.


Ultimate_Shadow thumbnail
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Posted: 7 years ago
#74
i couldn't relate to Ranveer's portrayal of khilji despite giving such a powerful performance,
he looks menancing evil and overpowering but still he's too sweet to be that beast you gonna hate ultimately u end up liking him because he is Ranveer and not khilji and that's where the film loses its steam

considering shahid was the hero, his performance had put me to sleep. Raja Ratan Singh or whateva...he looked an extra in this film !
Sarah007 thumbnail
Posted: 7 years ago
#75

Originally posted by: return_to_hades


I am currently watching Law and Order True Crime: Menendez Murders.

The defense lawyer says of the brothers "We know they did it, but why. You don't wake up one day and commit that level of violence. There is a story behind it" (I have paraphrased the gist)

What makes a villain? It is a tantalizing question. There are branches of psychology, psychiatry, and sociology all dedicated to understanding why some people become violent criminals.

It is a common theme in Star Wars. How did the innocent Anakin Skywalker become Darth Vader? And now, how did Ben Solo - the son of Han and Leia, nephew of Jedi master Luke - become Kylo Ren the dark Sith Lord.

Exploring the creation of a villain often humanizes a villain. It evokes a certain level of sympathy and understanding for a heinous character. It is easy to do in fiction because the atrocities of the villain are not real. No human being has actually suffered at the hands of the villain.

Doing so for a real-world villain is a tricky subject. It is one thing to write a thesis paper in strict academic confines. But to present a popular culture story that may make viewers feel sympathy for a mass murderer or terrorist is ill-advised. They are real villains. Their atrocities are real. Real people have suffered. Real people have experienced PTSD or other mental health issues or physical suffering due to the villain. No matter how authentic the story - if it evokes even a smidge of sympathy - it will be met with ire and controversy.

But another interesting facet of human psychology is that we are OK humanizing in-group villains but humanizing out-group villains upsets people.

For example take the "The McVeigh Tapes: Confessions of an American Terrorist". It was narrated by liberal flag bearer Rachel Maddow. Although met with resistance - most Americans accepted the documentary that painted McVeigh as a disillusioned American and somewhat of a martyr. Can you imagine a similar documentary on a Muslim bomber?

Compare and contrast the narrative around unarmed innocent black men being shot and white nationalist mass shooters.

Black men will be depicted through frightening mug shots. They will delve into all the negative parts of their history. They will be depicted as dangerous. A lot of effort is made to demonize them so that the shooting doesn't seem totally unjustified.

White mass shooters will be depicted through innocent photos from friends and family. They will delve into all the good parts of their history. They will be depicted as soft-spoken or introverted. A lot of effort is made to humanize them and create justified violence narratives.

So don't expect a Khilji prequel on why he was such a deranged person - unless its one that shows he was a born psychopath. Because not only is Khilji real - in India he is an out-group villain.



That's a fascinating take on the subject! It's been a long time since I've watched L&O. Need to brush up on the series again. :-)

I was aware that giving him any human-like traits would make it controversial considering that he was real and has committed acts of cruelty during his reign. And I'm sure Sanjay Leela Bhansali himself must have been aware of that and with all the brouhaha that it generated, I doubt he wanted to make the movie any more controversial. But considering all the creative licence SLB has displayed here I was left wondering what it would be like to see a prequel or sequel.

I agree. This would probably create more protests than it already did. And you do have a point. It would have been easier to do this with a fictional character than one that is based on a real person.

Man... Ranveer Singh should play a vampire someday! :D He almost makes evil look good ;-)


Edited by Sarah007 - 7 years ago
Sarah007 thumbnail
Posted: 7 years ago
#76
I wonder how Allaudin Khilji handled the situation after the doors were broken down. The Jayasi's version states that he learned his lesson and that he wanted to "avoid this" but it's unfortunate that SLB wanted to end this Devdas style :-/
Mallika-E-Bhais thumbnail
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Posted: 7 years ago
#77
^^They ended with Padma with her head held high but I am sure it must've been a life-long grouse that he could not get her.

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