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ProfMcGonagall thumbnail
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Posted: 7 years ago

Originally posted by: pamk06


@bold 1Well, apple does not fall far away from the tree then. Like mother, like son. Both are waiting for everything to just fall in its place.

@ bold 2 :Frankly, I had lot of issues with that whole scene. First, Dida has no problem asking random people for help to fix their family matters. Second, I am sure Yaminicould feel that her DIL in clutching her to be away from Kunal and is not comfortable even with the idea of her son touching her so. Even though she is tolerating this whole reconciliation drama, shouldn't she have raised an objection in support of her DIL when she was saying that she has pain in the leg and cannot dance. Thirdly, either this society is very understanding or the whole society is in league with Dida to reconcile these two, because where is the gossip, where is the finger-pointing. Infact, in the precap we hear them talking about their love. I guess I gave too much credit to the neighbor, Sweety.



@ Bold 1: I think where Yamini and Kunal differ is that Yamini will raise her voice when it gets too far. Kunal won't. He'll just quietly go along with everything.

@ Bold 2: Agreed on Sweety part. I actually thought Sweety would spread the news quickly and with lots of mirch masala, but either she hasn't said anything or she's one of those gossipmongers that no one believes. Every society has one. That one person who gossips about everything and at some point people realize she's making up stuff so they stop believing it.

It could also be that people just decided not to raise fingers because it is a happy time, a festival and pooja. Maybe they'll question and raise fingers afterwards. I just say this because I know that in one of my cousin's society in India, there was talk about this one couple who were living together unmarried (haww the horror), but the society found out during Navratri so no one said anything. After it was over, a group of society members went over to the house and demanded that the couple leave because yahan izaatadaar log rehte hain. I don't know what happened because I wasn't interested in finding out and my cousin doesn't get involved in all this stupidity, but my guess is that they were either forced to get married or they got kicked out.
rajh thumbnail
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Posted: 7 years ago

Originally posted by: WhyHate



@ Bold 1: I think where Yamini and Kunal differ is that Yamini will raise her voice when it gets too far. Kunal won't. He'll just quietly go along with everything.

@ Bold 2: Agreed on Sweety part. I actually thought Sweety would spread the news quickly and with lots of mirch masala, but either she hasn't said anything or she's one of those gossipmongers that no one believes. Every society has one. That one person who gossips about everything and at some point people realize she's making up stuff so they stop believing it.

It could also be that people just decided not to raise fingers because it is a happy time, a festival and pooja. Maybe they'll question and raise fingers afterwards. I just say this because I know that in one of my cousin's society in India, there was talk about this one couple who were living together unmarried (haww the horror), but the society found out during Navratri so no one said anything. After it was over, a group of society members went over to the house and demanded that the couple leave because yahan izaatadaar log rehte hain. I don't know what happened because I wasn't interested in finding out and my cousin doesn't get involved in all this stupidity, but my guess is that they were either forced to get married or they got kicked out.


as mouli says - she is indifferent to society gossips..
and society usually raises fingers on weak people..and mouli is not the one who takes this raising fingers silently..she will fight back-and -with such fierce women nobody going to take risk..
ProfMcGonagall thumbnail
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Posted: 7 years ago

Originally posted by: music_l0ver036

@mango_pudding. I understand what you're trying to say. It's very difficult to get a person out of an abusive relationship. No matter how much their friends try to explain to them, if they can't see it, it's not going to end. I do give a lot of credit to Mauli tho, she gave Nandani a safe space until Nandani could gather the courage to tell Rajdeep off. However, while Mauli was helping Nandani, so was Kunal. I think I read it on this thread but Kunal was there for Nandani physically. He talked her out of committing suicide, during the elevator scene and when Kunal and Nandani were stuck in her apartment, it was kunal that consoled her and made her feel better and took away her fear. Mauli is kind of harsh on her approach, which can be taken the wrong way. I am the kind of person that would appreciate Kunal's approach better because he wouldn't make me do anything uncomfortable that I didn't want to do but Mauli would leave me to the sharks and tell me to figure out my own way back. Point is, they're a contrast. When Nandani was dancing and her blouse's zip was about to expose her, Kunal literally went right to her and saved her from embarrassment and Mauli, though shocked, couldn't really do anything. I think that could be another reason why Nandani latched on to Kunal. And obvious Mauli has also been there for her physically, Nandani obviously's motive is her failed marriage. She wants a man's love and acceptance. And here's Kunal professing that to her. So from Nandani's point of view, Kunal played a bigger role in getting her out of an abusive relationship. Also, Mauli can just tell Nandani that she deserves better while Kunal could show it. During the earlier episodes she thought how crazy it is that a marriage could be this healthy and mutually respectful. From that time on, she started building the courage that oh yeah I can't stay with Rajdeep because he'll never treat me the way Kunal treats Mauli.

However, what was the point of showing Nandani longing for Mauli and her life-long friendship in the beginning when she wasn't going to really feel remorse about taking her husband. The only aspect of the show I have hard time understanding.



You put across a good argument for Nandini, but somewhere I feel that whatever Kunal did, Mauli could have done as well. Now I haven't watched from the beginning so I don't know about all the scenes you're talking about, but let's say for example the suicide scene.

When Nandini decided to commit suicide, if Mauli had been there, I'm sure she would have talked Nandini out of it as well. Your argument only holds true in this case because Kunal was there. What if Mauli had seen Nandini run out to commit suicide. She would have gone after her and convinced her otherwise.

With Nandini's blouse unzipping, I feel that this is one place where sometimes a woman doesn't know what to do. If you think about it, when say your bra strap is showing, a gentleman usually ignores it, but a woman points it out. If your neckline is deep, a gentleman will mostly ignore it, but a woman will point that out. Similarly, if your blouse or dress or skirt is about to unzip, a gentleman will try to help you out, but a woman might be at a loss as to what to do. It happened with a friend of mine. We were at a party and the dress she was wearing was tied in the back and that's the only thing that was holding the top part of the dress up. Now she used to wear that dress often, so the threads had begun to wear and that day they finally snapped. One of our common male friends standing behind her caught the threads before they fell and helped her into another room where she changed. I was also standing behind her, but I was actually at a loss what to do. I saw the thread coming undone and my first reaction was to tell her. If I had done that it would have been too late because by then the thread would have given away and she would have been exposed.

Also somewhere it has to do with the character of each. Mauli is a more practical person. Look at the way she is dealing with this EMA. She had an emotional breakdown, but now she's practical. Kunal isn't mine anymore, he doesn't love me, so divorce him. Okay we have to live together for a month, but I won't question him and in fact I'll help him meet his love. That's Mauli. Practical thinking. Kunal is more emotional thinking. He didn't tell Mauli about his love for Nandini because he didn't want to hurt her. He feels hurt seeing Mauli in pain, but he isn't feeling guilty. He came back on Dida's say-so because emotions count. Let's reverse the EMA situation. If Mauli had fallen in love with someone else, she would have told Kunal because it makes sense practically.

Now, let's say all your arguments are correct to this point. It makes sense that Nandini fell for Kunal and Kunal fell for Nandini. But did neither of them think for a second of all the people they would be causing pain to? I don't mean just Mauli. I mean Yamini, Dida, themselves, Nandini's family. Did they seriously think engaging in EMA was better than just divorcing and then getting married? When they first had sex, Nandini had just gone through trauma. And she started pulling Kunal towards her. Is that really the only thing Nandini could think of? Both of their arguments are that they couldn't control themselves, things just happened. Things don't just happen. We take steps towards them. We can take steps away from them as well. Nandini and Kunal could have controlled themselves. When Nandini made a move to leave, Kunal could have let her go. When Kunal tried to come close to her, Nandini could have stopped him. When Mauli would phone and ask Nandini where she was, she could have realized that she was lying and cheating her best friend and stopped herself. But they didn't.
pamk06 thumbnail
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Posted: 7 years ago

Originally posted by: music_l0ver036

@mango_pudding. I understand what you're trying to say. It's very difficult to get a person out of an abusive relationship. No matter how much their friends try to explain to them, if they can't see it, it's not going to end. I do give a lot of credit to Mauli tho, she gave Nandani a safe space until Nandani could gather the courage to tell Rajdeep off. However, while Mauli was helping Nandani, so was Kunal. I think I read it on this thread but Kunal was there for Nandani physically. He talked her out of committing suicide, during the elevator scene and when Kunal and Nandani were stuck in her apartment, it was kunal that consoled her and made her feel better and took away her fear. Mauli is kind of harsh on her approach, which can be taken the wrong way. I am the kind of person that would appreciate Kunal's approach better because he wouldn't make me do anything uncomfortable that I didn't want to do but Mauli would leave me to the sharks and tell me to figure out my own way back. Point is, they're a contrast. When Nandani was dancing and her blouse's zip was about to expose her, Kunal literally went right to her and saved her from embarrassment and Mauli, though shocked, couldn't really do anything. I think that could be another reason why Nandani latched on to Kunal. And obvious Mauli has also been there for her physically, Nandani obviously's motive is her failed marriage. She wants a man's love and acceptance. And here's Kunal professing that to her. So from Nandani's point of view, Kunal played a bigger role in getting her out of an abusive relationship. Also, Mauli can just tell Nandani that she deserves better while Kunal could show it. During the earlier episodes she thought how crazy it is that a marriage could be this healthy and mutually respectful. From that time on, she started building the courage that oh yeah I can't stay with Rajdeep because he'll never treat me the way Kunal treats Mauli.

However, what was the point of showing Nandani longing for Mauli and her life-long friendship in the beginning when she wasn't going to really feel remorse about taking her husband. The only aspect of the show I have hard time understanding.


Yes, thats exactly what happened.
Mauli was the instigator but Kunal was the one who was physically present throughout the journey of her recovery, hence she got more attached to him and he became her pillar of strength. There was a member on this thread itself who had mentioned that Nandini always used the word "Panaah" with respect to Mauli (same with Mauli) but when she talks about Kunal, she says "He gave her maan, samaan, pehchan" So may be in her mind, Mauli gave her shelter but it was Kunal who gave her the respect, strength and identity.

@bold: I guess it was because may be as Mauli was the only person who was left in the world for her other than Rajdeep and who she knew would loves her unconditionally.

Why she does not feel remorse is a question that only makers can answer. We have theories that we have discussed on this thread but thats a mystery that still remains unresolved.




pamk06 thumbnail
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Posted: 7 years ago

Originally posted by: WhyHate



You put across a good argument for Nandini, but somewhere I feel that whatever Kunal did, Mauli could have done as well. Now I haven't watched from the beginning so I don't know about all the scenes you're talking about, but let's say for example the suicide scene.

When Nandini decided to commit suicide, if Mauli had been there, I'm sure she would have talked Nandini out of it as well. Your argument only holds true in this case because Kunal was there. What if Mauli had seen Nandini run out to commit suicide. She would have gone after her and convinced her otherwise.

With Nandini's blouse unzipping, I feel that this is one place where sometimes a woman doesn't know what to do. If you think about it, when say your bra strap is showing, a gentleman usually ignores it, but a woman points it out. If your neckline is deep, a gentleman will mostly ignore it, but a woman will point that out. Similarly, if your blouse or dress or skirt is about to unzip, a gentleman will try to help you out, but a woman might be at a loss as to what to do. It happened with a friend of mine. We were at a party and the dress she was wearing was tied in the back and that's the only thing that was holding the top part of the dress up. Now she used to wear that dress often, so the threads had begun to wear and that day they finally snapped. One of our common male friends standing behind her caught the threads before they fell and helped her into another room where she changed. I was also standing behind her, but I was actually at a loss what to do. I saw the thread coming undone and my first reaction was to tell her. If I had done that it would have been too late because by then the thread would have given away and she would have been exposed.

Also somewhere it has to do with the character of each. Mauli is a more practical person. Look at the way she is dealing with this EMA. She had an emotional breakdown, but now she's practical. Kunal isn't mine anymore, he doesn't love me, so divorce him. Okay we have to live together for a month, but I won't question him and in fact I'll help him meet his love. That's Mauli. Practical thinking. Kunal is more emotional thinking. He didn't tell Mauli about his love for Nandini because he didn't want to hurt her. He feels hurt seeing Mauli in pain, but he isn't feeling guilty. He came back on Dida's say-so because emotions count. Let's reverse the EMA situation. If Mauli had fallen in love with someone else, she would have told Kunal because it makes sense practically.

Now, let's say all your arguments are correct to this point. It makes sense that Nandini fell for Kunal and Kunal fell for Nandini. But did neither of them think for a second of all the people they would be causing pain to? I don't mean just Mauli. I mean Yamini, Dida, themselves, Nandini's family. Did they seriously think engaging in EMA was better than just divorcing and then getting married? When they first had sex, Nandini had just gone through trauma. And she started pulling Kunal towards her. Is that really the only thing Nandini could think of? Both of their arguments are that they couldn't control themselves, things just happened. Things don't just happen. We take steps towards them. We can take steps away from them as well. Nandini and Kunal could have controlled themselves. When Nandini made a move to leave, Kunal could have let her go. When Kunal tried to come close to her, Nandini could have stopped him. When Mauli would phone and ask Nandini where she was, she could have realized that she was lying and cheating her best friend and stopped herself. But they didn't.


@bold:No, Mauli send him there. Mauli still does not know that Nandini tried to commit suicide. That was the first secret between them, where Nandini asked him to not tell Mauli and he agreed.

Thats what kept happening. Mauli used to send Kunal or insist he goes with Nandini if he refused. Hence I say that though Mauli was the instigator in each of the scenes, Kunal was physically present who used to push her, talk to her, help her sort through her thoughts, provide reasoning or just be her pillar of strength as she made her journey of recovery.

EMA is something that does not happen because of circumstances or emotions. It happens because you choose it. Its a choice that you make and they made it. They could have used self-control, Kunal could have let her go, Nandini could have insisted that she should go but they did not, They wanted to be together irrespective of the hurt they would be causing their near and dear ones. Now they have to suffer through the consequences of that choice.


Edited by pamk06 - 7 years ago
pamk06 thumbnail
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Posted: 7 years ago

Originally posted by: rajh



as mouli says - she is indifferent to society gossips..
and society usually raises fingers on weak people..and mouli is not the one who takes this raising fingers silently..she will fight back-and -with such fierce women nobody going to take risk..



Fighting for others and fighting for oneself when you are emotionally raw are two completely different things.

Anyways, I was asking so that Kunal feels shamefaced and guilty. Mauli is not the one who's wrong here.
Edited by pamk06 - 7 years ago
Saazhumsafars thumbnail
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Posted: 7 years ago
Again,I am really enjoying reading everybody's interpretation and views here.Thank you and a hello to all the newer post-ers.
I too think nandini's survivor or self preservation skills were really strong when she was with rajdeep.She wanted to live,wanted to survive and that is why she had got up to warm her body after rajdeep had poured chilled water over her(and reduced the temperature of the room too) even when rajdeep had threatened her to not use anything in the room to warm herself.Perhaps 'want' is a strong word here,it's an instinct which comes to the fore whenever needed but nandini was shown to try and survive somehow multiple times.Have any of you read of domestic violence cases where the victim had lost the will/instinct to survive?I am wondering if all or most behave like nandini or some ultimately lose the primary instinct to somehow survive.I think I will go try and search and read a bit about this.

But back to nandini's self preservation..where did all of it go when she started betraying mauli?Mauli did have nandini's back,didn't she?I keep thinking that by betraying mauli nandini has done bad to herself too,to lose that one strong support system,to invite the anger and humiliation of friend,family and society is not self preservation.She did not once wonder or think that by betraying mauli she is going to lose so many people who stood between her and rajdeep and losing these people would put her in the hands of grave danger too(the first thing rajdeep did after mauli had come to know about the affair was go to nandini's place and physically abuse her).But I suppose nandini's self preservation skills are more immediate,she is not of a completely healthy,stable mind to be able to process and think about all of this.
I personally would never lose so strong a support system like mauli,even if I wouldn't feel for her as strongly as she would feel for me.I think it would be such a sensible,practical and slightly selfish thing to do.But I understand nandini is not like me and not thinking,processing all of this and not acting practically is in her character.
Krinya thumbnail
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Posted: 7 years ago
Now i realize why is nandu so thankless and ungrateful to mauli ... When everyone discredited mauli completely and held her responsible for cracks in her marriage , what can i say ...nandu may be thinking on the similar lines and totally shunned mauli from her life . ...its kunal who actually helped her out and she was a born fighter..hhmm...sorry my bad ..
Edited by _charu_ - 7 years ago
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Posted: 7 years ago

Originally posted by: _charu_

Now i realize why is nandu so thankless and ungrateful to mauli ... When everyone discredited mauli completely and held her responsible for cracks in her marriage , what can i say ...nandu may be thinking on the similar lines and totally shunned mauli from her life . ...its kunal who actually helped her out and she was a born fighter..hhmm...sorry my bad ..



@charu -- think you have misunderstood; this topic from the beginning has been about the writing and characterization. so rather than our personal opinions on these characters, we are trying to understand the characters from a literary kind of angle. what are the CVs trying to say? why would these characters act in this way? our personal feelings may not agree with what these characters are doing but that is not the point of this topic. the thread here is trying to understanding the character sketch simply based on what CVs are writing and presenting.

so it is not about discrediting mauli's help but rather the question was why would nandini discredit mauli. why would nandini give kunal all the credit instead of mauli? and so we have to look at how the CVs have presented the story and try and see it from the perspective of the character of nandini.

now we may or may not agree with that line of thinking but that is not the point of this topic. it is about the story and characterization from a literary/writing kind of perspective. and it is difficult because there are super large holes in terms of writing which makes it very frustrating...
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Posted: 7 years ago

Originally posted by: music_l0ver036

@mango_pudding. I understand what you're trying to say. It's very difficult to get a person out of an abusive relationship. No matter how much their friends try to explain to them, if they can't see it, it's not going to end. I do give a lot of credit to Mauli tho, she gave Nandani a safe space until Nandani could gather the courage to tell Rajdeep off. However, while Mauli was helping Nandani, so was Kunal. I think I read it on this thread but Kunal was there for Nandani physically. He talked her out of committing suicide, during the elevator scene and when Kunal and Nandani were stuck in her apartment, it was kunal that consoled her and made her feel better and took away her fear. Mauli is kind of harsh on her approach, which can be taken the wrong way. I am the kind of person that would appreciate Kunal's approach better because he wouldn't make me do anything uncomfortable that I didn't want to do but Mauli would leave me to the sharks and tell me to figure out my own way back. Point is, they're a contrast. When Nandani was dancing and her blouse's zip was about to expose her, Kunal literally went right to her and saved her from embarrassment and Mauli, though shocked, couldn't really do anything. I think that could be another reason why Nandani latched on to Kunal. And obvious Mauli has also been there for her physically, Nandani obviously's motive is her failed marriage. She wants a man's love and acceptance. And here's Kunal professing that to her. So from Nandani's point of view, Kunal played a bigger role in getting her out of an abusive relationship. Also, Mauli can just tell Nandani that she deserves better while Kunal could show it. During the earlier episodes she thought how crazy it is that a marriage could be this healthy and mutually respectful. From that time on, she started building the courage that oh yeah I can't stay with Rajdeep because he'll never treat me the way Kunal treats Mauli.

However, what was the point of showing Nandani longing for Mauli and her life-long friendship in the beginning when she wasn't going to really feel remorse about taking her husband. The only aspect of the show I have hard time understanding.



@bold 1 - thanks! wasn't sure if people would understood what I was trying to convey. yes, mauli went above and beyond the call of friendship but at the end of the day, nandini had to make that choice for herself to leave. now, why she felt kunal's help more and underplayed mauli is the big million dollar question.

@bold2 -- so i had to think of your question and I was reminded of all these old songs like carpenter's "yesterday once more" or beatles "there are places I remember" -- the lyrics are really powerful and so it makes you reminiscence about different memories..

so there is a list of words from different languages that are not translatable and one of the words that often appears is saudade from the portuguese language. and there is something about the meaning of the word that inspires a lot of reflection. so here's from one blog:

I just came across the word saudade. Of Portuguese origin, in a whole bunch of clumsy English words, saudade means "the love that remains after someone is gone. It's the recollection of feelings, experiences, places or events that once brought excitement, pleasure, wellbeing, which now triggers the senses and makes one live again. It describes a deep nostalgic longing.

But it goes deeper implicit in the emotion is the fact it often carries a repressed knowledge that the object of longing will never return. It can be described as an emptiness, like someone (your children, parents, sibling, grandparents, friends, pets) or something (places, things you used to do in childhood) that should be there in a particular moment is missing, and the individual feels this absence. It can also describe a love for something that you know will never exist.

Saudade: It brings sad and happy feelings all at once; sadness from missing something loved and happiness for having experienced the love.

I can conjure this feeling. This kind of love is so potent and melancholy that it lingers. It's a love that lunges forward in anticipation, but with nothing to meet it, it can only keep reaching out further. This brings a doubling of emotion. Plus a sense of aloneness out there in the ether, forever reaching for love. I've felt this love for my dead grandfather. I've felt this love for the child I can't have. I feel it for the little girl I once was.

You?

http://www.sarahwilson.com/2014/10/a-beautiful-word-saudade/

so if I look at it from the perspective of saudade, perhaps nandini missing mauli was that kind of feeling. perhaps, it wasn't just mauli she missed but herself. for a time when she was happy, had family and friends, was free to be herself. but then why do this kind of betrayal? perhaps, what she was missing cannot be captured again and so she felt no remorse in betrayal. but since the CVs didn't spell it out, we can only guess. maybe, in the end, it just boils down to selfishness where she just chose her own happiness.

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