21/6-Kesar. Talli. Selfish.

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nm21

@nm21

Voyager

+ 2

Posted: 14 years ago

My heart went out to her today...Talli.
"Maine tere bare mein socha hi nahi..."

Although I was saddened when PaanBaa didn't answer Kesar's question-I reckoned with the mother in her who makes their child realise their mistake. Yes, you've told me your decision. Yes, Gulaal has declared what she wants...but in between you both there is an innocent girl being crushed.

Talli.

She still cries in the pain of the aftermath, the spectacle of that wedding. We get to the last round...the last few steps till she has lived her dream and suddenly everything is reversed. In slowmotion she looks up in horror as Kesar finally speaks his mind...the dream now turning into a frightful nightmare.
The wedding is stopped before it reaches it's ultimate stage.
Then again during the panchayat hearing...Sudha fights Talli's corner for her admist the gathering of the Pancho and society. But it's not what she wants, and again she stands alone, isolated...I don't want Kesar to be punished, it wasn't Gulaal's fault.
I was really annoyed at Kesar's selfishness today...for some reason I just couldn't stop looking at it from Talli's pov. Kesar is hurt, but when PaanBaa mentioned Talli it wasn't so you could rub salt in the wounds.
He stops her and forces her to listen, he is burdened by his guilt. Of course he didn't consider her once eventhough he decided she would be his bride...
He tells her he hasn't come to explain or apologise, but again his conversation was only one thing. Selfish. Your much better off than me Talli, you already knew you loved me but as soon as I was acquainted with the feeling, the object to my affection, Gulaal left me. It took me ten years to acknowledge my love for her...
I watch in shock as he says this to Talli and not once it occurs to him, Talli who states she has loved him since she became aware of the feeling...for Talli, those ten years probably feel a complete waste, a punch in the gut. The realisation that she had bred a form of unrequited love for so long would have left her shattered...and the tears flow automatically and uncontrollably from her eyes. The pain he experiences right now is for losing someone he only appreciated for those days; even before when he was unaware of his feelings, atleast he could hate Gulaal in order to release some of his pain and the surge of emotions he couldn't comprehend...but Talli has only ever learned to love Kesar. When you love someone for so long...it isn't so easy to teach yourself to hate them.
It may have been nice to experience the love, "tune kamse kam apne pyar ko jiya to sahi", and for Talli maybe that will be enough...maybe for Gulaal, Vasan't love is what keeps him fresh in her mind everyday but is it really enough? Does it not hurt to think that Kesar's every gesture which made Talli think he loved her was a complete misunderstanding? Every smile, every nice word he said, every playful chase? Is that gesture not just the same as him agreeing to marry her and then saying he has always considered his wife to be Gulaal? She may have lived the emotion...but those same experiences are cutting her up now.
Even when Talli turned around and spoke her mind...she didn't say enough. Atleast she made Kesar realise that sometimes what goes around does indeed come around. I hope Gulaal accepts Kesar...but for now it's shown- no good deed goes unpunished...Kesar realises that today.

Thanks for reading, sorry about the rant.
xo

p.s. the scene was very sawariya-like. Very blue...

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Frequent Posters

EXOL

@EXOL

Trailblazer

+ 7

Posted: 14 years ago

I agree. Even my heart went out for Talli today . And I also felt the same way when he started saying that atleast u could live your love for so many years. He was still absorbed in his own pain . I dont know how this coould have comforted Talli. may be as Kesar confessed he is very weak compared to her.

and yes i loved the whole blue shade in that scene..even they both were wearing blue dress

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Lennie

@Lennie

Trailblazer

+ 5

Posted: 14 years ago

Hey nm21

You have to feel for Talli, just imagine her situation and feelings which as Paanbha says no one really has given a thought to as such (i know why Gulaal hasnt been able to be there for her as she usually is, the guilt she feels but atleast we did see scenes of them and Talli coming to Gulaal, which also showed she holds nothing against Gulaal, but that doesnt mean the pain is any less does it, and like you say she loved Kesar, so i think most resentment would be against him, not in a bad way but in a natural reaction way ) - you should feel something for Talli even if its out of empathy atleast, and i agree with you that even today i felt that as i said in my post that instead saying sorry which i know Kesar did in a way, he still somewhat just talked about himself and his love - what was Talli going to say to him, she is still absord in her pain as she recollected her memories of Kesar and so on, and then it was no wonder that Talli said what she did, in whatever she said, because at of the day, the whole convo that started just went on about him and so on, and yeah it did show that he was weak compared to her in a way.

At the end of the day the thing is it doesnt matter if Kesar didnt say ILU or saw her as more or that Gulaal made promises and so on (she knows Gulaal didnt give a false promise and she knows that fate played some kind of trick with all of them esp her and Gulaal), the thing that made it real was Kesar agreeing to marry her and it was his decision at the end of the day coz he stepped up to it, and he even knows that - and he knows he shouldnt of let it get far, but we all saw that he didnt once really think about Talli in all this esp when he made the decision did he... and what he was planning hence thats why i see him saying sorry and so on and he realises that as well and feels guilty as well (Kesar knows his place in what he did was wrong, he isnt blaming anyone as well or putting the blame on anyone or making excuses... he just accepts it (coz he let it get far as in having the wedding, rasams and so on isnt it), thats one of the other things i like about Kesar)

Talli has seen the anger and rudeness that Kesar had unleashed on Gulaal when he came back so much (as she spent time with Kesar and also is close to Gulaal), so her talk today does come from her, but as we all know Talli doesnt know exactly what Kesar knows about the Vasant's truth and so on and why such anger on Gulaal it was, but only what Talli sees of what and how Kesar was like with Gulaal and also her that was why i felt she said what she did, i dont think Talli said anything wrong as such - he has broke both their hearts and his own heart is broken as well...

Edited by Lennie - 14 years ago

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bintus02

@bintus02

Explorer

Posted: 14 years ago

While we can all sympathise with what happened to Talli, Kesar never said that he loved her or pretended otherwise. We also aknowledged that he should never have agreed to marry her, although it was in a way to punish Gulaal for making decision about his life without consulting him first. The two people who were wholly responsible for Talli's present sad state are Gulaal and Sudha, you cannot blame Kesar for their empty promises. And Talli blaming Kesar for breaking her own heart I can understand, but Kesar breaking Gulaal's heart is a bit too much to comprehend.

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@ShellJA

Dazzler

Posted: 14 years ago

Agree that Tallie has become the collateral damage in the conflict between Kesar and Gulaal. Agree that Kesar selfishly used her as a weapon to hurt Gulaal.

However, the grief Tallie is facing is of her own making. The day before she agreed to marry Kesar she heard him say that he didn't love her and has never thought of her as anything other than a friend. But she agreed to marry him. She saw evidence of another woman in his life but she ignored it. She saw the letters loving written to another woman and she ignored them . She didn't even open them before the wedding. He told her he bought the chunar for someone else and she still happily took it as if he got it for her. He has yelled at her, he has been physically rough with her but she still agreed to marry him.

There were signs that marrying Kesar was not the right thing to do but she ignored all of them and still agreed to marry him. It is really hard to feel any sympathy for her when all her grief is of her own making. She didn't use her brain! She followed a dream blindly or with blinders on!

So yes Kesar was selfish but Tallie hasn't been very smart either.

Edited by lovtv - 14 years ago

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Nach_Baliye

@Nach_Baliye

Inactive

Posted: 14 years ago

Originally posted by: lovtv
Agree that Tallie has become the collateral damage in the conflict between Kesar and Gulaal. Agree that Kesar selfishly used her as a weapon to hurt Gulaal.

However, the grief Tallie is facing is of her own making. The day before she agreed to marry Kesar she heard him say that he didn't love her and has never thought of her as anything other than a friend. But she agreed to marry him. She saw evidence of another woman in his life but she ignored it. She saw the letters loving written to another woman and she ignored them . She didn't even open them before the wedding. He told her he bought the chunar for someone else and she still happily took it as if he got it for her. He has yelled at her, he has been physically rough with her but she still agreed to marry him.

There were signs that marrying Kesar was not the right thing to do but she ignored all of them and still agreed to marry him. It is really hard to feel any sympathy for her when all her grief is of her own making. She didn't use her brain! She followed a dream blindly or with blinders on!

So yes Kesar was selfish but Tallie has been very smart either.

I could not agree more about not feeling sympathy for Talli. I feel much more sympathy for Kesar because he has been sorely misunderstood by everyone. Talli, Sudha, and Gulaal put Kesar in this situation. Yes Kesar should have refused to marry Talli, but so should have Talli after listening to his conversation with Gulaal about not liking Talli, and having the letters in her room, and knowing full well how badly Kesar treated her. Had Kesar liked her even a little he would not have misbehaved with her. I find it very hard to feel any sympathy for Talli - she allowed herself to be blind-sided by Gulaal and Sudha.

Kesar is collateral damage in all of this. He was put in this situation by Gulaal and Talli. Gulaal gave the gift to Talli and led her on all these years despite knowing full well in Kesar's own words that he doesn't like Talli. And Sudha, she was so desperate to get Talli married and remain in the house that she went with Gulaal's thought of marrying Kesar and Talli without thinking for once that Kesar is already married. On top of that, EVERYONE agreed to marry Talli and Kesar knowing full well that Kesar was officially married to Gulaal - they did not even bother to dissolve the deeyarvattu, showing how little they believe in it despite Paan Baa's doing it with Mota Bha. Why then did Gulaal do prayers with Kesar as his wife, why did Paan Baa ask Gulaal to fast for Kesar, if they didn't believe in the deeyarvattu? Now that I look back, I am shocked at how much leeway Mota Bha and Paan Baa give Gulaal. Kesar is a victim in all of this, Talli is merely a victim of Sudha and Gulaal's desires and her own insecurities.

Paan Baa's telling Kesar about Talli's plight came at a very bad time. It is difficult to see another's pain when one is hurting so much. Kesar just wasn't ready to heel Talli when he himself needed heeling badly, but Paan Baa made him feel guilty so he went to talk to Talli but could not see beyond himself. Its not selfish, its life. That happens sometimes between I and my husband, we love each other a lot but when we are hurting its difficult to see the other's pain. So I understand why he could not see Talli's pain in that moment.

Edited by Nach_Baliye - 14 years ago

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AreYaar

@AreYaar

Icon

+ 19

Posted: 14 years ago

I personally felt that Talli's dialogue to Kesar in that scene just didn't go with the flow of the scene...it seemed very disjointed and random...and doesn't tie in with a Talli actually bringing over Kesar's letters to Gulaal...

I think that scene was about Kesar apologizing once again but also looking for some solace from his childhood friend...he is isolated in that house...no one cares much to understand Kesar and want to blame him for everything...yes, in Talli's case he did wrong with the way he broke off the wedding last minute...and he admitted to it as well...but everything he said beyond that was basically the turmoil inside him coming out again...he is unable to contain it...maybe that makes him selfish for a bit since Talli too is dealing with her own grief being the collateral damage in all this...but nothing he did that warranted Talli randomly turning on him and saying he is very bad...it sounded so childish and random😕

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Mehek25

@Mehek25

Sparkler

+ 2

Posted: 14 years ago

@bintus02

I agree with every thing u have said. If anyone has to be blamed it is Sudha and Gulaal. They were the ones who led her on. But besides that even Talli should realise that all's over now and since Kesar has admitted that he loves Gulaal, and she also has seen from the letters that he loves Gulaal and not her, she should get out of the way.

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without-fathom

@without-fathom

Rocker

Posted: 14 years ago

Heya nm - always glad to see you post (:

So agreeing with a few above me, and disagreeing just slightly with you - while no one takes away my sympathy for Talli being 'collateral damage' (as Shelly very well puts), I'm afraid I can't look at Kesar in black and white and call him selfish either. In fact, of the three characters in this jumbled love triangle if there is anyone who can even remotely pass the black and white test - it has to be Talli. For her, and her alone, I can lay some distinct this is right and this is wrong facts.

Kesar, and Gulaal for that matter, are more complex. Their lives, their histories, their entangled arrangement is much, much more complex. And black and white - or right/wrong, selfless/selfish are just not absolute terms to measure their current deeds by.

Thing is - when we look at things with a rosy glass, we see what we want to see. It has been the story of Talli's life. The culprit rosy glass itself has been given to her by Gulaal and Sudha, and she has been living this dream which even objectively viewing could and should never have been hers to begin with. Whether or not Gul did, or ever will accept Kesar for a husband is still a secondary matter in this light. The thing is, she was always legally his deeyarvattu wife... an that fact alone should have bothered Talli in her growing years, despite whatever assurances because A) the assurances were from one quarter alone, and that quarter held only half control and B) because ever since Kesar has really come back whatever may have been the misleading signs, there were far too many proper indications of his disinterest in her as a lover, much less a life partner. Anyone in her place, who hadn't been handed down that rosy glass and wasn't looking at their life through that alone would have been really, really bothered.

Momentarily, at Kesar's call to marry her, she was perturbed and wondered if he was doing it happily, and momentarily in that circumstance Kesar had his role to play in convincing her... but if his acceptance of her was candid (to her) wasn't his repulsion at even the thought of loving her, forget marrying her (which she has eavesdropped upon in a conversation between Kesar and Gulaal) much more blunt? Yes, he told her he had moved on from the past and wanted his present with her, but should her instinct have kicked in enough to at least read those letters she had possessed at least once in that brief doubtful phase?!

Like I said - my sympathy is with Talli, and the rosy glass which marred what her better judgment could have easily been was not even her own brainchild - there she stands in little wrong; but Kesar too has only the one distinct time of being in error, when he assures her he wants to be with her. If she has been mislead in her seeing of things, he has been mislead with the many dimensional tormenting past, its countless questions, and no one to answer them. If she was in her dreamy mode, he was in an emotional upheaval, and both those states can prove fatal to anyone's logic.

Therein, I believe, Kesar for whatever else he is, or may have been, was not exactly selfish. On a scale of 0-10, I'd probably rate him a 4 at max for being selfish, but that's about it. It's true his regret for Talli's misfortune will not fix her life and dream, but it is also true he is truly sorry about it - even when he rants about his own loss, it's not as if PaanBaa's words about Talli being sandwiched have bounced off him, and when he tells her he's not apologizing, its certainly not because he isn't sorry, but because in his mind he is beyond redemption as far as she is concerned. With Gulaal, he can't see his error of ways; with Talli he can, he does, and he confesses the same. And that can never be a selfish man!

*edit*

Btw, thanks for making a post on this matter - someone had to give a discussion platform to Talli, right?! (:

JZee

Edited by JZephyr - 14 years ago

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Vinitha

@Blueberry_07

Sparkler

+ 2

Posted: 14 years ago

#10

Talli saying that Kesar broke her heart - OK i understand. But how did Kesar break Gulaal's heart? 😕 That i didn't quite get. I feel sad for Talli but she should have known better. She heard it with her own ears Kesar claiming that he doesn't love her and will never love her. This itself should have made her not want to marry him. Infact when he agreed to the marriage, she became all happy at once. If am not wrong there was a scene where Talli asks Kesar why he agreed to marry her but Kesar pushes the question away. Talli shd have been persistent and asked him again but she just let it be.

As for Kesar being selfish regarding the convo he had with Talli in the yst's episode. I don't feel it was a moment of selfishness there. When he agreed to marry Talli as a form of seeking revenge with Gulaal, that i would say is selfish. But when speaking to Talli earlier, it was all in a moment where he poured out what he was feeling from within. All those emotions just came out at once. It wasn't intentionally that he diverted the convo back to his sad love story. Infact i loved how he made comparisons to his love story and Talli's story and how she was at an advantage as compared to him. I never looked at it from this POV... but when looking at it as such, i feel for Kesar more.

Agreed with ya on the Sawaariya setting 😆 It was all too bluish and i was wondering what's with the same colour code with Kesar and Talli 😆

Edited by Blueberry_07 - 14 years ago