Ash-Abhi’s intimate scene dropped - Page 2

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Posted: 16 years ago
#11

Originally posted by: ShadowKisses

The philosophy of theism in and of itself is based on conjecture and mythology. Mythology, coming from the greek "mythos", means a story/narrative. Particular cultures believe a certain myth (story) to be true and tend to use the paranormal and supernatural to explain events that, for the most part, have a rational and logical reason. That indicates there is no definitive way of knowing whether the supernatural exists or doesn't. As such, the theory of theism is simply a hypothesis, not theory. So, if the belief of theism itself is a hypothesis, how can an alternate perception of a myth concerning the hypothesis be offensive? After all, they are both hypotheses. No one has a conclusive and absolute way of assessing which hypothesis is more accurate.
You're dead on with the other part though. They will get a lot of flak, which is rather unwarranted. I don't understand why Aishwarya and Abhishek should have thought of the "family prestige" -- is that merely because it may offend a culture? If that's the case then, movies should never be made as they will almost always offend a culture. For example, a movie in which a human consumes a burger instead of eating another human being can be percieved as offensive by someone who practices cannibalism. Simply because a movie is deemed 'offensive' by a certain culture isn't any reason to think regarding their status. If people find it offensive then, so be it. Rather than reflecting poorly on Ash/Abhi, it emphasizes on the narrow-minded thikning of those who find it offensive.

Honey, they claim to do all this puja paath and also go to temples and what not which is why I am confused on why they would accept roles like this that mirror Ravan and Sita. I think that your theory behind mythology is of course, correct. That said, they are not offending a type of "culture," they are offending a religion which is Hinduism. There is a huge difference in the two. Religion is a belief system-it is faith. This is not what culture is. Even if it wasn't about "family prestige" which I dont think they have - that all went down the toilet a long time ago - I think that no self-respecting Hindu would take up roles like this. Its like a Muslim taking up the role of Allah or a Christian taking up the role of God. Lord Ram is God to us - an avartar of Lord Vishnu. Seeing someone portraying his wife in this manner is offensive. And apparently, they shot for the love scene, correct? If thats not asking for it, what is? Luckily Mr. Ratnam has chopped the scene.
People like M.F. Hussain have been literally chased out of india for offending Hindus/Hinduism. The Senior Bachchan is constantly going on and on about his children, the values he has placed in them and what not so where was he when these roles were being offered to Abhishek and Aishwarya?
Im saying that whatever flak the Bachchans face after this movies is released is of their own doing. They mess up, blame the media, apologize sheepishly, talk about it on a blog, and then go and make another mistake. When will it end? I used to be a die hard fan of Abhishek but I think that he is making some very stupid decisions that will come bite him later on.
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Posted: 16 years ago
#12
very well said brownbutt
this movie is going to be in unbelivable amount of controversy...!! they better not cry foul about it..caz this was totally them asking for it.
Jodha Akbar which had nothing to do with any religion brought in so much controversy, and here Mani is starting love story between Sita-Ravan!!
that's just absurd, it may be only a myth and mere story for some people...but there are hardcore hindus out there who belive, pray and live this stuff. Just imagine if the movie showed Jesus or Allah making love or something like that which is not in their religion. it would obviously outragious for that group of people
most controversies r/t bolly movies are attention and money seeking but this one i wont feel sorry for! Mani should have kept Ramayan out of this.
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Posted: 16 years ago
#13

Originally posted by: brownbutt

Honey, they claim to do all this puja paath and also go to temples and what not which is why I am confused on why they would accept roles like this that mirror Ravan and Sita. I think that your theory behind mythology is of course, correct. That said, they are not offending a type of "culture," they are offending a religion which is Hinduism. There is a huge difference in the two. Religion is a belief system-it is faith. This is not what culture is. Even if it wasn't about "family prestige" which I dont think they have - that all went down the toilet a long time ago - I think that no self-respecting Hindu would take up roles like this. Its like a Muslim taking up the role of Allah or a Christian taking up the role of God. Lord Ram is God to us - an avartar of Lord Vishnu. Seeing someone portraying his wife in this manner is offensive. And apparently, they shot for the love scene, correct? If thats not asking for it, what is? Luckily Mr. Ratnam has chopped the scene.
People like M.F. Hussain have been literally chased out of india for offending Hindus/Hinduism. The Senior Bachchan is constantly going on and on about his children, the values he has placed in them and what not so where was he when these roles were being offered to Abhishek and Aishwarya?
Im saying that whatever flak the Bachchans face after this movies is released is of their own doing. They mess up, blame the media, apologize sheepishly, talk about it on a blog, and then go and make another mistake. When will it end? I used to be a die hard fan of Abhishek but I think that he is making some very stupid decisions that will come bite him later on.

Your assertion that they would potentially be offending the religion, Hinduism, is correct. I disagree on the point that religion and culture are poles apart, though. I'm tempted to argue that religion is a form of culture due to the aspects which both encompass. Religion consists of shared values, beliefs and rituals, which are all trademark characteristics of a culture. Religion also creates a common identity among a group of people - essentially the definition of culture. While yes, religion does entail more than just those characteristics, it is still a form of culture. I can understand your confusion regarding the Bachchans doing such a role when they believe in hinduism - frankly, I didn't catch that until you mentioned it. Be that as it may, I still don't think they are doing anything morally wrong by portraying the role of religious dieties. I don't see how providing an alternate story to one that a lot of people believe (not know for a fact, but think to be true --> conjecture) is asking for flak. They are merely providing a different perspective of it; that isn't so bad when you consider that history isn't fully accurate or correct.
On the point of a muslim individual enacting the role of Allah and such, the name James Caviezel comes to mind. Caviezel was born into a family of Catholics. He later went on to enact the role of Christ in "The Passion of the Christ". I can't quite recall the name but I'm quite sure the actor in 'Jesus de Montreal' was Catholic. They or rather Caviezel wasn't excommunicated from his church which would show that they probably didn't find it as offensive as others might expect them to.
I disagree with you on the statment that Aishwarya or Abhishek have somehow exhibited poor values by accepting the roles. The movie itself is a fan-fiction, if you will, of a story (mythos). It just so happens (a not so shocking coincedence) that the story they chose to provide an alternative opinion of is one that is widely accepted by people as a component of their culture. I still don't understand what is explicitly 'wrong' about that. If the movie is not going to be forcing it down the audience's throats that its version of the story is more accurate or closer to the truth but rather just provides a different, intriguing opinion on something that is believed - not known - to be true, then the question of morality hardly factors into this.
Edited by ShadowKisses - 16 years ago
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Posted: 16 years ago
#14
they cant show sita luvin ravana..????
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Posted: 16 years ago
#15
i think its a good idea to scrap the said scene. If rumours are to be believed & this movie is a modern day Ramayan then i think its very important for the makers to be careful about not hurting anyone's sentiments. Some might argue that this is all make believe & one is allowed such cinematic liberties........but a film is made for the public & majority of them are very sensitive about matters related to religion so its prudent to be careful.
Edited by swan20 - 16 years ago
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Posted: 16 years ago
#16
If they dont care about their "family prestige" why is someone else here so worried about it ?

Maniratnam is a sensitive film maker who does not need cheap publicity - I am sure he has thought out the whole thing before going ahead with this movie. I have more faith in him and the films he makes than the combined selection that Abhi and Ash make.
And really we dont even know for sure what the story line of the movie - can people wait to pass their judgements after they actually see the movie ? - apparently not.
Edited by qwww - 16 years ago
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Posted: 16 years ago
#17
See withe emotional richness in India even a simple story of a Married Woman with a unmarried guy is goingto be not hit with Indian audiences. It is difficult for them to deal with it.
But when you say the movie is Ravana immediately you go to the Ramayana. And to say Sita is going tohave an affair with other guy who kidnaps her..that is going to be a like a suicide. No one is going to accept that. And why bring GOD and hurt the sentiments.
But I have full faith in Mani Ratnam. HE is no joke and he is not going to give us anything crap. So I am looking forward for the movie.....irrespective of ASh-Abhi jodi.
This film is going to be different from what media is portraying it to be.
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Posted: 16 years ago
#18
I can't wait to watch this movie. Maniratnam always brings out the best in Abhishek Bachchan. I don't think I have ever disliked any of Mani's films. Mauna Raagam still tops my list.

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