Please try to answer - Page 3

Originally posted by: wayward

no I meant that dragging the river Yamuna and all in the divine sense, I could have believed this in the divine form but the way it is shown makes it look like Yamuna was a women when all this happened, in fact much effort has not been put to make look like a divine river being dragged by a real plough or something, its looking like a women has been forced.

accha Even Krishna and Arjun use to take some kind of drink, it is shown in their picnic what was that? was that not alcoholl?

He actually chose his habit of drinking over his brother, no wonder why Arjun was favorite of Krishna, now I am thoda thoda getting why he )Krishna) would have said such a big thing that Arjun is above his wife, his kinsmen and everyone.

I have even heard that when the destruction of the clan was taking place, at that time Krishna went to Balram and he tried to talk to Balram, however he refused to even listen to him.

painful naa? Just imagine for once what if Krishna was a normal human

haan, may be the case of PTSD or something like that, that's why he would have visited Vrindavan to feel normal there.

accha is it true that Vasudev loved Balram more than Krishna?

Originally posted by: IWasHareeshFan

no I meant that dragging the river Yamuna and all in the divine sense,

Yes, the wording looks pretty intentional. If it was all truly good, then there were better ways to put it poetically.

accha Even Krishna and Arjun use to take some kind of drink, it is shown in their picnic what was that? was that not alcoholl?

Nope, I'd say all alcoholic. From the language, it seems they got pretty drunk too, the difference from Balaram being that their default response being drunk was to flirt with everything and then just take a long nap. I mean they were all social drinkers, only Balaram had a problem stopping at a reasonable time.

In fact, Krishna and Balaram both started drinking when they started hanging around the gopis itself. Many poems and dramas have taken ample advantange of this fact as well.

Arjun and Krishna probably refrained from drinking for those periods when they needed to remain focused, especially given archery, both of theirs favoured sport, requiring incredible precision. For Balaram this was less of a problem since he preferred to go charging into the field with a mace/plogh anyway.

I have even heard that when the destruction of the clan was taking place,

That last bit was probably because Balaram had already decided to end it. Both of them had fought acively in that last war, simply to keep themselves alive till the end. It was in fact ironic how Krishna especially found himself being forced to fight the very same people he had shielded all his life! For Balaram it might've looked like, yeah, see, this is why I drink, just so I don't have to actually deal with this nonsense!

accha is it true that Vasudev loved Balram more than Krishna?

This, honestly I can't say based on any facts. Even if he did, as far as I remember, no one documented that.

But I do feel, after Kamsa-vadh we see Krishna's meteoric rise to a deified status. This managed to somewhat alienate him from most of his family, as in they all still loved him, but were perpetually confused with the is-god/is-not-god connundrum. It was probably easier for Vasudev, in that case, to relate and bond with Balaram more. Also, Krishna did feel enormous guilt with VasuDevaki's condition, the way they were basically broken people. Being the infamous 'eight-child' Krishna might've blamed himself for this condition of his parents and that might've hindered him from developing a natual parent-child relationship with them.

One thing I can see is that Krishna is extremely protective of Vasudev. So much so, that Shalva, the only non-God person to ever overpower Krishna (even if for a few secs), managed to do it by Meghnad-style decapitating a fake Vasudeva in front of him. Krishna moreover never says no to his father, and indulges all the responsibilty-avoiding he does, and making excuses for him with other people, trying desperately to keep up the appearance that Vasudeva is the man of the house and not Balaram. Even when he is going of the Subhadra-kidnapping plan with Arjun he says something like, "so this means I can take the rishta to my dad right?" Even though both of them know very well who's actually in charge here. In fact, Krishna wasn't even interested in the Pandavas that much until one day Vasudeva broke down in front of him, explaining the guilt he felt on account of never being able to help Kunti in her tough times (hello, he was imprisoned??!!). It's at that moment that Krishna promises to make it up to Kunti on behalf of his father by basically adopting her kids and protecting their family no matter what!

Originally posted by: wayward

the difference from Balaram being that their default response being drunk was to flirt with everything and then just take a long nap.

Flirt with everything means? I have started imagining that they use to flirt with trees, rivers, seas, mountains, etc etc etc. btw how will someone flirt with trees, I mean how would it look like"uff iske nazuk nazuk patte, uff in patto me se nikalta hua pulp, iski lachakti hui daliyan uff mai toh mar hi jaun iss ped par".

OK so everyone use to drink, but some people in limits and few crossed the limits

This teaches us that any habit is not bad untill its harms other or yourself, do whatever you wanna do but in your limits, even drinking is not bad untill and unless it does not become a daily rutein and also starts harming others.

So do you mean that he decided to help Pandavs as Vasudev requested him and he eventually ended up bonding with Arjun?

btw what's with Samb aur Samba, why was he so much spoilt? Yes, it is true that he was pampered by Balrama so much so that when he abducted Lakshmana and misbehaved with her then also Balram was the one who went to Hastinapur and released him, Krishna refused to help Samb in this matter. But why could no one look after Krishna's child when Balrama was over pampering him and he was getting spoilt? As far as I know no was doing much work at that time, only Krishna was busy here and there when Samb grew up, so why no one could handle the child even in such a biiiiiiiig family, they loved Krishna so was Samb not their duty? Was it not their duty to look after him and check whether everything was fine or not? and Why Krishna also left him as he was, like did he try or not?

It went to the extent that samb even did (I don't know what to say, I can't find better word here) with Krishna's junior wife/wives, see how worse the matter became, I cannot imagine what would have been the situation when he would have heard that his own son saw his father's wife/wives like that who was/were like her mother.

btw is this story true? I mean is it mentioned somewhere in MB or H or SB?

Originally posted by: IWasHareeshFan

OK so what is your opinion, was it all fake? I mean throughout the epic he has expressed his love for Arjun so many times not just in front of him but even when he was not present, did he not mean anything? Were those words simply words and nothing more than that?

Does Kṛṣṇa ever say that he would sacrifice his own purposes of dharma, artha, kāma - moral obligations, goals, desires for those purposes of Arjuna? Or only that Arjuna the person is more important to him than anyone else, implying that he finds Arjuna useful for his own purposes?

Selfish love can be sincere. And many writers over the centuries have enjoyed characterizing Kṛṣṇa as a fickle traitor who uses and discards his most devoted followers.

https://www.indiaforums.com/forum/post/163646472

https://www.indiaforums.com/forum/post/163641593

Originally posted by: IWasHareeshFan

Flirt with everything means? I have started imagining that they use to flirt with trees

I meant to say everyone, but your version is objectively funnier, now I want that to be the ultimate truth, please (I mean Krishna did marry a river, so who are we to say no to flirting with trees)!

OK so everyone use to drink, but some people in limits and few crossed the limits

Yes, everything should be enjoyed in moderation. This is what Buddha taught as well.been the

Balaram's behavior could be explained from another side as well. From their childhood, Balaram has always the big bro, the protector, the disciplinarian (that part is correct in the TV shows, at least during pre-Kamsa-vadh days). But, when they grow up, Balaram finds Krishna's maturity a little hard to deal with. Over mere months, Krishna becomes better than him in every respect. He's smarter, calmer, sharper. He's by and large the better warrior. Even in a mace fight, which Balaram's pride and joy, Krishna would defeat him in a blink of an eye. Now, I ''m not saying this is a jealousy case, Balaram isn't that shallow, but he does feel extremely insecure as he sees his 'utility' in Krishnás like reduce day by day. He thinks, okay, Krishna doesn't need me, and if he doesn't need me, then what is the use of me bettering my skills? I can just let it all go, and Krishna, if he's such a big boy now, he can go deal with his own problems right?! He's so numb in these stages, that he can't even realize how Duryodhana and Shakuni and Karna are gently nudging him further and further down this rabbit hole, distancing him further than his "Pandava-supporting" brother.

Even though, Krishna loves him, and he desperately wants his big bro to remain the same strict but softie inside, but Balaram is too deep in this spiral to even notice Krishna's efforts, and instead he keeps lashing out at him and pushing him farther away. The two geniuses never actually end up talking about all this (it would literally take just half an hour to sort it all out), and just keep butting heads instead.

It's interesting how Arjun deals with a similar situation. You see, he knows, out of the two of them, Krishna's the better archer. But Arjun doesn't care, his only concern at that point is, how to sweet-talk Krishna into teaching him all these cool tricks! That's his first response to Ekalavya as well, he basically goes, "Who are you? Who's your guru? How did you do that?!" He's actually delighted to find better archers than him (except with Karna), because in his brain there's only one brain-cell, and it's jumping around screaming, "New tricks! New tricks! New tricks!"

That's a very fundamental difference, right.

So do you mean that he decided to help Pandavs as Vasudev requested him and he eventually ended up bonding with Arjun?

Yes, and even Kunti asks her sons to do whatever Krishna/Balaram says because she also feels extremely guilty with not being able to help Vasudeva with Kamsa because she was trying desperately just to keep her kids alive till adulthood in an extremely hostile environment.

btw what's with Samb aur Samba, why was he so much spoilt?

Actually, Jambavati and Krishna had trouble conceiving, and Jambavati used to be very sad when she saw the other wives with their children, and Krishna already had enough children so he wasn't very keen also. Finally, one day Jambavati brought up how Krishna had done tapasya to Mahadeva before Pradyumna's birth, and she convinced him to do the same tapasya again but this time for her. Krishna relented (he never did say no if his wives explicitly asked for something) and did a lot of tapasya, and the result was Samba (this citation I think BA gave in the Shiva thread), who was by the way a carbon copy of Krishna. Samba inherited every feature both physical and personality-wise, except for Krishna's maturity, self-control and the ability to think any more than one hour ahead. Basically, he was what Vrindavan-Krishna could've become if Yashoda hadn't beaten him straight.

As a thanks to Shiva, Jambavati and Krishna name this kid after Shiva himself. While most people weren't aware of Krishna's tapasya before Pradyumna, everybody and their mothers knew the secret ingredient to Samba's birth. This might've led to people basically treating him like Shiva's avatar only, and being afraid to discipline him.

Also, Jambavati defends him all out, only relenting after the curse he gets after the pregnancy prank and then it's too little too late. Even when Krishna tries to rein him in, going as far as (in some versions) cursing him with leprosy, it's always Jamvavati crying and begging till whatever punishment he's given is withdrawn. In other versions, Krishna simply points out based on early symptoms that Samba has contracted some form of s*d from all the parties, and gets blamed for "cursing" the boy. Even Balaram goes to fetch him from Hastinapur only after Jambavati goes to him to complain that Krishna won't go. Even Balarama is furious with Samba's conduct (not with what he did to the poor girl, but rather that he lost the fight and got arrested), he only saves him to 'save the family's face', and he himself is quite done with the mess.

It went to the extent that samb even did (I don't know what to say, I can't find better word here) with Krishna's junior wife/wives, see how worse the matter became, I cannot imagine what would have been the situation when he would have heard that his own son saw his father's wife/wives like that who was/were like her mother.

I feel, apart from the 8 main wives, the other 16100 wives were Krishna's wives only in paper, you know, so they could be eligible to draw a pension from Krishna's personal funds. The rest of time Krishna didn't really care what they did so long as no one insulted or disrespected them for having been kidnapped. Some of the women chose to stay loyal to Krishna (and treat him like a real-but-absent husband) out of gratefulness, but many of the girls were near to age or even younger than Krishna's daughters. Surely, it's natural that they'd be more comfortable with Krishna's children than with him. Pradyumna was a pure family man, devoted to his two wives, as were most of Krishna's other sons, so only Samba was even remotely an option. So I do think there could've been some affair-type thing going on there, but I wouldn't necessarily blame them for it.

Add to that, even Krishna's actual wives rarely got to see him with the amount of work Krishna was involved in, so there's really no saying when, if at all, those women might've seen Krishna on a personal level. So may be they treated Samba as Krishna-part-2, hoping that keeping his son happy may be the only way to express their gratitude to Krishna, since he wasn't that interested in being with them 24/7. Also Samba wasn't the only one who was involved with them, he just was the only guy to get caught red-handed by Krishna one day (orchestrated by Narada...probably this started a chain of pranks and revenge plans that eventually led to the last one).

btw is this story true? I mean is it mentioned somewhere in MB or H or SB?

I think either in SB or HV, I forgot.

Originally posted by: wayward

First of all I am really sorry for replying so late, actually I have read your answer thrice and thought to reply but couldn't as some or the other thing was there

I wish I could do something for Balram and Krishna, although after hearing Yamuna's story I kind have diff feelings about Balram, but of course Krishna loved his brother so much, so just for him I would have locked them up for at least 1 hour and I would have said ki jab tak baat nahi karoge tab tak koi nahi niklega.

I don't know why but whenever I think about Arjun and Krishna I imagine them as 2 lonely souls surrounded by so many people who appreciate them, who think that both Krishna and Arjun are the most strongest people but still they fail to understand them, they just look at the stronger side of both of them but fail to understand their feelings.

One more thing, Pandavs who easily could win Krishna's heart but could not convince Balrama who was more easier to convince and to be won. Why?

(except with Karna), because in his brain there's only one brain-cell, and it's jumping around screaming, "New tricks! New tricks! New tricks!"

I could not understand this, can you please explain?

So if it was out of girls (Krishna's wives) own choice then why did he curse Sambh? If both the sides were involved then why only him?

btw had he ever expected that he would see his son and his wives together? I mean did he expect his wives (other than the main 8) to be like wives to him? if yes then what would have happened I cannot even imagine.

Originally posted by: BrhannadaArmour

I am really sorry for replying so late.

I am happy to know diff opinions and perspectives

btw could not reply to the other thread that you created, I will soon read and definitely tell my views.

Originally posted by: IWasHareeshFan

First of all I am really sorry for replying so late, actually I have read your answer thrice and thought to reply but couldn't as some or the other thing was there

No problem!

I wish I could do something for Balram and Krishna

Haha, that might've just worked!

I don't know why but whenever I think about Arjun and Krishna

Yes they're basically running all their life...Krishna is running from accepting the fact that he's never going back to Vrindavan, and Arjun is running from the accidental mistakes he makes (Ekalavya, Draupadi) and neither of them want to slow down and face their fears (I understand, honestly, but they end up hurting their loved ones in the process).

One more thing, Pandavs who easily could win Krishna's heart but could not convince Balrama who was more easier to convince and to be won. Why?

Yes, Balaram was easier to convince, but you see he wasn't as close to the Pandavas as Krishna is. He does care for Bheem and has some interest in them as a group, but mostly as Krishna's little "project". So when the various situations come up, Balaram depends on pure facts, and tries to avoid emotion. Also, from the Yamuna incident we can probably extrapolate that deep down Draupadi's insult doesn't sting him as much as it stings Krishna. Even then, he offers to go and punish Duryodhan when he meets the Ps in the forest. In spite of everything, he is fair in his assessment.

So, to him, Duryodhan does have a point...purely from the side of the right to the kingdom. The fact that the Pandavas have divine fathers (who can't be summoned to a court to give proof at will right) is disputed heavily by Duryodhan, who basically blames Kunti for bringing 5 random kids and just saying they're Pandu's children. So, by pure human methods, Duryodhan can prove his paternity but Yudhishthira can't. So, then by that logic Duryodhan does have a cleaner claim to the throne (even if it is as Pandu's oldest nephew). Arjun angers him by abducting Subhadra. Plus, Balaram sees Bheem has a tendency of breaking dueling rules, so he is already irritated as a teacher (what Bheem did to Jarasandh, albeit on Krishna's prompting). Duryodhan can hide his tendencies for short times and be extremely polite to the right people (Balaram, Durvasa etc), but Bheem ka attitude is first talk then think, which anyway angered a lot of people. (Also Balaram doesn't like Krishna breaking the rules anyway).

Also, Krishna actually bothers to dive deep into their background, to understand the complexities of their birth and upbringing. Kunti probably wasn't too happy to call more gods for kids after the trauma she suffered with Karna's birth right. The only reason she did it was to please Pandu. I think finding out about Karna early on might've helped Krishna sympathize with her more (I mean, if Bheeshma knew before Kunti's marriage, surely Krishna also knew at least by Draupadi swayamvar). Also, Krishna's accused of being a fraud (and being Nanda's biological child) and a usurper all his life, so he probably relates to the Ps on that front also.

I could not understand this, can you please explain?

I was just trying to say that Arjun is always so excited to learn new things, especially with regards to archery, that sometimes it doesn't even matter to him who he's talking to as long as they have something to teach him.

So if it was out of girls (Krishna's wives) own choice then why did he curse Sambh? If both the sides were involved then why only him?

btw had he ever expected that he would see his son and his wives together? I mean did he expect his wives (other than the main 8) to be like wives to him? if yes then what would have happened I cannot even imagine.

I don't think Krishna was mad about the women specifically...I think he was more annoyed with his son's tendency to excessively indulge. Also, if we go with the other version of the story, then Krishna simply pointed out the obvious symptoms and everyone else made him into the bad guy who uttered bad things about his son. There's also another line of explanation (which is really bad and I don't personally agree with) which is that Krishna was getting older right, and it somewhat pained him to see women flock to his carbon-copy son and not to him like before. Like I said, really bad, but in this version Krishna does curse the women also, foretelling that they'd get kidnapped by robbers. Which I don't need to tell you how cruel it was to say to the women who'd already been through so much trauma with Narakasura. It's like rubbing salt in their wounds!

I think the pressure must've come from somewhere else. People could've said that see, if the women are Krishna's wives (and drawing pension from the state on the basis of that identity), then they have to spend the rest of their lives loyal to his image and refrain from forming any genuine connections with anyone else. If they want to be independent, they must then refuse the pension and vacate Dwarka and go live in the forest or something like "damaged goods" (typical victim shaming). The society must've had a heck of a problem with this half-half arrangement that Krishna (and Satyabhama) had come up with.

Krishna probably did expect Samba to be a little more discreet, a bit more intelligent, and have some more respect for both him and these women to not get romantic with them in front of him, but I don't think he was specifically angry or anything, more disappointed I feel. The way Krishna cared for him, once Samba got sick, sending him to Konark to se special doctors...I don't think,even in the curse versions, Krishna meant to punish him that much!

Originally posted by: wayward

Krishna is running from accepting the fact that he's never going back to Vrindavan

accha even Balram went to Vrindavan then why did Krishna never even visited that place once? Was there any problem in doing that?

Also, Krishna's accused of being a fraud (and being Nanda's biological child) and a usurper all his life, so he probably relates to the Ps on that front also.

Why he is accused? I mean what was the reason to do so? Vasudev called him right? I mean he wanted him to fight Kans and all, Krishna toh was living happily in Vrindavan, in fact everyone knew that Balram was Rohini's son so Vasudev was his father, therefore if only kingdom was the issue then he would have called only Balram and not Nand's son, but Krishna was Vasudev's son that's why toh he called him naa?

and how did he Also Why was he called usurper? Like when Ugrasen offered him the crown he rejected that, when jarasandh attacked Mathura (it was jarasandh only naa) toh he protected everyone (of course Balram was there) but texts says that he built Dwarka city although books also say that the land was Revati's I don't know what is true, but anyhow how he usurped.

accha and was balram interested in handling the kingdom? If yes then Krishna would have freely handedover him everything and bol dete ki bhai accha hai, you are elder, you only take care of everything and he could be free, actually isme toh nothing was wrong also, Balram was elder and if he was interested then he could have handled everything?

So basically Sambh was a shona mona raja beta

In one of your posts you said that

In other versions, Krishna simply points out based on early symptoms that Samba has contracted some form of s*d from all the parties, and gets blamed for "cursing" the boy.

What do you mean by this, what is s*d?

In which version it is written that Krishna was getting old wali story? I mean is it really possible? Like he did so much for his family and even for women, what do you think, about this?

What do you think, Yudhishthir did Draupadi division thing intentionally or it was rules rules rules for him and nothing else, I mean just because mother said something once how can it be like no this cannot be changed, did he also started liking Draupadi?

I mean Arjun asked his opinion but I don't think he would have ever expected that his elder brother who was like his father would say surprise surprise! yo bro, let's all marry her, all 5 of us will marry Arjun's almost would be wife.

I agree that Ved Vyaas told them to go there but I don't think they all went there for marrying Draupadi, may be only Arjun was about to get married, I mean I am not sure though.

btw I don't think marrying more than 1 man was considered something wrong at that time, I mean no one other than Karn said such words to Draupadi not even in dyut sabha anyone told such things, only karn was saying all such things, moreover before marrying Draupadi I think Yudhishthir gave so many examples of women marrying more than 1 husband, I don't know whether this is true or not.

Originally posted by: IWasHareeshFan

accha even Balram went to Vrindavan then why did Krishna never even visited that place once? Was there any problem in doing that?

You see, growing up, there was a new demon in Vrindavan like every other week right? As a kid, to Krishna, those were moments of adventure, a way to break the monotony of village life. He was chill with the demons because he knew no matter what he would always kill them before they hurt anybody. But, once Krishna moved to Mathura and eventually to Dwarka, he grew more and more paranoid. You know, as he started marrying, having kids of his own, basically growing up, he became more and more afraid that the demons will attack Vrindavan in a bid to hurt him indirectly. From Dwarka, Krishna knew, even if he flew on the back of Garuda, it would be minimum a half-day before he can reach there. That's enough time to cause irreparable damage.

So Krishna, in a bid to focus future demons' attention on him and himself only, pretends like he doesn't even know what or where Vrindaan is. He knows this hurts his parents, girlfriends and friends, but he'd rather face their anger and disappointment than attend their funerals. Especially, after Jarasandha burning down entire villages (including Gokul perhaps) as revenge while he is busy moving people to Dwarka, and after Shambara kidnaps baby Pradyumna from right under his nose, from literally beside a sleeping Rukmini, the poor guy is absolutely terrified. So, his best chance at protecting his first family was to abandon them and deal with the guilt of doing that by himself.

Also, you know how we are all so dependent on our parents? Even if they're old, still we take all our complaints and frustration regarding work or life and deep down hope that they can fix it, just like when we were kids right? I think Krishna had that same dependence on Nand-Yashoda. While he was out there being strong for everyone else, he needed them (and the rest of the Vrindavan-folk) to be strong for him. This was something he could only ask from them, and no one else. Even when they were going to Dwarka, I think Nand-Yashoda were invited to come with them, but Nand refused, choosing to stay back and protect Vrindavan from Jarasandha.

That's why you see he spends months in Indraprastha (which is like just one day's journey from Vrindavan), sitting for hours on end at the banks of his Yamuna, and still never goes to visit and neither does he send Arjun. He knows, even one minute's contact with them could spell disaster the moment Krishna left for Dwarka.

Also, how is he supposed to go back there, and face Yashoda (he's technically the reason for her daughter being murdered), face Radha (he's the reason why she was shunned by her family, after their relationship became public), and face any of his friends or gopis who he had explicitly promised that he would come back asap like 20 years ago now? This guilt is also a major factor in him not returning there. Another reason can be personal fear, you know how we see our childhood (the places, the foods, the people) with rose-tinted glasses. With that nostalgia, bachpan ka toh sab achha lagta hai and abhi ka sab bura. Maybe, Krishna didn't want his nice, comforting memories of Vrindavan ruined by going back to see how his precious gopa-family was doing without him. He was too afraid to find out exactly what had become of the village in the aftermath of the regime change and the wars and simply with time. He probably dreams about the lush fields, the lively streets and doesn't want those visions overridden by burnt remnants of houses, and memorials for the people who were his friends, and who had to give their lives fighting his war when Krishna himself was too occupied with building his golden city on the other side of the subcontinent.

For Balaram it is easier, because he was never the avatar, hence not the target for these demons. So, he doesn't bring dozens of threats with him wherever he goes. Plus, he never promised and then broke that promise to the villagers right. He was always supposed to leave Vrindavan eventually and become King of Mathura once Kamsa was dead. So, his return is more of a surprise than a relief.

Why he is accused?

Vasudev had been imprisoned for 25+ years. Devaki, when she got out, was still hallucinating her dead children. I mean she barely remembers giving birth to the eighth kid, and she's not even sure whether it was a boy or a girl. So, here Vasudev's testimony also doesn't hold any water because there's big doubts about his mental stability after so much torture they went through. The opposing people actually held on to that one point ke Vasudev ka toh dimag hi theek nahi toh Nand ne padha li hogi koi patti, kya bharosa (you know owing to that one established fact that Yogamaya and Krishna ka birthday is the same)!

Actually, even Rohini got accused of having an affair with Nand, making even Balaram his kid. I mean logically if you see, Balaram's birth is quite suspicious what with Rohini living with Nand while her husband is imprisoned. Actually, some versions say that Nand is either Vasudev's cousin or even straight up his illegitimate older step-brother. So, both Krishna and Balaram bear some physical resemblance to Nand, more prominently in their values and behavior (it could be an uncle-nephew kind of resemblance but some people also took it as proof of them being father-son). To add to that, Yashoda, has by chance, the same dark complexion as Krishna, thus complicating matter further. The real truth whatever it was, was only directly known to Nand and Vasudev, and Nand, in people's eyes had quite a nice motivation to push his so-called bio-kid into the void left by the mysterious 'eighth-child'.

Actually, Narad came and told Kamsa ki Krishna is Vasudev's son, and then only Kamsa forced Vasudev with death threats and what not to call Krishna to Mathura so he could be quietly murdered. Vasudev definitely didn't want to do that.

and how did he Also Why was he called usurper?

When Jarasandth attacked, first he surrounded the city of Mathura, locking everyone in. Then, he gave the parliament of the Yadavas a choice:

Option 1: They fight, in which case Jarasandha promised to burn the city to the ground, men, women, and children included,

Option 2: They arrest Krishna and Balaram, declare them frauds, and hand them over to J.

My interpretation is that there must've been a vote and I believe result would've come to some 51-49 split in favour of Option 1. So that 49% who wanted to surrender Krishna to a sure death, definitely did not consider him Vasudev's kid, and they had a LOT of problems with the brothers getting a seat in the parliament on behalf of their so-called father and grandfather. Although, most of them shut up once Krishna starts winning them the wars.

The only sort-of impartial people in their favour at that point were Akroora and Satyaki (who himself was quite young, so not much influence yet). There also, Akroora is a very passive guy, he supported Kamsa when he was in power, switching sides only once he was 150% sure that Krishna would win. I personally think Akroora backed Krishna with the planning ke once Kamsa was gone, he would crown Krishna/Balaram as King and rule through them like a puppet-king situation. The one thing he hadn't counted on was Krishna turning out to be an uncontrollable poitical mastermind. We actually get to see his jealousy in action once the syamantaka incidents roll around.

Dwarka land they definitely usurped, having Balaram marry the daughter of the regional leader to give it some legitimacy. Yeah, Krishna did have the city built there, but the land didn't belong to him. At the end with the tsunami, Krishna does mention his desire to give the land back to who they took it from. In the book, it's Samudra-deva but I imagine it to be him backing indigenous people, finally.

accha and was balram interested in handling the kingdom?

I don't think so, Balaram was more interested in moving back to Vrindavan and becoming a farmer there. Although, the official line of succession was:

Ugrasen -> Vasudev -> Balaram -> Pradyumna -> Anirudhha -> Vajra

After the Prabhas massacre and the tsunami it directly passed from Ugrasen to Vajra.

Practically Dwarka was an aristocracy...if you are willing to ignore the Adani-Ambani types getting preference in parliament, you could also call it the world's oldest democracy, with Ugrasen as the figurehead monarch of the various factions of the Yadava community. So, either Krishna or Balaram didn't have like a sole responsibility to take care of the kingdom as every thing was voted on in the parliament anyway. They just had to attend the sessions on behalf of Ugrasena's extended family, and cast their own votes. The extra thing they handled was part of the military and there too they had the help of Satyaki, Pradyumna, Kritavarma etc.

So basically Sambh was a shona mona raja beta

Exactly!

What do you mean by this, what is s*d?

s t d -> I censored it because I wasn't sure if IF would block it.

In which version it is written that Krishna was getting old wali story?

I read it in a work by Samaresh Mitra sir. I mean, if you see all of them as purely human then it is possible. Personally, I don't like this interpretation (and I wish I had just found a pdf of that book instead of buying it because I'm not interested in reading it again ), but logically I can't fully dismiss it also.

In the scriptures, mostly you wouldn't find these explanations, at most you will see the facts (Krishna cursed him), from there it's upto you to fill in the blanks sort of (why did he do that).

What do you think, Yudhishthir did Draupadi division thing intentionally

Yeah, I don't think that Vyasa's original plan, it was just Arjun's dumb joke backfiring spectacularly (bechara life mein iske baad aur koi joke nahi maara Arjun ne, at least book portions mein to bilkul nahi...but honestly aur karo biwi ko objectify, bhiksha laye the janab!!!).

But I remember reading something in MB only I think where Yudi looks at his brothers and realises that all 4 them and himself too are all attracted to Draupadi. Now, he knows that all 5 of them have big personalities, and one person marrying the lady would not go over well in the long run. It is insinuated that Kunti, Vyasa and Krishna all one-by-one realise the same thing that Yudi spotted, and I believe that was what made them start supporting the sabka-marriage idea.

btw I don't think marrying more than 1 man was considered something wrong at that time

It wasn't banned, but it was highly frowned upon. You know, how we can see our society being comparatively more progressive now than in the British era? The opposite happened in the MB society form Bheeshma to Yudhishthira. Life was getting more and more conservative, so no one other than Vyasa and Krishna was wholeheartedly in support, the rest all sort of compromised in the face of precedence. Karna only said what many of their contemporaries had been thinking but were too afraid to go against the Ps.