IPK and Feminism Query#2 Page 36

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DiamondLife

@DiamondLife

Stunner

+ 15

Posted: 12 years ago

#41

Originally posted by: HeadOverHeels

Um... The discussion/thread is about the portrayal of modern women/the character of Lavanya on the show.

This is not a discussion about the plot/story line.

i misunderstood..thanks

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Operaqueen

@Operaqueen

Rocker

Posted: 12 years ago

#42

Loved your opinion on ms. Lavanya Kashyap. I quite liked her character though she started off as a bit of a bimbo initially and I had a problem with her being treated like a door mat by ASR. Yes, live in relationships do have the same amount of emotional investment as a marriage does, so yes it is morally wrong for ASR to have cheated on her. So this serial was actually giving out a mixed message, that it is ok for someone to cheat in a relationship if it does not have the glorified and often overrated tag of marriage,.

I so agree with your opinion about kids, not choosing to have kids does not make one less of a woman than those who choose to have them. the ironic part is that men are equally responsible for Live ins or the decision to remain childless, but it is the woman who has to bear the brunt of the so called morally right society.

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Smriti

@serialjunkie

Rocker

+ 5

Posted: 12 years ago

#43

hi munchy

good to see a topic from you after a LONG time and what a way to go! Awesome topic. The show died for me last February when they forced a marriage on the "traditional" girl. I've been hanging out here mostly for the company of some good friends i made.

Coming to the topic of portrayal of women (modern, traditional, what have you) on Indian TV.

The channels can espouse any number of "Nayi Soch" but the truth is they will not experiment with anything that does not garner them TRPs. An assessment of average viewer will put the demography somewhere between 45 to 70 years of age, women born and bred in different times, 90% of whom did not have the right to choose their partners, education and lifestyle. They have the need to feel redeemed and validated if not in real life, then at least in the bounds of an imaginary TV show. Khushi gives them that outlet by showing how high road, morals and values get the elusive, most eligible recalcitrant bast...errr bachelor to fall in love with you.

Its liberating to know that your life did not go waste after all. That when you were forced to NOT work, NOT pursue serious education, NOT have reproductive choices, NOT have financial independence, heck, NOT even leave your house unaccompanied, that you still are an asset to the society because you brought down the ego of a mighty man and you straightened him. This is the dream SP is selling these women and it will sell till the basic constituents change to a different set of viewers.

Edit

Lavanya is everything Khushi is not. And she has to fall to further cement the righteousness of a moralistic girl like Khushi. Lavanya's entire life has to be a fallacy that she learns to change for the better with Khushi's "help". Another sixer for the traditional girl.

More Edit

Finally, the show is written by a group of kids, yes, kids, who have barely seen enough life beyond the confines of their middle class neighborhoods. Indian socialism tells you that distributive social justice is better than individual achievement, tolerance must replace aspirations, peace at all cost to the detriment of self-worth. A woman who can't achieve those lofty goals does not deserve to get an ASR. (kya cheez hai yeh??)

Edited by serialjunkie - 12 years ago

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654772

Suspended

Posted: 12 years ago

#44

Originally posted by: serialjunkie
hi munchy

good to see a topic from you after a LONG time and what a way to go! Awesome topic. The show died for me last February when they forced a marriage on the "traditional" girl. I've been hanging out here mostly for the company of some good friends i made.

Coming to the topic of portrayal of women (modern, traditional, what have you) on Indian TV.

The channels can espouse any number of "Nayi Soch" but the truth is they will not experiment with anything that does not garner them TRPs. An assessment of average viewer will put the demography somewhere between 45 to 70 years of age, women born and bred in different times, 90% of whom did not have the right to choose their partners, education and lifestyle. They have the need to feel redeemed and validated if not in real life, then at least in the bounds of an imaginary TV show. Khushi gives them that outlet by showing how high road, morals and values get the elusive, most eligible recalcitrant bast...errr bachelor to fall in love with you.

Its liberating to know that your life did not go waste after all. That when you were forced to NOT work, NOT pursue serious education, NOT have reproductive choices, NOT have financial independence, heck, NOT even leave your house unaccompanied, that you still are an asset to the society because you brought down the ego of a mighty man and you straightened him. This is the dream SP is selling these women and it will sell till the basic constituents change to a different set of viewers.

Edit
Lavanya is everything Khushi is not. And she has to fall to further cement the righteousness of a moralistic girl like Khushi. Lavanya's entire life has to be a fallacy that she learns to change for the better with Khushi's "help". Another sixer for the traditional girl.

More Edit
Finally, the show is written by a group of kids, yes, kids, who have barely seen enough life beyond the confines of their middle class neighborhoods. Indian socialism tells you that distributive social justice is better than individual achievement, tolerance must replace aspirations, peace at all cost to the detriment of self-worth. A woman who can't achieve those lofty goals does not deserve to get an ASR. (kya cheez hai yeh??)

SJ!! Looong time indeed. And yes, this is exactly what this series of posts is going to be about. To reveal how SP actually takes feminism years back by claiming it is. If it didn;t claim the Soch Nayi tagline I wouldn;t even be bothered because they are selling what is demanded but what they are doing is false advertising which doesn;t go down well.

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inspiringstars

@inspiringstars

Dazzler

+ 5

Posted: 12 years ago

#45

I completely agree with what you say here, but I always believed that fiction is somewhat based on reality, and if thats true, then I think what is shown in the serial portrays the glaring reality of the society and people that surrounds us.

So the Nayi Soch campaign that they keep raving about is nothing but utter BULLSHIT.

Its shown that women who are culturally rich, who know traditions of their families, are much more a marriage material than a woman, who has a modern approach towards it all. She is considered a perfect representation of an Indian woman as compared to the other who is a considered a mere high society show off. Why cant a woman choose if she wants to know the full Gita or just respect the book and move on? Why cant she choose to be who she wants to be, and be still considered a better person for marriage or anything because of her education, her nature, her sensibilities and approach?

I have seen hundreds of men who are atheists, who get bored of the traditional affairs going on around them and also who tell women off (a mother, sister, wife) for being so dramatic in religious beliefs. Why arent they considered less of a marriage material, and expected to change for the woman? But if a woman chooses to be all of the above, then she is looked down upon, told that she has wavered her path in obtaining the modernity, and so she needs to be taught everything. I dont understand this clear discrimination, but I know its there, and will remain.

Now coming to the debate of living in vs marriage. I know its a bit off topic, but I have always had strong views about this. You are right, for two people to live in, it requires the same commitment, love, trust. dedication as it requires in a marriage. And the breaks up are as worse as the divorce (okay barring the huge alimony issues that go on and on with divorces) and as heartbreaking emotionally, physically and financially. But the society frowns upon them, but when people have secret clandestine affairs in hotel rooms/each others houses behind the closed doors then its fine, because its not out in the open, its not declared like it is when its a living in relationship. So this is hypocrisy. Just like the mothers who insist their daughters come home, before 9 PM, now pray tell me, what is it that you can do at nights and cant do in daylight? Unless its out in the open, its not judged, but judging is a must, thats the motto of people in this so-called society of educational and sensible human beings.

Coming back to Lavanya--

She was a wonderful character, but they screwed it up. Personally I dont see anything wrong in her learning the Indian culture, but I do think the way it was portrayed that she was a dimwit was just plain ridiculous. She was smart, modern woman, but she was portrayed as a dumb shit woman, such that people would automatically make Khushi as a woman worthy of worship. I hate that kind of portrayal, I loved Lavanya too, but there was a time when I would be furious at the creatives for showing her like that.

Okay I get all the love story angle, but after the breakup also, she could have been showed as a woman who independently decided to leave the guy because he did not care for her, and is still working happily, living like she wanted to, probably pursuing any other love interest more suitable for her, but NO they had to show her as a "bechari" rejected by the great ASR for a ethereal beauty and perfect example of womanhood Khushi.

Anyways all the answers here are very thought provoking, and I really look forward to contributing my own thoughts. I will be very interested when you come to ASR and Khushi's characters, in fact even more when you come to Payal and Akash's. LOL!!!

You are wonderful honey, for bringing this out, in a forum full of either complete fangirls, or total bashers.

Edited by inspiringstars - 12 years ago

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NothingLasts

@NothingLasts

Voyager

+ 4

Posted: 12 years ago

#46

Lavanya's the bomb! I still want her to return!

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112642

Suspended

Posted: 12 years ago

#47

At the end of the day... Rishta wayi, Soch Nayi is nothing but a marketing gimmick. As Serialjunkie said, they wont do anything that doesnt bring them ratings. They are running it as a business and i cant begrudge them of a smart marketing gimmick!

As much as we'd like,the TRP demographic isnt the 20 year old college student or a 35 year old professional.. its the women who are older, with the old world view of seeing and understanding things. Thats why you have a traditional Khushi, who changed Lavanya to the point that she became sanskaari and understood the beating dil of ASR. Or a Bhabo or a kokila.

As long as the audience doesnt change, how can the content?

These Characters are created to reassure the older generation, look there is someone like you or reinforce the regressive thoughts in the face of Lavanyas and XYZ.Star Plus, 4Lions have shoved Lavanya in the category of "all that is wrong with society" and bhagwan bachaiye aisi ladki se and it needed a tradtional Khushi to change her, all the while forgetting that Lavanya was smart, sensitive and fabulous woman in her own right!

In the real world, if ASR can get a Lavanya, then Lavanya can help herself to a million ( and better) ASRs. Thank God she left them,when she still could.😆

PS: To be honest, I'd take a f**ked up IPK over Kokila or Bhabho.

Edited by tiya229 - 12 years ago

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parheezGM

@parheezGM

Navigator

Posted: 12 years ago

#48

What a lovely thought provoking thread! Much much needed in this forum too👏. The gushing threads would leave me quite 🤢

I have come to a conclusion that people in general have nothing new to say. I am not talking about clever above average folks, just the aam janta who go on with their daily hum drum lives, doing the same thing year in and year out!! They are so set in their ways that any thing out of the ordinary shocks them no end!!

These are the kind of people these serials are made for... Those who are not capable of any nayee soch! The channel started off this concept with a lot of aplomb but couldn't stick to it for nuts!! 😲

For example when a girl hits her 20's all she is ever asked by my the majority of people is that "beta when will you get married? " after her marriage the question is, "when are you giving us the good news? " after the girl announces her pregnancy and delivers a baby, within a few months she is asked, "beta when will you have the second child? " I'm sure you get my drift by now??

People IN GENERAL HAVE NOTHING NEW TO SAY!! 😡 life for them is just one cliche after another.

I believe in equality of the genders, no sex is superior for me. Men and women are equal in every way. What bugs me in this serial is that whatever khushi embarks upon is always unsuccessfully.

She started off a mithai biz which went kaput

She started her own dabba service which went ppfft

She is always reduced to a beggars position where the oh so mighty asr gets to lord over her!!

It is a very me tarzen you Jane kinda attitude.😕

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Smriti

@serialjunkie

Rocker

+ 5

Posted: 12 years ago

#49

Lavanya's modernism is a myth too.

She is a caricature, someone's romantic notion of how modernity has failed the young girls and is thrust forward as the prime example of that failed experiment - ta da, Lavanya! She is a cautionary tale of the ills of swaying too far to the right or left from centrist attitudes, which must be upheld, eulogized and serenaded by the bastions of culture - aka the traditionally, culturally rich girl named Khushi.

I remember when I had just started watching the show (much after the police incident), I had no idea of the evils of modern girl they were attempting. In fact I remember making a post that I'd take Lavanya any day over Khushi because Lavanya came across as a confident, go-getter even if her goal was as misguided as getting ASR. Khushi came across as an idealistic bumpkin, far removed from reality. Later of course, no stone was left un-turned to paint La as a ruthless, uncultured girl, so it was easy to start disliking her until she was "reformed"

Now, take the following scenarios and imagine when we hear this who do we tend to blame first, yes, even us the modern women...take this quiz to see how all of us are victims of our own limitations:-

1. A man divorces a wife because she refuses to have children w him despite the fact that she had shared her intent with him before they got married. Is she wrong or is he wrong?

2. A woman leaves her kids to be watched over by nannies because she feels she must work and earn a living - for many reasons. It is a well known phenomenon that when women take a break from career after pregnancy, their careers are thrown back by at least 5 years. (google plenty of research on this). Is she wrong to want to continue her career uninterrupted?

3. A woman refuses to live-in with her extended in-laws families as a joint family because she is afraid of interference from all the in-laws. She keeps her peace with them but can't imagine living with them every day of her life. Is she wrong to want this?

4. A woman makes major decisions in the house including her career, car purchase, home purchase, kids education because she is primary bread winner. Her neighbors call her husband hen-pecked. Should she appear less aggressive to her neighbors?

5. A woman decides to divorce her husband because she has truly found her soulmate outside of her marriage. Is she wrong in wanting this?

Edited by serialjunkie - 12 years ago

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WordStalker

@WordStalker

Explorer

Posted: 12 years ago

#50

Munches: Thanks for initiating this much-needed thought-provoking discussion. Over the course of watching IPK, I have steadily begun to shut down faculties of my brain because I realized I didn't need it much to watch what was being shown. This discussion might give me reason to restart those engines!

I must admit first that I don't watch much TV. IPK is the only Indian soap I watch (have ever watched). So I don't have much to compare it against in terms of what is shown on other soaps. Notwithstanding, I do agree that SP's idea of feminism and Nayi Soch is rather tepid. My tag line for them is 'Nayi Soch, Gayi Soch'!

And this tag line is very appropriate given what they did with La's character in IPK. Like you and many others have rightly said here, there was so much potential to show a strong, independent, intelligent and yet moral woman. But the makers chose to show that you cannot be all of that. If you are intelligent and independent, you must have a reason for your 'need' of independence. Perhaps to have a live-in relationship? Be sexually active out of wedlock? Or some such immoral reason.

I would have loved to see the go their separate ways because Lavanya was not willing to become Khushi in essence to please Arnav and he family. The ease with which they showed a career woman giving it all up to become the traditional SP bahu wannabe was disappointing. After working really hard to get to a certain position in your career, it is not easy to just give it up. First you fight hard to get to that position. Then you fight because you have to give it up to become this other person everyone wants you to be. It is a battle many woman fight long and hard, and still lose no matter what they decide. I so wished to see that battle, however briefly. But I guess, focussing on those nuances would have diverted away from the 'main' issues.