What problem does exactly Subu' mom have with Ishita? - Page 7

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Juggaadd thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#61

Originally posted by: paru_rox



I agree on the part where Shagun would use Adi as leverage against Ishita and will try to win back Raman through the brat. But i however do feel that she will go back to Raman only once Ashok dumps her. If Shagun stays true to her character, she will never accept she made a mistake by leaving Raman as she has always clearly shown a disdain for Raman and everything about him.Thus she will go back to him only when she has no other choice left.
She will then let go of her huge ego over this point and go back to Raman once she realizes that now he can provide for her in the same way that Ashok did and he is a family man (who can be manipulated through his kids) which will again benefit her in the long run. Shagun has always been one to look for the most beneficial situation for her.

Also I hope they don't mess with her character and show that she wants Raman back coz she has fallen in love with him (What crap that wud be) but coz she always wanted him to remain in love with her.

You are right. She will go back to Raman because she has no other choice. She might accept it was a mistake leaving Raman because that is what can get her in though the Bhallas will never fall for it. I am just worried about Ishita. Who knows what she might do!
@bold-Yes. That would definitely be the way to go. Whatever the writers do, as long as there is consistency in character, it wouldn't be a problem.
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Posted: 11 years ago
#62

Originally posted by: eternalasha



Great Post Aani and Malika👏

Like others, i have been thinking about this whole baanjh thing since yesterday

In this case I think @magenta and @red in both your posts are pointing us in the right direction.

I think what Ishita has is a self-worth issue that began when she was declared sterile. Let me explain. A google search of Baanjh came up with the following definitions: 1) Incapable of Reproduction 2) Unfit for reproduction of offspring.

1)Incapable of reproduction - set aside for moment whether this is medically verified - if its true that Ishita can't conceive, then it is a statement of fact - just as Toshiji explained - it is when a women can't have kids. While it is incredibly and unimaginably painful it is something that with love can be possibly understood, accepted and dealt with without damage of the soul - note I am not trying to be insensitive here

2)Unfit for reproduction of offspring. Unfit - herein lies the problem -
Historically, especially in India, when women couldn't conceive the intention with which the word Baanjh was used wasUnworthy - unworthy to be a mother, unworthy to be a bahu, unworthy to be a wife, unworthy as a human, unworthy of love, respect or care, condemned even by God as it were. It is the meaning that is applied to the event and word that is the issue.
This is how it was used against Ishita

  • Bala's mom declared her unfit as a DIL
  • Subbu abandoned her as unworthy of being a wife, unworthy of love
  • Prateek - ditto subbu
Take a look from this model - when something too traumatic happens in our life, we can't face or process the emotions, so we decide we are some form of Not OK. We make up a belief about ourselves that dictates our actions for the rest of our lives until the original traumatic emotions are faced and healed. The belief is subconscious and we will do anything to make the Not OK be OK.

When Ishu was declared infertile due to a medical cause TB, that was clearly not her fault but the way her environment treated, taunted, judged her. Ishu felt rejected and abandoned. So she subconsciously made up an erroneous belief that "I am unworthy" or "I am not good enough" She confused what happened to her with who she was a person, as a pure soul. In believing this, she rejected herself.

Then events happened that reinforced the belief I am unworthy for Ishu - Bala's mom, Subbu, Prateek, Mrs Iyyer obsession/desperation to get Ishu married - and then Raman marries her Sirf Ruhi Ke liye and then even uses that against her. p.s that's why this phrase sirf Ruhi Ke liye irks me.

Once at 15 she started believing I am unworthy, she subconsciously did a lot of things in her life from the tunnel vision lens of this belief, to correct what she believed made her not OK, Not worthy. She became a a praiseworthy, obedient, capable daughter, an educated and capable dentist, a praise worthy bahu, bhabhi, even wife and mother - in fact it is hard to find a fault with her but it is not enough. She still gets triggered into a paralysed silence when called baanj. I am not saying she isn't naturally all these things, I am saying she can't experience how awesome they are.

Now with that many achievements, capabilities, and accolades - who in their right mind would call her unworthy - what unfortunately matters is that she does, subconsciously.

@blue in your post, this is where I disagree. Worthiness and Confidence are an inside job. No-one and No-thing from the outside can give you inner worthiness or confidence in a way that is sustainable. Sure she will feel better if Raman praises her but it will be until the time someone rejects or disrespects her again and she will get hurt and triggered. She doesn't experience her own worth internally.

Look at her heroic efforts in the last two episodes, the ladies were clapping, Simmi said she was a hero, Mr & Mrs Bhalla were oozing with pride - yet she couldn't let it in the clear acknowledgement of her worth - maine kuchh nahin kiya- this wasn't just modesty.

Once Ishita faces her original pain of rejection, she will realize that:
  • it was an unlucky medical tragedy with a silver lining that made her strong
  • the problem is with the people that rejected and taunted her and were perhaps even jealous of her.
  • the belief I am unworthy she adopted is faulty - She is NOT her sterility, she is not the rejected.
  • all humans are inherently worthy of love - why would God, create anything unworthy, anything but perfection.
When she drops the belief, she will then fully accept and appreciate all that it is Ishita, the beautiful Ishita that others, love, admire and experience. She will be fully able to receive self-love, love from her husband and it was there today, with attitude but in spades.

Once Ishita recognizes her worth, she will automatically fully respect herself and then others will too. The energy she gives out will be different. Bala's mom won't dare taunt her, Raman won't disrespect her and Pervmeet the predator who has a nose for picking victims with worthiness issues aas-paas bhi nahin aayega

Would love to hear your feedback


Interesting theory. But I disagree. I don't think Ishita has low self-esteem. For me, she doesn't say anything because she is being respectful towards elders be it Toshiji or Subbu's mom. Sure, she does feel bad about people taunting her but her reaction yesterday showed me she accepts her condition. It is just others who keep bringing up and that hurts because people judge you on the basis of a silly thing. Raman supporting Ishita will be shown and that will help in strengthening their relation because finally Ishita has found a man who accepts her totally with all flaws, quirks and virtues, who understands someone's biological deficiencies are not a measure of their worth.
EkPaheli thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#63

Originally posted by: eternalasha



Great Post Aani and Malika👏

Like others, i have been thinking about this whole baanjh thing since yesterday

In this case I think @magenta and @red in both your posts are pointing us in the right direction.

I think what Ishita has is a self-worth issue that began when she was declared sterile. Let me explain. A google search of Baanjh came up with the following definitions: 1) Incapable of Reproduction 2) Unfit for reproduction of offspring.

1)Incapable of reproduction - set aside for moment whether this is medically verified - if its true that Ishita can't conceive, then it is a statement of fact - just as Toshiji explained - it is when a women can't have kids. While it is incredibly and unimaginably painful it is something that with love can be possibly understood, accepted and dealt with without damage of the soul - note I am not trying to be insensitive here

2)Unfit for reproduction of offspring. Unfit - herein lies the problem -
Historically, especially in India, when women couldn't conceive the intention with which the word Baanjh was used wasUnworthy - unworthy to be a mother, unworthy to be a bahu, unworthy to be a wife, unworthy as a human, unworthy of love, respect or care, condemned even by God as it were. It is the meaning that is applied to the event and word that is the issue.
This is how it was used against Ishita

  • Bala's mom declared her unfit as a DIL
  • Subbu abandoned her as unworthy of being a wife, unworthy of love
  • Prateek - ditto subbu
Take a look from this model - when something too traumatic happens in our life, we can't face or process the emotions, so we decide we are some form of Not OK. We make up a belief about ourselves that dictates our actions for the rest of our lives until the original traumatic emotions are faced and healed. The belief is subconscious and we will do anything to make the Not OK be OK.

When Ishu was declared infertile due to a medical cause TB, that was clearly not her fault but the way her environment treated, taunted, judged her. Ishu felt rejected and abandoned. So she subconsciously made up an erroneous belief that "I am unworthy" or "I am not good enough" She confused what happened to her with who she was a person, as a pure soul. In believing this, she rejected herself.

Then events happened that reinforced the belief I am unworthy for Ishu - Bala's mom, Subbu, Prateek, Mrs Iyyer obsession/desperation to get Ishu married - and then Raman marries her Sirf Ruhi Ke liye and then even uses that against her. p.s that's why this phrase sirf Ruhi Ke liye irks me.

Once at 15 she started believing I am unworthy, she subconsciously did a lot of things in her life from the tunnel vision lens of this belief, to correct what she believed made her not OK, Not worthy. She became a a praiseworthy, obedient, capable daughter, an educated and capable dentist, a praise worthy bahu, bhabhi, even wife and mother - in fact it is hard to find a fault with her but it is not enough. She still gets triggered into a paralysed silence when called baanj. I am not saying she isn't naturally all these things, I am saying she can't experience how awesome they are.

Now with that many achievements, capabilities, and accolades - who in their right mind would call her unworthy - what unfortunately matters is that she does, subconsciously.

@blue in your post, this is where I disagree. Worthiness and Confidence are an inside job. No-one and No-thing from the outside can give you inner worthiness or confidence in a way that is sustainable. Sure she will feel better if Raman praises her but it will be until the time someone rejects or disrespects her again and she will get hurt and triggered. She doesn't experience her own worth internally.

Look at her heroic efforts in the last two episodes, the ladies were clapping, Simmi said she was a hero, Mr & Mrs Bhalla were oozing with pride - yet she couldn't let it in the clear acknowledgement of her worth - maine kuchh nahin kiya- this wasn't just modesty.

Once Ishita faces her original pain of rejection, she will realize that:
  • it was an unlucky medical tragedy with a silver lining that made her strong
  • the problem is with the people that rejected and taunted her and were perhaps even jealous of her.
  • the belief I am unworthy she adopted is faulty - She is NOT her sterility, she is not the rejected.
  • all humans are inherently worthy of love - why would God, create anything unworthy, anything but perfection.
When she drops the belief, she will then fully accept and appreciate all that it is Ishita, the beautiful Ishita that others, love, admire and experience. She will be fully able to receive self-love, love from her husband and it was there today, with attitude but in spades.

Once Ishita recognizes her worth, she will automatically fully respect herself and then others will too. The energy she gives out will be different. Bala's mom won't dare taunt her, Raman won't disrespect her and Pervmeet the predator who has a nose for picking victims with worthiness issues aas-paas bhi nahin aayega

Would love to hear your feedback




Hey Sneha

awesome post 😃

@ red - exactly the word made the woman as a whole a worthless being and to be called worthless again and again is something that can chip away at anyone' confidence no matter how educated or modern they might label themselves as- things like these are connected to the emotional aspect of a person, the mind may reason for all its worth but sometimes it loses the battle too, especially once it allows the person to focus only on that.

and that is what has happened with Ishita to an extent her confidence has been chipped away bit by bit not just by that woman, Subu, the other guys who rejected her and Pratik but even her own mom and Raman in a way.

Her mom got obsessed with getting her married so much so she was willing to hide the truth she believed was a detriment to her daughter' otherwise flawless credentials. When Ishita would try to make her understand that hiding a fact is not changing the reality she wouldn't budge. Rather she would try to cajole and emotionally blackmail her daughter into lying and hiding the same thing. She began to see this inability as something to be ashamed off because of her own mom in this regard. People usually hide their flaws and flaunt their positive traits. In Ishita' case the flaw or the inability as I would like to call it become much, much more bigger than her persona which ate away at her self-worth

Even Raman called her unworthy of having a child, not deserving one when she was with Shagun during the custody case of Ruhi. He has NEVER taken back those words. Now while I see a progress on his front - with the precap that had him stop and take back his words last night. He said she couldnt conceive and immediately then uttered its because they have never consummated their marriage which makes it impossible - that one moment - that taking back his words in my opinion is finally the peak of the sensitivity Raman has began to have towards Ishita in his approach but those words are still hanging between them somewhere he needs to amend those sometime

@ purple - I agree with you Sneha that Ishita has to realize her worth and take a stand and acknowledge yes this is my reality I cant change that, revert it and it hurts me to no end but I am not about to make this the only thing about me - the only aspect of my being.

But what I meant here by her needing that boost and confidence, someone else' faith was this - Ishita knows this to be true somewhere at the back of her mind, which is why she could say those words last night esp to Subu' mom that Baanj is a woman who is incapable of love and not the woman unable to conceive. But for her to voice that opinion she needed the faith, the courage which Ruhi' stand provided her, her daughter made her feel and realize so long as she can admit that she isnt wrong she need not take anyone' shit. As Ruhi said to her - why are you crying you are not wrong you are my mom.

That little girl made Ishita strong enough with her love to allow her to speak her mind. Sometimes we know the rights from the wrongs, the truths from the lies but we are so scared, so overwhelmed by our fear we only need some encouragement to voice the things we know to be true.

Ishita doesnt need someone' validation or a stamp of approval. what she needs is to know people can love her not despite that inability but even with it. That her being, her identity is not defined and limited with one attribute she has no control over and be respected for the person she is. Somewhere in the back of her mind is the idea that if the man I loved for a decade could reject me in a second I am not worthy of any love or perhaps not good enough to be considered as a partner someone would want. She has to know that it was not her inability that made her split with Subu but his lack of courage to accept the facts and live with it.

She may have been the one with the problem, but he was the one without the strength amongst them.


EkPaheli thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#64

Originally posted by: india2050

I can fully sympathisize with Ishita as iam in a similar situation.& meet many Subbu mom likes who come up with dont do this,eat this ,do this pooja,do this fast.so much so that i have stopped attending any major functions wherever i can see this aunty or her associates.A woman can be a murderer also,accpeted but not infertile in our society-tht's the cruel mentality.ALso people like subbumom need constant society approval that what she did was right,maybe deep down their own insecurity !


Hi there

first of all thank you so much for making a comment here.

I wish I could come up with the words that can even seem appropriate to make a response to you in the face of things but I cant.

and I am not being patronizing here please know that.


Also i wholeheartedly agree it is men like Subu and women like his mom who have the insecurity and a low sense of self-esteem that would treat someone who is already in so much pain in the way that they do.

In my opinion the woman here is so much more stronger than them, She lives with something that she knows she never asked for and even tries to make peace with it no matter how hard it is, But they cant, their primitive patriarchal mindset cant which cannot allow them to move beyond their narrow mindedness and primitive thinking.

I will not offer you consolations here my friend or words of apology not because I don't feel for you, but because I do and it makes me want to respect you so much that I cannot degrade you with trivial words - this strength that you have.

All I will say is it was a humbling and a honoring experience for me to read your views and post. I hope you never give up your zest for life or your courage. People will be there to take you down, knock you off for one reason or another always - life isnt meant to be fair or perfect to anyone. What matters is not their ideas or opinions but your own individuality and strength to face things - life, people and situation in general.

Regards & love,
Aani
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Posted: 11 years ago
#65

Originally posted by: Heema22

Mailka . My thoughts exactly !! Ishita needs to change .

Eleanor Roosevelt said, "no one can make you feel inferior without your permission' and she said it so right. It is us who feel inferior and if we change our thinking, every thing about us changes.
Ishita feels that she is infertile so she is not complete women so she feels something is missing in her life . She has developed complex which can be very painful for a women.

Being nice doesn't win you the race. Being authentic to yourself does. It's very simple. If you allow others to walk all over you - even just once - you are telling the universe that you do not deserve better and that you are ok with a given state of behavior.There's no way around it. If you roll out a doormat outside your front door, people will naturally step all over it. And why not? That's what it's there for.

Ishita must know one thing .No one is perfect, everyone has their flaws. You have flaws as well. But, your inferiority complex is magnifying your flaws in your mind. No one else sees your flaws that way that you see them. Just because you are not exactly the same or twenty times better as someone else, doesn't mean that you're not good enough. It's about believing that you are good enough and working through your negative self-talk. There are things that can be done. This is your life and you should be living it positively!
So mrs Bhalla is right . Inshita must stand up for herself. After she does , no one will bother her !!


Lovely post Heema 👏👏
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Posted: 11 years ago
#66

Originally posted by: Savz_Startling

Ishita whole past story is not shown.few things r shown n mentioned. Ya cvs will develop according to d story for future drama n epis. Ya ishita preggy original track may come also in future. Wat mentioned n shown is ishita got severe stomach ache n later it's revealed she has conceive probs. Her mother told to ishita tat she had some fever something like when too young may be teenage n done tests then docs said she has conceive probs n can't bear d babies n almost imposible n nothing much done abt it. So prev reports n later another doc confirming same it's almost confirm for ishita. On tat grounds subbu n subbu mom n many rejected her. So tats shown n mention till now.so cvs will develop frm this like did subbu mom hand is there r not.
Is there any strong reason for subbu mom to hate ishita.
Irrespective of story d subbu mom character is low mind n unhappy person n can't see other happiness. It's another type of pervertness n sick mind lol.


Hi Savz

@bold - that is the core question here why hate Ishu when she has moved on 😕
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Posted: 11 years ago
#67

Originally posted by: luvsagar

Great posti have no issue if they do show Ishu being infertile however it is an Ekta serial and who knows what is in store for us. Today It seemed as Ishu has accepted herself not experiencing pregnancy however she is broken inside and feels herself less of a women mostly from the rejection by Subbu and taunts from his mother. I would love to see a total breakdown scene of Ishu with Raman comforting...I would love a track where they show the different avenues available for women who desire children but can't have them...Ishu has Ruhi but maybe she can meet women in similar situations and help them.

It is a social issue which is so sensitive impacting not only the woman but the husband and family as well and it's an issue that should be tackled and what better medium than TV to educate and bring forth to viewers.

Probably a little off topic so sorry about that but would love to see something different in an Ekta show.


Hey Sagar

amazing post thanks for the reply.

@bold - oh no it was not at all going off topic and I love what you wrote here yes they can use this medium to educate the masses TV can be a very powerful and influencing medium if it wants to be



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Posted: 11 years ago
#68

Originally posted by: Aliya_hzsn


A very good post!
Loved your views regarding subbu's mom. It would be an awesome twist.
It made me think too, why does she hate ishita SOo much??? She was ready to give her son in marriagge to ishita right, or was she pretending to? It could be a possibility that she is involved in something, the day ishita was declared Barren.

Or is it because, she thought Ishita is never going to have a happy, normal life now that she is barren and the fact that she didnt let her son marry her, meant noone else could. So ever since she must be feeling like she has been defeated or something?!

Anyways like you said, ekta shows bring up huge twists, wonder if there is one regarding Ishu's fertility. I hope there is one, and ishu might later get pregnant.


Hey Aliya

You know I think this woman is a sadist and she loves torturing Ishu. before her marriage she could say oh you will never have any guy willing enough to marry you.

Now with Ishu being married to Raman - a man more successful and richer then her son and a family which seems to be loving Ishu now she comes up with the one thing Ishu or her family cant refute but I am so glad Ruhi shut her up even on that front.

God knows what next taunt she will come up with but I hope to god Ishu replies to her without any apprehensions and gives it to her good once and for all at least once - so long as she is quiet this woman wont stop.

The Bhallas, Iyers and society people in general wont do what Ishu' reply can do. Really sting her and show her her place.
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Posted: 11 years ago
#69

Originally posted by: Faria.

hmmm very complicated question
i think shubs mom wants to prove that by rejecting Ishita as her daughter in law she took a right decision. she wants to prove that ishita was not good for shubs at all. so ab jo bhi ishi ko apnayega agar wo log ishu se khush rehte hai tou usko jalan hogi na? this lady was totally jealous of our ishita. aur uski aag main aur bhe ghee add hua jab ishu got married with so handsome and very cool business tycoon Mr. raman kumar bhalla. :D


Yep she cant stand it that Bhallas are loving Ishu and Toshi thanked her because her rejection made it poss for Raman to come into Ishu' life
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Posted: 11 years ago
#70

Originally posted by: Metamorphmagus

This time I don't think Raman will give into every one of Adi's demands because he has Ruhi to think about. That guy is going to be in a major fix. Each of his children want a different woman as their mother. Though he might tolerate Shagun, I don't think he will marry her while Shagun and Adi will be plotting to get their "family" together. As long as they don't show Ruhi being manipulated into siding with the duo, I will just sit and watch because it is going to be one hell of a ride. The writers definitely know what they are doing. Yesterday's episode convinced me of that.


@bold - yep the restaurant fiasco and Ruhi' pain on account of it has made Raman realize his little girl is so much more mature then he estimates her an he cannot just disregard her feelings or thoughts, taking her as a mere kid.

@red - yeah there is no way he can ever give Shagun the position she once held in his life, No matter what. And she will strive for it to no ends but it would be pointless and moot in the end for sure.

And the writers are going great guns here

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