sumthing i saw on cnn-ibn - Page 2

no my point of making this post was why is it with team india england lost a lot last year but such stories never came out why is it with us why do we give media the oppurtunity to do this and why cant the player keep their personal issues aside and work together as professionals

its really not abt sourav or dravid its abt the team and as far as sourav is concerned he is a media created star really maybe seven years ago u cud say he was gud for the team but not now u have to go way back in time to pull out an innings where he made india win....

he just wants media attention and hype arnd him to get that captaincy back

captaincy was always vdear to him he never wanted to let go of it then so obviously he wants it back

there is sum attitude prblem as far as sourav is concerned how cum he was the only one to have prblems with greg and match refrees and other international players....as well

Since gaguly was kicked out of the team, ofcourse people are going to naturally think he has problems with team unity and he doesnt get along with anybody. But I am not engrossed enough in indian cricket followings to comment on that or point the finger of blame. I dont know what Ganguly did, the point is he was a good captain, but why he had a fall out, was he the cause of it, shouldnt he have put the team ahead of his own personal bickerings is a good point. But to what point do you begin to stand up for yourself.

Originally posted by: tina59

oh this is outrageous

Ifcant blame someone , put the blame on the one who has already been blacklisted by the coach and some team members u .

ok then explain why sachin got out at zero and seven in two matches playing poor shots , was he playing for saurav too

why didnt dravid take uthappa to the WC when he wansnt expewrienced in any way and had played just a few games before it , was he on saurav's side too

why didnt pathan and sreeshnath play even a single game and agarkar was given a chance again and again , maybe theres a conspiration there too by saurav

The entire team lost , they bowled poorly , batted miserably and fielded terribly .Why would yuvaraj and harbhajan sacrifice their career and place and throw away their wickets for saurav who himself has come back after being dropped and was trying to prove a point .

all these are baseless allegations to put the blame on someone instead of taking responsibility and also bcoz of politics. Again they want to safeguard certain players so that people turn their attention towards these allegations and forget abt them

sach sachin( I am his biggest fan but its time he takes responsibilty for his poor show ), sack dravid as the captain , sack harbhajan ,Kumble and Agarkar , being back Saurav as the captain and bring young players and groom them

exactly,my thoughts.....................all BCCI,players,captain n coach are equally responsible for India's failure in the world cup.................plus media shud stop this baseless allegations if they don't have proof...................bas sab apni roti sekne me lage hai........🤢

Originally posted by: amu682

c u contradicted yr ownself u said i cudnt respect the team members..what abt yr own self are u respecting them and my only question to u why were we at just above bangladesh in the icc rankings when saurav was thrown out and u shud go n check that at cricinfo and why is is that rahuls winning percentage is better than ganguly in odis even though we didnt play the minnows at all during his short term as for sourav he won and made runs only with the minnows where as u can chek rahuls records for yr self and pik up the test matches and ull c who scored for sourav in the matches won did he ever make any contribution ???? and finally just a reminder of his gud leader ship that cudnt get the last 4 pakistan wickets in the mohali test in 2005 and the match was a draw ... rahul cud get australia out for less than a 100 in mumbai and he batted alone to make india win the test in windies and the series can u tell me when sourav did that .....and as for the odis in rahuls captaincy world record of 17 successful chases was broken we won 6-1 againt sl which is a record margin itself and in the matches he has captained u can c how much he has contributed whether ud like to give him credit for that or not is yr wish ....

as for rahul supporting sehwag well outform sehwag cud make a 70 odd ball 100 against bermuda but it takes inform sourav 100 odd balls for his 88 and outofform sehwag can make 47 against the lankans but the best captain ever plays a dumb shot and gets out .....

compare for yr self how many matches that sourav won did dravid play a major role in and vice versa and i dont need to say nething ull have the answer for yrself...

let's not speculate abt sourav or anyone else for that matter.Uske liye big big people are sitting and getting paid to speculate 😆

Originally posted by: bccool

c u contradicted yr ownself u said i cudnt respect the team members..what abt yr own self are u respecting them and my only question to u why were we at just above bangladesh in the icc rankings when saurav was thrown out and u shud go n check that at cricinfo and why is is that rahuls winning percentage is better than ganguly in odis even though we didnt play the minnows at all during his short term as for sourav he won and made runs only with the minnows where as u can chek rahuls records for yr self and pik up the test matches and ull c who scored for sourav in the matches won did he ever make any contribution ???? and finally just a reminder of his gud leader ship that cudnt get the last 4 pakistan wickets in the mohali test in 2005 and the match was a draw ... rahul cud get australia out for less than a 100 in mumbai and he batted alone to make india win the test in windies and the series can u tell me when sourav did that .....and as for the odis in rahuls captaincy world record of 17 successful chases was broken we won 6-1 againt sl which is a record margin itself and in the matches he has captained u can c how much he has contributed whether ud like to give him credit for that or not is yr wish ....

as for rahul supporting sehwag well outform sehwag cud make a 70 odd ball 100 against bermuda but it takes inform sourav 100 odd balls for his 88 and outofform sehwag can make 47 against the lankans but the best captain ever plays a dumb shot and gets out .....

compare for yr self how many matches that sourav won did dravid play a major role in and vice versa and i dont need to say nething ull have the answer for yrself...

This debate isnt about Sourav Ganguly Vs Rahul Dravid, or is it😕😆? I thought I stood up for the Team(who u alleged was syndicate against the country lead by Sourav Ganguly) Vs Rahul Dravid😕!!! If i came across as being disrespectful to Rahul Dravid & the Coach to stand up for false allegations made against Sourav Ganguly and the team… then it is my honour… because one man doesn't weigh much infront of an entire team to me! I didnt contradict myself, The contadiction between your argument and mine is that u stood by Rahul Dravid, an Individual and Me by a Team of exceptional players and their integrity and commitment towards the game and the country! I have always respected Rahul Dravid the player, I still do and always will😊… if I have a problem, it is with his Captaincy😕!

U gave some remarkable stats for Rahul Dravid… Hats off to him👏! But a captaincy isnt about going out there and scoring most of the runs urself or taking most of the wickets… A Captain is one who even if he doesn't score can motivate the rest of the people to score and take wickets! Captaincy isnt only about records, it is most about holding ur team together! I am no expert in Cricket techniques…so if I say Dravid failed as a captain on the field in the decisions he takes… then I am taking the words of experts, like Kapil, Jadeja, Sandip Patil etc! What ever little I know about HR management, I can say Dravid didn't do a good job at that!

Since ur reply was effectively about Sourav Ganguly Vs Rahul Dravid as captains… let me point out a few!

Firstly ur Question about India being ranked just above Bangladesh when Sourav was sacked… If Sourav has to take to blame for that, he does… but what about India having the highest rating ever in its history when it was Ranked 2nd after the ICC World Cup 2003? So the credit goes to Ganguly, right? Now who is expected to take responsibility for the slide in the ICC ranking post the world cup??? India just might be behind Bangladesh for all we know! As far I know Rahul Dravid says he isnt the captain anymore😕!!!

U r taking about the Pak series in 2005 as an example. Then what about Indian reaching the finals of the ICC knockout tournament twice in a row in 2000 and 2002? What about India reaching the finals of ICC WC 2003? What about India's victory in friendship series in 2004 in Pakistan? What about India winning a series and breaking Australia's rampage in the test arena in 2001? What about India defending the same cup and retaining it when we toured Australia in 2003? What about the Natwest Series?

Lets see in what state Sourav Ganguly took over as a Captain! He was chosen as a Scapegoat. When he took over the mantle of captaincy… there wasn't a team in the 1^st place, India as a country had given up on its cricketers due to the match fixing allegations. U have the best and biggest names in Indian Cricket who had brought down the team and country's spirits. Mohammed Azharuddin, Ajay Jadeja, Nayan Mongia all were shown the door. He was just 3-4 years into international Cricket. There was no one take the mantle as Sachin had categorically refused the responsibility. Sourav took over charge at that point in time, and if his inexperience wasn't enough he had the other senior players like Sachin, Javagal Srinath, Anil Kumble, Robin Singh being in and out due to injury scares, Rahul Dravid, Lakshman were considered as Test players only! he literally started from scratch. The only support of sorts he could have hoped for was in Kapil Dev, who after a brief stint as the coach resigned! He picked up new talents & molded them… Virender Sehwag, Yuvraj Singh, Zaheer Khan, Harbhajan Singh, Irfan Pathan, Mohammed Kaif and a lot more young guys. If dealing with absolute youngsters wasn't enough he had to deal with a foreign coach, cultural clashes, language and yes not to forget the cynics sitting out to pull him down and his style of captaincy! Starting off as a scapegoat(till they could convince Sachin to take over) Sourav Ganguly stands today as Indian Most Successful Captain having lead the team very well in the most important tournaments. He turned a timid Indian team into a force no one could ignore. He brought with him a sense of positive aggression and a killer instinct to the team.. it was under him that Indian Cricket emerged as TEAM India… it was from then on India's victory and not an individual, till the it was on Sachin, Sourav or Kumble individually to see India through a match! Captaincy needed a lot of attention on the entire functioning and not only personal form. Sourav's records took a beating because he had a lot many things to worry about than himself. He put the team's requirements ahead of his own game... which ultimately ended up in his own disadvantage Else in the last 6 years he would have gone on to break his personal records... which stands only 2nd to tendulkar in terms of runs and terms of centuries and man of the match awards!

When Dravid took over as the captain as a stand in captain when Ganguly wasn't around. He had a readymade team & established cricketers to deal with. Ganguly's ouster from the team was not because of his form. He once again became a scapegoat to the dirty politics played between Sharad Pawar and Dalmiya!

WC 2003 started off on a BAD note for India, the series before that was a debacle in New Zealand… but see where the team reached with sheer grit and determination and see how India finished 2007 WC despite having a win to boast their confidence just before the series! Look at the way Ganguly handled the situation back then, accepting the mistakes and still maintaining the confidence in his team he shot back at the detractors and protected his team from getting affected by the negativity. He had the guts to tell the Team's supporters that he didn't care if they stood by the team or not, They were there for eachother. And what did Dravid do? he declares 2 hours after the debacle says 'I am not even Captain at this point of time' It was so the easiest option out! He sits in a press conference after beating Bangladesh saying 'Our job is cut out now' What kind of a captain makes such statements? Didn't he know before losing to Bangaldesh what the 'Job' was?

There is no denying Rahul played very well and won many matches for the team under Sourav's captaincy… but I don't have anything to compare with Sourav's records under Dravid because Sourav didn't play that many matches! And coming to Sourav's role under Dravid's captaincy… if I am not wrong wasn't Sourav Ganguly rushed to South Africa on a SOS call because of the debacle in SA? And didn't he perform and saved India's face in SA? And if I am not wrong wasn't he the Man of the Series in the last tournament? He finished his WC campaign with an average above 50? And I think Sourav wont get to play under Dravid anymore… cause as Dravid says he is not even the captain at this point!

Ultimately… it is about Captaincy… records not always speaks the truth. We may consider anyone as the captain according to our own preference, but the truth is that Ganguly or Dravid isnt our Captain, they are captain of the team. The success of the captain is in his Team… The team has to accept him as a leader, no matter who it is…and the verdict out is that Dravid didn't go well with the team, it has been proven on the field… Dravid couldn't reach out to them and extract the performed he desired and the result of that is here to see and stay forever! And Ganguly will always have the repuation of being an elder brother to his team mates and him being called Dada by the younger lot & the entire country stands testimony to it.

And having said that to quote Dravid in a recent interview with NDTV before going to the world cup, he said that Sourav Ganguly is India's BEST ever captain and I agree! So I think Dravid himself has put an end to this debate and i have no more to add....

I rest my case!

the team as a whole has failed! therz no point in blaming individuals! there was no spirit and the team as whole has given a pathetic display! All i can say is Rahul Dravid definitely is not a motivating captain..he's a good batsman no doubt abt that..but lacks aggression..
the reason for dravid's success as a captain as soon as he took over the mantles from saurav was because of the team that saurav had nurtuted for 5 yrs under his captaincy! otherwise dravid has failed miserably as a captain..

wow amu,well written 👏 I agree,dada is the best captain