All discussions- before-during-after Dice game/VH here only/ DT Nt-128 - Page 16

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Posted: 11 years ago

Originally posted by: india2050

So after all this what blame is attached to Shakuni? As requested he rolled the dice (again no evidence that it was loaded) and proposed Draupadi as a stake. Apart from that he seems to have been the quietest compared to Dury, Dushi and Karna

Originally posted by: -Shruti

There's a big misconception about Duryodhan being manipulated and used by Shakuni, the reality is just the opposite!



Yeah, Bhas has pointed that out a number of times. Shakuni only acted @ the behest of others - Dhritarashtra/Kanika on the house of lac, or due to Duryodhan's discontent after Maya sabha. He had no role in Bhima's poisoning, and he was okay w/ the Hastinapur/Khandavprastha partition.
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Posted: 11 years ago

Originally posted by: ...Diala...

obviously lesser than DDK

Actually Shakuni was the 80% reason for humiliation of Draupadi bcoz he was the triggering factor if he did not ask Yudi to stake Draupadi then all the event would not have happened because the one who presses the trigger is blamed of killing not the gun or bullet.SO,SHAKUNI SHOULD BE BLAMED FIRST 😡,NEXT KARNA AND THEN DURY AND DUSHI.
hope u got the point
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Posted: 11 years ago

Originally posted by: Sabhayata


Why only yudi all other pandavas are to be blamed as well

They may not have physically staked Drauapdi but their silent acceptance of yudi's action was their affirmation as well.One can say that they didnt protest because they didnt want to go against their elder brother but still at end of the day they agreed to Draupadi's staking for sake of their elder brother.

If some one needs to be blamed yudi should get max blame undoubtedly but other panadavs arent blameless even they didn't do anything to stop Yudi Yes Bheem did protest after yudi had staked Draupadi same could have been done before the staking may be all brother's together could knock some sense in yudi. Yudi is to be blamed undoubtedly but other pandavas cant go scott free


In the dice game after Yudhishthira staked and lost all his wealth and kingdom,after staking and losing all his 4 brothers and himself he should withdraw from the game as he had no more wealth to stake but Shakuni was the person who asked Yudi to continue the game by staking Draupadi, being a slave of Shakuni(duryodhana) Yudi should obey the order of his master so Yudhishthira staked Draupadi and eventually lost (though he knew that she could not be staked but was compelled to do so).hence yudi cannot be blamed for staking Draupadi as he was following his DHARMA as a slave to Shakuni(Duryodhana).

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Posted: 11 years ago
But Shakuni didn't persuade Yudhisthira to stake his brothers. So I guess he would have staked Draupadi even without Shakuni's insistence.
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Posted: 11 years ago
Vaisampayana said,--"Hearing this Sakuni, ready with the dice, adopting foul means, said unto Yudhishthira, 'Lo! I have won.'
'Sakuni continued,--'Thou hast permitted thyself to be won. This is very sinful. There is wealth still left to
thee, O king. Therefore, thy having lost thyself is certainly sinful.'"

Vaisampayana continued,--"Having said this, Sakuni, well-skilled at dice, spoke unto all the brave kings
present there of his having won, one after another, all the Pandavas. The son of Suvala then, addressing Yudhishthira said,--'O king, there is still one stake dear to thee that is still unwon. Stake thou Krishna, the princess of Panchala. By her, win thyself back.'

"Yudhishthira said,--'With Draupadi as stake, who is neither short nor tall, neither spare nor corpulent, and who is possessed of blue curly locks, I will now play with thee. Possessed of eyes like the leaves of the autumn lotus, and fragrant also as the autumn lotus, equal in beauty unto her (Lakshmi) who delighteth in autumn lotuses, and unto Sree herself in symmetry and every grace she is such a woman as a man may desire for wife in respect of softness of heart, and wealth of beauty and of virtues. Possessed of every accomplishment and compassionate and sweet-speeched, she is such a woman as a man may desire for wife in respect of her fitness for the acquisition of virtue and pleasure and wealth. Retiring to bed last and waking up first, she looketh after all down to the cowherds and the shepherds. Her face too, when covered with sweat, looketh as the lotus or the jasmine. Of slender waist like that of the wasp, of long flowing locks, of red lips, and body without down, is the princess of Panchala. O king, making the slender-waisted Draupadi, who is even such as my stake, I will play with thee, O son of Suvala.'"
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Posted: 11 years ago
true diala
shakuni do tell yudi to stake drau. but a point to note is that he does not say so for his brothers!! yudi staked his brothers by himself. one wonders if yudi wouldnt have staked them , woould shakuni have told yudi to stake drau? its debatable. so yes yudi is to be blamed here before shakuni.

"Sakuni continued,--'O king, the sons of Madri, dear unto thee, have both been won by me. It would seem, however, that Bhimasena and Dhananjaya are regarded very much by thee.'
"Yudhishthira said,--'Wretch! thou actest sinfully in thus seeking to create disunion amongst us who are all of one heart, disregarding morality.'

"Sakuni said,--'One that is intoxicated falleth into a pit (hell) and stayeth there deprived of the power of motion. Thou art, O king, senior to us in age, and possessed of the highest accomplishments. O bull of
the Bharata race, I (beg my pardon and) bow to thee. Thou knowest, O Yudhishthira, that gamesters, while excited with play, utter such ravings that they never indulge in the like of them in their waking
moments nor even in dream.'
"Yudhishthira said,--He that taketh us like a boat to the other shore of the sea of battle, he that is ever victorious over foes, the prince who is endued with great activity, he who is the one hero in this world,
(is here). With that Falguna as stake, however, undeserving of being made so, I will now play with thee'"


how do we interpret those lines in bold above? that yudi did hesitate to stake arjun and bhima ?that he knew what he was doing was wrong!!!
clearly he doesnt think twice before staking nakul and sahadev, unprompted. but hesitates for arjun and bhima and stakes them only after shakuni promps him.

and while other times he sits stupified what about this message he sends to draupadi?:

"Yudhishthira, however, O bull of the Bharata race, hearing of Duryodhana's intentions, sent a trusted messenger unto Draupadi, directing that although she was attired in one piece of cloth with her navel itself exposed, in consequence of her season having come, she should come before her father-in-law weeping bitterly. "




Edited by bhas1066 - 11 years ago
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Posted: 11 years ago

Originally posted by: -Shruti

But Shakuni didn't persuade Yudhisthira to stake his brothers. So I guess he would have staked Draupadi even without Shakuni's insistence.

Ive said this earlier.. I think, Yudishtra would have considered Draupadi also as won along with her husbands.. now when Shakuni insists Drau to be staked what can he do? either utilize the chance and play or submit that she is won already..
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Posted: 11 years ago

Originally posted by: bhas1066


and while other times he sits stupified what about this message he sends to draupadi?:

"Yudhishthira, however, O bull of the Bharata race, hearing of Duryodhana's intentions, sent a trusted messenger unto Draupadi, directing that although she was attired in one piece of cloth with her navel itself exposed, in consequence of her season having come, she should come before her father-in-law weeping bitterly. "

from Shakuni's words it looks like he did hesitate to stake Arjun followed by Bhim.. but the narration as such does not specify Yudishtra hesitating.. am not sure how to take it..
the one in red.. I read that few days back.. dint want to comment on that here as I will be accused for accusing Dharmaraj Yudishtra to conceal the acts of Karna 🤢
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Posted: 11 years ago

Originally posted by: ...Diala...

from Shakuni's words it looks like he did hesitate to stake Arjun followed by Bhim.. but the narration as such does not specify Yudishtra hesitating.. am not sure how to take it..
the one in red.. I read that few days back.. dint want to comment on that here as I will be accused for accusing Dharmaraj Yudishtra to conceal the acts of Karna 🤢


OMG what is this was it yudi who asked Drau to come to the assembly first?Or i am reading it wrongly
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Posted: 11 years ago
he says this after Draupadi sends back Duryodhan's messenger twice with her question

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