JA~~Mirrors for princes~~ - Page 5

Originally posted by: history_geek

Lasya ,

Thanks for this thread and an alternate viewpoint . There are many awesome comments on this thread, whatever i have read till now, and all are equally good. I am quoting this one^^ and elaborating my views, this post made me see things in a different manner.

Especially with those lines that a parent may be able to teach something to his/her son/daughter which he/she may not have done in his/her lifetime.

In the show, this was in context of Jalal. 😉

But yes, this was a valid point. I have a friend, who is still 23(quite young), just married now and has a daughter, i have seen him making plans for his just born daughter , that he will teach him this and that. And, some times, i tease him, saying - "You want all this and look, you yourself could not do this in your time." 😆. But See, Parents always want their kids to excel .. 😊

Coming to show, the CV's have started showing Jalal applying innovative methods to teach Salim. His growth is portrayed nicely by the CV's. As an Emperor, as a father, he is showing his skills, though i don't think he has emerged as a good husband when we compare his role with that of an Emperor and a father.

But when it comes to Jodha, i wanted the CV's to show her growth also, along with Jalal. She was a business woman, commanded cavalries, had great hold in the Mughal Sultanate, known to issue charitable lands, had issues political farmans even, had her jaagir . But did we see even an iota of those facts.?. NO. The CV's seem to have reduced her role to singing Bhajans, and making Rangolis. They should have broken the norm, and come above the normally accepted trend of a "Medieval LadY" who could do nothing except some selected works which we all know.🥱 She had wished Hasan and Husain to be like their father when they grow up. Clearly shows that , US WAQT , she also had a vision regarding her sons. But right now, it seems nothing of the sort is happening. Leave a POWERFUL Empress, right now she looks like any other common lady. It seems she is MUZ just for name. In my opinion, She was much better, assertive before she got this title. Not once, CV's gave a good introduction like announcement in DEK, that - " Malika-e-Hind Mariam-Uz-Zamani Begum is arriving" ,< i mean the sort of announcement done for Emperor. Not once is she shown involved in some farman issuing activity. The list can go on and on.

Recently, they could have shown Jodha also being aware of Jalal's plan of becoming a Daaku and BOTH the parents could have been shown involved.?. Isn't it.?.

CV's have lost a wonderful opportunity. We all here expect so many things, but it seems that Jodha's role will not find the kind of elevation we are expecting. Though, Jalal's role is getting the required uplift slowly. :)

Also, i wanted to see good characterization of Daniyal. First and foremost, they are projecting him as neglected boy. Salim has Jodha, Murad has Salima, but Daniyal looks like unwanted kid. How are they projecting him.?. 😲 He was an awesome military strategist, was taught militia in Amer itself. Though, in this Natkiya Rupanter, he is shown totally opposite way that too in Agra.

What can be debated to an extent is the kind of method adopted by him. It can be correct and wrong also. Agreed that Jalal also became a ruler at 13, but Jalal was Jalal, and Salim is Salim and is NOT like Jalal. He is 9 right now. I would say that, he is a different person altogether. It appears to me that, Salim is very much scared from Jalal. He is not able to open up infront of him. I don't know why, but from reading the WU's it seems so.

Anyways, Salim was Bheegi Billi in front of his father ALWAYS. He did rebellion BUT never opened his mouth before Akbar in person. I don't want to write more on this here. Akbar was a strict father. Baaki sab samaj lo. 😆

Originally posted by: prav2

Awesome writeup Lasya,Radhika,Rashmi,Sindhu,cleo ,Maddy Charu .Loved all your views .

and agree with you all as my mindset is a mixture of all this,

I'm happy that all the relentless effort of friends through social media paid and though again a distortion at least cleared salima is not the mother of murad and hope they leave it there I really don't want a flashback showing an mu between ja and stating that as the reason for daniyal and murad .That is so pathetic and demeaning everyone involved.

This shows they can change whatever they say or show so I sincerely wish they no further go into the drugging of an innocent kid .

@Lasya

I agree with you Training of Princes at early stages is vital as the whole welfare of the nation depends on their guidance and knowledge and the books you shared made me nostalgic .They are treasure troves of enormous information's. Which book can more effectively describe the sama,dhana ,bheda,dhanda principles more than arthasatra does?

A king needs to be compassionate when needed and also should know to be tough and mettle justice with iron hands, We have vast no of kings who exemplified in all this .Like Radhika said I'm happy to see jalal trying to do this ,Unlike the promo they aired before showing jalal encouraging salim to be heartless I like this version of jalal who teaches how to be more compassionate yet to stand for justice even in doing so if he has to stand against his mentors he has to do it. I also liked his out of box ideas to create an interest for salim in archery and sword practice . Its always tough for children of legends to exemplify as whatever they do would always be measured in terms of what their father does and they have to tackle this enormous pressure too in process of setting an identity for themselves and here salim seems to need more encouragement.

But I also strongly agree with rashmi and maddy that for doing this there is no need of stereotyping jo. Why couldn't they bring a scene like salim dejected and jo coming to him and share with him a fb moment of her and sujamal ,her attempts ,sujamal's encouragement and she succeeding. It would be an interesting anecdote and salim who love his mother a lot also would get inspired. Then they can even show jo sitting alone thinking of sujamal and then jalal can come and they can share a fb of what happened to sujamal and sharif. I really want a closure to sharif track and his deeds are known to jo and ja.

We all wish to see a strong emperor and an equally intelligent and strong empress .Like rashmi said there is sivaji,there is Rajendra chola who was brought by his aunt to name a few .We have so many strong ladies whole played an important role in shaping up legends we are fortunate to have so y not show our jo strong Where is that jo who thought so much to Rahim and maansingh .who encouraged maansingh to do his duty. Now its shown the children are always afraid of jalal y should it be the case when we saw Rahim riding on jalal The only reason I could see is they have shifted from season 1 of ja to season 2 of mugal e azam .They want an Akbar who everyone would fear and reduced screen space of jo and made her only crying,doing bajaans and rangolis .But this is not what we signed for we wanted ja centric story line not jo or jalal or sa centric .If they can change storyline as and when needed I wish they change it back immediately to ja centric and stay true to their tagline. I'm still trying to understand where there comes a need for these leaps .I couldn't even think trps as in another one which continuously being in top 1 for 3 years there has never been a single mu between leads and female is shown so strong so suddenly y make our jo weak can they not be equal as they were .

Coming to ruq , I have lost all hope that her deeds would ever come to light .I remember her saying in Benazir track to jo "There is a reason I remain khaas begum as even jalal wouldn't dare talk against me " and how true her words were .We will never witness him standing against her ,But at least happy he instructed salim to do so and the way he handled her tactically .Small mercies. As they have no idea of exposing her I wish they at least maintain her like this instead of showing horrific acts like drugs...

Originally posted by: Charu.S

Very good points Abhay. I too am wondering as to why natakiya roopantar has not been put to proper use, with regards to Jodha's contributions as a parent, we all know that her talents definitely stretched beyond singing loris.

Until the month of July we were constantly shown the strengths in Jodha's personality, all of a sudden, she has been pushed to the background. Why is it she is not shown imparting some of her beliefs, learnings and hunars to Salim. Instead we have to see an innocent gullible boy being deceitfully fed opium by a queen, a mother-like figure.

Agreed, Jalal is trying to be a good father, and prepare the young Salim to become a brave and just shehenshah in the future. However, pushing a confused little boy with low morale, who is already anxious in his (abbu jaan's ) presence, may have the opposite effect. Salim is sensitive, laid-back and low in self confidence. Irrespective of the era, these minus points if addressed with positive learning methods and discipline will fetch favorable, beneficial results. Besides the well meaning parent, the young prince also has to deal with a show-off Murad and a mean Haider who never miss a chance to put him down. Children see the world through the eyes of their peers, and will always want to please and be accepted by them. Salim is a child, first, prince later.

His attempts to follow the 'seekh' imparted by Jalal and to prove that he is also a good arrow striker, ( both to himself and Murad/Haider ) has put him in deep trouble. I am hoping that the after effects of Jalal's punishment towards Salim will not have a lasting negative impact on their relationship. We never know how natakiya roopantar will take its course.

Charu.

Originally posted by: history_geek

Nabiii,

I read the spoiler just now, and to me it seems that Ekta has decided to use all the Navratans of Akbar and instill their qualities in Ruqayya. 😆😕

The birth mother, the powerful Empress, the businesswoman is no where in sight.

The importance given by Salim to his mother is FAR FAR FAR better than what is given to Ruqayya and Salima. I have read them nicely. You know, we can not discuss the details here.

CV's are writing their own version now, as per Ekta nama..
All the Navratans have vanished and Ruqayya has taken over..

And yes, you are right, Daniyal is emerging as a big victim of this Natkiya Rupanter. Imagine, making son of Akbar a clown in this show, already the mother and place of his upbringing has been changed , and now the complete character is taken for a toss.

Originally posted by: history_geek

Lasya ,

Thanks for this thread and an alternate viewpoint . There are many awesome comments on this thread, whatever i have read till now, and all are equally good. I am quoting this one^^ and elaborating my views, this post made me see things in a different manner.

Especially with those lines that a parent may be able to teach something to his/her son/daughter which he/she may not have done in his/her lifetime.

In the show, this was in context of Jalal. 😉

But yes, this was a valid point. I have a friend, who is still 23(quite young), just married now and has a daughter, i have seen him making plans for his just born daughter , that he will teach him this and that. And, some times, i tease him, saying - "You want all this and look, you yourself could not do this in your time." 😆. But See, Parents always want their kids to excel .. 😊

Coming to show, the CV's have started showing Jalal applying innovative methods to teach Salim. His growth is portrayed nicely by the CV's. As an Emperor, as a father, he is showing his skills, though i don't think he has emerged as a good husband when we compare his role with that of an Emperor and a father.

But when it comes to Jodha, i wanted the CV's to show her growth also, along with Jalal. She was a business woman, commanded cavalries, had great hold in the Mughal Sultanate, known to issue charitable lands, had issues political farmans even, had her jaagir . But did we see even an iota of those facts.?. NO. The CV's seem to have reduced her role to singing Bhajans, and making Rangolis. They should have broken the norm, and come above the normally accepted trend of a "Medieval LadY" who could do nothing except some selected works which we all know.🥱 She had wished Hasan and Husain to be like their father when they grow up. Clearly shows that , US WAQT , she also had a vision regarding her sons. But right now, it seems nothing of the sort is happening. Leave a POWERFUL Empress, right now she looks like any other common lady. It seems she is MUZ just for name. In my opinion, She was much better, assertive before she got this title. Not once, CV's gave a good introduction like announcement in DEK, that - " Malika-e-Hind Mariam-Uz-Zamani Begum is arriving" ,< i mean the sort of announcement done for Emperor. Not once is she shown involved in some farman issuing activity. The list can go on and on.

Recently, they could have shown Jodha also being aware of Jalal's plan of becoming a Daaku and BOTH the parents could have been shown involved.?. Isn't it.?.

CV's have lost a wonderful opportunity. We all here expect so many things, but it seems that Jodha's role will not find the kind of elevation we are expecting. Though, Jalal's role is getting the required uplift slowly. :)

Also, I wanted to see good characterization of Daniyal. First and foremost, they are projecting him as neglected boy. Salim has Jodha, Murad has Salima, but Daniyal looks like unwanted kid. How are they projecting him.?. 😲 He was an awesome military strategist, was taught militia in Amer itself. Though, in this Natkiya Rupanter, he is shown totally opposite way that too in Agra.

What can be debated to an extent is the kind of method adopted by him. It can be correct and wrong also. Agreed that Jalal also became a ruler at 13, but Jalal was Jalal, and Salim is Salim and is NOT like Jalal. He is 9 right now. I would say that, he is a different person altogether. It appears to me that, Salim is very much scared from Jalal. He is not able to open up infront of him. I don't know why, but from reading the WU's it seems so.

Anyways, Salim was Bheegi Billi in front of his father ALWAYS. He did rebellion BUT never opened his mouth before Akbar in person. I don't want to write more on this here. Akbar was a strict father. Baaki sab samaj lo. 😆

Originally posted by: history_geek

Nabiii,

I read the spoiler just now, and to me it seems that Ekta has decided to use all the Navratans of Akbar and instill their qualities in Ruqayya. 😆😕

The birth mother, the powerful Empress, the businesswoman is no where in sight.

The importance given by Salim to his mother is FAR FAR FAR better than what is given to Ruqayya and Salima. I have read them nicely. You know, we can not discuss the details here.

CV's are writing their own version now, as per Ekta nama..
All the Navratans have vanished and Ruqayya has taken over..

And yes, you are right, Daniyal is emerging as a big victim of this Natkiya Rupanter. Imagine, making son of Akbar a clown in this show, already the mother and place of his upbringing has been changed , and now the complete character is taken for a toss.

Originally posted by: lasyap3

Ufff...Phew.!! *Rubbing my forehead*

What shall I say to this UNSURPASSED post??!!⭐️

HATS OFF!! 👏

Seriously it was a 360 degree post for me😃

I am not finding any words...Hmnn I don't know what to say 😕...As I said previously you people have an ascendancy in experience regarding these things and hence you people can eloquently mention all the MIRRORS😉

@blue

This is a very common scenario in families...😊

@red

Yeah ! This was exactly I was musing about ...😊But I have to mention another side of the coin here...

The intention was not to show Jodha weak...but to show that Salim was ready to lift the sword..Did you get my point??So they have conveniently made the blunder

P.S: 🤗 *Hugs to you too for making such a striking post* You need not thank me😉Your post was not at all lengthy and I don't mind😆

Originally posted by: lasyap3

Outstanding views Abhay !!👏👏👏

@ blue

You have told the gist precisely, Abhay !😉

Let me give my own example here...(I am being more frank here😕)

Whenever my parents used to tell me something, as an immature personality,in my childhood,I used to neglect them.My reasons for the ignorance was something like this...

"Arre jo yeh kehte hain,iska khud paalan nahi karte...aur ulta mujhse keh rahein hain...main inki baat kyun maanoo??"

But as a child,one cannot understand the intention of them telling something to us...which is for our welfare😊

We are having UNDUE expectations from CVs...I don't expect anything from them now regarding a strong MUZ or Salim

Originally posted by: prav2

Awesome writeup Lasya,Radhika,Rashmi,Sindhu,cleo ,Maddy Charu .Loved all your views .

and agree with you all as my mindset is a mixture of all this,

I'm happy that all the relentless effort of friends through social media paid and though again a distortion at least cleared salima is not the mother of murad and hope they leave it there I really don't want a flashback showing an mu between ja and stating that as the reason for daniyal and murad .That is so pathetic and demeaning everyone involved.

This shows they can change whatever they say or show so I sincerely wish they no further go into the drugging of an innocent kid .

@Lasya

I agree with you Training of Princes at early stages is vital as the whole welfare of the nation depends on their guidance and knowledge and the books you shared made me nostalgic .They are treasure troves of enormous information's. Which book can more effectively describe the sama,dhana ,bheda,dhanda principles more than arthasatra does?

A king deeds to be compassionate when needed and also should know to be tough and mettle justice with iron hands, We have vast no of kings who exemplified in all this .Like Radhika said I'm happy to see jalal trying to do this ,Unlike the promo they aired before showing jalal encouraging salim to be heartless I like this version of jalal who teaches how to be more compassionate yet to stand for justice even in doing so if he has to stand against his mentors he has to do it. I also liked his out of box ideas to create an interest for salim in archery and sword practice . Its always tough for children of legends to exemplify as whatever they do would always be measured in terms of what their father does and they have to tackle this enormous pressure too in process of setting an identity for themselves and here salim seems to need more encouragement.

But I also strongly agree with rashmi and maddy that for doing this there is no need of stereotyping jo. Why couldn't they bring a scene like salim dejected and jo coming to him and share with him a fb moment of her and sujamal ,her attempts ,sujamal's encouragement and she succeeding. It would be an interesting anecdote and salim who love his mother a lot also would get inspired. Then they can even show jo sitting alone thinking of sujamal and then jalal can come and they can share a fb of what happened to sujamal and sharif. I really want a closure to sharif track and his deeds are known to jo and ja.

We all wish to see a strong emperor and an equally intelligent and strong empress .Like rashmi said there is sivaji,there is Rajendra chola who was brought by his aunt to name a few .We have so many strong ladies whole played an important role in shaping up legends we are fortunate to have so y not show our jo strong Where is that jo who thought so much to Rahim and maansingh .who encouraged maansingh to do his duty. Now its shown the children are always afraid of jalal y should it be the case when we saw Rahim riding on jalal The only reason I could see is they have shifted from season 1 of ja to season 2 of mugal e azam .They want an Akbar who everyone would fear and reduced screen space of jo and made her only crying,doing bajaans and rangolis .But this is not what we signed for we wanted ja centric story line not jo or jalal or sa centric .If they can change storyline as and when needed I wish they change it back immediately to ja centric and stay true to their tagline. I'm still trying to understand where there comes a need for these leaps .I couldn't even think trps as in another one which continuously being in top 1 for 3 years there has never been a single mu between leads and female is shown so strong so suddenly y make our jo weak can they not be equal as they were .

Coming to ruq , I have lost all hope that her deeds would ever come to light .I remember her saying in Benazir track to jo "There is a reason I remain kaas begum as even jalal wouldn't dare talk against me " and how true her words were .We will never witness him standing against her ,But at least happy he instructed salim to do so and the way he handled her tactically .Small mercies. As they have no idea of exposing her I wish they atleast maintain her like this instead of showing horrific acts like drugs...

Originally posted by: prav2

Completely agree with Lasya here radhika . Loved you post so much .Its always a pleasure reading yours ,but this was special.