JA: Journey To Eternity Updt Pg 1,7 - Page 6

Originally posted by: chitterati

Neither I am me,

nor you are you,

nor you are me.

Also, I am me,

you are you

and you are me.

We have become one

in such a way,

That I am confused whether

I am you,

or you are me.

~ Rumi

If human is divine, how could their love not be...

Originally posted by: history_geek

Simply beautiful..!!!.. This is evident..We can not separate J-J.. They are one entity now..

Originally posted by: history_geek

UNRes..

Hi all,

I will not go to Rumi this time(he is the King of Spirituality), and neither will use any of the theories pertaining to this topic, because Spirituality applies to all of us differently...We all perceive and look at it in different manner...I am jotting down whatever came to my mind i free flow...It's again an UN-edited Version...Pardon the errors, if any...

When i look at J-J's journey, it appears quite different to me...They lived in that era where they did not have all those amenities which we have today..No an iota of difference of opinion here that, they were the MOST RICH and powerful personalities of their times...Not all are Akbar and not all are MUZ and not all are SOUL-MATES as Jodha-Akbar...Someone said - "With greater powers come greater responsibilities"...I would go a step further and add one more line in this in JJ's context -- "With greater powers come greater responsibilities and ALSO GREATER TROUBLES" ... No doubt, Jalal was in a powerful position, hence he was always the NISHANA of his enemies...Poor Man...Had to FIGHT against his OWN Kinsmen, and faced betrayal...Be it Adham, Sharif, MA, Munim, Bairam, MC Begum...Don't want to write more on this, but this list is Endless and went on increasing till he ruled..!!!...

Sochkar hi ajeeb aur bura lagta hai ki, those people, had to lose so many kids in infancy...Those days when the Empire had many successors , Mughal Empire was an exception...Salim came quite late... The Birth of Twins, even today, creates so much pleasure and evokes celebrations of a different KIND...Imagine, those days, i have NOT heard, any Queen delivering twins...😊... I can not imagine the amount of emotional trauma, JJ had to bear after losing them...Mazak wali baat nahi hai > those people lost their 4 kids back to back.. !!!! And, twins included in that...

Ok...Coming back, i want to say that, a person.?.He/She may be powerful to any extent, but there are some "WOUNDS" , the remedy for which is NOT the superficial materialistic comforts and power, but "Spirituality" ... The Royals had many means of entertainment, be it singing, dance, shikar(hunting), elephant fights, trophy wars, etc., or "Aankh Micholi and Kabutarbaazi 😆" , and many other means...But some losses and deep scars of life can not be healed by these means...They need something else...I guess, here is when Spirituality comes into picture...

Spirituality, for me is a UNDEFINED DOMAIN..😊...And, i can justify my stand, as there are many shades to this WORD...We can go on an on and keep writing on this issue...So, here i go...>>..I think it is the personal transformation in accordance with "certain" ideals which are BOUND to result in our psychological growth, as it denotes the realm of the inner life, that is, the purity of motives, affections, intentions, inner SELF, and the the analysis of one's feelings... In laymen terms, it may be a kind of blissful experience... It can be also seen as a process of re-formation which "aims to recover the original SELF of man"...and is often seen as a blend of humanistic psychological growth, along with mystical and arcane happenings..We all know JJ's "Tryst with Spirituality" and their COMBINED trips to Sufi Saints/ Mystics (Ajmer Sharif, Agra Dargah, Shri Gusainji Ashram, etc..I think these will be shown in our serial..😃..I and KDR81 have mentioned these in our OLD threads..)..If we combine these trips as a PROOF of their Spiritual Journey, then this topic will also include the ethos of mysticism, perfection, devotion and piety...Infact, it relates to the mental aspect of life, contrasted with the material and sensual aspects...Coming to the other side of coin, it can also be accorded a social meaning along with the psychological aspect(described above), because it is the spark which leads one to a journey to attain more secular beliefs, and hence has got to do a lot with our social outlook...I can prove each of these words attaining the maximum meaning in Jodha-Akbar's context...Socially, Psychologically, Mentally, or many aspects which i am writing below...Take Social - And you get the doctrine of secularism getting past the 'treadmill', thereby helping in the Creation of a Better Nation, and this fabric was responsible for the flourishing Mughal Empire in Akbar's time...😉.Hukumat Taaqat ke dum par nahi ki ja sakti...Kuch der ki liye kar sakte ho par zyaada waqt ke liye nahi..These BIG things are often rooted in such small aspects which we tend to ignore...Take Psychological/Mental - And you find a Fountain of Strength Emerging within, which gives you a MEANS to get past the MOST Traumatic Situations of your lives...I want to give examples, but again i am restraining myself.!.

I would also like to mention that, Spirituality has NOTHING to do with a religion...Often, it is confused with religion.. I can give countless examples in this regard, but that may be "out of scope"..😉 .. Hence, only writing normal passages today...{ Those who want to know on this, can Google for "SBNR", and you will know what i mean here..😊 } .. Still, can there be a BIGGER example than OUR OWN Jodha and Akbar.?., two beings who WENT PAST all barriers, and unshackled every tradition...Their journey is Unique for that time, and even in today's world, for they blended 2 faiths to reach the true SELF...Spirituality is not merely following customs and traditions of a religion,{ hence i am NOT talking about this topic} although that helps too. It is an inner awareness of one's connectedness with a higher, call it God or Collective or Source or Life Force, some call it the Ultimate Soul, etc...Another aspects, can be Gratitude, Compassion and empathy...These 2 virtues are the true spiritual bridges. When we feel for another person and connect with him/her, we are indeed connecting to the "spiritual realm" . Only a "genuinely" spiritual person can "truly" feel another's pain and pleasure. And if you can do it, then you are spiritual, whether or not you "believe" in spirituality...For me BELIEVING in Spirituality or not is different than, whether you are spiritual or not...B'coz one may NOT be knowing that he has taken a spiritual route, but may be PASSIVELY following it..😊 Gratitude opens a floodgate of inner peace, and thereby spiritual awareness. Just take note of what we do in our daily lives. Take note of the blessings. Bless the food we eat. Make a list of things we are grateful for. All these will open us up, and bring us closer to experiencing peace and awakening. When we are grateful for everything from our food to our life, we are acknowledging the presence of a Universal Energy and welcoming more positivity into our lives..Isn't this called spirituality.?.In modern times, we all are told by our teachers/elders, etc to maintain a diary and note our daily happenings in it, and told to learn and DERIVE some meaning from it...Same thing happened in OLD times, when Kings used to have many chroniclers with them..Isn't this something on the lines of spirituality.?. Here we are learning something...Isn't it.?. The cause is NOBLE, that is we are exploring where we went wrong...I also want to talk about the Spirituality and Rationalism in this case, in this context i remember Akbar's rational views and Einstein's also...Both, refer to Spirituality in "Rational context"...But that can be "out of scope"..Lets leave it...


Hence, in my sense, Spirituality is a wide subject and we can explore as many dimensions as possible..😊...You see, that there can be various facets of this ONE word, and i'll be very happy if the Creatives are able to rope in even an "iota" of the above qualities in Jodha Akbar...I have seen episodes where the Creatives nailed this ESSENCE perfectly...Does anyone remembers these scenes.?.
1. When Jalal was against Jodha's faith conversion..
2. When he removed the Pilgrim Tax..+.. Jodha's reaction in Amer when he removed the pilgrim tax..
3. Jodha-Hamida convo, after jalal gets well, after the Tiger attack..
These scenes were different...And, they were NOT about "normal talks of tolerance" , but the execution and dialogues in these scenes were par excellence...Sometimes the CV's really shock us with such stuff...I wish, that DEEP thinking and finely "grained" dialogues are again given back to the Leads... The RAW Material is present in this post, and i think this can be conveyed to the CV's (albeit in a easier to understand manner.😉)

Thanks for bearing with this long post...I hope this made SOME sense...
This is my wishful thinking for our Jodha Akbar.!!.

Originally posted by: neeshaa16

Abhay and Radhika..OMG..Take a bow..You two are most eligible to write a PhD thesis on spirituality. Radhika ..thanks a ton for starting this amazing thread and look at amazing posts we have ..Lasya and Rashmi also have written beautifully..and you both... what can I say..WOW...

I only want to differ on one point Abhay...Though I cent percent agree with you that SPIRITUALITY and religion are not linked..but in case of Jodha-Akbar...I beg to differ.. I feel it was their inter caste marriage that acted as a catlyst in bringing forth their spirituality...

They accepetd each others religion..here it was Jalal's broad mindedness or whatever..he allowed Jo to practice her religion ... they learnt a lot from eachs others religion..their overall outlook towards other
religions broadened ..their outlook changed.. they both had spiritual bent but Jos thoughts and actions showed her to be more spiritual person.. she never craved for material tHINGS ..Maybe Jalals spiritual journey began little late after he discovered his heart ... but I feel he was attracted towards Jo because of her spiritual side..her purity of soul..that he fell in love with... ..her inner beauty was what he fell for.. otherwise he had all of 5000 beautiful ladies in his harem... but Jo was so very different.. WHat I meant to say atleast as per Jodha Akbar serial I feel Jo was the catalyst in bringing forth Jalal's spiritual side... I may be wrong ..but thats my POV...

Originally posted by: chitterati

Very well written, earlier your long posts used to scare me, but now that I have started reading them I can see why you have such a fan following . Funny that you should think about Rumi... There were so many instances in their journey where I thought Rumi' s gems would fit perfectly.

Originally posted by: RadhikaS0

Neesha,

Thanks a ton! Your affection makes you praise me more than I deserve. 😊 This thread was born on its own - and has sprouted and is flourishing because of the nurture provided by all of you.

I like your post but I wish to explain a few points in greater detail.

Jalal / Akbar was born spiritual. He inherited a spiritual vision from his mother's side. This side manifested itself at least twice before he ever met Jodha.

Secondly, religion, per se, had little to do with their spiritual journey together. This is my personal opinion. You may disagree. 😊

Why I feel so is because both of them were individuals who practiced their religion privately and never thrust those beliefs on anyone else around them. They started unknowingly influencing each other's thoughts and beliefs at an intellectual level, thru their talents as well as the exposure of hitherto hidden facets of their personality.

For instance, Jodha was struck by Jalal's decision to pardon the parents of a child because he didn't want the child to be orphaned. Similarly, Jalal was entranced by the fact that Jodha had used his farmaan to seek the release of a maid rather than even her liberty.

What attracted Jalal to Jodha initally was not (only) her spiritual side but the wealth of talent that seemed to be pouring forth from her like a gushing mountain spring. A girl he didn't wish to give a second glance to was forcing him every moment to dare to look elsewhere.

A man who seemed to be the epitome of all that was evil in her world seemed to get lost in God while listening to sufi music at Ajmer - the stark contrast was hard for Jodha to accept.

You may think I am straying from the point. But what I want to say is that it was not religion but a recognition of the inner similarities between the two that brought them together initially as friends and later as lovers and soul mates. They both were extremely loyal to their loved ones and put duty above everything else. They both believed in trusting God's loving and merciful nature when overwhelmed by problems.

They both had high standards of moral values and ethics. Jodha's had been allowed to shine always. Jalal's had been buried deep inside his heart and had to be brought out by Jodha. But they were always present within him too.

The deep connect that established slowly between them on a physical, mental, emotional and social level thru shared experiences and shared learning helped them forge a common belief system in a God who was above all religions and faiths. Added to this was the extreme suffering they underwent together during the early years of marriage that forced them to look inwards and seek solace in their abiding faith in God.

Yes, JJ went to temples and dargahs, celebrated each other's festivals, and genuinely accepted each other as they were, without regard for their creed. But this was, if anything, only the tip of the iceberg for their spiritual journey. The real catalyst for their common spiritual journey was their shared life experience that taught them to look beyond people and experiences and to believe in that Almighty who alone teaches us all there is to learn and who alone holds our hand and leads us thru the darkness to Light and Life.

Originally posted by: peepu

Jalal is rationality and jodha the emotional aspect.
When rationality combines with emotions it becomes the perfect synchronization.
That is how jodha and jalal blended into each other's soul like the waters of Ganga and Yamuna.
This blend created history,we are witnessing it.

Originally posted by: RadhikaS0

Chitterati:

Abhay thinking of Rumi is not at all funny or surprising 😊- he lives and breathes Rumi and his philosophy.

Originally posted by: Rashmi81

Abhay and Radhika,

Thanks for your reply to my spirituality post.

Thanks a lot,dear.

I know it's a vast topic and to talk about spirituality ,I think I am still not eligible .

What we as a common man,who doesn't go into deep thinking about spirituality and all,want from god?Why we worship god?

A man goes to temple puts a one rupee coin into that donation box and asks many things from god from passing exams to promotion ,increment ,good life partner ,a baby etc anything.

Nowadays with one rupees what will you get ?Nothing ,not even eclairs.

But in the temple ,still we can go ask anything from god with that .So no inflation here.😆

But does he really require this bribe? No right.We all know that .But we still continue that practice .
Same way many people keep fast .Reason behind that ? Numerous.From solah somwar for a good husband to Saturdays for " shani Pida " and all.We eat that " vrat" food,But do we really know the reason of keeping fast ? Very few people know.

Same applies to pooja paath and all .We shouldn't recite mantras,sholkas ,aarti for god but for our inner peace.
The examples you have high lighted are some happenings among Hindus. And Hinduism accepts every type of thinking people into its warm embrace including the one saying there is no god. As much as it has rituals, it has deep profound mysticism connected to it. God creates the soul and the soul resides inside the human body. The soul's age is independent of the human bodies age. All souls are children of god. Every people who having different dept of spirituality are actually of different maturity. What makes the soul to mature and grow is the experience it faces. Now the person putting 1 rupee and asking god something is like a child coming to father and asking what he desired. This is why the wish get fulfilled but if not then it means that it is not to be given. This basic way of following the process of worshiping is how a young soul will do and it evolves birth after birth. Further more, by fasting, doing pooja and all with or without knowing the reason will still get result but the intensity will not be the same. So it said that do something knowing about it is always better.

I sincerely feel ,the day when a person goes to temple and doesn't ask anything to god and just feels happy by seeing god's face,the day when he keeps a fast not for a specific reason but for being close to god and to give some rest to his digestive system ( in reality "upwaas" means to be close to god) and when a person closes his eyes and when we say " ganpati" then it shouldn't be elephant god but even a small dot we see should be ganpati for us, as god has no physical form ,then at that time, I say the journey of a person starts from god fearing to god loving.
👏 Very good and rightly said. And would say everyONE will come to that juncture in their journey. I see that you love Ganesha and He's my favorite too.

It's the most difficult journey and has lots of obstacles but the day we reach the destination ,we will be the happiest person on earth.

Now coming to this spirituality in our show.We see Jodha only doing pooja .There was only one scene where Rahim recites gayatri mantra and bhagwad Gita sholka and tells the meaning to Akbar.Is this really enough? We should have more scenes of her reading Gita and even explaining the sholkas to some bandhis or even to Akbar too.

Same with Quran .We had one scene of hers of trying to learn it from Salima and one that day of Hamida explains something from Quran .But we want more of it .Let even the viewers also know what's written in Quran and in Gita.

So here when Akbar learns about her scriptures and she learns about Islam ,it's not they who are benefitting, Its we as viewers too.We all will come to know that finally whether it's bible ,geeta or Quran ,everybody teaches same things .So all religions are equal .
Yes all religions are like many part taken to one destination, God.

Jodha Akbar is a beautiful example of two religions coming together and forming one religion of humanity,love ,compassion . These two people not only come close to each other but they are close to divine power which is finally one though we give different names to it like Bhagwan ,Allah and many more.
This the beauty of JA. I sometime cannot even describe in words how harmonious they are despite belonging to different religion. For me there are alot to learn from them in this aspect.

Originally posted by: RadhikaS0

Abhay,

I wish to know how you are able to be so deep and philosophical at your age. I do believe that you have some connect with JA in the past that you understand them so well. But now I feel you must have some soul connect with the sufis of the past to be able to delve so deep into the mystic well of spiritualism and draw forth heavenly pearls of wisdom.

"We are travelers on a cosmic journey, stardust, swirling and dancing in the eddies and whirlpools of infinity. Life is eternal. We have stopped for a moment to encounter each other, to meet, to love, to share.This is a precious moment. It is a little parenthesis in eternity."

Truly, you have captured the essence of the relationship of JA. They were two different individuals from diverse backgrounds who, ordinarily, should not have even met each other. But something pulled Jalal to Jodha like the sun pulling the earth to itself, even when the earth tries to pull away, and keeping it near and attached always through an unseen bond. It was as if the entire Universe conspired to help Him find Her - his Soul Mate for Eternity.

When they met, they spoke to each other (or rather their souls spoke to each other) in the pure Language of the World. It required no explanation, just as the universe needs none as it travels through endless time. What Jalal felt at that moment was that he was in the presence of the only woman in his life, and that, with no need for words, she recognized the same thing. He was more certain of it than of anything in the world. He had been told that he must never fall in love. But maybe people (like Bairam Khan and Mahamanga) who felt that way had never learned the universal language. Because, when you know that language, it's easy to understand that someone in the world awaits you, whether it's in the middle of the desert or in some great city. And when two such people encounter each other, and their eyes meet, the past and the future become unimportant. There is only that moment, and the incredible certainty that everything under the sun has been written by one hand only. It is the hand that evokes love, and creates a twin soul for every person in the world. Without such love, one's dreams would have no meaning.

You have mentioned some incidents. I recall still more moments from the show.

• When Jalal goes to Kali Ma's temple and fulfills Jodha's vow in a simple yet ingenious manner.
• When Jodha accompanies Jalal to Ajmer for the first time - Jalal says that she need not pray at the dargah if her faith stops her, but she learns from Jalal (whom she couldn't stand then) how to pray there.
• In the same sequence, Jodha is amazed for the first time to see the spiritual side of Jalal as he dances in a trance-like state with the dervishes there.
• When Jodha asks Jalal to teach her how to do the namaz.
• When Jalal learns to perform arati and surya namaskar.
• When Jodha wants to keep roza with Jalal.
• When JJ pray together for the well-being of Ruq's "child".

And so many more that I can go on listing them...😊

To think, Abhay, that five centuries back, two people could overcome all prejudice and intolerance from both communities and forge a deep soul-level bond with each other and develop a common faith in a higher power, seamlessly merging their customs and beliefs in the process. What a beautiful union these two had - something most other mortals can only yearn for.

"When we love, we always strive to become better than we are. When we strive to become better than we are, everything around us becomes better too."

It is well said marriages are made in heaven. This was a match that could only have been made by the Almighty, after searching far and wide for suitable partners for these two exceptional individuals, who were destined to tread the path of spiritualism, often alone and in the face of much opposition. Their Love enabled them to transform themselves, their life and the world around them into what can only be called Paradise on Earth.

I agree with you that the scars Life / Destiny / Fate left on the psyches of JJ might have acted as the catalyst that propelled them ahead on their quest for Inner Peace and Meaning of Life. Here was the most powerful couple in Hindustan at that time, whom Fate seemed to delight in mocking. They lived in constant fear of betrayal and impending death. They lost some of those who had been loyal to them while, every day seemed to bring a new enemy into their life. They lost four babies in quick succession. Their own communities derived pleasure in mocking their union and rejecting them. Even a fraction of this would have been enough to break lesser mortals. But JJ strived on, believing in the inherent goodness of the Almighty, who they knew would never burden them with more than what they could bear.

"Tell your heart that the fear of suffering is worse than the suffering itself. And that no heart has ever suffered when it goes in search of its dreams, because every second of the search is a second's encounter with God and with eternity."

The blows of Fate could not bend their spirit and they kept believing in their dreams of having kids and being together in happy union and of being ever loved by the Merciful God. From where did they derive this immense strength and faith? From their love and trust in each other. And when two people love each other truly, they can achieve anything in the Universe.

Did they understand what was happening within their souls, as they tried to find solace in each other, when tormented by Destiny? Perhaps, perhaps not. But then again, like you said, it's not important to realize the process of transformation. It happens within the heart and the soul, without a person being conscious of it. But once the transformation is complete, even that person finds it hard to recognize what he/she has left behind.

It is merely sufficient to be remain faithful to the One we pray to and be grateful for the good He bestows on us in multitude, yet minor ways. To their credit, JJ never failed to recognize and be thankful for the small things that brought them closer to each other and to God.

(I remember an old post of Mansi where she had mentioned that Love is not all about the big events only. It is also about the small acts of respect and care we bestow on each other every day, without being conscious of it.)

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The biggest transformation was perhaps undergone by Jalal, after Jodha lit the flame of Love in his heart. He could never have become Akbar the Great on the strength of brute force alone. His journey to greatness started the day he stopped fighting the forces of the Universe and accepted Love to seep into each and every pore of his being. He learnt the biggest lesson of Life that one can never escape from his/her heart. When the Heart calls, one has to follow it in order to realize his/her destiny. There is no stopping nor any turning back on this journey. Once a person starts it, he/she can only move forward.

And whatever the person needs to know to undertake this journey can only be learned through the experience of the journey.

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When JJ made the decision to be together henceforth (post Jodha's return to Agra), they offered their destiny into the hands of the Almighty and trusted in Him to take them to their final destination that they themselves could have never dreamed of at the time. And God tested them in immeasurable ways. He tested everything they could have learnt in their journey together.

Why did God test them so for so many years till He finally blessed them with a divine son and peace? Only because God wanted them to not only realize their dreams but also to master the lessons they learnt while moving towards their dreams. JJ could have easily given up during this long period of testing. They could have "died of thirst in the desert just when the palm trees appeared on the horizon."

But their love for each other as well as their faith in the kindness of God kept them going - they knew that they deserved to realize their dreams and they had the strength to achieve them, as long as they were together.

JA - Rest in Blissful Eternity!!! 😊