NO SORRY - Page 2

Originally posted by: Arsheela

I am not with U

Maan didn't think before saying those harsh words

All, those who are still blaming Geet for forgiving Dev, I gave some eamples, but ppl wanted to compare apples to apples and oranges to oranges.. So here I have finally found some thing very close this situation and trying to think too much..

Pinjar yes Amrita Pritam's heart wrenching novel on women's plight in the most disturbed & celebrated era of 1947.

Movie too was great to watch though reading it was more a emotional experience to me.

Puro forgave Rashid & accepted him Now coz she did not want to move on & fight anymore her father & mother had shown her door how could she trust another family, the man's family who was seeking her hand. She also did not want to burden them as already they were taking a case similar to hers with them she dint want the other lady being saved to face same as she did when she had returned home atleast not if she could help by not going back.

She also knew Rashid loves her & never hurt her minus what he had to do as it would have been worse if not him but any other male of their family had chosen to do it. Others could have just raped her & throw her out. But he married her as he knew she would never be welcomed by her family he did not want her to die or be left at others mercy as happened to woman in her position.

When she ran away from him to her family he was on her heels so that she meets no harm.He never disrespected her always took great care of her & dint hurt nor question her when she on purpose lost his baby. He bowed & accepted it as his punishment. His guilt never allowed him to touch her again.

He fought his family gave away rights to land & crop when her brother had burnt their crop & his family wanted him dead or hurt.

He on his life saved her sister - in - law by aiding her to escape & gave her shelter & protected her in a time when that was suicidal.

All this given & her having nothing more to lose made her forgive this man & give him & her life another chance.

Indeed a heart wrenching plight of women.

But Pinjar in context to Geet & her situation & now especially with her forgiving Dev this story is not same nor remotely close .

My point of view with all due respect to yours.

@Post maker- Both should apologize not one. Certainly not Maan alone it could be suicidal if he clears himself & she is shown to have learn nothing from it at all.

i half agree n half not

Originally posted by: AnuN

All, those who are still blaming Geet for forgiving Dev, I gave some eamples, but ppl wanted to compare apples to apples and oranges to oranges.. So here I have finally found some thing very close this situation and trying to think too much..

Has anyone watched movie called 'Pinjer'? A movie that deals with most complex human emotions of love, hate, pain, agony, accusation, frustrations, sacrifice, and forgiveness..

I have watched this movie twice.. when I first saw it, it left me shocked, pained and crying with so much to absorb.. I felt as if I have seen something that can cut my heart apart.. I still dared to watch it second time after few yrs when it was coming on TV as its the most touching story of a girl, I could ever see onscreen.. I have watched movies of Dilip Kumar (tragedy king), moving of Meena Kumari (tragedy Queen), but had never cried so much ever before..

So here is the story -

Puro, daughter of the wealthy family, leads a happy life in Amritsar. Her family returns to its village, Chatwal, west of Amritsar, where her marriage is arranged with Ramchand. She dreams of herself as Janki of Ram... Loves him from depth of her heart.. And is waiting to get married. Puro's dreams of a happy future are shattered when, one evening, she is kidnapped by Rashid. He is looking to settle a family score that goes back two generations. Rashid, who has by now fallen in love with Puro, confines her to his house in the same village. When he tells her they are getting married, a desperate Puro manages to escape. But an even crueler fate awaits her: her parents tell her they cannot take her back. When a heartbroken Puro heads to the village well, she finds Rashid waiting to take her home. They get married but for, Puro, this marriage is akin to death. She wastes away, becoming a pinjar (skeleton) who exists but has ceased to live. For her, she has gone through a false marrige and its a rape too.. To save the family izzat, Puro's sister Rajjo is offered in marriage to Ramchand. But Ramchand does not agree as he still loves Puro and says he will wait for her forever. So Rajjo is married to Ramchand's cousin, while Puro's brother, Trilok marries Ramchand's sister, Lajo. Puro cannot forget Ramchand and her family and dreams of being re-united with them. Trilok, who has never given up his search for his sister, returns to Chatwal. He soon finds out that she was kidnapped by Rashid and burns Rashid's farm, destroying the harvest. Rashid is broken but refuses to seek revenge, pointing out that if someone's sister had been kidnapped, this was the least he would do in anger. And he asks them to let him pay for his sins.. In mean time, Puro if found to be 4 months pregnant and she tells Rashid, she hates herself for carring his sin for 4 months now. She later has a miscarriage and she has no regrets as to her it was sin anyways.. Partition is announced and everyone's world comes crashing down. Ramchand's family is forced to flee eastwards, towards India. On the way, they are attacked by a Muslim mob and a pregnant Lajo, Ram's sister, who had returned to her parental home to deliver her first child, is kidnapped by a Muslim. Puro meets Ramchand at a refugee camp for Hindus and he pleads with her to find his missing sister. Rashid promises to help Puro so that he may redeem himself in her eyes. Puro finds the kidnapped Lajo and Rashid helps her escape safely back to her family. Ram and Tilak ask Puro to come with them too as Ram is still ready to accept Puro.. But Puro refuses... She finally forgives Rashid and accepts him as her husband.. And Ram, he is really greatest person, who immidiately accepts this and sacrifices his love and returns back to India with his sister and Trilok..

When I compare what Geet has gone thru, nothing compared to Puro.. She had Maan by her side, but Puro was all alone staying with person she hated most.. Geet atleast did not know Dev is cheating when Dev raped her.. so she atleast loved her baby.. Puro knew and was being raped mentally and physically for some family enimity.. So for her, even the baby was someone's sin..

So when Puro can forgive Rashid and accept him as her husband, Geet just forgave him and know him as just a person there and nothing much.. Yes she accepted his color of holi, but Puro even accepted Rashid as her husband..

if you know this you should know Amrita Pritam wrote that novel to protray plight of women during that era. She herself was victim of 1947 riots therefore she accepted that her novel have dark and weak women in end which was truth of that era. Similarly was most leading ladies of Premchand. They actually protrayed truth of that era. Amrita Pritam herlsef accepted essence of stroy was that Puro left into pinjer kankal from lively girl courtsey social and cultural norms of that era according to which women was not human being rather a puppet to her sarroundings. Puro was puppet to social sarroundings. Remeber scene when she was disappinted when that muslim name was writtern on her hand. That was her last reaction as human being. She was always a puppet or better pinjar...who breathes not live. She dint left husband because I have seen in this era tooo women tormented tortured by her husband goes back to him for their loyality. yes rmachadra would have accepted him But that was vision of Amrita Pritam that puro....lived like Pinjar never got life back....Amrita Pritam always conveyed through her novel how women of that era was mere puppet who used to live for their survival not ffor existence never for identity
Now you are comparing GEET with Puro GEET who started her fight for her identity from HP days...there start her journey
.so dear actually you are comparing apple with orange......Puro story was different from Geet....Puro was never rebel she went back to rashid on her own and accepted her fate the day her parents disowned her............geet was fighter who fought against parents society for her kid who was going to be illegimate kid....If you understand charcter rightly .....Given she was puro she would have gone exactly according to parents got bay aborted and and got married to another guy....As predicted my dev NT ...

...Basically Forgiveness and acceptance from Puro was her character because she never learned to fight all her life....All she fought was once for her bhabhi thats all......But that time too she was so sacred....leaving husband during that era was next to impossible.....so that was her character....She was always silent meek observer what fate had for her in store...I would say it more as acceptance to whatever life and fate give you back more than forgiveness...

Forgiveness from Geet was something not her charcter she was fighter a rebel after fake marriage ....she started this fight....why she left her parents than...her parents never involved in assult it was BRij ....Why she punished them for crime they never did......After Maan came to her life...she became rebel who want to fight against all injustice done to her.....not accept it quietly as her fate

....Geet was fighter... rebel,,,,a bold strong women or fighter of 2010 era ......and Puro was timid..dilusional...weak ...puppet or observer of 1947 era...........both have only one thing common......both were lively chirpy girl..before bad fate embraced them...but puro never came out of that trauma and remianed pinjar.....whereas Our GEET jumped back....she was pheonix for me before who used to rise from ashes....When you are comparing such distant charcter.....how can you say if forgiveness is virtue of one...it would be same for other....

Originally posted by: kuls11

if you know this you should know Amrita Pritam wrote that novel to protray plight of women during that era. She herself was victim of 1947 riots therefore she accepted that her novel have dark and weak women in end which was truth of that era. Similarly was most leading ladies of Premchand. They actually protrayed truth of that era. Amrita Pritam herlsef accepted essence of stroy was that Puro left into pinjer kankal from lively girl courtsey social and cultural norms of that era according to which women was not human being rather a puppet to her sarroundings. Puro was puppet to social sarroundings. Remeber scene when she was disappinted when that muslim name was writtern on her hand. That was her last reaction as human being. She was always a puppet or better pinjar...who breathes not live. She dint left husband because I have seen in this era tooo women tormented tortured by her husband goes back to him for their loyality. yes rmachadra would have accepted him But that was vision of Amrita Pritam that puro....lived like Pinjar never got life back....Amrita Pritam always conveyed through her novel how women of that era was mere puppet who used to live for their survival not ffor existence never for identity
Now you are comparing GEET with Puro GEET who started her fight for her identity from HP days...there start her journey
.so dear actually you are comparing apple with orange......Puro story was different from Geet....Puro was never rebel she went back to rashid on her own and accepted her fate the day her parents disowned her............geet was fighter who fought against parents society for her kid who was going to be illegimate kid....If you understand charcter rightly .....Given she was puro she would have gone exactly according to parents got bay aborted and and got married to another guy....As predicted my dev NT ...

...Basically Forgiveness and acceptance from Puro was her character because she never learned to fight all her life....All she fought was once for her bhabhi thats all......But that time too she was so sacred....leaving husband during that era was next to impossible.....so that was her character....I would say it more as acceptance to whatever life give you back than forgiveness...

Forgiveness from Geet was something not her charcter she was fighter after HP days....she started this fight....why she left her parents than...her parents never involved in assult it was BRij ....Why she punished them for crime they never did......After Maan came to her life...she became rebel who want to fight against all injustice done to her.....not accept it quietly as her luck..

....Geet was fighter... rebel,,,,a bold strong women of 2010 era ......and Puro was timid..dilusional...weak puppet of 1947 era...........both have only one thing common......both were lively chirpy girl..before bad luck embraced them...but puro never came out of that trauma and remianed pinjar.....whereas Our GEET jumped back....she was pheonix for me before who used to rise from ashes....When you are comparing such distant charcter.....how can you say if forgiveness is virtue of one...it would be same for other....

Originally posted by: -Rati-

Pinjar yes Amrita Pritam's heart wrenching novel on women's plight in the most disturbed & celebrated era of 1947.

Movie too was great to watch though reading it was more a emotional experience to me.

Puro forgave Rashid & accepted him Now coz she did not want to move on & fight anymore her father & mother had shown her door how could she trust another family, the man's family who was seeking her hand. She also did not want to burden them as already they were taking a case similar to hers with them she dint want the other lady being saved to face same as she did when she had returned home atleast not if she could help by not going back.

She also knew Rashid loves her & never hurt her minus what he had to do as it would have been worse if not him but any other male of their family had chosen to do it. Others could have just raped her & throw her out. But he married her as he knew she would never be welcomed by her family he did not want her to die or be left at others mercy as happened to woman in her position.

When she ran away from him to her family he was on her heels so that she meets no harm.He never disrespected her always took great care of her & dint hurt nor question her when she on purpose lost his baby. He bowed & accepted it as his punishment. His guilt never allowed him to touch her again.

He fought his family gave away rights to land & crop when her brother had burnt their crop & his family wanted him dead or hurt.

He on his life saved her sister - in - law by aiding her to escape & gave her shelter & protected her in a time when that was suicidal.

All this given & her having nothing more to lose made her forgive this man & give him & her life another chance.

Indeed a heart wrenching plight of women.

But Pinjar in context to Geet & her situation & now especially with her forgiving Dev this story is not same nor remotely close .

My point of view with all due respect to yours.

@Post maker- Both should apologize not one. Certainly not Maan alone it could be suicidal if he clears himself & she is shown to have learn nothing from it at all.

I respect your opinion. All I can say is how ever good he may be, the rape (well in Puro's thinking whatever I understood from the movie) or forced marriage could not be justified. It will still be a sin and even of same level that Dev did. Yes, Dev has not done anything close to what Rashid did during repentence, but thats cos the circumstances are different. But sin is same and so forgivenss can be compared. Thats all I tried to compare.. And regarding applogy. I think she owed him an explanation for sure.. but after leaving house instead of discussuing matter, may be yes..

Originally posted by: AnuN

All, those who are still blaming Geet for forgiving Dev, I gave some eamples, but ppl wanted to compare apples to apples and oranges to oranges.. So here I have finally found some thing very close this situation and trying to think too much..

Has anyone watched movie called 'Pinjer'? A movie that deals with most complex human emotions of love, hate, pain, agony, accusation, frustrations, sacrifice, and forgiveness..

I have watched this movie twice.. when I first saw it, it left me shocked, pained and crying with so much to absorb.. I felt as if I have seen something that can cut my heart apart.. I still dared to watch it second time after few yrs when it was coming on TV as its the most touching story of a girl, I could ever see onscreen.. I have watched movies of Dilip Kumar (tragedy king), moving of Meena Kumari (tragedy Queen), but had never cried so much ever before..

So here is the story -

Puro, daughter of the wealthy family, leads a happy life in Amritsar. Her family returns to its village, Chatwal, west of Amritsar, where her marriage is arranged with Ramchand. She dreams of herself as Janki of Ram... Loves him from depth of her heart.. And is waiting to get married. Puro's dreams of a happy future are shattered when, one evening, she is kidnapped by Rashid. He is looking to settle a family score that goes back two generations. Rashid, who has by now fallen in love with Puro, confines her to his house in the same village. When he tells her they are getting married, a desperate Puro manages to escape. But an even crueler fate awaits her: her parents tell her they cannot take her back. When a heartbroken Puro heads to the village well, she finds Rashid waiting to take her home. They get married but for, Puro, this marriage is akin to death. She wastes away, becoming a pinjar (skeleton) who exists but has ceased to live. For her, she has gone through a false marrige and its a rape too.. To save the family izzat, Puro's sister Rajjo is offered in marriage to Ramchand. But Ramchand does not agree as he still loves Puro and says he will wait for her forever. So Rajjo is married to Ramchand's cousin, while Puro's brother, Trilok marries Ramchand's sister, Lajo. Puro cannot forget Ramchand and her family and dreams of being re-united with them. Trilok, who has never given up his search for his sister, returns to Chatwal. He soon finds out that she was kidnapped by Rashid and burns Rashid's farm, destroying the harvest. Rashid is broken but refuses to seek revenge, pointing out that if someone's sister had been kidnapped, this was the least he would do in anger. And he asks them to let him pay for his sins.. In mean time, Puro if found to be 4 months pregnant and she tells Rashid, she hates herself for carring his sin for 4 months now. She later has a miscarriage and she has no regrets as to her it was sin anyways.. Partition is announced and everyone's world comes crashing down. Ramchand's family is forced to flee eastwards, towards India. On the way, they are attacked by a Muslim mob and a pregnant Lajo, Ram's sister, who had returned to her parental home to deliver her first child, is kidnapped by a Muslim. Puro meets Ramchand at a refugee camp for Hindus and he pleads with her to find his missing sister. Rashid promises to help Puro so that he may redeem himself in her eyes. Puro finds the kidnapped Lajo and Rashid helps her escape safely back to her family. Ram and Tilak ask Puro to come with them too as Ram is still ready to accept Puro.. But Puro refuses... She finally forgives Rashid and accepts him as her husband.. And Ram, he is really greatest person, who immidiately accepts this and sacrifices his love and returns back to India with his sister and Trilok..

When I compare what Geet has gone thru, nothing compared to Puro.. She had Maan by her side, but Puro was all alone staying with person she hated most.. Geet atleast did not know Dev is cheating when Dev raped her.. so she atleast loved her baby.. Puro knew and was being raped mentally and physically for some family enimity.. So for her, even the baby was someone's sin..

So when Puro can forgive Rashid and accept him as her husband, Geet just forgave him and know him as just a person there and nothing much.. Yes she accepted his color of holi, but Puro even accepted Rashid as her husband..

I have watched Pinjar and it shook me too. A beautiful movie indeed.you have given example of Puro. So I will also try to explain my point from same example.Puro stood by her marriage,a marriage which was based not on love but on revenge,a marriage which was forced on her. As you have told her husband kidnapped her,raped her. Yet even after going through these horrors,she was able to identify his love. She chose her husband over the person she loved whole heartedly(Ramchandra,whose love for Puro is pure and selfless beyond words).

So basically Puro forgave her husband for these horrible crimes,was able to identify the love hidden behind these twisted actions,accepted him with his flaws,respected the marriage even though it was forced on her and stood by her husband,forsaking everyone. It is not easy to have such strength.

Compare this to what Geet has done. She walked out of marriage based on love for a few harsh words. She left the husband who she knows loves her above all. Who knows better than Geet that Maan is out of his senses when angry. And who knows better thn Geet that Maan loves her insanely. But she chose to overlook that love. Refused to see the hurt,pain and helplessness that lay beyond those harsh words. She has left him forever instead of understanding him and making him understand. Of course we know that Maan would go after her and find her. But the fact remains that Geet chose to walk out forever on the person she knows loves her and loves her like no one else and their marriage due to Maan's harsh words. Whereas Puro chose to stand by her marriage and husband even after going through situations which were incomparably worse than this.

Originally posted by: AnuN

I respect your opinion. All I can say is how ever good he may be, the rape (well in Puro's thinking whatever I understood from the movie) or forced marriage could not be justified. It will still be a sin and even of same level that Dev did. Yes, Dev has not done anything close to what Rashid did during repentence, but thats cos the circumstances are different. But sin is same and so forgivenss can be compared. Thats all I tried to compare.. And regarding applogy. I think she owed him an explanation for sure.. but after leaving house instead of discussuing matter, may be yes..

Rape of any kind included marital is heinous sin.

Exactly Dev did nothing close rather nothing at all other than whole day weep around that he is repenting & the act of donating blood which ofcourse Maan by paying the goons called it even.

Dev did nothing but interfere in her married life & gave her moments when she had to explain to her husband though he never asked as he knew that its Dev's doing not Geet's.

As the circumstances of Dev are not similar to that of Rashid's so is Geet's with Puro nor their position in life when they are shown to forgive their sinner besides the only fact that both are women & women who were wronged by both their family & the outsiders nothing makes them comparable.

No two people nor their circumstances are ever ditto so the comparison drawn or contrast made is always very unsure & unstable both technically & factually

Originally posted by: ankita10

I have watched Pinjar and it shook me too. A beautiful movie indeed.you have given example of Puro. So I will also try to explain my point from same example.Puro stood by her marriage,a marriage which was based not on love but on revenge,a marriage which was forced on her. As you have told her husband kidnapped her,raped her. Yet even after going through these horrors,she was able to identify his love. She chose her husband over the person she loved whole heartedly(Ramchandra,whose love for Puro is pure and selfless beyond words).

So basically Puro forgave her husband for these horrible crimes,was able to identify the love hidden behind these twisted actions,accepted him with his flaws,respected the marriage even though it was forced on her and stood by her husband,forsaking everyone. It is not easy to have such strength.

Compare this to what Geet has done. She walked out of marriage based on love for a few harsh words. She left the husband who she knows loves her above all. Who knows better than Geet that Maan is out of his senses when angry. And who knows better thn Geet that Maan loves her insanely. But she chose to overlook that love. Refused to see the hurt,pain and helplessness that lay beyond those harsh words. She has left him forever instead of understanding him and making him understand. Of course we know that Maan would go after her and find her. But the fact remains that Geet chose to walk out forever on the person she knows loves her and loves her like no one else and their marriage due to Maan's harsh words. Whereas Puro chose to stand by her marriage and husband even after going through situations which were incomparably worse than this.