Sushpective Chat Club: Thread #6 - Page 82

Created

Last reply

Replies

1.1k

Views

88.8k

Users

19

Likes

5.1k

Frequent Posters

-Sush- thumbnail
15th Anniversary Thumbnail Sparkler Thumbnail + 3
Posted: 9 years ago

Originally posted by: grumpydwarf

It's comparing the death rates to car accidents and gun violence. About 33,000 die each year from gun violence. The media and campaigns don't cover it as much. I don't think it's undermining it. World Politics profs posted it.


Red...I find this sort of comparison ...quite erroneous ...By this line of reasoning...the number of people died in Apollo 13, or the number of people died in Pearl Harbor, or even by a serial killer ...should not get the attention they get...because on an absolute comparison of numbers alone...those events are quite insignificant...compared to people dying in car accidents...

The popular thing now is to blame the "media" for all evils in the society...I think 24 hour media is only a problem if people are watching it 24 hours...That is not how the media is supposed to be consumed...they loop any news...only because people tuning in any time can get the news they are interested in...

I personally think...there is a huge difference between events we think are preventable compared to events that are not...Comparing the numbers without this in mind...doesn't serve much purpose...IMO


EDIT: Bhavi, just read your post above...we agree about the fallacy in the use of statistics without considering the nature of the event...Also regarding guns...guns don't shoot themselves ...people shoot them...yes, guns make killing easier...but use of numbers like this article does ...doesn't make a lot of sense to me...,.



Edited by -Sush- - 9 years ago
Grumpydwarf24 thumbnail
11th Anniversary Thumbnail Visit Streak 180 Thumbnail + 4
Posted: 9 years ago
we had a similar discussion in class today on the subject. Terrorism causes 34,000 deaths a year around the world. Guns cost more in America alone yet don't get half the media coverage or importance given by any political party.
Edited by grumpydwarf - 9 years ago
-Sush- thumbnail
15th Anniversary Thumbnail Sparkler Thumbnail + 3
Posted: 9 years ago

Originally posted by: grumpydwarf

Hey Sush,

I dont agree with everything the article say either. Especially how raising the minimum wage won't solve the issues. It was raised in the 90s and helped a lot of people move up in terms of economic stability. And is said to have helped the economy because minimum wage workers have to spend everything they have. That helps boost the economy, many people will tell you.

And as far back as you look back in American history the economy has always done better with taxes being increased not decreased. Even under Ronald Reagan it was 70% percent for a while. As the taxes decreased he incread the deficit. The corporate tax rate in the progressive era use to be 60 some percent. But since the Free Trade agreements weren't written for and by corporate America. The way they are now by giving the American government money through Super Pacs so corporate America can play by their own set of rules. Like taking their companies over seas where they can pay workers cents an hour and still be able to sell their products here. Thus we didn't see a lot of outsourcing of jobs.

Even Robert Reich, who was the former Sec of Labor in the Clinton administration has stated the lowering taxes on corporations as been tried by both the Obama and Clinton administration but it hasn't worked since the effective rate is already low. But people Gerald Friedman, Robert Reich and others say Bernie's single payer plan may encourage companies to come back here as they will not have to pick up the private cost of health insurance for their employees.

Look at democratic socialist countries like Denmark, Sweden, Scandinavia, Norway. 90% percent of Danes are fully satisfied with their country. It actually ranks as one of the world's happiest countries. These countries have the lowest rates of poverty in the OECD. Because Government tends to work for ordinary people and doesnt just provide corporate welfare by voting in favor of Bills due to Super Pac money that only help the top 1%. And these countries actually pay just as much in taxes as American only their more fair. Most of our tax payer dollars go to regime changing wars and military spending. China, Russia, Saudi Arabia, France, UK and other countries combined spend $601 Billion dollars as a whole on military spending. America alone spend $610 Billion dollas every single year. And even with more taxes the average person in democratic socialist countries is at least $13,000 dollars richer than the average American because they dont have to spend fortunes on healthcare, education.

Now our tax payment also gets wasted in funding prison cost thanks to the first Clinton administration. There was a crime bill passed in the 90s by the Clinton administration where Hillary darling famously referred to African Americans as Super Predators which she denies now to Black Activist. Again this is not surprising coming from a woman who supported Goldwater a segregationist after college while Bernie was fighting for Civil Rights. And who showed pictures of Obama in a garb. Who is she to criticize Trump for being a racist and encouraging anti-muslim rhetoric? Any hoo now states after to tax their citizens significantly high due to the Clinton Era's start of mass incarceration that has put more Americans behind bars than any other country including China. Again Bernie also supported this bill because it was combined with the Brady Bill and VIAWA. But he at least is apologetic about it unlike Hillary and never referred to anyone as a "super predator". Again there are many reason to dislike Hillary they aren't all rooted in her being scrutinized or sexism. I dont think she has been a victim of any kind at all just gotten where she has gotten due to the Clinton last name.



The Clinton administration also signed free trade deals like Nafta which cost as thousands of jobs. Permanent trade relations China which even Donald Trump says was a disaster. And cut welfare which was only 4% percent of the budget and put millions of Americans in poverty. The few economic success that administration had was due to the Internet boom which wasn't REALLY Bill or Hillary's fault. Also raising the minimum wage and reversing trickle down economics to SOME extent. But not even as close to how much it was during the progressive era. The middle class grew minimally at best. They actually got far less passed than Obama. The few things that were passed ended up proving to be harmful in the future like repealing Glass Steagall.

Here is Robert Reich the former Sec of Labor take on the article: Copied Straight from his Facebook page

The Economist is an excellent source of analysis, even though its editorial direction is right-of-center. Here it makes that case (the same one I make in "Saving Capitalism: For the Many, Not the Few") that American corporations have become too dominant -- capable of overcharging consumers because of lack of competition. The result is a major redistribution upward, from the paychecks of average people to corporate executives and major shareholders.

And the take on world piece. Of course there are times where War is necessary but should it be the first resort? Is using violence as a means to supposedly fight for the humanitarian cause justified? The Iran Deal proved otherwise? In the Iraq War itself America is responsible for kill over 100K civilians? How are we any different than Sadam Hussain. Do we even have a number of how many people he was killing? Do know how many innocent minorities get killed in by our police AKA government every year? Should someone come in and police us? And it very debatable about whether Iraq is better off today. None of my TAs who come from Syria would agree. Its become a haven for terrorist who kill many people too. They believe we destroyed a beautiful country. The healthcare system was ranked far better than ours. It was once a developing nation. Now in complete and utter chaos. Isis is not the only terrorist groups there are many smaller ones.


And secondly the humanitarian explanation was not the one give to the American people which was WMD. That we never found. It resulted not only resulted in a severely destabilized middle east. Which we can see the results of now not just in the middle east but all over the world. For an example, we see terrorist attacks happening all over the world. Trillions spent and an increased deficit. Veterans coming home to one of the most messed up (sorry) the most messed up health care system in the world suffering from PTSD. Not having a enough funds to fix our crumbling infrastructure that is poisoning kids in Flint Michigan. Of course sometimes war is nessacary but should we sit back and think about the consequences FIRST before we vote for in Iraq and decide for an intervention in Libya, another destabilized state becoming a haven for terrorist.


Oh and ONE of the huge reason behind Sanders upset in Michigan was because people underestimated the Muslim vote. Who are now for Sanders because they partly blame Hillary for whats happening in Libya and Iraq. I dont know too many Muslim intellectuals living in the Middle East who thought it was a good idea. Fatima Bhutto certainly takes every chance she gets to criticize Bush and Obama for his drone strikes. The majority of the American people dont. Look at Bush's approval rating here and around the world primarily due to the Wars?

Again I fully agree with this article I posted from international relations.


http://foreignpolicy.com/2016/01/08/what-would-a-realist-world-have-looked-like-iraq-syria-iran-obama-bush-clinton/

But to each its own.

Finally another endorsement.


You and I have very different views, Red. While may be both democrats...our reasonings and conclusions differ a lot...

Let me just say...I understand where you are coming from...and some of the feelings are very justified...but I do not agree with the conclusions and solutions...

Any way...further debate will not help...so I will leave it at that...lets talk about more fun things...shall we? :D
-Sush- thumbnail
15th Anniversary Thumbnail Sparkler Thumbnail + 3
Posted: 9 years ago

Originally posted by: -Bhavi

hello all

G- I don't think that there is a family politics yet in the show. What they are showing is very natural and close to reality. I am liking the show however am not sure how long can one have good episodes since its a 7 days show. Cast and crew will surely burn out soon.

On terrorism: Many people can die at the same time if its taken lightly. There can be mass destruction both of property and lives like that on 9/11. As far as shooting is concerned the no gun policy can take care of it. Accidents can be prevented. They are due to human errors and not due to some unseen reason.

Indra- The engagement was a drama. The lawyer mind at work. He calls Suman cheap but to me he did a cheap drama with Urvashi and family. Today he blames that Suman did what she did on purpose and claims that she knows that he remembers about jewellery😲 On one side he tells her that he has forgotten everything and on other 😆 They both are still in the school the way they are behaving.

Just a suggestion and not to offend any one. Can everyone here just post the link of the article if its too lengthy😕 It takes a whole lot of effort to find the other post especially if you are logging from phone. 😳




Ahhh...sounds like the hate story...We have seen before!!

Anyone else watched Kapoor & Sons or Tamasha? What did you all think??


-Sush- thumbnail
15th Anniversary Thumbnail Sparkler Thumbnail + 3
Posted: 9 years ago

Red...my apologies ...if I have offended you...
Political discussions...have a way of bringing out a lot of differences in people's views...

If only Obama could run for a third term...many including me...would have taken that option...above all...
Grumpydwarf24 thumbnail
11th Anniversary Thumbnail Visit Streak 180 Thumbnail + 4
Posted: 9 years ago

Originally posted by: -Sush-



Red...my apologies ...if I have offended you...
Political discussions...have a way of bringing out a lot of differences in people's views...

If only Obama could run for a third term...many including me...would have taken that option...above all...



Not all! If you think invading country after country! Creating terrorist havens there like Hillary voted to in Iraq and than Libya. Taking dozens of innocent lives is a better means of achieving peace than through negotiations than you are free to have than opinion I suppose. 😊 I will say so far it's only created more terrorist and less peace. Let's see where it takes us in the future!

Henry Kissenger is one of Hillary's top advisors he surely knows how to attain peace better!
Look Sush, I respect you and your views! But Regime Change has proven to do more harm than good! Look at the two places that have the greatest number of terrorist today Iraq and Afghanistan. The two places we went to WAR with. But I guess we can agree to disagree.
Edited by grumpydwarf - 9 years ago
chicksoup thumbnail
12th Anniversary Thumbnail Sparkler Thumbnail + 4
Posted: 9 years ago
Red,
I happen to subscribe to your philosophy, be it on terrorism or media abuse.

And now moving on to more fun things.

Gorky is coming up with something with Barun and Surbhi. Not sure how many people would be excited to hear this...

I would love to have Barun back on my screen. SJ has surprised me with every role of hers...She did very well with KSG and KV...exceptionally well, I must say. But she was surprisingly equally disappointing in the next two seasons...So I hope Barun will show me exactly what it is that makes SJ click for me.

But 4L...I have been following Adhuri Kahani on screen and off screen drama...Show is quite pathetic. I hope they have something good for Barun.🤔
Edited by chicksoup - 9 years ago
-Sush- thumbnail
15th Anniversary Thumbnail Sparkler Thumbnail + 3
Posted: 9 years ago

Originally posted by: grumpydwarf



Not all! If you think invading country after country! Creating terrorist havens there like Hillary voted to in Iraq and than Libya. Taking dozens of innocent lives is a better means of achieving peace than through negotiations than you are free to have than opinion I suppose. 😊 I will say so far it's only created more terrorist and less peace. Let's see where it takes us in the future!

Henry Kissenger is one of Hillary's top advisors he surely knows how to attain peace better!
Look Sush, I respect you and your views! But Regime Change has proven to do more harm than good! Look at the two places that have the greatest number of terrorist today Iraq and Afghanistan. The two places we went to WAR with. But I guess we can agree to disagree.


In bold...
That is a complete mis-characterization and misrepresentation of my views...Red. I am really disappointed with how you have chosen to portray my views...😕

bhavis thumbnail
13th Anniversary Thumbnail Stunner Thumbnail
Posted: 9 years ago
Hello all
Sush - I have not watched any movies lately and with good weather I will be out more than in front of TV so am not sure when will i watch those. Yet i have a list of movies to watch.

Tamasha, Kapoor and sons, Neerja, Airlift and on Angrez side Spotlight, Zootopia (I loved its trailer), The big short.

Its not even a hate story😕 Its more like a stagnant story. It does not go ahead. Its going in circles. Not sure how long will i last there.
chicksoup thumbnail
12th Anniversary Thumbnail Sparkler Thumbnail + 4
Posted: 9 years ago
Sush n Red,
🤗


To all CC members,

No one has anything to say about Barun's comeback vehicle?😲

😳

Related Topics

Chat Clubs thumbnail

Posted by: SriRani · 4 years ago

Members Only - SSR Case Discussion Thread Hello Everyone, This chat club made for discussion related to SSR. This chat club remains for invited...

Expand ▼
Top

Stay Connected with IndiaForums!

Be the first to know about the latest news, updates, and exclusive content.

Add to Home Screen!

Install this web app on your iPhone for the best experience. It's easy, just tap and then "Add to Home Screen".