Abir - the family guy??? - Page 10

Originally posted by: aquaHP

Who is "they"? Mujhe jo kehna hai, main directly kehti hoon. Aur na hi maine directly ye kaha aur na hi indirectly.

Also, it should have been 'Shaheer ka Abir' and not 'Abir ka Shaheer'. Please try and calm down. Nobody cares about preference in the show. Personally, I am very happy with how much screen space everyone has. Pata nahi kyun itna hawua bana ke rakha iss baat ka?! Anyway, I have nothing to gain even if a character gets more or less screen space. If the actors would give me a share of their money, I would definitely campaign but until and unless that day comes, I don't care.

Aqua you are one who questioned abt shah choice of the show..then you said abir has nothing to do in the show..then you are saying I am not talking abt anything..if you want to talk abt abir then why brought shaheer in this topic(as per if rule we should not discuss abt actors personal life..choosing a show is his choice )..this is what I am saying you make a post if we reply then you say we are wrong.

Originally posted by: Onyourface

Hi aqua , I have many replies to make on this post, choosing this one to reply first Because sometimes things blow way out of proportion and the threads suffer and some conversations are left midway only, which I don't want to happen with this thread , not sure why you had to use a "clickbait" to invite us all in the discussion ? So has the clickbait does its job ?

Bold - I know abir has his own set of flaws , and I l know you have followed me in this forum for the longest of time here, we have interacted before also so you know I don't shy away from pointing them out when at fault , and this is something my readers have appreciated me for , I am not a blind fan , if I was I would have never opened an AT for nishant, or praised kuhu to lengths post leap even over mishti .... but when I see characters are getting misunderstood , I can't stop myself from replying na

I have understanding of all the characters may be not as much as you do , but that doesn't make me a blind fan either, and there is absolutely no problem if others think differently

so you are wishing to discuss flaws and understand his character arc , I am very much open to do that with you, but your post came across a demeaning post to me rather than an attempt to understand the character, infact you mentioned about actor's choice too ?

I know people bombarded you , kisi ek ke points pe reply kar lo , all of them have tried their best to explain his struggles and flaws , not all just defended him you want to discuss right? Let's start then ! One side you are saying the character has lost its appeal to you - a statement and on other side you are also saying to want to discuss , how can I discuss when already this kind of judgement is already made my dear , aqua if you feel we got way too defensive I apologise on everyone's behalf , but if you talk about 2- 3 scenes from the past that too you way beyond 100 episodes and then you say by this post you want to discuss the future of the character , I am sorry, but your first post gave an all together an different impression! And I am being very honest about it !

Also , I am aware of all my steps , thank you

And how many fishes are there The reason I told that is because I have seen you have that zeal to understand characters in depth so it just surprised me that how didn't you get abir in your mentioned scenes because I think the intentions and emotions were clearly visible without even the in depth analysis

Anyways, I am open for discussion if you are really interested to do that !

Hey Uru!

The clickbait definitely worked🤭🤭, way more than I had expected it to. I had to use it because koi mere posts me participate hi nahi kar raha tha.

You seem very interested in my analysis post to then I will do it. Usme flaws, qualities sab daalungi, character arc sab daalungi.

Thanks for telling me how my original post was far off as compared to my intention. I was high on emotion at that point in time and very sleep deprived.

I mentioned actor's choice because the actor has the knowledge of the basic arc and that is what helps them decide which character they take, how they wish to portray them and how long they will stick with it. That was my reason for mentioning Shaheer. For me, the appeal is how much depth the character has and how much their character traits are explored. As of now, I don't see the traits being explored or rather the flaws of the character being explored. The conflict that comes from that is what makes a character interesting and keeps them fresh. I love where they left the plot for Mishti and Kuhu respectively because there is whole lot of personal conflict for the actors and makers to play with. Frankly, even for Kunal and Abir but where the story was left, I don't think we will see it addressed for Abir because it never is. There were so many chances to do that in the Baba track, right after the leap, Nish-mish track but they always moved past it. I really hope they won't do that when the show comes back.

I chose to mention the few episodes because that is when you clearly see the flaws. No other track in the show portrayed his character's flaws and pain as clearly as those few episodes did. Also, those conflicts/flaws were personal to the character and did not originate from external factors or any other motivation.

Originally posted by: aquaHP

Thank you for the polite explanation of the scene and moreover, the fact that you decided to engage in a discussion.

Let's hope I can explain my point as well.

My point is exactly the opposite: Why did he have to keep opening that box when everyone around him told him that it will only bring havoc.

When his whole family is against that discussion, why couldn't he for once trust their judgement? Why does he get that opportunity to explore the truth about his Baba at the cost of causing pain to everyone else? Why are only his feelings important and not theirs? Nobody wanted Baba back except for him.

Coming to the drama quotient from the writers: that is one major problem I have. Why do they not address these things when it would only help make the story more interesting? It annoys me so much.

Also, I'm not going to get started on Abir having to sacrifice Mishti and choose Kunal because that is whole other Pandora's box and you don't want to unleash that because after seeing the reaction to this post, I don't think this forum will be able to handle it. I would rather keep it to myself than be bashed for having a different view.

Glad we can discuss this pragmatically.

Okay, I see your point. I understand how Abir's persistence and stubbornness, only appears to create more chaos in the family. Infact I do find it amusing but also inspiring to see how ideally we all would over time surrender and accept things that our family members tell us constantly, because we believe they say it for our own well-being. However, to see a character like Abir sustain that many years, to stand up against his mother and grandfather is really quite crazily amusing. As a child, Abir possibly succumbed to it and somewhere believed both Meenu and Naanu were saying this for his well-being, but sometimes there are these unanswered long questions that stay with us throughout our childhood that we drag with us through adult life too. That's exactly what it was doing to Abir - although he seemed to set in his life professionally etc, emotionally he was still that young little boy who yearned to for Baba and those answers to the truth. He too is not wrong, as a young boy lost his father with no solid reason, as an adult he has every right to not only ask questions, but to also pursue those queries to search for answers.

I would like to point out a relative bias we all have currently: we are making these posts in retrospection. No matter how much we deny, that we are being neutral - it is inevitable our knowledge is now biased. We already know how awful Abir's Baba a.k.a Mehul turned out to be, he infact did become the criminal that Meenu and Naanu vaguely warned Abir about. Key word there is 'vaguely'.

However it is important to recognise, before even we, as audience began to see Baba's real side/identity, many of us believed or at least hoped that Abir's baba would have been a good-intended person but somehow caught up in this fraud accusation, or at least have those layered grey shades that explained his reasons for doing the fraud, or not standing up/fighting for himself but rather running off for decades.

So now knowing how horrible Baba actually was, we are looking back at those old episode scenes where Abir (and frankly the audience too) was uncertain of Mehul's truth. So we cannot be so harsh on Abir not accepting Meenu and Naanu's words just because they keep saying it, or how the household became super sensitive and tensed.

It was definitely a very intriguing plot - unfortunately once again the writers ruined Baba's image and made him a very one-dimensional character. Sameer D the actor is so talented and was doing such a wonderful job at playing the character, it would have been so much better and interesting to see those layers of Baba, had they not ruined it. [okay control nandu..this is another pandora box I don't want to get into, so ending this rant right here]

@Bold: Trust. The idea of trust for Abir on his mother was at a very very very sensitive/shaky stage at that time - given the number of manipulations and games he's seen her do. He had lost a large amount of trust factor, and Meenu simply continued her games without seeing how she is simply pushing him further away closer to Baba. But still he was willing to give her the chance to come out straight with truth, he was ready to listen to them. I know it will sound repetitive, but Why couldn't Meenu or Naanu tell Abir the truth directly to him, with all the evidence they claimed to have. They simply assumed he would not believed them.

Sure I can agree that it looked like Abir didn't care for the stress and pain he was inflicting on his family due to his stubborness...but may I ask; Why were they so worried? What was the cause of that stress and pain?

It was because they knew Abir's heart was going to be broken, his dreams and faith of his idolised baba will be shattered. So they (meenu and naanu) knowing the full genuine truth, felt scared for Abir's heart break; hence they were trying to protect him, by giving him false or 'vague' answers. Parenting doesn't work like that, I hope you can agree that each individual needs to find their destination on their own route and journey by themselves, and if that means they have to face heart-break and pain, then so be it - that is art of learning in life, you have to fall to get back up.

Abir really needed that ice to break or that bubble he was living in to break - and he deserved to know the truth. Meenu and Naanu could have saved a lot of their pain and heart-break, if they broke that truth to him prior to Mehul's entry, if they didn't indirectly push him further on his expedition to find Baba.

oops I'm so sorry I rambled way too much😕

xx

Originally posted by: aquaHP

Thank you for the polite explanation of the scene and moreover, the fact that you decided to engage in a discussion.

Let's hope I can explain my point as well.

My point is exactly the opposite: Why did he have to keep opening that box when everyone around him told him that it will only bring havoc.

When his whole family is against that discussion, why couldn't he for once trust their judgement? Why does he get that opportunity to explore the truth about his Baba at the cost of causing pain to everyone else? Why are only his feelings important and not theirs? Nobody wanted Baba back except for him.

Coming to the drama quotient from the writers: that is one major problem I have. Why do they not address these things when it would only help make the story more interesting? It annoys me so much.

Also, I'm not going to get started on Abir having to sacrifice Mishti and choose Kunal because that is whole other Pandora's box and you don't want to unleash that because after seeing the reaction to this post, I don't think this forum will be able to handle it. I would rather keep it to myself than be bashed for having a different view.

I stayed away yesterday because I try to avoid wars, innocents are the ones who get hurt you see 😆 but I'm always ready for a discussion on characters and the arcs. And about people not participating - I don't think there's that much enthu since the show is on break. I started one to discuss all characters and that went by the wayside as well (you also didn't, by the way), so perhaps your clickbait was what worked...

I appreciate your views because they always make me think more about the character 👍🏼

@Bold - You know the last thing that came out of pandora's box right? Hope is a very powerful motivator. It keeps us going. That's why Abir could not give up on his idea of baba either.

And given that he is as perceptive about people as Meenu is, he can clearly figure out when people are lying to him. When you can see that people are lying to you, are you supposed to trust them just because they raised you or are elder to you? For me, that character trait of Abir is admirable and not a flaw.

You say whole family is against the discussion, but I could only see Meenu against any type of discussion and the others following her lead and simply asking Abir to believe her and stay back.

Trust needs to be earned. Mishti knew enough about Abir to know that if she provided proof against his baba, he would believe her, and he might not if she didn't. Wouldn't Meenu know this about her son? Why wait until all options are exhausted before providing that proof? And so dramatically as a birthday gift from naanu? She could have given it when he kept asking her the previous day, he just might have believed her.

@Italics - Because he wants to close a chapter in his life? Get some answers to his unanswered questions? So is it ok for him to live with this pain to not knowing just because it makes everyone else happy? I understand this whole sacrifice one for the sake of the family and so on, but what exactly is the family losing if Abir meets his father and talks to him? I still don't understand the reasoning. He was a fraud, he left them all (including Abir). If it's ok for some family members to decide they never want to see his face, why is it not ok for Abir to decide he wants to meet him?

I've made this point before and so have some others in the forum, but questions don't go away just because someone says you have to ignore them. Asking Abir to forget about his dad is like asking an adopted child not to wonder about their birth parents. Being grateful or loving someone for raising you does not entitle that person to tell you that you cannot have questions about people who deserted you.

@colored text - you knew what was going to happen when you made the post, you did say it was on purpose...maybe you could make it more introspective? I'm sure there are people in the forum ready to discuss different viewpoints.

Originally posted by: Agrata23

Aqua you are one who questioned abt shah choice of the show..then you said abir has nothing to do in the show..then you are saying I am not talking abt anything..if you want to talk abt abir then why brought shaheer in this topic(as per if rule we should not discuss abt actors personal life..choosing a show is his choice )..this is what I am saying you make a post if we reply then you say we are wrong.

Okay! Let's reset this conversation because kaafi jhagda ho gaya wo bhi bina baat ka.

I am sorry if you felt I was saying that. I never meant to say that. My point in mentioning Shaheer's choice and body of work was that as of now, most of the characteristic features of his character have been put at the back burner. It may be because of the track running on the show. Baaki cheezein, I have written in my reply to Uru, which are more articulate than I am able to write as of now.

My frustration was with the writers for not exploring the flaws that they based the whole Baba coming in the story track. Jaise hi Mehul ne story se exit liya, so did his insecurities and zid. They keep bringing this characteristic in the story time and again and putting it to the side to never be dealt with. And that was the point of the post. It was not me condoning Shaheer's choice.

Originally posted by: yrhpk_aus

Glad we can discuss this pragmatically.

Okay, I see your point. I understand how Abir's persistence and stubbornness, only appears to create more chaos in the family. Infact I do find it amusing but also inspiring to see how ideally we all would over time surrender and accept things that our family members tell us constantly, because we believe they say it for our own well-being. However, to see a character like Abir sustain that many years, to stand up against his mother and grandfather is really quite crazily amusing. As a child, Abir possibly succumbed to it and somewhere believed both Meenu and Naanu were saying this for his well-being, but sometimes there are these unanswered long questions that stay with us throughout our childhood that we drag with us through adult life too. That's exactly what it was doing to Abir - although he seemed to set in his life professionally etc, emotionally he was still that young little boy who yearned to for Baba and those answers to the truth. He too is not wrong, as a young boy lost his father with no solid reason, as an adult he has every right to not only ask questions, but to also pursue those queries to search for answers.

I would like to point out a relative bias we all have currently: we are making these posts in retrospection. No matter how much we deny, that we are being neutral - it is inevitable our knowledge is now biased. We already know how awful Abir's Baba a.k.a Mehul turned out to be, he infact did become the criminal that Meenu and Naanu vaguely warned Abir about. Key word there is 'vaguely'.

However it is important to recognise, before even we, as audience began to see Baba's real side/identity, many of us believed or at least hoped that Abir's baba would have been a good-intended person but somehow caught up in this fraud accusation, or at least have those layered grey shades that explained his reasons for doing the fraud, or not standing up/fighting for himself but rather running off for decades.

So now knowing how horrible Baba actually was, we are looking back at those old episode scenes where Abir (and frankly the audience too) was uncertain of Mehul's truth. So we cannot be so harsh on Abir not accepting Meenu and Naanu's words just because they keep saying it, or how the household became super sensitive and tensed.

It was definitely a very intriguing plot - unfortunately once again the writers ruined Baba's image and made him a very one-dimensional character. Sameer D the actor is so talented and was doing such a wonderful job at playing the character, it would have been so much better and interesting to see those layers of Baba, had they not ruined it. [okay control nandu..this is another pandora box I don't want to get into, so ending this rant right here]

@Bold: Trust. The idea of trust for Abir on his mother was at a very very very sensitive/shaky stage at that time - given the number of manipulations and games he's seen her do. He had lost a large amount of trust factor, and Meenu simply continued her games without seeing how she is simply pushing him further away closer to Baba. But still he was willing to give her the chance to come out straight with truth, he was ready to listen to them. I know it will sound repetitive, but Why couldn't Meenu or Naanu tell Abir the truth directly to him, with all the evidence they claimed to have. They simply assumed he would not believed them.

Sure I can agree that it looked like Abir didn't care for the stress and pain he was inflicting on his family due to his stubborness...but may I ask; Why were they so worried? What was the cause of that stress and pain?

It was because they knew Abir's heart was going to be broken, his dreams and faith of his idolised baba will be shattered. So they (meenu and naanu) knowing the full genuine truth, felt scared for Abir's heart break; hence they were trying to protect him, by giving him false or 'vague' answers. Parenting doesn't work like that, I hope you can agree that each individual needs to find their destination on their own route and journey by themselves, and if that means they have to face heart-break and pain, then so be it - that is art of learning in life, you have to fall to get back up.

Abir really needed that ice to break or that bubble he was living in to break - and he deserved to know the truth. Meenu and Naanu could have saved a lot of their pain and heart-break, if they broke that truth to him prior to Mehul's entry, if they didn't indirectly push him further on his expedition to find Baba.

oops I'm so sorry I rambled way too much😕

xx

Baap re! So much you have written! This requires so much patience which I will probably never have. Hats off, dude!

You highlighted an interesting point which I had unsuccessfully been trying to convey: him holding on to his belief and his perception of people. It's a double edged sword. Positive bhi aur negative bhi. If used, that would make such a great story!!!

In this case, I actually think it was wrong of him to hold on to that doubt about his Baba being positive. That was my opinion when I first saw the episode as well: that he should let it go when so many people were telling him to. Jis insaan ka tumhe naam bhi yaad nahi, and the person who's mention makes everyone's faces go sour should be left alone. The new thing I noticed this time was how much he disobeyed his family's wishes to get closure for himself. It really shocked me that I didn't see it before.

Coming to him deserving to know the truth, I agree that he deserved to know anything and everything relating to him so he should have definitely have been told that the fraud was committed by his dad but apart from that, there were a whole lot of secrets buried along with that. The truth about Parul, Kunal was alongside it, and my guess is that the writers' had decided to mix that up in somehow but they changed their mind so that the plot point could be used for MA's separation.

In all of this, I also do think that after so much of insistence and his family not telling him about the guy, he should have listened to them. And that for me is not compromiseable because family comes first and not someone who left years ago. He definitely deserved the truth but not at the cost of his family's happiness and wishes.

Originally posted by: angelfire78

I stayed away yesterday because I try to avoid wars, innocents are the ones who get hurt you see 😆 but I'm always ready for a discussion on characters and the arcs. And about people not participating - I don't think there's that much enthu since the show is on break. I started one to discuss all characters and that went by the wayside as well (you also didn't, by the way), so perhaps your clickbait was what worked...

I appreciate your views because they always make me think more about the character 👍🏼

@Bold - You know the last thing that came out of pandora's box right? Hope is a very powerful motivator. It keeps us going. That's why Abir could not give up on his idea of baba either.

And given that he is as perceptive about people as Meenu is, he can clearly figure out when people are lying to him. When you can see that people are lying to you, are you supposed to trust them just because they raised you or are elder to you? For me, that character trait of Abir is admirable and not a flaw.

You say whole family is against the discussion, but I could only see Meenu against any type of discussion and the others following her lead and simply asking Abir to believe her and stay back.

Trust needs to be earned. Mishti knew enough about Abir to know that if she provided proof against his baba, he would believe her, and he might not if she didn't. Wouldn't Meenu know this about her son? Why wait until all options are exhausted before providing that proof? And so dramatically as a birthday gift from naanu? She could have given it when he kept asking her the previous day, he just might have believed her.

@Italics - Because he wants to close a chapter in his life? Get some answers to his unanswered questions? So is it ok for him to live with this pain to not knowing just because it makes everyone else happy? I understand this whole sacrifice one for the sake of the family and so on, but what exactly is the family losing if Abir meets his father and talks to him? I still don't understand the reasoning. He was a fraud, he left them all (including Abir). If it's ok for some family members to decide they never want to see his face, why is it not ok for Abir to decide he wants to meet him?

I've made this point before and so have some others in the forum, but questions don't go away just because someone says you have to ignore them. Asking Abir to forget about his dad is like asking an adopted child not to wonder about their birth parents. Being grateful or loving someone for raising you does not entitle that person to tell you that you cannot have questions about people who deserted you.

@colored text - you knew what was going to happen when you made the post, you did say it was on purpose...maybe you could make it more introspective? I'm sure there are people in the forum ready to discuss different viewpoints.

Heylo Daya ben!

Bhaag khule humaare ki aap padhaare! I hope you don't mind this dramatic welcome. Your name takes me to Taarak Mehta because that was the only daya in my life till now (CID, too!) so hearing the name reminds me of her garba and I go into that mode too.

The clickbait was just the title. Baaki to apni frustration thi jo uss moment me nikal. Will have to remind myself to never post in the moment again because it causes wars but ab jo hona tha, wo to ho gaya. Sorry, I didn't participate in your post. The reason for that was me fearing the outcome we kind of saw in this post. My opinions lie on the unpopular side and so I usually prepare myself before engaging and that is why I only mostly participate in my own created posts when the discussion is supposed to be in depth. I did go through your post though. I'll try and reply today.

Now, getting into your reply, I will have to disagree about Abir being perceptive. I don't think he is and we haven't really been shown that he is but I would love to know what makes you think he is perceptive because maybe I've missed out on it.

He was told by Parul and Naanu that Baba was not right. Naanu had clearly expressed his dislike. Naanu was one person who Abir shared his worries and problems regarding BB, so when he was siding with her even in private conversations, that should have ticked Abir off that this matter was serious enough to take her side.

Trust needs to be earned even by your family?? I don't think so. Family should never have to earn your trust. They can lose your trust like Abir and BB but they shouldn't have to earn it. If that is so then, Mishti and Baba did nothing to earn Abir's trust. He trusted them blindly and that too without cause. Abir has a very clear heart and he trusts very easily but that leads to him getting heartbroken as well. What I don't get is why he trusted these 2 so easily and not his family with whom he grew up. I can understand him not trusting his mother but Naanu, Parul and Kaushal? Why not them?

I am not saying that he would not wonder. He definitely would but he never sowed his family that he could handle the truth. Also, what is confusing me is how did he used to look for his Baba when he didn't even know his name or had a photo? Dil se dil ka connection hone waala tha kya?

I didn't know what was going to happen. I just wasn't expecting introspection because that wasn't what this post was about. I was hoping for people to share my frustration of not seeing the character being developed properly and maybe share their ideas on what they would have liked to see but jab neend se jage to nazaara kuchh aur hi tha.

Originally posted by: aquaHP

Heylo Daya ben!

Bhaag khule humaare ki aap padhaare! I hope you don't mind this dramatic welcome. Your name takes me to Taarak Mehta because that was the only daya in my life till now (CID, too!) so hearing the name reminds me of her garba and I go into that mode too.

The clickbait was just the title. Baaki to apni frustration thi jo uss moment me nikal. Will have to remind myself to never post in the moment again because it causes wars but ab jo hona tha, wo to ho gaya. Sorry, I didn't participate in your post. The reason for that was me fearing the outcome we kind of saw in this post. My opinions lie on the unpopular side and so I usually prepare myself before engaging and that is why I only mostly participate in my own created posts when the discussion is supposed to be in depth. I did go through your post though. I'll try and reply today.

Now, getting into your reply, I will have to disagree about Abir being perceptive. I don't think he is and we haven't really been shown that he is but I would love to know what makes you think he is perceptive because maybe I've missed out on it.

He was told by Parul and Naanu that Baba was not right. Naanu had clearly expressed his dislike. Naanu was one person who Abir shared his worries and problems regarding BB, so when he was siding with her even in private conversations, that should have ticked Abir off that this matter was serious enough to take her side.

Trust needs to be earned even by your family?? I don't think so. Family should never have to earn your trust. They can lose your trust like Abir and BB but they shouldn't have to earn it. If that is so then, Mishti and Baba did nothing to earn Abir's trust. He trusted them blindly and that too without cause. Abir has a very clear heart and he trusts very easily but that leads to him getting heartbroken as well. What I don't get is why he trusted these 2 so easily and not his family with whom he grew up. I can understand him not trusting his mother but Naanu, Parul and Kaushal? Why not them?

I am not saying that he would not wonder. He definitely would but he never sowed his family that he could handle the truth. Also, what is confusing me is how did he used to look for his Baba when he didn't even know his name or had a photo? Dil se dil ka connection hone waala tha kya?

I didn't know what was going to happen. I just wasn't expecting introspection because that wasn't what this post was about. I was hoping for people to share my frustration of not seeing the character being developed properly and maybe share their ideas on what they would have liked to see but jab neend se jage to nazaara kuchh aur hi tha.

Arre now I have to watch CID but I'm not sure it's available to watch in the US 😊

Frustration toh dikh raha tha, sometimes we just need to vent, but dhyaan se 😆 No issues about not participating, but I did intend that thread to discuss all characters in that thread, so you might find it interesting.

Unpopular opinions, yes, it does take a lot to put yourself out there when you already know your opinion puts you in the minority and you still keep doing that 👏! I just love posts that are sometimes the complete opposite of what I think because it makes me wonder if I'm justifying something or just think differently. It also gives me a completely different take on the scenario. I also love posts that are able to articulate what I'm trying to say better than I can like uru's 😆

About Abir being perceptive, there are many instances they show where Abir puts completely unrelated things together to come up with the right answer - one I can think of is Naman Agarwal being Mishti's father. They also show he understands people and why they behave as they do and how they might behave. He's also (presumably) the only one not buying BB's act of liking Mishti right now. Another thing is that being perceptive is an important trait to have to manipulate people, and Abir and BB both clearly can manipulate others.

Yes, Parul and Naanu told him baba was not right and he does acknowledge that they might be right but he still wants to find out the truth for himself. Naanu expressed his dislike, but he still hadn't told him then that it was his baba who has committed the fraud. It was expressed as if his baba did not want his mom to help naanu and Abir wanted to find out why. That was the time to tell him his baba was the one to commit the fraud and show him the newspapers, but it wasn't done. I mean, if you were going to do it the next day, why not then?

Regarding trust, I agree that trusting family should come naturally. There are different kinds of trust, Abir trusts people to behave according to their nature, whoever it is. With Mishti it is based on how he has seen her behave in different circumstances. So far she has not broken his trust (partly because he already knew she was in rajgad on KC day, which meenu did not know). With baba alone it was based on a (remote and biased) memory, and once that trust was broken, he walked away from him without a second glance. Parul warns Meenu of this character trait of his one time afterwards (can't recall when exactly).

He trusts Kunal to blindly believe Meenu. As for the others, he says to Mishti that he's not sure what is making naanu behave as he's doing (yeah, you made me go back and watch ) before he left for mumbai and then found out that naanu had once again not told him he won't meet his father there, nor had Parul or Kaushal. He trusts Parul and Kaushal to be on BB's side in this, as he says to Parul - he is not asking her any questions since he doesn't want her to betray her friend. Kaushal keeps asking him to wait/listen to BB (I might have missed if he had said more, did he?)

There are 2 ways to look at this - all these people in my life are trying to keep me away from this person, so perhaps they're right that he's not a good person, or, all these people are influenced by my mom who is trying to keep me away my father without giving me a solid reason as to why. He already has no trust for Meenu, especially after all the stunts she had pulled.

How would an adult show they can handle the truth? You can only show that if you have been shown the truth first right? The man is looking for answers. Give it to him and then see how he deals with it. He has shown many times that he values the truth, so if Meenu had chosen to tell him the truth things would have turned out differently. He might have checked it out for himself by going to Rajgad and maybe that's what Meenu didn't want - since that would have opened a whole new can of worms. [They didn't say how, but they did mention he was looking for baba, so can't explain how. It's just based on what was said.]

Arre I think the problem is that this particular issue, people are seeing from very different angles and we are not able to find a mid-point. According to you (and hope I'm not reading this wrong), he should trust his family's view on baba's matter and not selfishly try to find answers. He should let this go for the sake of family. For me, and perhaps others, the family has not shown itself to be trustworthy in the baba matter and Abir thinks that the truth will help his family break free of Meenu's influence (which made his brother almost leave a girl on the wedding day). Once he deals with baba though he does come back and apologize to his family for the way he behaved and felt terrible about it.

Meenu could have taken advantage of this, but she decided since his trust on baba was broken, she could break his trust on Mishti as well BUT she didn't realize that trust on baba being broken didn't automatically make him trust her. A topic for another day.

Abir is a beautifully flawed character. I think the problem is that most don't think of the point you brought up as a flaw. There are character flaws though, he is incredibly stubborn and doesn't listen when he's angry. For me, even his band-aid theory and the way he manipulated Kunal are not right (Kunal is also at fault here), but insaan hi toh hai! He forgives people way too easily as well.

You brought up his running away from issues and inability to accept truth. First is a valid point, he just ran away from the resort in frustration, but he is going back (thanks to Kunal). Inability to accept truth you will have to elaborate on coz I haven't seen that. Are you talking about how he's seeing the situation between Kuhu and Mishti? or Parul and Kunal? or something else?

Into the future - I'm waiting for the clash between meenu and abir. Why do you think it would be boring?

OK - if you aren't asleep by now after reading this thesis, and still remember the point, you can respond 🤣kitna likh diya 😆

Originally posted by: aquaHP

Baap re! So much you have written! This requires so much patience which I will probably never have. Hats off, dude!

You highlighted an interesting point which I had unsuccessfully been trying to convey: him holding on to his belief and his perception of people. It's a double edged sword. Positive bhi aur negative bhi. If used, that would make such a great story!!!

In this case, I actually think it was wrong of him to hold on to that doubt about his Baba being positive. That was my opinion when I first saw the episode as well: that he should let it go when so many people were telling him to. Jis insaan ka tumhe naam bhi yaad nahi, and the person who's mention makes everyone's faces go sour should be left alone. The new thing I noticed this time was how much he disobeyed his family's wishes to get closure for himself. It really shocked me that I didn't see it before.

Coming to him deserving to know the truth, I agree that he deserved to know anything and everything relating to him so he should have definitely have been told that the fraud was committed by his dad but apart from that, there were a whole lot of secrets buried along with that. The truth about Parul, Kunal was alongside it, and my guess is that the writers' had decided to mix that up in somehow but they changed their mind so that the plot point could be used for MA's separation.

In all of this, I also do think that after so much of insistence and his family not telling him about the guy, he should have listened to them. And that for me is not compromiseable because family comes first and not someone who left years ago. He definitely deserved the truth but not at the cost of his family's happiness and wishes.

Thanks. Perhaps yesterday was just one of those days, I was in the mood to write and discuss.

Okay, I feel like we will be running in circles again about Why abir 'just didn't let it go, when many people were telling him'. Many other including me have already tried to discuss and explain Abir's notions for such actions.

I think I'll just have to call ceasefire for the moment. I frankly don't quite have the energy to continue explaining my perspective again, but I see Daya has done needful very well (thankyou daya, really appreciate your awesome explanations) Hope, her posts gave some more insights.

Agree to disagree, with your p.o.v. That's all

Look forward to the show, hopefully bringing out at least some these complexities in his character.

have a nice day

xx

Originally posted by: aquaHP

Oh wow!! I didn't know that these many people were still active on the forum. Lol!

But can I just say that there was no need to bombard me with multiple similar posts about how much you all love Abir. I already know that. If you still don't know what I mean, please look up the word 'clickbait'. Thank you!

I know how much it hurts when characters you like are called names. I've seen it happen with comments like "jalkukdi/jalkudi/2rs person/so many more". Atleast, I still used better words. I am such an angel, right?😇

Whoever said, Shaheer as an adult has the right to choose his own roles. I never said he didn't. I only said that I don't understand the appeal of the character anymore because there is not much left to play around with, as an actor.

Sach kahun to I was hoping to see some analysis on this flawed side of Abir and understand how you guys wanted his character to grow or be developed but instead of focussing on the main point of the post, everyone started defending him as if I am new to this forum and don't know who or what Abir is.

And people, if you're still focussing on the few things I said above which are mildly against Abir, looking for a way to defend Abir, you've still not understood the point of this post. The point of the post is to discuss the flaws and the character arc. Stop defending the character and start discussing him instead.

I hope I was able to explain what the purpose of this post was because it was definitely not analysis. It was discussion and generating new ideas. I hope we can get to it now since there are so many people active on this forum which I see leaving right about now since no one really cares to discuss but rather only defend.

The child who cries the most or makes the most noise gets the most attention. Apne show ka bhi kuch aisa hi haal hai abhi... ek ko please aur highlight karne ke chakkar main lot of characters get flattened and butchered... #KyaKarein

Now, Shaheer is not the types to crib about others getting the limelight or his character getting less importance. He thinks long term, takes things in his stride and lets others in his show shine unlike some who in their newfound stardom now do not hesitate to compete even with him! In any case, if he thinks his character has gone down the dumps, he will know what to do na... why question his decision of taking up a show that he found exciting after reading the script and that too by citing examples of scenes that came after 100 some episodes and are passed another 175 after that?! Logic kuch samajh main nahin aaya... unless what you meant to say was his character is flattened, no scope to perform now, why is he still sticking around?

Haan, clickbait toh tha. Many of us already understood... dekho, we still came Aur aap ko bhi acche se pata tha Aqua, discussion toh yeh tha nahin. It was more like accusations and attack on Abir to provoke his fans and watch what happens... I remember you expressing in the AT to put a member's anti-Misthi post out on the main forum and watch with a bucket of popcorn how AM fans fight it out... so we never know, you know!

Ab attack aayega toh defense bhi aayega! Discussion hota toh discuss bhi karte...

Intent and how you put across your points decide the direction of the replies.

I think Kuhu aapki favorite hai, I will give you an example through her. Suppose, while watching an old episode or two I got irritated with Kuhu's behavior (trust me, there are plenty of occasions when that happens ), so I come to the forum and start blasting her left and right about how she is behaving, what is she thinking, how can she be so mean and selfish, call her a few names, describe how her character is just reduced to Mishti stole my limelight, I made a galti se mistake and question why Kaveri took up this role?...

Ab after making such a post, I am not going to get wah wahs from Kuhu fans that much I know Rather, I would expect her fans to write paragraphs about how she has layers and I am not able to see them. And I also know, I will be quoted a link or two of posts where it is explained in depth how others are wrong and she is right... no doubt, replies will be eloquent unlike our amateur efforts , none the less they all will still be made to defend her character.

And that is because it is human nature. We defend what we like so dearly. It's similar to parents criticizing their own kids but do not like it when others do - especially when the others have never made it a point to appreciate them...

@bold:

So this was tit-for-tat kya?

As for you stating that you wanted people to share your frustration about the character of Abir, toh Daya has already given a wonderful explanation! People are not able to do so because our opinions are diametrically opposite, and there is no middle ground... what you are rebuking Abir for, we applaud him! So instead of welcoming our different perspective on it, naming it as your bashing for having a different/unpopular opinion is not fair now, is it?

Anyways, since you say you were really going for a discussion, I would say there is a way to go about it. This definitely was not the best one.

In any case, now that you have clarified, Uru, Nandu and Daya have offered you their posts for discussions... but aapko woh bahot lambe lage! Toh decide karlo aap chahti kya hai phir