SKR:Of loops and symbolisms: 25/03- P.142-TRUTH - Page 7

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daydreamers thumbnail
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Posted: 9 years ago
#61
shruthi thank you dear...
please go through my post. pretty lengthy. My eye has started aching, i hope the infection doesn't return.

pls add up if i have missed anything as i won't be able to.

one more request is regarding ram-shatrughna scene and the way the sisters sat. there was the pattern that follows the boys too. i ges something with pillars of life. and why did ram talked to shatrughna about daughters and their importance? in a nutshell about women.

was it because it is shatrughna who dealt with every work when ram was away? coz as per my information bharat was much into pain and chose a life of hermit. was shathrughna told because he will have to take cre of the women in those 14 yrs? its a mere speculation. i need your thoughts shruthi coz i do feel the scene has something which hasn't met our eye.
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Posted: 9 years ago
#62

Originally posted by: daydreamers

SIYA KE RAM - 16/02/16: ROLES,ROADS, REASSURANCES



You open a thread to analyze scenes, to decipher symbolisms and enrich our minds. One wishes to delve deeper into a scene, dialogue and a setup and elaborate it lucidly. As you begin doing this cv's throw a major challenge towards you. And that challenge for me is today's episode. You all heard it right. Today's episode was replete with messages, symbolisms and most importantly a foretelling of the future.

I am so lost in today's episode that i find it pretty difficult to pen down things.

To make things easier, i will proceed scene wise.

The episode begins with Ram. I so much loved this whole thing. He was lost into deep thoughts of how sita pacified her father. Sita comes and tells him about food being served. Note here, of what she calls him, not swami, not prabhu, not dashrath nandan, not ayodhyapati. She calls him "raghunandan". Did it a ring a bell? NO? Connect the flashback that ram has and this particular word. You may get the answer. Lets go reverse. Ram recalls sita saying that she is in a dilemma as there is mithila on one side and ayodhya at other side. She cares about the reputation of both the kingdoms. She doesn't want people to talk ill about mithila or ayodhya. She here spoke as a daughter and as a kulvadhu. Now bring in "raghunandan", she addressed ram as the son or the heir of raghu dynasty. She didn't address him as her husband. Had a husband been addressed, it would have made him weaker emotionally seeing his better-half's separation from her family, her land. Instead she points out the thought of the heir who also has to care for the reputation of the respective kingdom. She assures that he doesn't lose his knowledge in the face of emotions.

what comes next is worth asking for. Many loops that had opened culminated here and hence new ones have opened. A time was there when ram had questioned sita that she wants to ask something but is unable to do so ( the bahuvivah question on the cliff in mithila ). Again ram asked her in the temple if she was happy or not. Sita beautifully pointed out of how lucky and happy she was.

Today a similar thing happened but with a twist. Sita posed curiosity for his thoughts and he opened his heart. He told how lucky was he to have her in his life. He appreciated her for her straightforwardness, honesty, empathy, love and a sense of duty. He in a nutshell pointed out her ROLES. The role of a daughter and a pillar in the time of need.

" aj se sansaar aap ka naam mujhse purva lega. Aj se ram ki siya nahi siya ke ram kaha jayega"

The dialogue is beautifully analysed by shruthi below.

The next scene comes is that of the sisters. As Ram had truly addressed her roles, sita fulfills the same with her sisters. She imparts her sense of dharma to them.

The third scene is chandrabhaga, sunaina with their daughters. Long back there was a kitchen scene, when these were kids. Sita had also answered then about the types of foods. Today sunaina asked sita about 'sasural'. Her subsequent questions revolved around the different roles. So ram's address continues here also. A frequently occurring word through and through was 'kulvadhu'. Note the way the girls sat.

SITA-URMILA IN A LINE WITH MANDVI-SHRUTHKIRTI BEHIND.

A crucial pointer. ( i guess this has to do with the 4 pillars of life) But again as sita explained her stance of following the duties of sasural, she would always be the light-bearer for her sisters. She would always do her sister's margdarshan. A point to be noted, as sita explained, first focus was given on urmila.

Time and again chandrabhaga and sunaina pointed out that all the four sisters would stay together. This was ironically foretelling of the future. The way sita time and again pointed herself as the torch bearer was an icing on the cake. Very deep. She indeed was the margdarshak as her exile made her sisters' take up their responsibilities in the future. Sita interestingly focussed on how she would teach them to respect their in-laws. And a minute focus was on mandavi then. It would be really interesting to watch how the sisters will manage this aspect once sita accompanies ram on exile given by kaikeyi. A loop has opened here.

The scene that drew my attention was sita's mention of Gargi. Sunaina once again is tensed. I loved how the cv's have maintained their equation as same right from the beginning. The way sunaina and gargi greeted after the wedding was over, was phenomenal. I wont comment much on the scene. Let the details play out tomorrow.

Once again janaka-dashratha scene was awesome. I didnt loved it coz janaka was ready for bidaai, i loved it bwecause he said "janaki aur anya teen putriyan". I loved the mention of janaki here. See the role reversal, there was time when ram had addressed sita not by her name (on the cliff) and today is the day when ram calls her 'sitae' and janaka mentions her as 'janaki'.

A clever portrayal of roles it was.

Ram explains shatrughna the importance of daughter to a family and vice versa. well i don't know why he chose shatrughna for this. I guess shruthi might have an explanation for this.

Cherry on the cake was kept by rishi yagyavalva. The way he put forth the importance of janaki. Till now from yday's episode, everything revolved around janaka's daughter janaki. Yagyavalva cleverly gives the twist by bringing in mithila.

Now if you connect my starting point till the end, you will notice one thing common, Ram admired sita's role as a daughter, as a guide, and found himself lucky as she would be his better-half, his kul ki maryada. Recall the way he had addressed her saying "aj aapka alag roop dekha"

To reach sita, Ram has to understand janaki (which he did today, as janaki also is the REFLECTION of JANAKA), maithili, vaidehi, bhumija. Once he does this, the "raghunandan" will become sita's swami.

After this long post, I'll make a point to explain the title. The three R's- ROLES, ROADS AND REASSURANCES.

ROLES- There was a consistent mention of women and their roles. kulvadhu topping the list. daughter,sister,guide,pacifier and the reputation. The names JANAKI,MAITHILI,BHUMIJA,VAIDEHI and SITA metaphorically indicate these roles. It will be forever SITA for Ram but to reach till sita he needs to understand JANAKI,MAITHILI,BHUMIJA,VAIDEHI.

ROADS- The roads, in short the 'maarg' solely belong to the sisters and to RAM. The four sisters who believe that they would be together, will have to traverse an individual path with different challenges. As sita said i would be the torch bearer for them, she indirectly refers to JANAKA and his teachings. As i mentioned yday of sita being his reflection. Sita also pointed of the knowledge that her sisters had received. In a nutshell, the torch-bearer would be JANAKA's teachings. CV's used SITA metaphorically. Sita being the guide for ram will be during her abandonment.Here a circle shall be completed of what began today in the form of kulvadhu and maryada. once again swami shall become raghunandan. Time will tell how cv's handle this.

REASSURANCES- Well this is straight and complex. Sunaina- chandrabhaga reassured that their teachings were a success by taking their daughters' tests. Ram's reassurance of sita being his true soulmate as he is lost in thoughts.
sunaina's reassurance of how she and janaka will spend their time. Her reassuring to sita that even when they would be away, her invested time in them in the past would be fruitful.


If yesterday belonged to janaka, today it belonged to Ram.Am amazed at the depth of the scenes and dialogues. What i look into tomorrow's precap is sita and her talks with bhoomi. And this is where Ram shall be introduced to maithili and bhumija.


Awesome ! ⭐️👏👏
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Posted: 9 years ago
#63

Originally posted by: Krishna_Sourav

Superb beautiful thread

beautiful posts , analysis loved them...


Thank you krish ( I hope I can call you this 😃)
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Posted: 9 years ago
#64
DD Thank you for the p.m. I read all your posts today. They were quite insightful and I am looking forward to great and meaningful discussions in the future too.
The messages from the 'Vivah saptah' has been bountiful in nature. In the previous episodes the emphasis was on the rituals of a wedding and their significance Whereas today the spotlight shifted to what constitutes a successful marriage. Ram ,as you wrote ,has to understand all the aspects like Janaki, Maithili, Bhumija,to get to Sita his wife. Yesterday and today he grasped the essence of Janaki and furthermore he got a hint for her other personas like Maithili and going by the precap touches on 'Bhumija 'too. He is finding every aspect of her praiseworthy as well as interesting.
I have always felt that it takes a very confident man to praise a woman for her qualities than her physical appearance. Ram as a husband impressed me a lot today. I have always revered Ram as a god and as a perfect son, brother and a king, but this serial is making me consider the 'husband 'aspect too. He must have been an exemplary husband for Sita to surrender to him so completely.Well looking forward to exploring this aspect of him throughout the entire Ramayan.
Savita


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Posted: 9 years ago
#65
@DD you have analyzed everything pretty well. Especially the roles part. Detailed explanation of roles and priority fixing you can check in my individual post
I couldn't post on the sister's seating and Ram-Shatrughna dialogue because I watched epi quite late in daily motion and was tired and wanted to sleep. So here goes.
You are right. Sister's position and focus did indicate to the 4 pillars of life. Note when Sita tells her duty as Kulvadhu is important focus was on Urmila. As I said earlier also Sita represents Dharma or knowledge, so she gave the knowledge that role of Kulvadhu is important over and above the duties of sister. Just like Lakshman arth or wealth took the wisdom, Urmila took it. When Sita decides to go for vanvass it is her duty as a kulvadhu of Ayodhya. How can she stay in the palace from where her swami is banished. What will Ayodhya talk about such a kulvadhu and wife. We need to note that vanvass is for Ram, Lakshman does not have the obligation. But he chooses to follow Ram for his brother's and bhabi's protection. As a soldier as a service as expected by his mother who had dedicated both her sons for service. So what is the duty of Urmila as a kulvadhu. To take up the service in the palace. Manage relations in the palace, take care of the mothers.
Now coming to focus on Mandavi, I will teach them to respect elders. Mandavi is Kama or Power. When vanvass happens she is at the crucial juncture she is the one who can make or break things. Create a ruckus over Bharat's decision or stand by him. She sees one Kulvadhu gone to vanvass, other bearing separation for the sake of service, so what she needs to do. As Kulvadhu of Ayodhya, she has to standby the family in the hour of crisis, show the unity of brothers thus defeating the divisive force that is Manthara. She respects Bharat's decision.
Sruthakirti last one related to Moksha. She combines duty, service and power in supporting Shatrughna to run the tasks or rather he is the one who is executing the task and is directly connected to the welfare of the people of Ayodhya. When the elder kulvadhu's do their duty the youngest take everything from it and combines it to run Ayodhya smoothly till the return of Ram and Sita.
Now coming to talk between Ram-Shatrughna. Very important because as I said above if Shatrughna needs to execute orders of Bharat, to run around he has to listen to the intuition and knowledge of Sruthakirti. Her valuable inputs have to always sought in any action wherever confusion is there, so that the praja is benefitted always.
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Posted: 9 years ago
#66
@ savita, i agree with you. The whole week has been a journey of symbolisms.
i wanna add few things related to the episode of 16/02 as i couldn't do it yesterday.



If one watches SKR from the beginning, they would notice that the makers have kept one thing common. Every episode from the beginning till yesterday has one 'POINT' from where either things diverge or to where the things converge.

15/02 was pretty clear with this, JANAKA being the POINT. On the contrary yday i had tough time figuring out who exactly was the POINT till every thing fell into place and I zeroed on RAM.

Ppl may ask this why RAM? On 15/02 I mentioned of RAM too being a reflection of janaka. How this plays out will be a treat to watch. I'll cover this point in my post regarding DASHRATHA. It is ironical of how a son is portrayed different fro m his FATHER.

But again my point of focus here, is why RAM? As I referred to the reflections theory, i would add up that reflections understand each other, know each other and get along each other. Sita and Ram are not only shadows of each other but also reflections of each other. The 36 guna milan did an exceptional job in explaining this. On 15/02 it was made a point that a boy told a king of how he had inspired him. It was crucial to bring in sita, not for ram to understand and appreciate her, but for him to understand JANAKA. It is needed for ram to see what really makes up a man called JANAKA. Inspiration is a different thing but to reflect is another. Ram not only appreciated Sita but he acknowledged Janaka's influence and his teachings. Bringing 'SIYA KE RAM' dialogue was that clever twist ( shruthi i have a different interpretation here). By saying this RAM not only acknowledged her intuition but also her knowledge. By his proclamation, sita will always be in the front. Remember the word "paardarshata" meaning transparency. So now if sita is in the front and you look through her you will see RAM behind. Take the whole thing metaphorically. Thus ram becomes sita's reflection and sita already reflects janaka. So ram shall become Janaka's reflection. Am sorry if this sounds incoherent.😆

Coming to the next part as I had said Ram has to cross maithili, vaidehi, bhumija, janaki to reach sita. Am here reminded of the episode 2 when JANAKA named his new found daughter. See the sequence he takes: videha kul ki vaidehi, mithila ki rajkumari maithili, bhumi se janmi bhumija, janak ki janaki aur hal ki nok se rekha banati sita. A loop was opened there. I never mentioned of this as i wanted to see if the makers take it anywhere. This particular loop is towards culmination. Take this point and move to the cliff where ram addressed her as mithila's rajkumari, videha's daughter. And she insisted him to call her sita. The hesitance with which he takes her name was commendable. The name sita was taken by JANAKA at the end. Similarly, Ram called her sita at the end. This was about calling different names. But what about understanding them? And this is where a streak of supreme screenplay lies. The way janaka named her, keep that sequence in mind, sita came at the last. The cv's made the layers of other names over sita. JANAKA layered it, in a way veiled SITA. Now what Ram does is open those layers. As RAM pointed her transparency, once he reaches SITA, her transparency will reflect videha,mithila,bhoomi and janaka. But to reach there he has to understand why people of mithila worship sita. YAGYAVALVA made a beautiful point yday. Unlike the sequence by Janaka, Janaki was introduced first. The simplest reason to this is the REFLECTION theory. As ram said that janaka's subjects reflect him, they understand or see sita in a different way ( and this is where yagyavalva's dialogue fits in. Ram now will begin journey to maithili and bhumija). His introduction to janaki first was very thoughtful as again it closed a loop that opened in second epi, janaka said that sita had chosen them as her parents. To get the real sita out, he needs to understand JANAKA.

One line that i would put up for reflection theory and RAM-JANAKA dynamics is this :

" YOU KNOW A PERSON HE BECOMES YOUR INSPIRATION,
YOU UNDERSTAND A PERSON YOU BECOME HIS REFLECTION"

In a nutshell, Ram has to reach sita through mithila,videha,bhoomi and most of all JANAKA.

The day he understands sita, he'll understand janaka and vice versa.

Edited by daydreamers - 9 years ago
shruthiravi thumbnail
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Posted: 9 years ago
#67
@DD your interpretation of Siya Ke Ram is not different from mine. You made it scientific and to understand it people have to know science for that matter optics. I only said Sita's knowledge shines through Ram, what the world sees of Rama is actually Sita and Sita is actually Janaka. How Janaki became Sita. And you brought another point, meaning of Sita. Sita means creating a line.
What does line represents mathematically. It is the connection or the rather for any geometric figure except circle you need line. It looks 1. Ekam. All the numerals are representations of this Ekam.
As I said earlier also zero is the path to reach ekam. And on binary system lies everything. Ekam and path to reach ekam.
And as I said for any man the ultimate aim is moksha. And the medium through which he reaches that moksha is the woman, the woman who shows the path, who is a man's karmasathi, jeevansathi. Hence he asks her to lead, to give direction so that together they reach the goal of moksha.
If I have complicated things with maths guys please forgive me. But then the real learnings in our epics can only be taken using maths and physics based on which the laws of universe or nature runs.
Edited by shruthiravi - 9 years ago
daydreamers thumbnail
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Posted: 9 years ago
#68

Originally posted by: shruthiravi

@DD you have analyzed everything pretty well. Especially the roles part. Detailed explanation of roles and priority fixing you can check in my individual post

I couldn't post on the sister's seating and Ram-Shatrughna dialogue because I watched epi quite late in daily motion and was tired and wanted to sleep. So here goes.
You are right. Sister's position and focus did indicate to the 4 pillars of life. Note when Sita tells her duty as Kulvadhu is important focus was on Urmila. As I said earlier also Sita represents Dharma or knowledge, so she gave the knowledge that role of Kulvadhu is important over and above the duties of sister. Just like Lakshman arth or wealth took the wisdom, Urmila took it. When Sita decides to go for vanvass it is her duty as a kulvadhu of Ayodhya. How can she stay in the palace from where her swami is banished. What will Ayodhya talk about such a kulvadhu and wife. We need to note that vanvass is for Ram, Lakshman does not have the obligation. But he chooses to follow Ram for his brother's and bhabi's protection. As a soldier as a service as expected by his mother who had dedicated both her sons for service. So what is the duty of Urmila as a kulvadhu. To take up the service in the palace. Manage relations in the palace, take care of the mothers.
Now coming to focus on Mandavi, I will teach them to respect elders. Mandavi is Kama or Power. When vanvass happens she is at the crucial juncture she is the one who can make or break things. Create a ruckus over Bharat's decision or stand by him. She sees one Kulvadhu gone to vanvass, other bearing separation for the sake of service, so what she needs to do. As Kulvadhu of Ayodhya, she has to standby the family in the hour of crisis, show the unity of brothers thus defeating the divisive force that is Manthara. She respects Bharat's decision.
Sruthakirti last one related to Moksha. She combines duty, service and power in supporting Shatrughna to run the tasks or rather he is the one who is executing the task and is directly connected to the welfare of the people of Ayodhya. When the elder kulvadhu's do their duty the youngest take everything from it and combines it to run Ayodhya smoothly till the return of Ram and Sita.
Now coming to talk between Ram-Shatrughna. Very important because as I said above if Shatrughna needs to execute orders of Bharat, to run around he has to listen to the intuition and knowledge of Sruthakirti. Her valuable inputs have to always sought in any action wherever confusion is there, so that the praja is benefitted always.


bang on yaar shruthi...👏 you know even if i try i wont be able to do justice to the 4 pillars theory😆 ye department tum hi sambhalo. i wish i could write something so deep like this...

and yes i'll go through your post.. my pc is giving problem.
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Posted: 9 years ago
#69
You can take one more thing DD with respect to that dialogue. Not only Shruthakirti, he needs to respect every woman in the palace. 3 mothers who has imparted learnings and then 2 of his bhabi's. Mandavi and Urmila, who represents the wealth and power of Ayodhya.
Infact though he is the one executing the tasks, there are 6 women behind him. 3 mothers, 2 bhabis and his wife. Only by loving and respecting them he will be able to do the tasks correctly. Hence imparting knowledge to him on the importance of women.
Ram is Vishnu. He knew it upfront what lies ahead. He was preparing his younger brother for the same.
daydreamers thumbnail
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Posted: 9 years ago
#70

Originally posted by: shruthiravi

@DD your interpretation of Siya Ke Ram is not different from mine. You made it scientific and to understand it people have to know science for that matter optics. I only said Sita's knowledge shines through Ram, what the world sees of Rama is actually Sita and Sita is actually Janaka. How Janaki became Sita. And you brought another point, meaning of Sita. Sita means creating a line.

What does line represents mathematically. It is the connection or the rather for any geometric figure except circle you need line. It looks 1. Ekam. All the numerals are representations of this Ekam.
As I said earlier also zero is the path to reach ekam. And on binary system lies everything. Ekam and path to reach ekam.
And as I said for any man the ultimate aim is moksha. And the medium through which he reaches that moksha is the woman, the woman who shows the path, who is a man's karmasathi, jeevansathi. Hence he asks her to lead, to give direction so that together they reach the goal of moksha.
If I have complicated things with maths guys please forgive me. But then the real learnings in our epics can only be taken using maths and physics based on which the laws of universe or nature runs.


yes... got you...

i ges i complicated things by bringing in optics..😆

regarding your previous reply, shruthi... Am very much hopeful with urmila and mandavi... there's a lot being discussed on urmila, i guess we need to shift to mandavi. Her characterisation has a lot of potential. Majorly because of the shades prominent in her. She is literally at the extremes. Her scenes during wedding proposal made me think so. And during the testing times she would be the most eccentric of all. I actually hope she gets the deserved screen space and the cv's don't rush and forget everyone during vanvas. I really hope cv's take her character justifiably. and yes cv's change mandavi's headpiece asap.😡 The other 3 came off decently gaudy, but mandavi looked funnily gaudiest.

i guess u r exceptional with computers shruthi. I only know binary in bits. am actually into civil engineering and not much related to binary as such.

i request you to pls make a separate thread for binary if possible. I remember you had put this previously also. it would be great if you compile them all on a single thread. 😃

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