Sa Re Ga Ma Pa Dha Ni (the Seven notes) - Page 3

Kishore ji
its really fantastic

Thanks KB. I asked for 3 You gave 4 times more.
Thats what being great is all about.
You might be way younger than me, but all my regards to you. Donno wat your career goals are but you wud do great justice to MDship. Think about it(if you havent already) 😊

Lovely...Thanks for the info, Kishore.

So these 22 microtunes can be played out only on string instruments?

Also, 20 instruments is a great accomplishment! I have enough trouble playing one! 😆

Originally posted by: MysticaMagic

Lovely...Thanks for the info, Kishore.

So these 22 microtunes can be played out only on string instruments?

Also, 20 instruments is a great accomplishment! I have enough trouble playing one! 😆

The twenty-two microtones, technically speaking can be played on any melodic instrument. I didn't mention this earlier, but theoretically, you can divide microtones down further and further. Of course, with limited senses and play by ear mostly, attempts haven't been made to go deeply specific.

In term of dynamically playing the microtones, sarangi (all class of bowed instruments, actually), sitar and sarod would be able to do this job. The chances of holding it longer is evident in and sarangi and sarod, as the process of doing a meend (glissando) is by moving up or down the string. No additional "energy" is needed. In sitar, meend is achieved by pulling the string. This yields limitations, as pulling a string can only go so far without detuning or even breaking the string.

Santoor does not have the ability to do this, because santoor is based on each note having its own string. This hinders the ability to change microtones. Harmonium falls in this same category of difficulty.

The most difficult to method of pulling microtones is in the susira vadya class of instruments or the blown instruments. It takes great sadhana and practice to be able to do this properly. Hariprasad Chaurasia and Bismillah Khan are able to do that with ease on their bansuri and shehnai. Just like with sitar, limitations come as the stimulus is breathing. Someone with asthma or other respiratory problems will have trouble enunciating microtones or even plain suddha swars.

Originally posted by: adwarakanath

You should see the effort Pt. Shivkumar Sharma puts in when playing the santoor....I've seen him live in concert, and the fellow's a genius. He has to slide those...whatyoucallems....over the strings in perfect harmony to produce the gliassando effect.

Panditji talks about the meend effect in his website www.santoor.com. It definitely an amazing meend effect to consider.

The "hammers" are known as "kalams" 😊

Kishoreji,
Could you talk alittle on the Pancham swar and its role? AS briefly spoke about it after hemu's Haye Rama. I am sure everyone would like to know about it. Also a little on malkauns as probably the only raaga that doesn't use Pa....

Oh! Now I know why our music teacher started and completed every session with "Sa Pa Sa".

Thanks a ton KBji.

Thank you, Tansenji
Your comments though in Hindi make sense and add to KB's excellent writeup.

Originally posted by: raghav64

Kishoreji,
Could you talk alittle on the Pancham swar and its role? AS briefly spoke about it after hemu's Haye Rama. I am sure everyone would like to know about it. Also a little on malkauns as probably the only raaga that doesn't use Pa....

I unfortunately missed that episode where Hemachandra sang "Hai Rama Yeh Kya Huwa" from Rangeela. Once that video clip is found on sifymax, I'll check it out.

Panchama is the most important note in the sargam. Panchama is the Sanskrit word for 5th, and rightly enough, it is the fifth note of the suddha swars. What makes panchama so unique it forms the most perfect harmony with Sa. If you were to graph harmony vs. note (position in the sargam), you will the Sa, higher octave Sa (tar saptak Sa), lower octave Sa (mandra saptak Sa) will have the highest level of perfect harmony. As you move through the saptak, you will see that re has a very dissonant harmony to Sa. Suddha Re is also very bad as far as harmony to Sa is concerned. If you examine the spectrum, you will see that besides Sa, Pa has the highest harmonic factor. Then come Ma, because the panchama of Ma is Sa. But the nature of Ma is not achal, hence it is ranked lower. Then comes Suddha Ga. If you play the final string of a tanpura, you will clearly hear Sa, Pa, and Ga. The most dissonant note is Tivra Ma in relation to Sa. Between Sa to tivra Ma, and tivra Ma to Sa, there is an equal number of notes separating them, namely six notes apart. The relationship between the tonic (Sa) and the augmented fourth (tivra Ma) results in a dissonance due to the undefined nature of which is the true Sa and which is the true Tivra Ma, even though a musician may intentioanlly do so.

Ragas without Pa are very interesting to examine. In fact, it is because of this fact that gives tanpura player some "importance" in a concert. Ragas without Pa, such as Malkauns, Ragesri, Lalit, and Kaushikdhwani, have immense strength focused on Ma. For an untrained musician, it would difficult to tell Malkauns from Raga Dhani or Raga Lalita with Raga Todi or Puriya Dhanasri. The strength on Ma is such that it doesn't deviate the importance of Sa. Listen to any composition of the above mentioned ragas. The Sa serves as the fundamental while the Ma is a perfect resting place to sit on.

Ragas without a shuddha Ma or Pa are stories worth telling. You really have to use creativity on how to go about making the perfect drone. Raga without a Pa or shuddha ma include ragas like Sohini, Marwa, Gujari Todi, and Hindol. For all of the above mentioned ragas, I tuned the first string to Shuddha Ni. It's interesting to note that Ni is not harmonically great with Sa, yet it is constantly used. Pandit Bhimsen Joshi and Pts Rajan and Sajan Misra do this a good number of times. In a raga where komal ni is used, their tune it to shuddha Ni. It's definitely raises eyebrows on some -peoples shoulders. 😕 Some like it. 👏 Some will have trouble hearing dissonance between the komal Ni sung and the shuddha ni played in relation to the Sa! 🤢 For people who don't like this method of tuning, For the above mentioned ragas, except for Gujari Todi, they tune the tanpura to Shuddha Dha. It sounds nice, but creates a very eerie feeling, especially for the Raga Marwa where Dha and komal re have a strong relationship leaving out Sa. In Gujari Todi, some tune the final string to komal dha, which does not create an eerie scenario, but it is definitely something that is best left for ragas in the Todi that, which for the most part form their source of strength on komal dha.

That was a brief tutorial on Tanpura tuning and harmonics!

Originally posted by: Tansensez

Bhai Aisa hai
Sa se Pa 1 1/2 times zyada hai
Agar Saptak ko 2 bhaag me karoge to
Sa pehle bhaag ka shuruvad
Pa Doosre bhaag ka
Isiliye Pa aur Sa shudd hote hain.
Aur
komal Re, GA, Da, Ni and Teevra Ma ki tarah Sa aur Pa nahin Hai

KB Saaheb, Kya hamne sahi farmaya?

Bilqool thik hai, Tansenji! This is a more quantitative way to examine harmonics and weights amongst the notes.