Poll
Should India Declare a War on Pakistan after the Mumbai carnage?
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india will not be able to reduce pakistani army's power cause if pakistan reduced its military power just to meet the demands of india then pakistani would feel more and more insecure that the india might go and attack pakistan and invade it. the more india make its army stronger pakistan will feel insecure of being attacked by india and thus would also try to strengthened its army's power. plus india and pakistan are two countries which both sides have lacked of trust with each other, that's one of the reason why there was partisan in the first place because of power politics. pakistan wouldn't trust india that it would not do something bad to pakistan and meet indian demands to reduce its army and influence to please india.Originally posted by: SolidSnake
No, but we must never rule it out (and hopefully it never gets used).There are plenty of non-military options which can force Pakistan to act on our demands.Our long term goal must be to reduce Pakistani Army's power and influence in Pakistan. Pakistani Army must be subservient to political/civilian leadership which is how it should have been.
Most magazines are doing cover stories on her.
Bhutto is on the verge of becoming a 'martyr of democracy'. It is a sad that a mother of three children was so brutally killed and we all mourn her terrible death.
Full coverage: Benazir Bhutto killed
Nevertheless, truth must be told. For, as usual, what the press says is not exactly what happened.
Firstly, under Bhutto, anti-Indian terrorism in the Kashmir region was fostered and increased. Benazir was also directly responsible for the ethnic cleansing of Hindus in Kashmir.
"She was instrumental in sponsoring jihad, openly inciting militants to intensify terrorism in India," says Ajai Sahni, the executive director of the New Delhi-based Institute for Conflict Management. "I find it very difficult to discover a single element with her relationship to India that is positive and for the betterment of her country or the region," he adds.
Remember how she was shouting her slogans of azaadi, and exhorting the people of Kashmir to cut Jagmohan, then governor of the state, into pieces, as in "jag-jag, mo-mo, han-han". She would say this while making chopping motions with her right hand as it moved from her left wrist to the elbow, leaving nobody in any doubt as to what she meant.
Secondly, under Bhutto, the Taliban formed and, helped by Pakistan's intelligence service, swept across Afghanistan and later hosted Osama bin Laden. It is a bit of an irony that she may have been killed by the very people she helped foster if at all she was murdered.
We South Asians like our leaders dead
Thirdly, she deliberately increased tension levels and then threatened India with a pre-emptive nuclear strike. The tension peaked when Bhutto repeated her late father's immortal boast of waging a 1,000-year war against India. Even Rajiv Gandhi was forced to mock her in Parliament, asking if those who talked of a 1,000-year war could last even a 1,000 hours.
And fourthly, in her last speech before she died, she alluded to India as one of the threats Pakistan had to face, implying that if she was elected she would deal firmly with it.
Then why is it that Prime Minister Manmohan Singh calls her a friend of India and that Indians mount candlelight vigils in the Gateway of India for her?
I interviewed Benazir Bhutto [Images] twice, the second time as she was campaigning to be re-elected for a second term. The first question I asked, was about Kashmir, as she was the one who had called for Azad Kashmir, a Kashmir free from India, which had triggered the ethnic cleansing of most of the Hindus of the Valley of Kashmir -- 400,000 of them had to flee their ancestral land.
"You know," she answered, "You have to understand the Pakistani point of view on Kashmir. If one goes by the logic of Partition, then at least the Kashmir valley, which is in great majority Muslim -- and it should be emphasised that for long the Hindus Pandits in Kashmir exploited and dominated the Muslims, who are getting back at them today -- should have reverted to Pakistan. But let us say that officially we want to help grant Kashmiris their right to self-determination."
"That's the only reason?" I continued.
"No," answered Benazir. "It should be clear also that Pakistan never forgot the humiliating loss of Bangladesh at the hands of India, although India claims it only helped Bangladesh to gain its freedom in the face of what the Bangladeshis say was Pakistani genocide. Zia's emergence was a result of that humiliation."
"But Zia hanged your father" I interrupted.
"Yes and I hate him and god the almighty already punished him for that," said Benazir, alluding to Zia's death in a plane crash. "But Zia did one thing right, he started the whole policy of proxy war by supporting the separatist movements in Punjab and Kashmir, as a way of getting back at India."
"What about Pakistan' nuclear bomb?" I asked.
"That's my father's work," she said proudly. "He realised, after having lost the 1965 and 1971 wars with India, that both numerically and strategically, we can never beat India in a conventional conflict. Thus he initiated the programme by saying that 'We will get the nuclear bomb, even if we have to eat grass'."
"But is it not a dangerous weapon if it falls in the hands of the fundamentalists of your country?" I asked.
Anti-Bhutto army factions behind the murder?
"No such danger," Benazir answered. "Anyway, it is not only a deterrent against India's military conventional superiority and an answer to India's own nuclear capability, but also the ultimate weapon to re-assert Islam's moral superiority."
"We in Europe are going to unite in a Common Market, why don't Pakistan and India forget their differences and form some kind of confederation with other South Asian countries, instead of killing each other?" I asked.
"Pakistan and India were never one country," answered the imperious lady. "They were only kept together by force, whether by Mauryan, Moghul or British rule. Hindus have recognised the reality of Islam, and we needed our own country to feel free."
I was flabbergasted: here was a lady educated in Oxford and Harvard, who mouthed such irrational statements. She spoke good English, was pretty, articulate and pleased the press.
But when in power, she had to resort to anti-Indianism to please her voters. Her husband was known as Mr 10 Per Cent. She was hounded out of power twice for incompetence and corruption.
Is she then a martyr of democracy?
History will tell.[/quote]
Originally posted by: chal_phek_mat
If we declare a war against Pakistan it would be against the govt or the people over there.hmmmmm.......ever heard of collateral damage😊 Gehoon key saath ghun bhi pista hai whether we like it or not.Some of the nicest people I have met while travelling the globe have been the Pakistani people. I have found them to be far more hospitable people than my fellow Indians.I agree with you. Most pakistanies I have met here in the U.S. are hospitable and nice but they don't represent the majority in pakaistan. Majority there, unfortunately, is the madarsa trained fanatics.On the other hand, I dont hold Zardari responsible for the current attacks. He has paid far bigger price for terrorism than me.You really believe Zardari lost benazir to terrorists?But there are people in Pakistan who are our enemiesIndia should declare a war against those elements in Pakistan which are harmful to India, anyway those are stateless to Pakistan as they claim it.😉 Currently those people roam across Pakistan without any fear. Let us put the fear of death in themIndia should declare a war on LET, D company, etc (just like Bush declared a war on Al-Qaeda)) and tell Pakistan, if we feel/find them on your soil, we will come onto your soil to get them, If you say they are stateless and banned or nonexistant groups(stateless) you should have a problem with our forces doing the job for you in the same sentence we should also say we should retain our cultural, diplomatic, economic ties with Pakistan Lets train some special forces send them over to Pakistan and do the jobThis way we will be on a level playing field with Pakistan in their approach with us😊 This type of a war would be far cheaper for us in Human life or monetory terms than a conventional war with Pakistan.In the current event of the Mumbai attacks, dont ask for the 20 terrorists, instead establish the identity of the 10 terrorists,have their Pakistan govt declare them as stateless entitites. Hire a constitutional lawyer and get the families of these terrorists extradicted to India based upon the laws of citizenship in Pakistan. Hang everyone in their families. If the Pakistani govt refuses to do so. send special ops and shoot everyone in their families from age 2 to 90. Make these f....ers realize there is a price for their goal of 72 virgins!!!How is that any different than waging a war against pakistan - the government AND the people both😊 I really like your idea here but I see some contradictions given the stand you took at the very beginning.
we are peaceloving ppls not want any war
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