Alia Bhatt's New Bridal Wear Ad Sparks Controversy - Page 14

Actually, both of you are wrong here. Kanya means 'daughter'. I'm a Bengali. In shuddh Bengali, we call daughters as 'Kanya' and sons as 'Putra'. Virgin means 'Kumari'. The Sanskrit word 'kaumarya' means 'the state of being a virgin'.

So yes, kanya means daughter and kumari means virgin.

Originally posted by: Mahisa_22

Actually, both of you are wrong here. Kanya means 'daughter'. I'm a Bengali. In shuddh Bengali, we call daughters as 'Kanya' and sons as 'Putra'. Virgin means 'Kumari'. The Sanskrit word 'kaumarya' means 'the state of being a virgin'.

So yes, kanya means daughter and kumari means virgin.

I don't speak Bengali, but Kumaari does not mean virgin in sanskrit. It only means girl after puberty, aka teenager. take for ex Vyasa's famous verse: .

kumArI chApi pA~nchAlI vedimadhyAtsamutthitA | subhagA darshanIyA~NgI vedimadhyA manoramA

https://sanskritdocuments.org/mirrors/mahabharata/txt/mbh01.itx

If we take Kumari as virgin, the verse would make zero sense. All girls are born virgins. Panchali was supposedly born postpuberty.

And you can check any Sanskrit dictionary for kanya. TBH, I think it is used simply to mean girl, not particularly a virgin. But people are twisting themselves into jalebis to claim kanyadaan is not patriarchal, so it was interesting for a while.

Originally posted by: HearMeRoar

Actually no. Sanskrit text and Hindi are not the same. The following is Sanskrit. Does it look like Hindi to you?

Also, Kanya Daan has nothing to do with Kanya raashi.😆

Sanskrit , Hindi and Marathi have the same text - Devnagari Script.

And Kumari means virgin whereas Kanya stands for daughter / daughter like / Miss .

None of the facts will change because you wish it so .. it doesn't work like that .. 😆

Just the fact that you thought that picture actually helped your ignorant argument is hilarious to say the least .. 🤣

Originally posted by: --Pro.vo.King--

Sanskrit , Hindi and Marathi have the same text - Devnagari Script.

And Kumari means virgin whereas Kanya stands for daughter / daughter like / Miss .

None of the facts will change because you wish it so .. it doesn't work like that .. 😆

Just the fact that you thought that picture actually helped your ignorant argument is hilarious to say the least .. 🤣

Oh, no. You don't get to change what was said. The claim was Hindi text was the same as Sanskrit text. I just showed you they are not. Script and text are 2 diff things.

Words matter.

Btw, Sanskrit does not have an accepted native script. Just that in the modern era, it has been written in Devanagri.

If you collect manuscripts from Kashmir, Sanskrit verses have been written in Sharada script.

So yeah, Hindi and Sanskrit do not share a script, either. What you're saying is the same as claiming Hindi and English share a script because on IF, Hindi statements are written with English alphabet.

Love the confidence with which you made the claim, though.👍🏼

Kumari means virgin? You might want to tell Vyasa he was mistaken.

Originally posted by: HearMeRoar

I don't speak Bengali, but Kumaari does not mean virgin in sanskrit. It only means girl after puberty, aka teenager. take for ex Vyasa's famous verse: .

kumArI chApi pA~nchAlI vedimadhyAtsamutthitA | subhagA darshanIyA~NgI vedimadhyA manoramA

https://sanskritdocuments.org/mirrors/mahabharata/txt/mbh01.itx

If we take Kumari as virgin, the verse would make zero sense. All girls are born virgins. Panchali was supposedly born postpuberty.

And you can check any Sanskrit dictionary for kanya. TBH, I think it is used simply to mean girl, not particularly a virgin. But people are twisting themselves into jalebis to claim kanyadaan is not patriarchal, so it was interesting for a while.

I have studied some Sanskrit, and according to what I've read, 'Kumari' comes from 'Kaumarya' meaning virginity. In Bengali and Hindi we say kumari to mean virgin

Kanya means 'daughter' everywhere, not sure if the Vedic era meaning was something else. But later it came to mean just daughter and nothing else. Today when we say Kanya, w don't mean virgin. Like I said, in Bengali we use 'putra' and 'kanya' as formal words for son and daughter. And a lot of shuddh Bengali and Hindi are derived from Sanskrit (Bengali is derived from Magahi Prakrit which comes from Sanskrit).

Originally posted by: Ashley.Tisdale

Every Hindu has a Gotra or "lineage" which comes from mainly the Saptarishis. In other cases students would take their teacher's gotra etc, but originally its to determine a person's lineage.

Its advised not to get married within your Gotra in the scriptures because on a spiritual level, it would mean you're marrying within the family, which can cause health issues in the future generations.

So the Gotra transfer in short means the girl is joining the boy's Gotra. It won't change her own technically, but the child born will be given the father's Gotra. In areas in South India it is the other way around, the guy joining the girl's and children getting their mother's Gotra.

Its not about the girl being donated or parayadhan, those concepts are fairly new and tbh demeaning.

Its basically is like the wife taking up her husband's surname. In the longer run, it would basically mean no genetic disorders for the children.

Very well said. 👍🏼

@bold black

Which places in South do you mean?

In Tamil Brahmin weddings, married girls take on their husband's gotra.

Balya (Balaka, Balika) pre pubesents

Koumarya (Kumara, Kumari) post puberty minors

Yuva (YuvaK, Yuvati) Adults

Vriddha (A person in his her sunset years)

Kumari refers to age not sexual status.

Putri means a daughter Putra means a son. Putrika means a daughter with inheritance rights.

Kanya means a virgin girl

Brahmachari means a celibate, pursuing education.

Ideal marriage scenario was between a Kanya and a Brahmachari.

Do note Brahmachari was not donated. There was no men being donated to anyone. Adoptions used to happen and they were called Dattam not Danam.

Yes a girl was called Lakshmi meaning wealth meaning a physical asset to be donated by father and acquired by husband and means to produce sons. Hence the term Kanyaadaan. A virgin girl donated to a man to start his family.

There is absolutely no citation any where in text of Hindu scriptures Vedic and Pauranic of any schools for girls or even co education schools. Schools were only for boys.

There were female saints (monks/renunciates) like MaitreyI Gargi etc, some married Rishikas too like Arundhati and Lopamudra who have hymns attributed to them in vedas. But Gargi learned from her father. As did Maitreyi. While Arundhati (Vashishtha) and Lopamudra (Agastya) learned from their husbands

So yes very few privileged women did get education, if they were daughters of great Rishi or their wives. But they were exceptions. There was never any mass education program for women like we have today. Neither were there any schools for a girl from an average family to go and get an educatuon Like boys had.

You all can keep screaming glory to ancient vedic culture but this is a fact, girls didn't go to schools in ancient times. They learnt to read and write and studied at home and only if their fathers or husbands allowed them too.

Manusmriti didn't ruin anything for women. It was always so.

Kanya means a virgin girl

Originally posted by: Ashley.Tisdale

Every Hindu has a Gotra or "lineage" which comes from mainly the Saptarishis. In other cases students would take their teacher's gotra etc, but originally its to determine a person's lineage.

Its advised not to get married within your Gotra in the scriptures because on a spiritual level, it would mean you're marrying within the family, which can cause health issues in the future generations.

So the Gotra transfer in short means the girl is joining the boy's Gotra. It won't change her own technically, but the child born will be given the father's Gotra. In areas in South India it is the other way around, the guy joining the girl's and children getting their mother's Gotra.

Its not about the girl being donated or parayadhan, those concepts are fairly new and tbh demeaning.

They are demeaning yes. New noway. Girls have always been expected and made to move out of parents home and live with husbands and in-laws. The grooms have always taken the bride away generally.

Is there any ritual where a son has been donated in marriage. Have you ever heard of putradaan in marriage. That should explain the patriarchy better than anything else.

Its basically is like the wife taking up her husband's surname. In the longer run, it would basically mean no genetic disorders for the children.

So why not donate the son to bride's family. Let him take up wife's surname. Inbreeding can be prevented by putradaan just as much as Kanyaadaan but that never happened that is why the.ritual is demeaning and patriarchal.

Because there is no corresponding equivalent ritual for a boy.

It was OK in the past to not have one because woman was considered less than human, an asset, property (lakshmi or wealth)

Now it is not OK. The ad is right in pointing that out.

Originally posted by: Swetha-Sai

Very well said. 👍🏼

@bold black

Which places in South do you mean?

In Tamil Brahmin weddings, married girls take on their husband's gotra.

If I remember correctly the Tulu people take mother's Gotra.

I think there are a few others too but I cannot remember.

Originally posted by: Mahisa_22

By that logic, why have rakhi, bhai dooj (bhai fonta for us) etc.? These are all so patriarchal? Even worshipping of Goddesses and calling them 'mother' is also patriarchal.

I feel its an unnecessary debate--it's not like kanyadan will actually have an impact on your married life. It's symbolic FFS.

Rakhi is actually for the protection of brother; not the other way round. A thread when tied is a Raksha sutra. People have interpreted as brother vows to protect the sister because historically women have asked for help from her Rakhi brother. Like Rani Karnavati asked for Humayun’s help by sending a Rakhi and he did help.

But the thread is tied for protection and long life of the brother.

😆