death of tragic hero karna

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charminggenie

@charminggenie

Stunner

+ 2

Posted: 11 years ago

#31

Originally posted by: TheWatcher

Was losing their father anyone's mis-deed? like Kunti?, it was no-one's fault. What antagonism?, Bhima was the one who bullied Duryodhana and his brothers. Pandavas lived a very happy life in the gurukul and they were the favourites of their guru. They came back, exhibited their skills and gained great fame.

Lakshagriha and Bhima's poisoning was the only thing where they faced hardships, after that - they wed a beautiful wife, came back to claim the kingdom and apparently got one didn't they?, No-one forced Yudisthira to come and play dice, and no-one forced him to bet his brothers and his wife. And then too, Yudisthira played the second and game again lost. Exile was their own fault.

You mean 1 Bhima with 4 of his brothers were marginalized by Dury and 99 of his brothers even though it was Dury's father who was the king and the fact that Pandavas were treated like outsiders. All of them including Kauravas were great warriors , if you think Dury didn't gain skills or his brothers were not capable , then well that is pretty shocking.

Lakshgriha and Bhima's poisoning were not just hardships they were attempt to murder , the latter of an innocent young child who was incapable of defending. .

Yes they were married to Draupadi but that didn't stop Dury and his brothers from seeking matrimony, Didn't it.

They lived for years in hiding and in forests, there are zillion times of hardships like bandits,rivals, wild animals , travel and many more.

Yes Yudi made a mistake and exile was his fault? So was the fate that was handed to Dury and his brothers because of their Karma . It was Dury's own will for vastraharan that became his undoing.Add to that the tag of alleged murder.

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TheWatcher

@TheWatcher

Voyager

Posted: 11 years ago

#32

Originally posted by: charminggenie

You mean 1 Bhima with 4 of his brothers were marginalized by Dury and 99 of his brothers even though it was Dury's father who was the king and the fact that Pandavas were treated like outsiders. All of them including Kauravas were great warriors , if you think Dury didn't gain skills or his brothers were not capable , then well that is pretty shocking.

Lakshgriha and Bhima's poisoning were not just hardships they were attempt to murder , the latter of an innocent young child who was incapable of defending. .
Yes they were married to Draupadi but that didn't stop Dury and his brothers from seeking matrimony, Didn't it.
They lived for years in hiding and in forests, there are zillion times of hardships like bandits,rivals, wild animals , travel and many more.
Yes Yudi made a mistake and exile was his fault? So was the fate that was handed to Dury and his brothers because of their Karma . It was Dury's own will for vastraharan that became his undoing.Add to that the tag of alleged murder.

That innocent child Bhima, used to bully Duryodhana and his 99 brothers he used catch then by their hair and drag them, Bhima even made Duryodhan's brothers fight each other.

I dont mean in it, its what I it is written in KMG. Bhima broke many parts of Duryodhan's brothers and even drowned him until they were nearly dead.

"..The son of the Wind-god pulled them by the hair and made them fight with one another, laughing all the while. And Vrikodara easily defeated those hundred and one children of great energy as if they were one instead of being a hundred and one. The second Pandava used to seize them by the hair, and throwing them down, to drag them along the earth. By this, some had their knees broken, some their heads, and some their shoulders. That youth, sometimes holding ten of them, drowned them in water, till they were nearly dead..."

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TheWatcher

@TheWatcher

Voyager

Posted: 11 years ago

#33

Originally posted by: ..RamKiJanaki..

Exile may have been their own fault, but at least they repented and realized what they did was wrong. They did suffer for 13 years, didn't they? What did the Kauravas or Karna do to repent? They never once repented what they did to Draupadi. In fact, they did not even consider it wrong, since she apparently was their "servant" when they disrobed her and servant women are allowed to be humiliated.

Actually - Karna died to repent his mistakes, he admitted that he has to pay for his sins commited against the Pandavas and hence he cannot join the Pandavas.

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Gayatri

@FeistyQueen

Sparkler

+ 2

Posted: 11 years ago

#34

Originally posted by: ..RamKiJanaki..
As far as physical capability goes, it's true Karna was equal to Arjuna as Lord Krishna himself said so, but Krishna also said in the Shrimad Bhagavatham that he and Arjuna are incarnations of Nara and Narayana, who are Vishnu's avatars, so Arjuna was in no way inferior to Karna. He was another incarnation of Vishnu in the form of Nara.

For me, Mahabharat is very much a spiritual epic, so I cannot criticize the Godly characters as if it's a fictional story of the modern era, where it's fashionable to love "flawed" characters. In my opinion that's equal to blasphemy, but of course others are free to disagree.

If someone like Karna today ordered a woman to be stripped, people would be protesting and blaming him for sexual harassment. They'd want him to be punished and given capital punishment, but since Karna is such a "tragic hero" in the epic, his mistake is forgiven and forgotten.

@bold: not just Karna, ppl would protest against everyone present there.. if any husband today dared to stake his wife, he will be the main accused!

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Srishti

@srishtisingh

Voyager

Posted: 11 years ago

#35

come on yar! some people like karna some people hate.just accept the difference. do u people really need to make others feed ur words because both of u know none is going to accept others argument!

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riti4u

@riti4u

Stunner

+ 7

Posted: 11 years ago

#36

Originally posted by: ..dreamygatz..

@bold: not just Karna, ppl would protest against everyone present there.. if any husband today dared to stake his wife, he will be the main accused!

If a husband or a known relation to that woman is silently watching stripping of his wife or any close relative and not reacting at all, for me that is biggest crime of all. Its a trust of that woman broken here whom they vowed to protect throughout life. How can this be any less crime and Adharma. How can staking wife as a property or in other words gambling your wife be any less crime .

Yes Karna is tragic hero inspite of that because like pandavas regretted and repented ...atleast in some versions Karna do repent his mistakes too... if in KMG he does not specifically take draupadi's name, still he mentions events of dyut sabha and apologise for that...So how is that pandavas are allowed to repent and regret for their mistake while Karna is not allowed. If pandavas suffered for their mistake...obviously this man here died for it... So why bringing in this argument of him doing unforgivable mistake... again and again countless times in any argument or any topic related with Karna..

I thought I wont reply but seeing some arguments here ,I just could not control. I agree with you gayatri on all points you said.

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Janaki

@RamKiSeeta

Achiever

+ 6

Posted: 11 years ago

#37

Originally posted by: ..dreamygatz..

@bold: not just Karna, ppl would protest against everyone present there.. if any husband today dared to stake his wife, he will be the main accused!

Sorry, I don't believe he is the main one to be accused, because what you're saying is that if someone stakes their wife, then other have a right to strip her and the fault is the husband's. The fault is the husband's, but only for staking her. We should give fault where it lies. Yudhisthir is to be blamed for staking her, no doubt, just as Raja Harischandra is blamed for selling his wife and son in the black market, BUT Yudhisthir cannot be blamed for her disrobing, because that was perpetrated by the Kauravas and Karna, and even if Draupadi can be considered a slave because Yudhisthir staked her, a slave too is a human being. She too should be treated with respect. She does not deserve to be disrobed. What irks me is that we Pandava supporters criticize them for their crime in the dyut sabha. We do not look for excuses to make them seem blameless. We accept that Yudhisthir committed a crime in staking his wife, and we accept that the other Pandavas committed a crime in sitting quiet while Draupadi was disrobed, but why do the Kaurava supporters want to whitewash their favorite characters? Why can't they accept that Duryodhan, Karna and the other Kauravas committed an equally disgusting crime by disrobing Draupadi, that too during her menstruation?

The Pandavas' crime was their silence during their wife's humiliation. It was a big crime indeed and cannot be defended.

The Kauravas' (including Karna and Shakuni) crime was to physically abuse and disrobe Draupadi. No matter if the husband sells the wife, it does not give anyone the right to abuse her, whether she is a servant or a queen.

Both sides were equal to blame, there is no "main" culprit.

It is easy to blame Yudhisthir as the "main" culprit of the dyut sabha, because people love the character of Karna, and some even Duryodhan. While the bystanders are to be blamed for sitting quiet, that does not make the perpetrator right. People love to blame Yudhisthir for the disrobing, because they reckon that he gave the Kauravas and Karna a right to abuse Draupadi, so what the Kauravas did cannot possibly be considered wrong, can it? They were just having their way with a servant, which is of course fine and not morally wrong. 😕

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riti4u

@riti4u

Stunner

+ 7

Posted: 11 years ago

#38

Originally posted by: srishtisingh
come on yar! some people like karna some people hate.just accept the difference. do u people really need to make others feed ur words because both of u know none is going to accept others argument!

I tried restraining a lot dear..from morning I was...but seriously bringing in same topic and same argument again n again in every post of Karna just makes me loose cool.

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Janaki

@RamKiSeeta

Achiever

+ 6

Posted: 11 years ago

#39

Originally posted by: TheWatcher

Actually - Karna died to repent his mistakes, he admitted that he has to pay for his sins commited against the Pandavas and hence he cannot join the Pandavas.

Sorry, but I don't buy this. Anyone who fought on the battlefield was fair game to die, even the Pandavas. I don't see any form of repentance from Karna's side. What did he do those 13 years while the Pandavas were exiled? Karna did not stay on Duryodhan's side to die for his mistakes. He had every intention of winning against Arjuna, and he remained with Duryodhan because Duryodhan was his friend.

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Gayatri

@FeistyQueen

Sparkler

+ 2

Posted: 11 years ago

#40

Originally posted by: riti4u

If a husband or a known relation to that woman is silently watching stripping of his wife or any close relative and not reacting at all, for me that is biggest crime of all. Its a trust of that woman broken here whom they vowed to protect throughout life. How can this be any less crime and Adharma. How can staking wife as a property or in other words gambling your wife be any less crime .

Yes Karna is tragic hero inspite of that because like pandavas regretted and repented ...atleast in some versions Karna do repent his mistakes too... if in KMG he does not specifically take draupadi's name, still he mentions events of dyut sabha and apologise for that...So how is that pandavas are allowed to repent and regret for their mistake while Karna is not allowed. If pandavas suffered for their mistake...obviously this man here died for it... So why bringing in this argument of him doing unforgivable mistake... again and again countless times in any argument or any topic related with Karna..

I thought I wont reply but seeing some arguments here ,I just could not control. I agree with you gayatri on all points you said.

@underlined: yess!! I feel that as the Biggest crime in the Epic and no 13 years of Penance can be considered its punishment! For me it is unpardonable!

Riti.. me too agree completely with what you said! And even I didn't want to enter a pointless argument !! Was forced comment at least that!