death of tragic hero karna - Page 14

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TheWatcher thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago

Originally posted by: supri1607

"Karna said,--'Of all the persons in the assembly, three, viz., Bhishma, Vidura, and the preceptor of the Kurus (Drona) appear to be independent; for they always speak of their master as wicked, always censure him, and never wish for his prosperity. O excellent one, the slave, the son, and the wife are always dependent. They cannot earn wealth, for whatever they earn belongeth to their master. Thou art the wife of a slave incapable of possessing anything on his own account. Repair now to the inner apartments of king Dhritarashtra and serve the king's relatives. We direct that that is now thy proper business. And, O princess, all the sons of Dhritarashtra and not the sons of Pritha are now thy masters. O handsome one, select thou another husband now,--one who will not make thee a slave by gambling. It is well-known that women, especially that are slaves, are not censurable if they proceed with freedom in electing husbands.


How does this prove anything you've said before?.


Madri and Kunti never fought like Sautens, Pandu was never weak, he in fact conquered many kingdoms.

Nobody insulted them due to their Divine Birth, if anyone did, please provide citations

You did provide a citation but seems like you didn't have a gaze on it, please gave a gander on the citation you provided, in the citations Karna says that Slaves have no liberty of choosing husband, Karna also says that Draupadi is now their slave. The citation you provided is non-contextual in the reference of your claims. Karna had a grudge on Pandavas not Draupadi.


When did Pandavas get insulted due to their Brahmin status, they were not Brahmins and any insult related to Brahmins does even relate to them. They were not Brahmins period.





Edited by TheWatcher - 11 years ago
Sabhayata thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago

Originally posted by: supri1607


lol go up i posted citations for that..drau claim...and sisupal friends though he was with the pandavas..or rather bheem he did insult them too he insulted bheeshma making the same claim..and its great to know i helped ur grammar 😊no enmity with drau..u have read vana parva rit? he was sooo eager to see parth panchali suffering in the forest...and karn not having a grudge against drau ?? ur kidding right ?? yes i have no qualms in posting from KMG i already did dat..but personally i feel bibek debroy is more reliable ... and what else did u ask me to clarify ?? and he hated her for insulting him in er swayamvar... a woman has no rights to ask for what she wants..i agree with u...how dare she choose who she wants to marry ?? so ur telling me karn insulted drau just because he could just because she was a weakling in front of him..just because she was exposed..it wouldve been better if he hd given her a tit for tat


LOL again no citations .Please post citations for what you are saying so that we can have a fruitful discussion.Bibek debroy will also do

In any case let me post citations

1)Regarding drau claim -You posted citation for Karna insulting Drauapdi but not for the fact that he did it because he had a grudge against Draupadi.Please post citation for that.He insulted her because he of his enmity with panadvas which he even later accepts during his conversation with krishna ji.Below is the citation .If you think otherwise please post citation rather than just claims.please share citation where he says he hates drau

For those harsh words, O Krishna, that I said before unto the sons of Pandu for the gratification of Dhritarashtra's son,--for that wicked conduct of mine,--I am consumed with repentance

2)Regarding shishupal again share the citation.Here let me do that for you.Below is the full citation pleas point out to me where did shishupal insults panadavs because of how they were born

http://www.sacred-texts.com/hin/m02/m02040.htm

it begins from here please let me know when he insults panadvs for how they were born

you want to share it from bibek debroy then please do that whatever makes you more comfortable

your other claim i have already shared in the previous point but still let me help you with your own claim 😊

2 moms forever jealous of each other a weak father

please share citation that panadavs had a difficult childhood because of the above fact
Edited by Sabhayata - 11 years ago
...Diala... thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago

Originally posted by: Sabhayata



2)Regarding shishupal again share the citation.Here let me do that for you.Below is the full citation pleas point out to me where did shishupal insult panadavs because of how they were born

http://www.sacred-texts.com/hin/m02/m02040.htm

it begins for here please let me know when he insults panadvs for how they were born


not even in ⭐️bharat that I was expecting eagerly 😭


as I said, most of the crowd was convinced that they were children of Gods.. if not Gods too, Niyoga was accepted.. none probably other than Dury had the courage to speak against that.. would be glad if enlightened.. afaik, NO.. and about Madri Kunti thing, the jealousy came only in one instance from Kunti's end for Madri misusing the boon to get two children.. YBA would have been too young to feel this pain I think 😕..
Edited by ...Diala... - 11 years ago
-supri- thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago

Originally posted by: ...Diala...


not even in ⭐️bharat that I was expecting eagerly 😭


as I said, most of the crowd was convinced that they were children of Gods.. if not Gods too, Niyoga was accepted.. none probably other than Dury had the courage to speak against that.. would be glad if enlightened.. afaik, NO.. and about Madri Kunti thing, the jealousy came only in one instance from Kunti's end for Madri misusing the boon to get two children.. YBA would have been too young to feel this pain I think 😕..


yes...they were young in fact waaayy to young and there was jealousy from kuntis side...yes most of the crowd ... niyoga was accepted but as in the case of satyavati and kunti not so much...actually in rajaji mb sisupal insults the pandavas and bheeshma too i think..dont exactly remember the credentials anyway ur welcome to check dear he claims something around illegitimate birth..birth from high to low and stuff like dat..ill check...and again godd why is it soo hard to read what ive already said ??? *Facepalm*
The question arose as to who should be
honored first. The grandsire was
emphatically of the opinion that Sri
Krishna, the king of Dwaraka, should be
honored first, which was also
Yudhishthira's own opinion.
Yudhishthira followed the advice and
under his instructions Sahadeva offered to
Sri Krishna the honors enjoined by
tradition. Sisupala, the king of Chedi, who
hated Krishna as wickedness alone can
hate goodness, could not tolerate it.
He laughed aloud in derision and said:
"How ridiculous and unjust, but I am not
surprised. The man who sought advice
was born in illegitimacy. (This was an
insulting allusion to the sons of Kunti)
The man who gave advice was born of
one who ever declines from high to low.

there u go..i dont know mb better than this great patron so ur welcome to contradict him...and wait wat was the other thing ??

What happiness can be more complete than that which he enjoyeth who while himself in prosperity, looketh upon his foes in adversity, like a person on the hill top looking down upon another crawling on the earth? O tiger among kings, the happiness that one derives from beholding his foes in grief, is greater than what one may derive from the acquisition of offering or wealth or kingdom! What happiness will not be his who, himself in affluence, will cast his eyes on Dhananjaya attired in barks and deer-skins? Let thy wife dressed in costly robes look at the woeful Krishna clad in barks and deer-skins, and enhance the latter's grief! Let the daughter of Drupada reproach herself and her life, divested as she is of wealth, for the sorrow that she will feel upon beholding thy wife decked in ornaments will be far greater than what she had felt in the midst of the assembly (when Dussasana had dragged her there)!"

yes karn dint hate her at all... if u still dont think my citations dont merge with m points...very well..im not wasting my time..u win...

there u go... now dont tell me ur gonna contradict KMG for me.. *Sigh* the pandavas better be grateful for this..

there u go bibek debroy :

"Sisupala said--'O thou of the Kuru race, this one of the Vrishni race doth not deserve royal worship as if he were a king, in the midst of all these illustrious monarchs. O son of Pandu, this conduct of thine in thus willingly worshipping him with eyes like lotus-petals is not worthy of the illustrious Pandavas. Ye sons of Pandu. Ye are children. Ye know not what morality is, for that is very subtle.born where the foxes ye howl where the kunti conceiveth ye ..thou art father not known to thee..ye no not what conduct is, Bhishma, this son also of Ganga is of little knowledge and hath transgressed the rules of morality (by giving ye such counsel).And, O Bhishma, if one like thee, possessed of virtue and morality acteth from motives of interest, he is deserving of censure among the honest and the wise. How doth he of the Dasarha race, who is not even a king, accept worship before these kings and how is it that he hath been worshipped by ye? O bull of the Kuru race, if thou regardest Krishna as the oldest in age, here is Vasudeva, and how can his son be said so in his presence? Or, if thou regardest Vasudeva as your well-wisher and supporter, here is Drupada; how then can Madhava deserve the (first) worship? Or, O son of Kuru, regardest thou Krishna as preceptor? When Drona is here, how hast thou worshipped him of the Vrishni race? Or, O son of Kuru, regardest thou Krishna as the Ritwija? When old Dwaipayana is here, how hath Krishna been worshipped by thee? Again when old Bhishma, the son of Santanu, that foremost of men who is not to die save at his own wish is here, why, O king, hath Krishna been worshipped by thee? When the brave Aswatthaman, versed in every branch of knowledge is here, why, O king, hath K rishna, O thou of the Kuru race, been worshipped by thee? When that King of kings, Duryyodhana, that foremost of men, is here, as also Kripa the preceptor of the Bharata princes, why hath Krishna been worshipped by thee?


there u are guys..believing me or not ts completely your choice...good bye and we should discuss stuff like this more often...its fun😆


now let me sleep in peace🥱

Edited by supri1607 - 11 years ago
...Diala... thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
citation from Rajaji MB? again which is a retelling not translation.. never mind.. oh now Kunti to Satyavati? OMG!! now what problem did Satyavati have? 😕 again Rajaji MB? and what was written your post? 'dont reply, I talk whatever I feel like to'?? 🥱
Sabhayata thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago

Originally posted by: supri1607


yes...they were young in fact waaayy to young and there was jealousy from kuntis side...yes most of the crowd ... niyoga was accepted but as in the case of satyavati and kunti not so much...actually in rajaji mb sisupal insults the pandavas and bheeshma too i think..dont exactly remember the credentials anyway ur welcome to check dear he claims something around illegitimate birth..birth from high to low and stuff like dat..ill check...and again godd why is it soo hard to read what ive already said ??? *Facepalm*


what happened to Bibek debroy's CE since that is reliable

again please share citations from that for your claims
Sabhayata thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago

Originally posted by: ...Diala...


not even in ⭐️bharat that I was expecting eagerly 😭


as I said, most of the crowd was convinced that they were children of Gods.. if not Gods too, Niyoga was accepted.. none probably other than Dury had the courage to speak against that.. would be glad if enlightened.. afaik, NO.. and about Madri Kunti thing, the jealousy came only in one instance from Kunti's end for Madri misusing the boon to get two children.. YBA would have been too young to feel this pain I think 😕..


Did even Dury insult panadavs for being born through niyoga?

Yes he did doubt whether they were son's of god or not but as per him they could be born from rishi's through niyoga.His own father was born like why would he insult panadavs for being born through niyoga

As long as panadavs were panadavs no one insulted them for being born through niyoga. if they were would love to read citation
TheWatcher thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
Give citations from CE or KMG, retelling like Rajaji's MB wont work here.Moreover - the citations you provided from KMG don't prove any of your claims.
Edited by TheWatcher - 11 years ago

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