Karna: Does He Deserve So Much Respect??[DT Note Page 15] - Page 6

@Watcher my point is she can but if she would say "I don't want to marry him, just because I am not feeling like it." that was not something to be done in Dwapar Yug. She said that she does not want to marry a Suta-putra. If a Rajkumar is called a Rajkumar, Suta putra is called that. And it is true that Karna belonged to a lower caste. She said she will not marry a man belonging to a cast lower to her. And can you post citations of Karna being invited to Draupadi's Swayamvar.?
And what big deal in refusing him when he is about to hit? So she was late in saying? Okay, accepted she was late. So?
But I am saying after all, is it not true that Karna was as known to all at that time, a Sutaputra? Panchaali was a Kshatriya princess. So, he was rejected.

Originally posted by: shlvrv_Niva

Can we deny that Karna's statement in RS before VH was out of revenge? No we can't.

Nothing in this world - norm, revenge, hate for someone, love for someone, loyalty to someone, freindship to someone, ownership over someone, or pain of personal wounds --- absolutely nothing can justify sexual harrasement of a woman.

Good people then did not justify it (Krishna, Bheesma, drona etc.) - It was not a norm then, and good people today do not justify it. Because someone's personal wounds can't be the reason to make a lady naked in a hall in front of hundreds of people.

This is not right. Logic can be put into anything, but when pain of a female (Draupadi's and that of other ladies of all times) can be justified using ANY argument whatsoever, then every female would be denied the Right to make a mistake. in our patriarchal society "He did it because she said so" is license to males to do anything.

working for women and children in particular, I feel that Draupadi's case is never a matter of justification at all. It has to be seen emotionally and not logically.

you know the one walking in tunnel can see very limited kind of small light. The direction of eyes is only riveted towards those rays of light. Loving Karna is great - love him for his reality, love him for his humanity, love him for his struggles, for his worrier skills, love him and love him more. But don't lay the blame at Draupadi's feet for VH is all I am saying.

Having said that - I loved reading all your posts and POV's. It was lovely to read it in friendly manner, and now I would bow out because in my humble opinion Draupadi's one mistake of unintentionally scrapping on Karna's wound is being used as a shield for him, and so its not a thread for me anymore.

Love u all, and peace - may the women kind in our times, find more justice!

Originally posted by: TheWatcher

I consider his mistake in the VH to be the sole one, it cannot be argued.

For me, Karna, in his whole life, did only one mistake and that was during the VH.

I am finding citation in which Karna protested during the Lac house plot or he did not agree with the plot. Some experts who have KMG and other accurate translations do always say that Karna did not agree with the Lac house incident, its just a matter of finding a citation.

When did I say she deserved it?, you interpreted my post in a wrong way.

I said she was wrong during the swayamvar and Karna was wrong during the VH. Each of the one does not gets nullified. Both are mistakes, not only one.

Originally posted by: Brishti_Sarkar

@Watcher my point is she can but if she would say "I don't want to marry him, just because I am not feeling like it." that was not something to be done in Dwapar Yug. She said that she does not want to marry a Suta-putra. If a Rajkumar is called a Rajkumar, Suta putra is called that. And it is true that Karna belonged to a lower caste. She said she will not marry a man belonging to a cast lower to her. And can you post citations of Karna being invited to Draupadi's Swayamvar.?
And what big deal in refusing him when he is about to hit? So she was late in saying? Okay, accepted she was late. So?
But I am saying after all, is it not true that Karna was as known to all at that time, a Sutaputra? Panchaali was a Kshatriya princess. So, he was rejected.

Originally posted by: riti4u

My dear friend please read his other post just below that before making any assumption.

He just pointed her mistake... NOONE here is comparing their mistakes.

Peace out dear..

who said about blaming draupadi for VH.. I dont see any post regarding that...

This is the reason how things go from peaceful decent discussions to argumentative fights... coz people read too much in replies.. just because it is coming from so called other side...

I am a woman and it really hurts me a lot when I see people saying we justify ... I would say it for all karna fans who replied in this thread...With their views, I dont see any of them justifying that VH act at all..

Sry i would give reply to u on this - By "HE" I think u r referring to our friend 'The watcher' -- I am actually not pointing to him at all. I am expressing my own humble opinion about the feeling that I get when drau's one mistake is highlighted a lot, and that happens all the time, and most do it.

As I said, I didn't refer to Thewatcher in my post, and I did not refer to any single Karna fan. 'What I am against is actually making big of Sutputra comment. If you extrapolate that argument, it ends up lending the blame at Drau's feet no matter what.

In life one event leads to other, they are not discrete things, no matter how we want them to keep separate.

I have loved Karna and his struggles enough to understand him and the fans mentality. But finally for me -- Draupadi's sutputra comment shouldn't ever even be mentioned because, you like it or not, it is done to reduce her victim hood, and somewhat justify Karna, whether u state it explicitly or not. Again not intended at anyone in particular, not even you, though I am replying to ur comment.

And thanks for taking the time to have a chat with me. 😊

"Dhrishtadyumna said, 'Duryodhana, Durvisaha, Durmukha and Dushpradharshana, Vivinsati, Vikarna, Saha, and Duhsasana; Yuyutsu and Vayuvega and Bhimavegarava; Ugrayudha, Valaki, Kanakayu, and Virochana, Sukundala, Chitrasena, Suvarcha, and Kanakadhwaja; Nandaka, and Vahusali, and Tuhunda, and Vikata; these, O sister, and many other mighty sons of Dhritarashtra--all heroes--accompanied by Karna, have come for thy hand.

Originally posted by: Arijit007

to me karna is a very confusing charecter, he was the one who ordered the vastraharan of draupadi and one of the men that gave duryodhan the idea of imprisoning krishna in the epic, but, he was also the one who knew that krishna was narayan himself, it means he was not that evi or proudy. and about his kavach kundal daan, no selfish person can donate something that protects him. he was a mix of both positive and negetive things, he was despite being suryaputra, an exelent example of an ordinary human being, who has 50% evil and 50% good inside of him.

Originally posted by: vinnas

well i must appreciate for this post of urs..
my views are as much near to this reg karna ...
thanks fr filling alot of info by this post ..
agreed to all points..
nd liked very much comments of all..

Originally posted by: shlvrv_Niva

Sry i would give reply to u on this - By "HE" I think u r referring to our friend 'The watcher' -- I am actually not pointing to him at all. I am expressing my own humble opinion about the feeling that I get when drau's one mistake is highlighted a lot, and that happens all the time, and most do it.

As I said, I didn't refer to Thewatcher in my post, and I did not refer to any single Karna fan. 'What I am against is actually making big of Sutputra comment. If you extrapolate that argument, it ends up lending the blame at Drau's feet no matter what.

In life one event leads to other, they are not discrete things, no matter how we want them to keep separate.

I have loved Karna and his struggles enough to understand him and the fans mentality. But finally for me -- Draupadi's sutputra comment shouldn't ever even be mentioned because, you like it or not, it is done to reduce her victim hood, and somewhat justify Karna, whether u state it explicitly or not. Again not intended at anyone in particular, not even you, though I am replying to ur comment.

And thanks for taking the time to have a chat with me. 😊

Awesome post amrita!!

a great analysis n yes you did come up with the same questions i had!!!

i too adore karna!!
i feel that karna and drau stands at the same status of complex characters and both are mistakenly interpreted!!
both have suffered and both had strength to come out of it with glorious colours!!

n yes i too have found commedds in facebook and all saying the bloddy bitch drau deserves 100 slaps for rejecting the golden heart...
n some even said she should have been raped!!

i was shocked to read this as it came from a female itself tht a girl deserves to be raped for rejecting a person!!

but yes there are noble karna fans who says wat he said to panchali was not ryt!!

so many ppl come in to these fan pages n drown themselves without even knowing the real truth!! most of them have only read or heard abt POV books..

i've also not read KMG!! (actually planning to read it now only!! i cant take in Shakespearean language!! ) i'm some wat well versed in geetha though, i think geetha too holds answers to some of the above said "mistakes n wrong doings" of Karna (not juz karna but of all, i juz took his name coz he is the man under discussion!!!)

well written amrita!!! hats off!!!
hope all learn something from these n have a good perspective abt facts!!!