Take 5: An end of an era; update on Friday's episode on page 15

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divyavm

@divyavm

Sparkler

Posted: 11 years ago

#81

Originally posted by: WhyWhynot

Divi, agreed maybe a diff script for them. But her vicious acts need to come to light na? Till date the real culprit she, in the case of Ruq MC, is not revealed. And add the big list of her sins. The way Resham's loyalty is repeatedly shown (am sure they are going to show her take revenge for MA), the chance of it being revealed through her is lost. None else who knows are existing today anyway.

And if she had truly felt love for her son, she should have repented her such acts against such a son. It could not have just been just a desire to see him or being called mother and even having time for a Lori (this was too much- looks like a copy from Mahabharata serial where Kunti sings for Karna).this rendition is lacking as quite a few have pointed out, and I feel that it could not be ignored and hence the FB guess (if am right per history she regrets her acts to Akbar when in deathbed).

Regd praising of Jodha, it seem a force fit - looks like there is a policy that all villains need to salute her sometime. If MA had been true to her character, assuming that is why she did not apologize, then she should not have saluted Jodha as well. If a reformed MA is to be shown, then an apologetic MA, even in a dignified way was needed as repentance goes with regret. And for this just a mere mention of Jodha coming to feed her and hence her blessing does not fit. Brand Jodha that way, with MA's repentance and Jodha's patience and kindess despite her behaviour, would have been more glorified. Only way I could think is - they wZnted to keep MA's character intact (they will die with their ego), and her love for Jalal rather Jalal's love for her despite her behavior and brand Jodha had to be shown - all in a single frame and hence that scene.
But in this process MA was glorified intentionally or unintentionally or maybe confused as a glorification of Ashwini!! Glorification of MA could be justified only with repentance, else it will only leave a bitter taste in many a mouth. Those who praise the Epi are praising the acting more than the content as you would have noted.

Regd brand Jodha, she should not have been projected as her going to MA with an intention to revoke the curse. Instead as someone who genuinely wants to take care of one in such a condition, especially as she is the one who has saved her dear husband unmindful of herself. This would have more the brand Jodha.

What you describe is great but would need nuance ... Which the CVs are never good at

It would be difficult to script a scene where MA would repent for all the hurtful things while still showing Jalal's grief for Maham Anga

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divyavm

@divyavm

Sparkler

Posted: 11 years ago

#82

Originally posted by: Rashmi81
Why do I feel there is slight decline in the interest in the show ,I felt it generally for everybody.

Yes, because it is going staccato again .., there is a disconnect

I knew the tide was shifting with the curse ... And I was right

The curse was one NR and a Queen delivering in the rains another one

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divyavm

@divyavm

Sparkler

Posted: 11 years ago

#83

Originally posted by: ashpat
Nice take, Divya!!

Ashwini is a superb actress which breathed life into character of MA.But, I cannot stand MA. I don't know about others but I did not feel emotional at all when MA died. Yes, I liked when MA accepted Jodha and took back the curse and blessed that Jalal will get an heir from Jodha. It was nice to see that MA accepted Jodha who she hated most. But, I was not satisfied; not only as an Akdha fan but even as human being, this was not enough for me (if it meant to be shown MA was repenting). I wanted MA to apologize to JALAL also for causing pain to him and betraying him. But, here she was asking Jalal why he punished her and stopped calling her Baddi Ammi, are you kidding me? Or at least MA could have been shown repenting in jail and thinking of all her past crimes since her hand in Bairam's death to saving Adham to causing Ruq MC (inturn making her infertile) to letter MU. She could have counted all her crimes and said to herself that due to all of these she was punished by Allah by losing both of her sons. This would have been more apt. I just do not think it is fair to Jalal, Jodha or Ruq or others that they do not know MA's all past crimes. Even after knowing ALL her past crimes and sins, Jalal and co had still bid her farewell with sombre expression and without display of OTT would have been fine.

Thanks! yes Ashwini is deserving of every praise ... But yes an apology and leas crying from Jalal would a been welcome

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rasha1500

@rasha1500

Navigator

Posted: 11 years ago

#84

I liked singing Rajat although his voice was not good, but he came out of his heart and was honest without music or another singer, this is the essence. Well done Rajat

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shreya roy

@munni_rajatfan

Stunner

+ 4

Posted: 11 years ago

#85

Originally posted by: ashpat
Nice take, Divya!!

Ashwini is a superb actress which breathed life into character of MA.But, I cannot stand MA. I don't know about others but I did not feel emotional at all when MA died. Yes, I liked when MA accepted Jodha and took back the curse and blessed that Jalal will get an heir from Jodha. It was nice to see that MA accepted Jodha who she hated most. But, I was not satisfied; not only as an Akdha fan but even as human being, this was not enough for me (if it meant to be shown MA was repenting). I wanted MA to apologize to JALAL also for causing pain to him and betraying him. But, here she was asking Jalal why he punished her and stopped calling her Baddi Ammi, are you kidding me? Or at least MA could have been shown repenting in jail and thinking of all her past crimes since her hand in Bairam's death to saving Adham to causing Ruq MC (inturn making her infertile) to letter MU. She could have counted all her crimes and said to herself that due to all of these she was punished by Allah by losing both of her sons. This would have been more apt. I just do not think it is fair to Jalal, Jodha or Ruq or others that they do not know MA's all past crimes. Even after knowing ALL her past crimes and sins, Jalal and co had still bid her farewell with sombre expression and without display of OTT would have been fine.

really superb writing. i was also saying the same. its gud tht she did appreciated jodha & did a salam, but maham's crimes r not limited to jodha only. jalal deserved an apology from her. ok he doesnt know about maham killing her babies, but she had hurt jalal in many ways. she should have realized why exactly jalal stopped calling her badi ammi.

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..Anusha..

@..Anusha..

Sparkler

Posted: 11 years ago

#86

Originally posted by: divyavm

yes Magal and Ladies...your Manmohini Morey VM is here...

https://www.indiaforums.com/forum/post/113422579

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sashashyam

@sashashyam

Sparkler

+ 3

Posted: 11 years ago

#87

Divya dear,

You are indefatigable, and I see that you are back with your cotton candy confections, this time re: Mahaam

"While I do not agree with Maham Anga's actions" indeed! Do not agree??? 😡 Have you sat down and made a list of all the horrible crimes that this woman committed without the slightest twinge of regret, starting with the serial miscarriages that killed all of Jalal's unborn children? If Jalal had known about that, as we do, what do you think he would have done? And is it enough for such a dyed in the wool villain to start coughing away and sport dark circles under her eyes for everyone to start sentimentalising over her? Why, Mahaam was grieved over by Jalal more that he did for Agtah, who lived and died for him. I find this kind of whitewashing of evil insufferable.

I always love the way you write, but I am not going to drown all over again in the sea of facile sentimentality that you have conjured up. Having to suffer thru all that treacle late last night was enough.

I see that even you could not conjure up a song to mark Jalal's tuneless warbling, which had me reaching for my non-existent earplugs!😉

I am still waiting for you to do a sharp, unbending, unsentimental analysis of something in Jodha Akbar, if you ever get around to that. I begin to think that it is a vain hope, but do carry on and have fun with this determined sunny-heartedness by all means if it makes you, and so very many others, so happy.

Shyamala Aunty

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sashashyam

@sashashyam

Sparkler

+ 3

Posted: 11 years ago

#88

Jodha Akbar 334: Mahaam triomphatrix!

Yesternight - I caught the 11 pm repeat telecast and was pleased to see that some of my predictions of the day before (on Khushi's thread) had come right, which was a nice change!

1) Mahaam did NOT repent for anything she had done for which she had been caught and found guilty - neither the Atifa plot nor even the baddua. No question, therefore, of her confessing and seeking forgiveness for her hidden crimes, beginning with her serial killings of Jalal's unborn children. This was no whimpering, apologising weakling.

So there was no question of Jalal giving absolution to a "repenting mother". Sorry, Khushi dear !

It is another matter that Jalal, who is busy first reminiscing about his childhood with his badiammi and then weeping all over her, does not know about 90% of Mahaam's crimes against him and his family. I would have thought the Atifa track would have been bad enough, but apparently all is forgiven provided the criminal is clever enough to be dying. Still, I wonder what he would have done if he had read the whole catalogue of her crimes, beginning with the serial miscarriages.

Jodha of course would not acknowledge these crimes even if they stared her in the face, for she is now fixated on playing the angel of mercy and forgiveness.

2) Mahaam finally deigned to "accept" Jodha, and exactly as I had predicted, Jodha was all gratitude for that and overflowing with respect for the woman who had nearly got her husband assassinated, and had kept Chand Begum in harsh custody for decades out of sheer greed, and managed to drive her out of her mind. Jodha is not bothered now about any of that, for after all Chand Begum was not Mainavati. Or maybe she would have been as full of forgiveness even if it had been Mainavati!

3) Mahaam condescended to lift the baddua ( which seems to be like a purchase in a US department store, returnable at will ) not because she had changed her mind, but as a quid pro quo for Jodha having given her the great happiness of getting her Jalal to see her at long last. Now that too was interesting, and in character. I liked the fact that Mahaam kept her end up till the last.

It is another matter that the baddua, like a shraap in the Hindu tradition, apparently cannot be taken back, at least as per Shaguni Bai, and so Hasan and Hussein will have only very short lives, and Ruqaiya's hard own gains will be as dust and ashes.

4) Jalal wept enough to flood Agra, again as I had known he would. As for the rest of the grieving multitude, they seemed to be operating on the principle that all is forgiven to one who is dying.

The triad of principals - Jalal, who looked throughout like an undertaker's assistant (who is duty bound to look even more mournful than his boss the undertaker😉 ) and wept like a tap in full flow, a wailing Mahaam who pulled out all the stops and drowned Jalal in an ocean of treacle (it was noteworthy that she had now completely stopped coughing, and was able to deliver all those long lines without being short of breath! ) , and Jodha, properly tearful and secretly rejoicing that her "reverse psychology" had worked at last - all hammed away to glory.

The final lesson to be drawn from this display of unbridled emotionalism was that one need not spend one's whole life being loyal to the emperor, ending up by saving him even with your dying breath, as Atgah Khan did, to merit such a grief-filled farewell. Mahaam, by trumping Atgah effortlessly in this regard despite her endless crimes, proved that it is possible to fool at least some people all the time. Especially those like Jalal who, as I wrote yesterday, seems to be an emotional haemophiliac, bleeding all the time for the assurance that he was truly loved.

I don't know about you folks, but I was hard put to save myself from being drowned as well in this sea of facile sentimentality. Oof...!

Shyamala Aunty

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mishtidoi

@mishtidoi

Dazzler

Posted: 11 years ago

#89

Divya...gr8 insight into MA's character...a character,which left questions, debates till the end and even after it...that's called a personality.

As many here, I waited, and waited and waited to hear a SORRY from MA, to her Jalal...a general Sorry to have hurt him.

I was DISAPPOINTED in not getting her sorry...so much so, that I don't know, what to say...she left me BLANK, then.

She died in consistent with her character. Bowing to Jodha was not out of character...it was a barter, she was repaying a deal to her, as MA herself said.."Maham Anga bhi kisi ka ehsan nahi rakhti", after saying this, did she salute Jodha. It was a deal and ...and as Jalal had told Ruqaiya, "koi bhi samjhauta ek tarafa nahi hota hai". Jodha fulfilled her challenge, she re-payed her by accepting Jodha's influence and taking back her curse, which Jodha had asked for, not once but twice.

Did you see, how Jodha upped her chin with pride when MA saluted her, accepted that only she is meritorious enough to be MUZ of Mughal Sultanate and blessed her that she will be MUZ?

And why not, will Jodha be proud of her self? She won a challenge and she won her prize. Did you watch how MS was puffed chest, smiling at that time?

Curse from MA, did matter to both Jodha and Jalal...and NO, not for BELIEVING it...but the HURT...any normal parent would be hurt to hear bad about their child, from someone close to them, in the family...bahar wale ka toh muh tod dengein...but if a person is an elder of family, one would either cut one from that person, as Jalal did, or want to build the image of the child or do good to earn blessings from that same person for the child, as Jodha did. This doesn't take away any of the services Jodha did for MA, but she did express her hurt to MA and asked to take her words back. She will be a robot to not get hurt for MA's curses. Jodha, sighed in relief and smiled through her, tears, when MA took her curses back...as all present there did, except, I think Jalal, he didn't want to go there, coz he shook his head in sadness and refusal to go back to that topic, when MA started it, he was not ready to hear anymore about it; but MA never the less completed her sentence. This shows how much Jalal was hurt, that even when MA was dying, he didn't want to discuss about it, and wanted to skip that sore point.

MA died unrepentant, she died truly believing in what all she did was right, right as a mother of Adham Khan, as she'd earlier told Jodha, so there could never have come a sorry from her. She did reminisce about her deeds and she concluded that she didn't do justice with AK and neglected him due to Jalal and she was sorry for this to Adham Khan, many a times she'd said to an imaginative AK in her cell, "humein muaf kar dijiye Adham"and NO, she didn't think killing, murdering, plotting to fulfill some wishes of her own blood or save the skin of her son Adham was a sin...it was a need of the situation then and she acted upon it, it was politics for her; that she failed in her moves is a different matter altogether...she was defeated by the best, she was given sheh-maat from none other but the King himself, and is a no mean feat to achieve.

MA was unrepentant of not only all the deeds unknown to Jalal and Mughal family, but also for the curses she gave, even for that she didn't say, I shouldn't have said those words...NO, she BELIEVED her curses would come true, if she didn't took it back and blessed in return with conviction. This was the kind of immense faith and pride she had in herself, till her end. Why not? A mere servant and a lady at that, who turned simple joys and jobs of life in to opportunities to climb success ladder and go on to become vazir-e aliya of Mughal Sultanate, who would have thought that, apart from her own self. She truly believed in, "fortune favours the brave" idiom and lived every word of it.

Right or wrong can be a bone of contention, it is WE who believed MA sinned, it wasn't her perspective, so how could we expected her to act according to our perception?

In politics, as in chess, MA won battles ,till she played from both sides, herself and Jalal, but when gradually Jalal learned and rose capable enough to manoeuvre the game by himself, did she started to loose ground and finally the war...she lost not because she became weak, but because her opponent was best not only in himself but had also learned from the best, BK and MA.

In each and every FBs of little Jalal and MA, we see her reminding little Jalal about being the future Shehahshaah of Hindustan, she did her job meticulously, neither she forgot her aim and ambition nor she let Jalal forget it ever. She truly and conditionally loved an heir apparent child, a Shehanshaah to be, and she'd no qualms what so ever in admitting it. She also knew Jalal loved her unconditionally and as a mother and not as a wet nurse. Thus, MA called for the child, the bachcha Jalal, who was sulking in a corner, hurt; to cajole him and manaofy him before going away...and as soon as that bachcha came to her, she exclaimed, "yeh humara bachcha hai", and chided Jalal as to why he stopped talking to her, "aisa bhi koi karta hai bhala, haan". She believed she did nothing wrong intentionally to hurt him, it was only her miscalculations that backfired, and so, there was no need for any questions and explanations there.

Satisfied that her grumpy bachcha is now talking to her, did she slept in peace, relishing she still had that old charm on her child; she died happily with this thought perception.

Divi, the cracks of Maham's hold on Jalal appeared way before she heard Jodha's name...Jalal didn't discuss or tell her, what he saw in Amer, when she'd come to visit his stopping on Amer's limits, he didn't disclose to her what lay in Amer when he was elated at the news of Shareef-ud-din winning Amer...then something did hit her, "aisa kya hai Amer mein, jo Jalal humein nahi bata rahein hain?"

Jalal's whole world was Maham, as for any other child, his mother is.

Maham was the closest Jalal ever witnessed in terms of emotions...TILL, yes, till Jodha made him feel like no other.

Jalal knew deep, deep inside he was lonely, but always shrugged off the feeling every time he got affection and care from MA...TILL, yes, till Jodha stirred that loneliness sort of something deep inside him.

Jalal always thought he was happy with what MA showered him with, TILL, yes, till Jodha made him feel ecstatic and frenzy.

Jalal always felt a glow on his face when he saw his mother MA, TILL, yes, till Jodha made him experience a twinkle in his eyes along with the glow on his face.

Jalal always thought love was a mother only like MA, TILL, yes, till Jodha loved Rahim.

Jalal always thought MA was right, he was a Hathiyaar in himself, TILL, yes, till Jodha made him feel, he was that and much more.

Jalal always thought MA was right, "Jalal ke paas dil nahi hai", TILL, yes, till Jodha told him, "aap jhoot boltein hain Shehashaah, ki aapke paas hriday nahi hai"

Jalal always had a smirk with pride, which his MA gave him, TILL, yes, till Jodha gave him a smile with blush and pride.

Jalal always thought, it was MA (and BK) who made him, gave him what he has today, TILL, yes, till Jodha told him, it was he who had in him the quality to be nurtured and grow; he deserved and earned hard way what he has got today.

Jalal always thought, no one could love him unconditionally, selflessly like his mother MA and make him feel safe, satisfied, TILL, yes, till Jodha loved him and drunk poison,never to return, cocooned him and he experienced peace of his soul in her arms like never before.

Jalal thought he could sleep like a child uncaring of worldly responsibilities only hearing his mother MA's lori and in her lap, TILL, yes, till Jodha cradled that innocent child to sleep in her lap singing a serene lori.

Jalal thought, that a mother is MA, TILL, yes, till his wife Jodha became a mother for the child Jalal in him (Godeshu mata) and his children.

Life did come a full circle.

Maham started her journey with Jalal soaking in the happiness that he loved her unconditionally, come what may and she died satisfied with this emotion, experiencing it in her death bed, when her bachcha cradled her with his unwavering, unconditional love.

Jalal started his journey with MA, loving her and believing in her love, and he ended his journey with her loving her back and believing in his belief, one more time.

Both started their journey with the words "Badi Ammi" and, the same words repeated at their destination.

A chapter completed in the life of Jalal-ud-din Mohammed...Akbar is now on his own; but he is not alone, he is not lonely.

@Lori scene: i cracked up... I cracked up every time I saw that scene and screamed a NO, when MA offered her wish to hear Jalal sing...BUT no voice, no other voice could've filled the scene with the depth of warmth, love, care and sorrow all at the same time as Rajat's voice did. The cracking of his voice showed his inner breaking, which he was trying to cover up as a Shehanshaah.

I'm looking forward to his lori for his twins😊

I hope you're not yawning😆

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adiana12

@adiana12

Rocker

Posted: 11 years ago

#90

Mishti, the curse matters only to Jodha becoz she actually believes it - it is said that the person who keeps uttering that something does not matter and they dont believe as Jodha has been, it actually means that this does matter to then - and it matters becoz she does believe in curses and becoz she is going to give the waris, sorry but that is the way I see this - it matters to Jalal becoz it shattered his belief in MA as the mother who would not harm the "SON" come what may and not becoz he believes in curses.