Jodha Akbar 105 & 106: Sound and Fury - Page 8

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sashashyam thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#71
My dear,

As usual, you are lucid, balanced and coherent. But as for your fond hopes for Jalal's future behaviour, they are sure to be dashed. Just as Jodha will be back to her self-righteous, obstinate, blinkered and stupid self, so will Jalal continue to moon after her, hang around places she might visit so as to meet her apparently by accident, and otherwise make a cake of himself.

This said, if you have the time and the patience, do take a look at a long response I had posted on Vicki's latest thread, at

https://www.indiaforums.com/forum/post/95951066

It touches principally on the lack of balance that you have highlighted, and you might like it. In fact, I am thinking of posting it here for anyone interested to read.

As for the @bold below, that is exactly what I had discussed, at considerable length, in my opening post here, in the section on 'rational faith'.But Jodha has neither faith - blind or rational - or sense.

As for the political ramifications of this imbroglio that you have, correctly, highlighted, neither the CVs nor the bulk of the forum has any use for such complications.

Shyamala

Originally posted by: loveanime

You are right about jodha being petty minded when it comes to jalal. I couldn't laugh at the irony of her describing the scales of marriage being balanced, has she in her mind made any attempt to keep that balance of trust going. I feel it was on jodha more than jalal to start thinking logically. He has more reason to believe that she is cheating than she does to believe he is lying. The ball was on jodha court but she swung the pitch back to jalal. I don't mind one bit seeing jalal in action and how sensible he went to salima begum not even maham Anga. That shows so much about his character when he turns to her for unbiased advice. Only if jodha had half as much sense she would have solved this puzzle days ago instead we are back to ghrina.


Of for god sakes once this is all over I want jalal to stay away from jodha and her drama. I liked the touch today in court about jalal attention I am glad atleast they keep showing that no matter how troubled he is his ears are on his duties and he took it as an offence that anyone would think otherwise. How all this would have turned out if jodha didnt act like a tantrum throwing kid while running out in the cold. This shows every action has a reaction.

Her action have so far in the story has only had negative reactions. She triggered this snow ball effect and obviously she is going to pay a heavy price but it is not her only, the whole kingdom and also jalal as well for the turmoil he was put thru. Personal pain is one thing there will be lingering effects of humiliation on his throne. If jodha can't be a wife to him that is one matter but if her acts cause irreparable damage to his pride as shehenshah, forget epic love story then there is no story at all.

sashashyam thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#72
I do not know how many of you read Vicki's wonderful threads, but on her last mini post, I had argued that Jalal alone should not be asked to apologise for suspecting her of infidelity. She and another young lady wrote back so sweetly and thoughtfully to smooth what they took to be my seriously ruffled feelings that I was really touched.

I wrote back to explain where I was coming from re: both Jodha and Jalal, and why I was very disappointed with her, and to a lesser extent with him as well. I am reproducing my response below for those of you who might find it of some interest as reflecting their own feelings about the show.

Shyamala

***********************************
MY RESPONSE ON VICKI'S LATEST THREAD

https://www.indiaforums.com/forum/post/95951066

Posted: 15 November 2013 at 1:46am | IP Logged
Well, my dear young ladies, it is my turn to say sorry for not getting the point that the whole thread was a joke. Please put it down to my aging neurons not being at their best at 1 am😉. And there was not the least need for any of you to apologise for your (humorous) stand either. I am, however, flattered and touched that you felt it necessary to soothe my ruffled feelings so sweetly!

This said, I do begin to feel that there is too much knee-jerk feminine solidarity with Jodha in much of this forum.Now I would not normally object to that, for all things being equal, I would side with the woman, but the problem here is that all things are not equal.

I wanted a Jodha who would be feisty and intelligent and coolly self-possessed, capable of holding her own against an emperor without being petty or smart alecky or plain rude. One who could face any calamity with fortitude and resourcefulness, instead of weeping like a tap in full flow and lamenting her fate to Moti. I would have cheered myself hoarse for that Jodha as she brought a turbulent, haughty and arrogant Jalal to heel in slow stages.

In her place, for example, I would have pre-empted the latest blow up with Hamida by going to Ammijaan and telling her the whole of my side of the story. Having by now at least some idea of my husband's integrity and his loyalty to his word as given, I would have at least considered the possibility that both of us might have been deceived. Jalal does that, which is why he consults Salima; why can Jodha not be shown to have the same good sense?

Instead, she goes to Jalal and lectures him on trust. But how much trust can she demand from him when she gives him none at all, and is ready to believe the worst of him at the first opportunity? That line about vaasna ki poorti ke liye anek saadhan the was very ugly coming from her. Very few normal husbands would have let her hold out indefinitely as Jalal does, and wait for her pleasure. She does not seem to understand or appreciate that at all.

So what we have had here so far is very different from the Jodha I was looking forward to. To my mind we are getting stuck with a typical Ekta female lead, who is always right no matter what she does and how she behaves. Jodha to me now looks much like Archana and Purvi of PR, obsessed with their maternal parivaars and pushing the men unfortunate enough to have fallen for them relentlessly on the backfoot till they have been reduced to doormats. And this while having the height of the pedestal on which they are perched being steadily raised by the admiring multitudes.

Hamida's outburst of today is an aberration that will be soon reversed, and the cheerleading will be restored in no time, thus ensuring that Jodha learns nothing from this, or from the next disaster which is surely round the corner, and sees no need to do so either.

But why should she, when she is always lauded to the skies for her real and imaginary acts of commission? Have you ever seen Jodha introspecting over anything that she has said or done, and maybe, just maybe, concluding that she was wrong? The Green Jodha-Yellow Jodha scene was the one exception, and that has never been repeated.

The upshot of all this is that I am, increasingly, unable to relate to this Jodha at all. She is a major disappointment: opinionated, obstinate, blinkered, and weak and and weepy to boot. Where is the strong, intelligent, resourceful Diana-cum-Juno that I had wanted?

Coming to Jalal, he is getting to be as much of a let down, but in a different way. I cannot imagine any emperor who would bend so far for any woman as Jalal does, or take so much impertinence and incessant jibes from her while still hanging around her. He is not realistic at all, and I am quite sure the real Jalal was nothing like this.

This Jalal is becoming weaker and more distracted, and more obsessed with Jodha, by the day, whereas she has hardly moved (except for those archaeologists of the serial world who can see her hidden love even in her resurrected ghrina😉).

Jalal seems to be steadily losing all that set him apart from the standard issue male lead in a soap - his imperiousness, his dominance, his self assurance, his ability to conquer his weaknesses, including her, his ability to cut thru the thickets and get to the core of an issue by himself and then move to sort it out logically and forcefully.

Now, instead of proving straightaway that Jodha is not expecting at all, he is going to acknowledge the virtual child as his to salvage her reputation (which will still be as muddied as before, for no one will believe him). In return, he is getting the earful shown in the precap. And the forum comments that his head is bowed because he is in the wrong!

Even after it is all made clear, Jodha will not apologise for having accused Jalal of marital rape, whereas he will apologise profusely for having doubted her character. This done, she will continue to swan around with Moti as before and he will be hanging around trying to meet her as if by chance.

No way is he going to back off and leave her to herself, which is what he should do even if he wants desperately to have her care for him, for if at all that is to happen, she has to miss him and miss him a lot. How can she miss him and learn to value him when he is eternally available and is making a cake of himself for her daily? She will only get more puffed up in her already huge self esteem, and have only amused contempt for him. Women do not admire men who are too compliant; they look up only to a man who is a man, not a poodle.

By now, I can almost see where this is headed. There is not going to be any epic love story, except in the ghostly exchanges between the roohs of Jodha and Jalal, which I am sure meet at her maqbara 1 km away from Akbar's at Sikandra, so as to satisfy her ego.😉

See, if they are shown as really falling in love with each other, that will mean the serial will have to be wound up soon thereafter. So that will not happen till near the end, and in the meantime, this sort of periodic upheaval will be repeated ad nauseum.

Each time, though Jalal would have done all the running and heavy lifting, Jodha will be shown as the moral winner and the mahaan one, though any rational observer would be hard put to identify anything that she has done for him.

Jalal will be given no credit for anything he does, and even if the Jodha ne use banaya haiwaan se insaan theme is toned down, it will be always there in the background.

Not an inviting prospect!

I have started watching a new show based on a Saratchandra novel, Tumhari Pakhi,with a rather interesting hero who is obsessed with his public image, and who is played by Iqbal Khan. I have not seen any of his work before, for I watch very few serials and none to the end so far, but he is not bad at all. I have no intention of commenting on that, but it is a pleasant watch, being set in the most photogenic parts of Rajasthan. As I said, I am beginning to lose interest in Jodha Akbar, at least in commenting on it. At least in Tumhari Pakhi, the heroine seems like a real person.

I apologise for inflicting this Ramayana on you unsuspecting young people, but I wanted to show you where I was coming from. I expected a lot from Jodha Akbar, and I am getting less and less these days. It is a major let down, for at least with the likes of PR, I did not expect anything at all.

Once again, thank you for being so indulgent towards me!

Affectionately,

Shyamala Di/Aunty

Originally posted by asuknowme


Shyamala aunty, I have always been a fan of ur writing and ur unbiased opinion about the characters ... Further to Vicky ... I too apologise if my statement didn't seem right to you ... Nevr meant to hurt anybody's sentiments... As vicky has rightly mentioned ...this whole post had been composed for a humorous coming back of the Ghrina mention ... and ... Yes fault is from both sides ... Jodha and Jallal equally responsible for this misundstding ... and when the time comes even jodha should und jallal s perspective and apologise to him for always having an anti jalllal approach...

Ultimately this whole episode wouldn't have occurred had Hyperwati given proper Birds and Bees education to her Daughter and anatomical changes felt... and a self assessment of being violated or not ...


Originally posted by MoronsKiMallika



Arre? Aap aisse gussa kyun ho rahhe ho, Dee? 😲😕...You know that its not about taking sides on JJ because just day before yesterday , i have justified the POVs of both JJ that they are understood where they are coming from. Understanding Jodha does not mean I negate Jalaal - for me both of them are the same - flawed but good people. I get Jodha's POV as a woman but my defence of Jalaal has been equally firm in connection to her and as an individual.

The quoted text is written for Jalaal because we are talking about him. If the discussion extended to Jodha , then, of course, she should apologize - and in this thread itself , i have mentioned that how Jodha may not even apologize in her hurt pride. I don't see Jalaal groveling at Jodha's feet and he shouldn't. In fact, this whole thread is a big joke and there was no serious discussion happening.

From day 1, i have kept JJ on equal scales.And if this one bit of quoted text , dismisses the stance i have put across all along , then i , repeat what i have always maintained - i don't choose JJ over each-other.

And since the composition of your post indicates that you are appalled what i have said, my apologies. That was never my intention.


Originally posted by sashashyam

I am truly amazed at and deeply impressed by this fervid loyalty to Jodha.

Here is a emperor-cum-husband who knows he has not gone anywhere near his wife till now, and she is declared to be an expectant mother.What should he do, order an imperial crib and do her aarti? And prepare to accept what he naturally believes to be another man's child as the heir to his throne? Othello strangled Desdemona, whom he loved and who loved him, totally unlike Jodha Begum, on a similar suspicion and on far less"evidence".

So now Jalal is expected to grovel at her feet for having voiced a perfectly justifiable suspicion, but of course Jodha does not need to apologise for having accused him equally wrongly, of marital rape. What a beautifully fair and balanced arrangement!👏

Shyamala B.Cowsik

Ariel thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#73
Ok I just read the update and I'm 99.9999999% certain I'm the only one disgusted with this episode.

A shehanshah having to explain to his mom whether or not he had spent the night with his wife . Said mom blaming the son for her stupidity and hasty rash decisions after listening to explanations coming from a lady she doesn't trust or like. Said hasty accusations were all for Trp so that she can apologize to the exalted one and only Jo . Are they serious ? Did they just make HB say she was ashamed to be mother to a great historical figure like Akbar ? I'm sure the writers are not aware anymore of what they are typing into their computers. This is disgusting and This is just another ekta show :

HB : I spew rubbish so that I can apologize to the exalted one.
Jo : I hate you shehanshah . I ghrina you . Rinse repeat .
Jalal: I love you because you hate me and can't see beyond that.
Ruqs: Cvs make up your mind, am I to be the vamp or not ?
Salima : newest entry to jodha cheerleading squad. Pray tell me Salima begum , when you can sing jodhas praises and tell shehenshah and ruqs it would be most wrong to accuse Jo , can you not tell jodha how wrong she is to constantly suspect her own husband ? Wth kind of tunnel vision is this ?

Maybe I'm missing something important because I haven't watched the episode yet but just reading the update was a huge disappointment for me .



Edit : what is this blue vomit pregnancy test ? That was hilarious !!
Edited by Ariel - 11 years ago
Ariel thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#74
What is the point of this stupid pregnancy test ? He knows he didn't touch her , he believes her now and is not suspicious , then isn't obvious the hakim is wrong ? Why prolong it with another test ? What is there to test when she is not pregnant ?

Could he not explain it to everyone in that room that nothing happened , hakim made a mistake and to stop believing in vile rumors because Jo is honest and definitely not pregnant ? I don't get why he even had to come and make grand announcements ? Unless he plans to catch the culprit which I doubt . And how on earth is he going to explain to the sultanate that there is no heir ?

I'm so done with this travesty of a track

Ok will stop ranting now
Autumn_Rose thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#75

Originally posted by: Ariel

Ok I just read the update and I'm 99.9999999% certain I'm the only one disgusted with this episode.

A shehanshah having to explain to his mom whether or not he had spent the night with his wife . Said mom blaming the son for her stupidity and hasty rash decisions after listening to explanations coming from a lady she doesn't trust or like. Said hasty accusations were all for Trp so that she can apologize to the exalted one and only Jo . Are they serious ? Did they just make HB say she was ashamed to be mother to a great historical figure like Akbar ? I'm sure the writers are not aware anymore of what they are typing into their computers. This is disgusting and This is just another ekta show :

HB : I spew rubbish so that I can apologize to the exalted one.
Jo : I hate you shehanshah . I ghrina you . Rinse repeat .
Jalal: I love you because you hate me and can't see beyond that.
Ruqs: Cvs make up your mind, am I to be the vamp or not ?
Salima : newest entry to jodha cheerleading squad. Pray tell me Salima begum , when you can sing jodhas praises and tell shehenshah and ruqs it would be most wrong to accuse Jo , can you not tell jodha how wrong she is to constantly suspect her own husband ? Wth kind of tunnel vision is this ?

Maybe I'm missing something important because I haven't watched the episode yet but just reading the update was a huge disappointment for me .



Edit : what is this blue vomit pregnancy test ? That was hilarious !!


🤣

I think the test it to prove her innocence
Ariel thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#76

Originally posted by: Autumn_Rose



🤣

I think the test it to prove her innocence




But what is there prove when she is not pregnant and the hakim is wrong and there is no bulging belly in a few months anyway ?
sashashyam thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#77
Well,my dear, did I not warn you what it was going to be like? So then it was that way. It is also going to be "like that only" in the future as well. Get your parachute ready; we might have to bail out one of these days!

Shyamala Aunty

Originally posted by: Ariel

Ok I just read the update and I'm 99.9999999% certain I'm the only one disgusted with this episode.

A shehanshah having to explain to his mom whether or not he had spent the night with his wife . Said mom blaming the son for her stupidity and hasty rash decisions after listening to explanations coming from a lady she doesn't trust or like. Said hasty accusations were all for Trp so that she can apologize to the exalted one and only Jo . Are they serious ? Did they just make HB say she was ashamed to be mother to a great historical figure like Akbar ? I'm sure the writers are not aware anymore of what they are typing into their computers. This is disgusting and This is just another ekta show :

HB : I spew rubbish so that I can apologize to the exalted one.
Jo : I hate you shehanshah . I ghrina you . Rinse repeat .
Jalal: I love you because you hate me and can't see beyond that.
Ruqs: Cvs make up your mind, am I to be the vamp or not ?
Salima : newest entry to jodha cheerleading squad. Pray tell me Salima begum , when you can sing jodhas praises and tell shehenshah and ruqs it would be most wrong to accuse Jo , can you not tell jodha how wrong she is to constantly suspect her own husband ? Wth kind of tunnel vision is this ?

Maybe I'm missing something important because I haven't watched the episode yet but just reading the update was a huge disappointment for me .

Edit : what is this blue vomit pregnancy test ? That was hilarious !!

Edited by sashashyam - 11 years ago
smile.sara thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#78

Originally posted by: sashashyam

Well,my dear, did I not warn you what it was going to be like? So then it was that way. It is also going to be "like that only" in the future as well. Get your parachute ready; we might as well bail out one of these days!

Shyamala Aunty

I m also disgusting it...
but normally I remain in Rajat AT... aunty always gives voice to my thinking...but she is far better in it... people here also respect her ...so bear truth from her..I don't have this privilege here... but all her views are mine...that is for sure...
this forum is very depressing these days..
nor in my mature age I enjoyed ...masti for these idiotic epis...
sashashyam thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#79
@blue, my dear girl, is far too practical and sensible for the CVs. Look up what I wrote in my long response to Vicki and her friends, which I had posted above on this thread as well.

You know, it is a sort ot TV soap convention for the noble, self-sacrificing heroine to make herself out to be a villainess at some point in the story, so as to save the reputation or marriage of someone else, ideally her husband's sister. It would not be such a great tyaag if it was her sister, you see! Plus it never occurs to her to tell the truth and take the straight way out of the mess, for she HAS to make tyaags periodically.

So for a bunch of episodes, the heroine is vilified by all the rest, till one day the truth comes out and she instantly acquires a halo.

This is what is happening here as well. Except that the gender has been changed. It is now the hero who is making himself out to be a villain, strictly temporarily, of course. Soon he will have a halo of his own. The question is whether Jodha will also fall in line and start singing hosannas to him or not.

Either way, it is a sad fate for Jalal, soon to become Akbar. To depend on vomit being blue, ugh.., instead of coming clean like a man, this is hardly the path to greatness.

Shyamala Aunty

Originally posted by: Ariel

What is the point of this stupid pregnancy test ? He knows he didn't touch her , he believes her now and is not suspicious , then isn't obvious the hakim is wrong ? Why prolong it with another test ? What is there to test when she is not pregnant ?

Could he not explain it to everyone in that room that nothing happened , hakim made a mistake and to stop believing in vile rumors because Jo is honest and definitely not pregnant ? I don't get why he even had to come and make grand announcements ? Unless he plans to catch the culprit which I doubt . And how on earth is he going to explain to the sultanate that there is no heir ?

I'm so done with this travesty of a track

Ok will stop ranting now

KDR81 thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#80

Hi Ariel and Shyamala(and all),

@Ariel: No u r not alone...the 1st part where HB does all the betukhi baatein and then Jalaal comes in to rescue Jo from the pit...and in the process makes himself look like a Royal A**H***...this whole sequence was enough to make me feel sick to the core...!!🤢

I guess CVs need to put a bridle on their choice of lines and dialogues as the serial is supposed to be a Mass-entertainer...!!
I simply have problem in digesting the following things specially:
1.How can a Royal Saas like HB come fuming to Jo asking her all sorts of lowly questions, instead of 1st having a word with her own son??😕
2. How on earth can an Emperor like Ja 1st spill out all the details of their BR story to the Hakim in presence of SB and Guards(r the guards deaf and dumb BTW??)

3.Walk in proudly to declare in front of his already upset Mom et al that he indeed have taken full Lutf of Raat Bitanaa and had mistakenly doubted Jo as he had some doubts abt his own potency...??😕😕 And indeed he was the proud Abbajaan of the Virtual Baby ( which is already a co-hated soul, courtesy it's Virtual Ghrina-ing Ammi..)

I simply don't have words to describe the cringing that I felt seeing the portrayal...🤢😕🤢

The other parts of the epi were so so and quite predictable...

Regards,
Kamal

P.S.Instead of this blown-up grossness, why couldn't Ja arrange for a board of Special Lady Hakims to double-check Jo?? Was there a Dearth of Lady Hakims in Sultanate??😕



Originally posted by: Ariel

What is the point of this stupid pregnancy test ? He knows he didn't touch her , he believes her now and is not suspicious , then isn't obvious the hakim is wrong ? Why prolong it with another test ? What is there to test when she is not pregnant ?

Could he not explain it to everyone in that room that nothing happened , hakim made a mistake and to stop believing in vile rumors because Jo is honest and definitely not pregnant ? I don't get why he even had to come and make grand announcements ? Unless he plans to catch the culprit which I doubt . And how on earth is he going to explain to the sultanate that there is no heir ?

I'm so done with this travesty of a track

Ok will stop ranting now

Edited by KDR81 - 11 years ago

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