An Atheist's argument: Read this! - Page 3

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_rajnish_ thumbnail
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Posted: 15 years ago
#21

Originally posted by: S_rocha

When did I say I don't believe in Ram or Krishna. I only said it's inappropriate to look into religious issues through scientific view as both are completely opposite in its reasoning and manipulation.



In hinduism or 'Sanatana-dharma' as its popularly known now-a-days Religion and science are NOT different!
Epics Ramayana and Mahabharata are not mere religious treatises but full of scientific details, The writers Valmiki and Veda-vyas were geographers and astronomers par excellence, for eg., in Ramayana Valmiki describes how our country India got its shape specially the tapered southern India which was dug up by 60,000 sons of king Sagara also it describes that 'Bay of bengal was not a sea from beginning but was a LAND!!
That river GANGA is MAN-MADE and not natural which is why the term'Bhagiratha prayatna' came into context. Ramayana also gives information of 'Vimanas' which was used by Ravana and its description is given in details.
The phospherous trident at Peru is mentioned in Ramayan to great accuracy.
Mahabharata also tells us about the constellation Ursa major -sapta rishi and Arundhati saying that Arundhati who once followed Vashishtha began to lead him meaning the Arundhati star lead vashishtha -an astronomal phenomena
The drying up of river saraswati is also mentioned.
Rishi Vedvyas mentions nine planets and has composed stotras for them also known were the planets uranus neptune and pluto under the name of 'shwet' shyam and teevra'.
The creation of Kauravas was fully scientific.
Our ancient Rishis just did not chant the names of lord but were great scientists...Rishi agastya pioneered the making of electricity and showed anyone can create electricity domestically(refer 'Agastya samhit)
Rishi Bharadwaj the father of Dronacharya was a pioneer in 'hydraulics'
Dronacharya himself was a great scientist-teacher- to teach archery requires immense knowldge of Physics and Mathematics.
The creation of Bows and arrows and different astras require great knowledge of metallurgy.....the list is very long so therefoore once cannot make a choice between Religion and science since they are not different from each other.

Originally posted by: S_rocha



they tried to relate the verses of old sanskrit text with mordern research, some time they successfully explained but at the other time when cross questioned failed because of lack of strong foundation. For example string theory says that there is a fundamental particle negligible in size, are thought to be excitation modes of elementary strings. However, the strings in string theory are floating in space-time. Nonetheless, they have tension. and the same is written in one of our scripture that whole of the universe woven in string. so people went on comparing the theory with scripture.



We are used to thinking of fundamental particles (like electrons) as point-like 0-dimensional objects. A generalization of this is fundamental strings that are 1-dimensional objects. They have no thickness but do have a length, typically 0.000000000000000000000000000000001cm [that's a decimal point followed by 32 zeros and a 1]. This is very small compared to the length scales that we can reasonably measure, so these strings are so small that they practically look like point particles.
Now what some of our ancient scriptures say about the elementary composition of this 'Universe'.
"Sun and the rest of the universe are woven in string. What is that string that is Vayu." (Shatapatha Brahmana (8.7.3.10)
Kathashruti 2.2 says that Vayu has entered the universe and taken the shape of every object in the universe.
Now please don't translate the meaning of 'Vayu' to be 'air' because in Vedic Sanskrit 'Vayu' is some thing different. 'Vayu' is something, which is all pervading. Shatapatha Brahmana gives a definite clue as to the meaning of 'Vayu' when it says that 'What is that string is Vayu'. It further says that whole universe is woven in 'String'. Now haven't you heard some thing similar being discussed by 21st century physicist when they discuss the 'String Theory'.
Some people may laugh and say it is a long shot and those ancient people may just have mentioned something like 'String' by mistake. Well before rejecting what those 'ancient people' said it would be worth for any intelligent person to read some of these ancient scriptures after learning Vedic Sanskrit. Then you can come to your own conclusions.

Originally posted by: S_rocha



But as far as Quantum physics is concerned the scripture has completely failed to prove even a part of it. This is one of thing questioned while relating science with scriptures that why hindu scripture is unable to describe quantum world.


Are you sure, have you read all the scriptures😉. Do you know about Austrian physicist Erwin Schrodinger, who was arguably one of the two greatest scientists of the 20th century. If Albert Einstein is celebrated for his creation of the theory of relativity, Erwin Schrodinger is equally famous for his creation of quantum mechanics, the deepest theory at the basis of outer reality. Quantum mechanics went so far beyond the already radical framework of relativity that Einstein refused to accept it to his last day.

It is a fact that the great European scientists have searched for truth by first abandoning the narrow theologies of the religion into which they were born. But for Schrodinger Indic ideas provided the very foundation for his uncompromising search for meaning.

It is not generally known that before he created quantum mechanics he expressed his intention to give form to central ideas of Vedanta which, therefore, has had a role in the birth of quantum mechanics. In 1925, before his revolutionary theory was complete, Erwin Schrodinger wrote:

    This life of yours which you are living is not merely a piece of this entire existence, but in a certain sense the "whole"; only this whole is not so constituted that it can be surveyed in one single glance. This, as we know, is what the Brahmins express in that sacred, mystic formula which is yet really so simple and so clear: tat tvam asi, this is you. Or, again, in such words as "I am in the east and the west, I am above and below, I am this entire world."
Schrodinger's influential What is Life? (1944) also used Vedic ideas. The book became instantly famous although it was criticized by some for its emphasis on Indian ideas. Francis Crick, the co-discoverer of the DNA code, credited this book for key insights that led him to his revolutionary discovery. According to his biographer Walter Moore, there is a clear continuity between Schrodinger's understanding of Vedanta and his research:
    The unity and continuity of Vedanta are reflected in the unity and continuity of wave mechanics. In 1925, the world view of physics was a model of a great machine composed of separable interacting material particles. During the next few years, Schrodinger and Heisenberg and their followers created a universe based on superimposed inseparable waves of probability amplitudes. This new view would be entirely consistent with the Vedantic concept of All in One.
Schrodinger was born on August 12, 1887, so we celebrate the 113th anniversary of his birth. He became a Vedantist, a Hindu, as a result of his studies in his search for truth. Schrodinger kept a copy of the Hindu scriptures at his bedside. He read books on Vedas, yoga, and Sankhya philosophy and he reworked them into his own words, and ultimately came to believe them. The Upanishads and the Bhagavadgita were his favourite scriptures.

According to his biographer Moore, "His system -- or that of the Upanishads -- is delightful and consistent: the self and the world are one and they are all. He rejected traditional western religious beliefs (Jewish, Christian, and Islamic) not on the basis of any reasoned argument, nor even with an expression of emotional antipathy, for he loved to use religious expressions and metaphors, but simply by saying that they are naive."

Schrodinger was a professor at several universities in Europe. He was awarded the Nobel Prize in 1933. During the Hitler era he was dismissed from his position for his opposition to the Nazi ideas and he fled to England. For some years he was in Ireland, but after the conclusion of the World War II he returned to Vienna where he died in 1961.

Quantum mechanics goes beyond ordinary logic. According to it reality is a superposition of all possibilities which restates Vedic ideas. It is quantum mechanics which explains the mysteries of chemical reactions and of life. In recent years, it has been suggested that the secrets of consciousness have a quantum basis.

In a famous essay on determinism and free will, he expressed very clearly the sense that consciousness is a unity, arguing that this "insight is not new... From the early great Upanishads the recognition Atman = Brahman (the personal self equals the omnipresent, all-comprehending eternal self) was in Indian thought considered, far from being blasphemous, to represent the quintessence of deepest insight into the happenings of the world. The striving of all the scholars of Vedanta was, after having learnt to pronounce with their lips, really to assimilate in their minds this grandest of all thoughts."

He considered the idea of pluralization of consciousness and the notion of many souls to be naive. He considered the notion of plurality to be a result of deception (maya): "the same illusion is produced by a gallery of mirrors, and in the same way Gaurisankar and Mt. Everest turned out to be the same peak seen from different valleys."

Schrodinger's ideas continue to be fundamental in a variety of new fields. The wonders of modern science, such as electronics, biology, chemistry, wouldn't have been possible without the insights of quantum theory. The possibilities inherent in quantum theory have not all been realized. Schrodinger remains one of the most discussed figures in modern scientific thought. His ideas will continue to inspire science.

Schrodinger was a very complex person. But he had a sense of humor and paradox. He called his dog Atman. Perhaps he did this to honour Yudhishthira whose own dog, an incarnation of cosmic justice (Dharma), accompanied him on his last march to the Himalayas. More likely, he was calling attention to the unity that pervades the web of life.

It is frustrating to note that the Indian educational system will not let students know of the centrality of Vedantic thought in the works of scientists like Schrodinger or our own Jagadish Chandra Bose. Is it possible that at some future time Indians will have to travel to the West to know about their own heritage?😕



Edited by Rajnish_Kumar - 15 years ago
set_raj thumbnail
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Posted: 15 years ago
#22
Hello firends...there's request ..since this is JSK forum and all the articles related to ShriKrishna posted are welcome and also present JSK serial...in future please refrain from posting other than Krishna's articles...this is not a Einsten Serial..and it has no relation with JSK...
sitakshii thumbnail
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Posted: 15 years ago
#23
ok raj !!! we will keep that in our minds next time !!!
& rajnish what a detailed explanation u hv given ,mindblowing !!
sattvik thumbnail
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Posted: 15 years ago
#24
Still have to read most of the posts above but Sita11, I have no idea of the past, but I have my own opinions so there is no need for you to say all that, if you have a problem with me or anyone, use PMs not posts. I also said I agree with most things, not all. Its not nice to read this or for anyone to read stuff like this!

But thanks for all that Rajnish.
_rajnish_ thumbnail
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Posted: 15 years ago
#25

Originally posted by: sita11

ok raj !!! we will keep that in our minds next time !!!

& rajnish what a detailed explanation u hv given ,mindblowing !!


Thanks sita di, waiting for that member to reply my post if he still have source left to contradict what i posted😛
_rajnish_ thumbnail
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Posted: 15 years ago
#26

Originally posted by: sattvik

Still have to read most of the posts above but Sita11, I have no idea of the past, but I have my own opinions so there is no need for you to say all that, if you have a problem with me or anyone, use PMs not posts. I also said I agree with most things, not all. Its not nice to read this or for anyone to read stuff like this!

But thanks for all that Rajnish.


No sattvik you probably misunderstood sita11, she is telling about the member S_rocha that why he has not been supported by anyone here before😊
sitakshii thumbnail
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Posted: 15 years ago
#27

thanks rajnish !!!

but i think if tht member is gonna reply again to ur post then again a debate wud start !!! u can understand what i mean !!!
Edited by sita11 - 15 years ago
sattvik thumbnail
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Posted: 15 years ago
#28
Ok, sorry I didn't know.
_rajnish_ thumbnail
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Posted: 15 years ago
#29

Originally posted by: sita11

thanks rajnish !!!

but i think if tht member is gonna reply again to ur post then again a debate wud start !!! u can understand what i mean !!!


Yes i understood sita di, thanks 😊
sattvik thumbnail
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Posted: 15 years ago
#30
Wow Rajnish, I guess I agree more with your Long post, it was really really interesting!

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