Independence what is it afterall - Page 3

Great topic and replies. Here are my two cents.

I think having mental autonomy is a prerequisite for independence. This means having the ability to formulate your own thoughts & taking your own decisions without being swayed by what other people think or say. You can also call this emotional independence. One can be financially independent & have a prestigious career, but still be dependent in the sense that they rely on other people for their opinions and life decisions. Or change their opinions/actions on a whim based on what how other people react, i.e. Malini.😆

I am not sure what this debate is about, but to me it is clear that Imlie is a solar kind of person. Like the sun, she manages to rise stronger & brighter after every dark night/adversity in her life. I mean, at an age of 18 she was forced at gunpoint into a marriage, endured constant denigration from her husband who let her introduce herself as a naukraani in her sasuraal and had to put her dreams/career goals on the backburner (for a while) due to the uncertainty she faced. Even after all this, she held her head up high, managed to win over an entire family of strangers and elevated her status from naukraani into a daughter of the house. I was just re-watching some of the initial epis recently and marveled at how effortlessly she managed to bind the family together with her trademark Imlie antics. She gladly shouldered responsibilities she didn't need to...like that badi mandi incident & the fact that she CLIMBED a tree to get shudh honey for Adi's mom.😆 Is a person who is not mentally independent capable of doing things like this? I don't think so. Such a person would surely need assurance and validation from others ki haan go on, you are doing the right thing. But Imlie did all these things without any expectation for assurance or validation. This is just one incident, but there were many in which she took charge & handled the situation, achieving the right final outcome for everyone involved.

To me, there can be no greater demonstration of independence than this. Even in the show's current track, she has taken a firm decision to step back from claiming the right to being Adi's wife, when she justifiably could do so. She loves him, he loves her, she could have easily asked him to forsake all his relationships in Delhi and live with her as her husband. And he would have happily done it.🤣 But she didn't do it, which is a testament to her mental autonomy and resolve. Even if this entails her forsaking her own rights, she cannot see herself laying the foundations of her own relationship on the ashes of another relationship. As you already mentioned, she fiercely stood by her decision and did not succumb to Adi's pleading/emotional blackmail, even forsaking her own feelings for Adi. That's really what independence is all about, rather than token displays of ego-fuelled bhaashanbaazi saying ke "look at me, clap for me... I'm so empowered/independent!" I think that kind of 'empowerment' is really dis-empowering in the sense that it makes a person heavily dependent on social validation to feel empowered. Isn't it kind of ironic that you can accuse society of disempowering you but in the same breath seek validation from it to feel empowered/independent?😆 It's really one big ego-battle like you said.

So to summarise, independence to me begins and ends with mental autonomy. You can have financial independence and a prestigious career, but if you can't think for yourself and take firm decisions and stick by them, and depend on others for your decisions & thoughts, you will always be a prisoner of others/society. And if you are that kind of person, you will always be dependent, doesn't matter how many speeches you give on women empowerment.😆

Originally posted by: naadanmasakalli

Agreed ! Just because she is living at somebody's home under the guise of being a nukrani( which she isn't btw) doesn't make her dependent.. but somehow that is the only part that is visible to specific audience and everything else is unseen.. this is the girl who has taught big life lessons to supposed mature independent women in the very same household and why are they being toutues independent oh yeah caz they work outside of home.. and she does at home .. 😆

Aise toh dekha jaaye toh her koi kisi na kisi ka naukar hi hota hai even in outside world the jobs you do you are working for your employers makes you naukar hi in the wider use of term..

It is ridiculous to judge someone based on what they wear how they look and base how dependent or independent they are on that. Basically it mirrors AC ki soch exactly how she looks at imlie and cannot see beyond her pehnawa or her Background. Despite imlie time and again showing her wisdom and AC liking and appreciating it at times too still is too consumed by the idea of outer appearance and hence she unseen it caz imlie ke kapde simple hai she doesn't do makeup hairstyles. Lol shallow meters and bars to judge kisi ke soch and kisi ki sachaai

I would also like to mention here that I forgot earlier in reference to nim's post isn't it amusing to you guys the very same AC who herself never separated or divorces is so casually mentioning it for her daughter.. that kinda undoes my stigma theory too ke khud ko nahi lagne dena but Beti ke liye it is fine rofl

Reserved Will reply later 😊

sorry girls got busy in episode thread:)😆 will come to it later:))

Originally posted by: Apudip

Thank you for raising the issue right here right noe.I was frustrated with random topics about Adilie and guesses that aren't suited to their personalities. I come here to AY post and ho out silently .Imlie is way more independent and strong willed than Aditya .Malini is the weakest of all of them.Talking about Imlie:s external appearance , I find it suitable and real. I don't want their characters to be butchered for petty romance.

lol if only you knew how much i try to curb the nonsense and block it out all day long..

@bold What a shame that will be🤔 *sigh* temporary excitement ke liye poora kachra ho jaaye .. that will be too sad given how amazingly well crafted the characters are i hope the makers stick to their guns and Stick to what they have faith in as they have now for almost 120episodes.. come on ek baar apne guts se jud ke delho kaamyaabi tumhari hogi like it is so far:)) Touchwood..

thanks for replying and you are welcome to participate more often:))

Originally posted by: -RD-

My first post in this forum ...the topic and subject in hand is too tempting to not post...hey :)) my pleasure to have you make the post in my thread:)) enjoy

I pretty much agree with the topic maker as to me independence and empowerment is abt a woman or man being able to make their choice as they feel and i think Imlie has done well there ...she may have not had the independence to not have that forced marriage or to not have come to delhi with Adi initially bec of the circumstances but post that making her place in adityas family was all her own doing ...she stayed with tripathis on her own terms as a person and formed relationships as per her choice ...the whole being servant was circumstantial ( empowerment and independence do fall prey to circumstances unless u r a rebel which imlie isnt ) And to say she is dependent on Tripathis i d say they are more dependent on her inc Adi now ...she has always managed to create that independent atmosphere around her to have her say speak her mind even to Adi when he wasnt too friendly with her and she is even making her own choices when it comes to Adi n their relationship ...she has somewhere always managed to have her way with him after a pt ...its been shown that Adi was dictating her around but i have always felt somewhere she was getting the better of him always.

Independence and Empowerement is also not abt moralistic hi fi lectures or sermons but its more about the power of being able to be yourself anywhere and everywhere and be accepted as u r and Imlie has successfully done that! Couldn't agree more with ya and one can see how she left her mark that with her gone for few days only the tripathis have all dismantled their house has been left under darkness they all are lost not knowing what to do with themselves.. ab dependent kaun hua. she was the one calling the shots for them solving their very personal internal matters in a blink with full haq se. In return they gave her a place of beti and not just naam ki they meant it for the most part.. and even as occasions where she was forgotten as it had happened it happened in the flownot to deliberately make her feel left out caz she is bahaar wali.. she has not only made decisions for the ghar and implied them and changed the gharwlaon ke faisle but her guidance and talks have moulded adi too madehim do unthinkable things too and yes she has gotten her way many times with him.. making him so emotionally dependent on her jiska full display we have seen in last 3 weeks or so.. she came on her own she left on her own and she will be back whenever on ehr own .. sure external catalysts have a part to play but again the choice is simple and hers whether she wants to go all out or no.. for whatever reaons..

Imlie is equally independent and empowered whether she chooses to stay with Adi as servant wife live in partner or whatever or she chooses to dump him n move on because its going to be her choice!This!!!! it is about her choice her will her desires her needs.. her willingless to be with adi or someone in any form or shape.. Not caz we have to extract something out of adi so let's tie her up and force her to be with someone else.. that is what is problamatic to me and Throws me off so much the badle ki aag for what?? for 2 mins ka cheap sjow off and joy lol Spare me plz.. i'd rather have The characters follow the organic path and experience things organically be it nay emotion then doing it for ulterior motives or to put someone down on purpose.. 😃

Originally posted by: nim_var

Another paralle I wanted to draw was between the mothers on the show, namely the T's, Anu and Mithi.

Look at Mithi/Anu and how they have raised their daughters. Born to the same man but the differences in them are so stark, so divisive, right from their thinking, to facing difficulties, to standing up for justice or truth.

Mithi made her own bed and she paid a price for making a choice. She chose to spend the time with Dec, knowing fully well what could happen. Nothing could have prepared her for the heartbreak and betrayal that followed, but she did not let that experience come in the way of a raising a child with values and freedom to choose. She is not very educated but she trusts her child and let her be free within the confines of the village society, gave her a strong foundation as she knows firsthand how cruel the world can be. As she proudly stated to Dev, Imlie is pure, born of her love, she just is a ray of sunshine. she is guileless, unafraid to speak the truth and has more courage in her little frame than anyone I have seen.

The Tripathi women Aparna and Radha have raised good children and are in good marriages, where they have the affection, respect, bonding from their husbands and children. Rupi is separated and they have strived to make her life as comfortable as possible by supporting her, their grandchild, her various courses. At first, Rupi was shown to be negative but their love and understanding, overcame all of Rupi's fears and now she has made peace with her situation. She does not hold any grudge against her family and feels lonely, that is a battle she had to fight, to overcome.

Written about Anu already and nothing more to add for now.

Got to read up on the replies, good topic !

and you know that is the beauty all of the women in this show are Independent in their choices in the way they chose to live their lives.. learned from their experiences.. Made the hard choices then be It Mithi Or Imlie or Rupi the only exceptions are The chaturvedi women who are so emotionally manipulative and Dependent that they can't even fathom to be independent and make those choices.. hilarity of it all them coming form the highest social strata while someone like mithi is from the lowest tier and Tripathis is mid lol . again a Point that social Status can be deceptive.. it really is not a valid meter to judge kisi ka bhi dependency or independence level

Originally posted by: Krantikari

Great topic and replies. Here are my two cents.

I think having mental autonomy is a prerequisite for independence. This means having the ability to formulate your own thoughts & taking your own decisions without being swayed by what other people think or say. You can also call this emotional independence. One can be financially independent & have a prestigious career, but still be dependent in the sense that they rely on other people for their opinions and life decisions. Or change their opinions/actions on a whim based on what how other people react, i.e. Malini.😆

I am not sure what this debate is about, but to me it is clear that Imlie is a solar kind of person. Like the sun, she manages to rise stronger & brighter after every dark night/adversity in her life. I mean, at an age of 18 she was forced at gunpoint into a marriage, endured constant denigration from her husband who let her introduce herself as a naukraani in her sasuraal and had to put her dreams/career goals on the backburner (for a while) due to the uncertainty she faced. Even after all this, she held her head up high, managed to win over an entire family of strangers and elevated her status from naukraani into a daughter of the house. I was just re-watching some of the initial epis recently and marveled at how effortlessly she managed to bind the family together with her trademark Imlie antics. She gladly shouldered responsibilities she didn't need to...like that badi mandi incident & the fact that she CLIMBED a tree to get shudh honey for Adi's mom.😆 Is a person who is not mentally independent capable of doing things like this? I don't think so. Such a person would surely need assurance and validation from others ki haan go on, you are doing the right thing. But Imlie did all these things without any expectation for assurance or validation. This is just one incident, but there were many in which she took charge & handled the situation, achieving the right final outcome for everyone involved.

To me, there can be no greater demonstration of independence than this. Even in the show's current track, she has taken a firm decision to step back from claiming the right to being Adi's wife, when she justifiably could do so. She loves him, he loves her, she could have easily asked him to forsake all his relationships in Delhi and live with her as her husband. And he would have happily done it.🤣 But she didn't do it, which is a testament to her mental autonomy and resolve. Even if this entails her forsaking her own rights, she cannot see herself laying the foundations of her own relationship on the ashes of another relationship. As you already mentioned, she fiercely stood by her decision and did not succumb to Adi's pleading/emotional blackmail, even forsaking her own feelings for Adi. That's really what independence is all about, rather than token displays of ego-fuelled bhaashanbaazi saying ke "look at me, clap for me... I'm so empowered/independent!" I think that kind of 'empowerment' is really dis-empowering in the sense that it makes a person heavily dependent on social validation to feel empowered. Isn't it kind of ironic that you can accuse society of disempowering you but in the same breath seek validation from it to feel empowered/independent?😆 It's really one big ego-battle like you said.

So to summarise, independence to me begins and ends with mental autonomy. You can have financial independence and a prestigious career, but if you can't think for yourself and take firm decisions and stick by them, and depend on others for your decisions & thoughts, you will always be a prisoner of others/society. And if you are that kind of person, you will always be dependent, doesn't matter how many speeches you give on women empowerment.😆

I couldn't have said it any better.. Thank you for the lovely Input KK Ji😃aapki baat 100 takke durust hai.. how is it being empowered if it Needs validation of Zamana and cheekh cheekh ke chilana ke look at me hum EMpowered hain.. hum apne faisle khud kar sakte hain.. just caz she stays silent and doesn't make a scene about her choices and her decisions it doesn't make her any less independent..

Originally posted by: naadanmasakalli

I couldn't have said it any better.. Thank you for the lovely Input KK Ji😃aapki baat 100 takke durust hai.. how is it being empowered if it Needs validation of Zamana and cheekh cheekh ke chilana ke look at me hum EMpowered hain.. hum apne faisle khud kar sakte hain.. just caz she stays silent and doesn't make a scene about her choices and her decisions it doesn't make her any less independent..

Thanks NM ji! :)

Exactly...and like you said (I think) in this thread, even Mithi is like this and Imlie has gone after her mom. I find it strange that characters like Mithi and Imlie are not celebrated more for their display of quiet and fierce independence...

This is the glaring danger in movements that supposedly 'empower' women. Women are told by other women how to empower themselves.😆We need to recognise how disempowering this actually is. Maybe if everything was not viewed through the lens of the ego, people would have greater clarity.😛

Originally posted by: Krantikari

Thanks NM ji! :)

Exactly...and like you said (I think) in this thread, even Mithi is like this and Imlie has gone after her mom. I find it strange that characters like Mithi and Imlie are not celebrated more for their display of quiet and fierce independence...

This is the glaring danger in movements that supposedly 'empower' women. Women are told by other women how to empower themselves.😆We need to recognise how disempowering this actually is. Maybe if everything was not viewed through the lens of the ego, people would have greater clarity.😛

the worst part it is women like AC in reality jinka khud ka koi stand hota nahi hai as such they would stay in toxic relationships but go on Giving advice to dunia to get out *cough* case here being malini.. AC khud kuch nahi ki for 19 yrs of cheating but 2 days of adi leaving "supposedly for work" is pushing her to take drastic steps ahh yeah right self validation is important.. logon se aarti bhi toh utarwani hai😆

My big issue is empowerment being used as a Bait to push poor imlie with any other man.. that leaving adi will make her empowered somehow so she do it asap and marry even a stick a khambha that will be empowering somehow.. and i don't get the logic at all 🤔

Originally posted by: naadanmasakalli

the worst part it is women like AC in reality jinka khud ka koi stand hota nahi hai as such they would stay in toxic relationships but go on Giving advice to dunia to get out *cough* case here being malini.. AC khud kuch nahi ki for 19 yrs of cheating but 2 days of adi leaving "supposedly for work" is pushing her to take drastic steps ahh yeah right self validation is important.. logon se aarti bhi toh utarwani hai😆

My big issue is empowerment being used as a Bait to push poor imlie with any other man.. that leaving adi will make her empowered somehow so she do it asap and marry even a stick a khambha that will be empowering somehow.. and i don't get the logic at all 🤔

I think AC is actually being protective in her own twisted way. Seeing Adi leave Malini like this is reminding her of her own experiences in her marriage and she wants Malini to leave early so that she doesn’t have to experience more heartbreaks later on. AC views the Adi-Malini relationship through the lens of her own with Dev. I think she wants Malini to leave cuz she doesn’t want her to repeat her own mistakes. And she likely thinks it’s good to do this early before there is a child in the equation. I’m not saying ke I agree with her, but this is her reasoning I think.😆

To me that kind of thinking that Imlie leaving Adi is ‘empowering’ is hadh level childish. See this is what I meant when I said there is nothing empowering about being told how to empower yourself. Aren’t these people doing the same thing Adi did by asking Imlie to marry another man?😆 They are insulting her beliefs, her faith. Where is the empowerment in this?