harry potter vs twilight!

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Posted: 14 years ago

#61

Originally posted by: return_to_hades
Personally, I found absolutely nothing wrong or un-classy with an innocuous statement like 'grow up'. Think about it, how many times have people used that term or something similar, including yourself. It does have a negative connotation to it, but it is not always used maliciously. Many people use it innocently without second thought on how it might come off.
I don't think it was something that warranted flying of the handle and getting aggressive. At least not before giving the person the benefit of the doubt to explain what they meant and engage a bit further. Considering that this thread was in the majority against and critical of Twilight, it would be natural for someone who liked the series to get a bit defensive. I know I unwittingly get defensive when people criticize things I like.

It is your opinion that you find the phrase "grow up" innocuous. I don't. For me it's an immature, if not utterly insulting, comment to throw around - it assumes that one is at a level lower than yourself and he requires some growing to do in order to reach yours. It is also your perception that there was nothing wrong or un-classy about it. It's not something that I can subscribe to, I'm afraid. Having said that, now that I've interacted with the member, I can say that I was mistaken - it seems like she was genuinely saying so, rather than being malicious. However the way the comment came off as at the exact moment, I can assure you that a lot of people could have taken it like the way I did. The member herself apologized later for her usage of the phrase, even though she did that unintentionally. I also went on to an excruciating length digging her post with a condescending and sarcastic tone, and I shouldn't have done that either.

I may have also thrown similar comments around in the past. But two wrongs do not make a right. If - and whenever - I did the same, I am certain I also had to face the consequences for my transgression. Moreover, as a regular member, I don't hold the same responsibilities that someone from the Dev. team does.

Originally posted by: return_to_hades
In cases of disagreement or finding things distasteful, there is room to try and work things out before getting angry and upset right away.

Just as the "grow up" thingy came off maliciously and at the wrong note even though it wasn't intended to be that way, my unfairly sarcastic response to hers came off naturally and spontaneously at the heat of the moment.

I know I shouldn't have done that and instead, I should have taken the time to ask her what she meant instead of jumping at her throat impulsively. This isn't a justification, but I had apologized to her for my misunderstanding and rash behaviour.

Originally posted by: return_to_hades
I think debates on fiction are hugely different from debates on real issues. Of course I love fiction and fiction presents relevant issues and topics of discussion that relate to real life. I do find there is great scope in reading, discussing and debating fiction. However, I think fiction is still fiction and is in no way directly comparable to real life. The stakes and importance are definitely higher when real people and situations are involved.

There are both similarities and dissimilarities. On one hand they both are debates - a form of structured arguments. One needs to present arguments, evidences, logic in their favor - and consequently, shatter the basic premise of the opposite side / find inconsistencies with the other side's viewpoint, etc if there is a serious, heated debate going on. Obviously a debate involving real-life/world-scenario requires more factual analysis and evidences than a debate involving literature or art does.

Originally posted by: return_to_hades
Why didn't you explain it this way in the first place. At least the other person understand why you disagree. How is someone to see your viewpoint if you just lash out and attack them without giving an opportunity to share ideas.

I hope you say the same for the other (first) post that caused the disruption here, even if it was done in a harmless, unintentional manner. ; )

I frankly didn't see what it was there to explain when literary debate/comparison is such a common thing and I thought anyone would be acquainted with (it). My mistake, and lesson learned, from next time, I will try to clarify my position and stance in the debate, give a proper introduction, and then start presenting my ideas. And no, I honestly am not being sarcastic when I say so.

Originally posted by: return_to_hades
And ultimately with somethings subjective like literature, music etc some people can make comparisons and other people will find comparisons absurd. It just depends on how we perceive them. For example Souro found Harry Potter comparable to Huck Finn and Tom Sawyer, and found that he preferred Huck Finn and Tom Sawyer. However, we thought it was an unfair comparison because they are two completely different genres and styles. Similarly, we may be able to compare Harry Potter and Twilight, but a third person may find that

There is nothing wrong with finding a comparison absurd. I too find the comparison between Harry Potter and Twilight (among other things) to be absurd to an extent because there are more dissimilarities than similarities, more things to draw contrasts than find parallel from the two series. But then, one can't say that unless they actually compare the works and see things in perspective.

Originally posted by: return_to_hades
I think you missed the point. No one said don't compare, don't discuss, don't contrast. Some people find that the two series being compared are far too different to warrant a fair and reasonable comparison. The issue was never bashing and the comparison was never deemed as bashing, the issue merely was that some people disagree with the comparison. It works both ways, just because someone disagreed with your opinion does not mean that they accused you of bashing.

I wasn't specifically talking about this particular thread when I made my previous post. I have come across members who seem unable to distinguish a harmless comparison and actual malicious bashing.

@ the bolded bit:

Originally posted by: Savage
Well, anyway, the point is that most of us know that there are more pressing matters in the world than 'having a boyfriend' and those who've read Harry Potter, they'd just know that there is hardly anything better on paper they'd ever come across. It is just that, we need to have at least one point of origin to have a go at COMPARISON. And there is nothing common in the two series, I am sorry but Robert Pattinson is not enough a reason to abuse two different genres of books and 'Black' is not enough to demarcate the respective Sirius and Jacob standards the fans have set. You can't compare the way they are written, because one is Fantasy and the other is Supernatural. There we go, explaining how Harry Potter is much better than Twilight. In my opinion, there's no point in comparison because those who look for substance can simply have a go with HP and be overwhelmed for a lifetime and those who are intrinsic ruthless romantics can always have a go with Twilight. The more we compare, the more we give people a chance to thrash our favorites. 😳

(This was certainly a harmless comment, and I hold nothing against Savage for expressing his view(s), even if I disagree with this aspect of his post vehemently.)

Originally posted by: return_to_hades
The fan sections are definitely different, including the television serial ones. Those sections are there solely for people who "like" or "follow" a show. Being familiar with some of them, some of them explicitly don't allow compare and contrasts between two shows/characters etc due to the nature. Criticism is assumed as bashing and every point is misunderstood. I definitely do hope that the same does not happen in DM and I think on the whole DM members are more receptive to differing views.

As per my understanding, they are discussion portals/forums, not fan sections that are devoted specifically for fans to gush about or discuss their favorites without receiving any form of negative criticisms / feedback. Formally speaking, I am a Harry Potter fan, but I am highly disappointed with the way threads have been closed down in that section (Harry Potter forum) in the past even though no serious bashing or personal attack had occurred in there.

Originally posted by: return_to_hades
It is a generalization, but not an extremely unfair or ridiculous one. People make generalizations based on interests. It happens. Just explain why you disagree or why the generalization is incorrect. Most of the time people don't mean any offense. Being upset over small matters detracts from a good discussion and adds nothing.

I didn't take that particular aspect as offensive. I simply asked why is it automatically assumed that the only reason people are into Harry Potter is because they like magic and wands and the only reason people are into Twilight is because they are into vampires and werewolves. To me, both of the notion is incorrect because it negates all the other things the series are about, and the fact that people's liking is not based on one or two specific factors, but many.

All said and done, I will try to end my end here. I will take your advice on "Most of the time people don't mean any offense. Being upset over small matters detracts from a good discussion and adds nothing." seriously and try taking my time understanding a particular post before lashing out in the future. I hope all sides do so too. : )

Edited by Beyond_the_Veil - 14 years ago

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blue-ice.

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Posted: 14 years ago

#62

Any issue if raised again and again looses its effectiveness and becomes a rant...people who care for it will get it the first time ...people who don't care won't get it despite all ur rantings...

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344471

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Posted: 14 years ago

#63

Never mind... 😆

Edited by Beyond_the_Veil - 14 years ago

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Ajnabee

@*Woh Ajnabee*

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Posted: 14 years ago

#64

Sarina and Labib - GROW UP and let it go.

@debate: It doesn't matter what you read. Just go read something.

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Ajnabee

@*Woh Ajnabee*

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Posted: 14 years ago

#65

Originally posted by: Beyond_the_Veil
Never mind... 😆

I like you better when you're LOL-ing.

P.S. I think it's adorable that you and Angel-Jot made up. It's SO obvious that she's not from DM (seeing how she apologized and all 😆).

Edited by *Woh Ajnabee* - 14 years ago

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344471

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Posted: 14 years ago

#66

Originally posted by: blue-ice
Any issue if raised again and again looses its effectiveness and becomes a rant...people who care for it will get it the first time ...people who don't care won't get it despite all ur rantings...

I don't know if you were speaking generally or this was directed at me - and I am assuming this since I did bring up the same old issue again - but if it was, in fact, directed at me then: I simply elaborated on the points that I couldn't do yesterday night due to time constraints. Sarina commented/dissected part of my post, and I responded to it. That was it.

Now if your post wasn't directed at me and I misunderstood you then just ignore this message and think like it was never posted. 😛😆

Edited by Beyond_the_Veil - 14 years ago

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Ajnabee

@*Woh Ajnabee*

Stunner

Posted: 14 years ago

#67

Originally posted by: Beyond_the_Veil

I don't know if you were speaking generally or this was directed at me - since I did bring up the same old issue again - but if it was, in fact, directed at me then: I simply elaborated on the points that I couldn't do yesterday night due to time constraints. Sarina commented/dissected part of my post, and I responded to it. That was that.

Now if your post wasn't directed at me then just ignore this message and think like it was never posted. 😛😆

The fact that you replied to the post is enough evidence to prove the fact that you still did not get the message. At least we know that somethings never change. :P

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344471

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Posted: 14 years ago

#68

^^ Probably. Consequently (am I using this word way too much?), I can't say I got your post either. 😆 Probably I am suffering from a (hopefuly temporary) post-incomprehension disease and should take a break from DM until I get my sanity back. 😆

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Ajnabee

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Posted: 14 years ago

#69

Originally posted by: Beyond_the_Veil
^^ Probably. Consequently (am I using this word way too much?), I can't say I got your post either. 😆 Probably I am suffering from a (hopefuly temporary) post-incomprehension disease and should take a break from DM until I get my sanity back. 😆

Okay, but what kind of break is this going to be? The kind where you ACTUALLY take a break or the kind where you just say you are but you continue silently stalking the forum hoping someone will mention you somewhere and beg you to return, and then you realize no one is doing that you finally just given in and make a post hoping someone will care enough to respond! 😆

And it's okay if you didn't get this post - it wasn't for you to get. And I'm quite sure your incomprehension is only temporary. It'll blow over soon - I'm sure you're just hungover from your intense debate yesterday. 😆

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return_to_hades

@return_to_hades

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Posted: 14 years ago

#70

Some fun stuff from Dear blank, please blank

Dear Buffy,

We have a new assignment for you. His name is Edward.

Sincerely, anonymous.

Dear Twilight fans,

Thank you for making us look sane and well-adjusted.

Sincerely, Trekkies.

Dear Edward Cullen,

Avada Kedavra!

Sincerely, Tom Riddle

Dear J.K. Rowling,

Your books are entirely unrealistic. I mean, a ginger kid with two friends?

Sincerely, anonymous.

Dear Voldemort,

So they screwed up your nose too?

Sincerely, Michael Jackson

Dear Stephenie Meyer,

I'm sorry your fans are so obnoxious. Try using less glitter.

Sincerely, J.K. Rowling

[I think Ke$ha should be in that message somewhere]

Dear Sirius Black,

What's your middle name?

Sincerely, I hope it's Lee

Dear Voldemort,

A couple of lies would take care of that.

Sincerely, Pinocchio

Dear Edward,

This is why you were in Hufflepuff.

Sincerely, The Sorting Hat

Dear God,

Please give us Heath Ledger back, we'll let you have Robert Pattinson.

Sincerely, anonymous.

Dear Stephanie Meyer,

Please note that when the love of Hermione's life left her, she continued to search for the keys to destroying the world's most powerful dark wizard. When the love of Bella's life left her, she curled up in the fetal position, went numb for months then jumped off a cliff.

Sincerely, J. K. Rowling

[Dear Modern Writers,
It is extremely sad and disturbing that teenage girls have found the love of their life. Has it even started yet?
Sincerely, Me]

Dear Edward,

You're doing it wrong.

Sincerely, Dracula

Dear Hogwarts,

Please send me another letter. I'm pretty sure Sarah Palin shot my owl.

Sincerely, It's not my fault I live in Alaska

[This is by far the cutest]

Dear Noah,

It's ok, we caught the train to Hogwarts instead.

Sincerely, Unicorns and Dragons

Dear Cedric Diggory,

Vampires don't sparkle. 20 points from Hufflepuff!

Sincerely, Snape

Dear Dumbledore,

I just got off the phone with Merlin and he is totally down to get the band back together!

Sincerely, Gandalf

Dear William and Kate,

If William is 100% royal and Kate is 0% royal, will that make your son the half-blood prince?

Sincerely, curious.

[This is by far the wittiest]

Dear Bella,

They have sex on True Blood all the time.

Sincerely, Edward's just not that into you

Dear Wizard Community,

It has come to our attention that a Dark Wizard has made a Inferi of Cedric Diggory, now going by the name of Edward Cullen. He is known to be running around with an unregistered Animagus, Jacob Black. If you have any information about their whereabouts, contact the Ministry of Magic.

Sincerely, Minister for Magic

Dear Edward,

Maybe the reason you can't read Bella's mind is because there's nothing in her head.

Sincerely, logic.

Dear Jacob Black,

I noticed you drive a motorcycle and turn into a huge dog. How original.

Dear J.K. Rowling,

Writing a book for muggles describing the magical world in explicit detail is a violation of Section 13, Part C of the International Warlock Convention. We expect you to attend a hearing on February 28th.

Sincerely, The Ministry of Magic

Dear Rebecca,

You are a disgrace to the family name.

Sincerely, Sirius.

Dear Bella,

It's called a threesome.

Sincerely, people against hard decisions

Dear Edward,

I really hope that one day, I can find my way into your heart.

Sincerely, a stake

Dear Twihards,

If he sparkles he's probably one of ours.