Chandra Nandini 23-25: Helen 2.0 - Page 14

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shailusri1983 thumbnail
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Posted: 9 years ago
I have been making the very same points about Helena ever since her character was introduced. Betraying your country for your selfishness, and betraying somebody else's imperialistic ambitions of conquest (Alexander's dream of conquering India) for the sake of your own ambitions or priorities are two different things. You can't judge both these decisions on the same scale of justice. It would be erroneous to do so.

Similarly, after Alexander's death, Helena just took a calculated risk. She knew its implications and outcome. But it is really surprising that she took this leap of faith on Chandra after a very short acquaintance with him. Perhaps it shows the extent to which Chandra's character and personality was able to inspire confidence and trust in her. She seems to have been ready to willingly throw in her lot with Chandra.

I still find it problematic why people think two individuals come together because they love each other. Love is not the only thing under the Sun which makes a personal equation between two people worth their while. At times, you would prize that relationship which gives inner peace to your troubled soul and fills the wounds that time and circumstance have caused by the soothing balm of comfort, care and affection.

Such a relationship is much better than an angst-ridden or poisonous and suffocating kind of love. Chandra and Helena give each other this inner peace, happiness and comfort with themselves. They care for each other and soothe the wounds of one another with the balm of solace. A relationship which keeps you balanced and grounded and is your secure anchor in life, isn't it as good as a relationship of love or in some cases even better than a relationship of love?

PS: I too can visualize that Durdhara cheerleading scene of Nandini and encouraging her because she is the best for Chandra... The whole thought is nauseating even to think. I hope Moora teams up with Helena whenever these twosome indulge in such stupidity. I hope by then, even Chandra is not chump enough in his love for Nandini to forget whatever Helena has done for him and start neglecting or disregarding her. And this girl Nandini I really hope she spares us her sermons which she has already I presume started working out in her pea-sized brain which seems entirely taken up with cockscrew curls to leave very little place for intellect, logic or sense. She just bulldozes her way forward.



Originally posted by: tejaswiniwenham

wow this discussion is fascinating. But if i may, throw in my 2 cents as to why Helena and Chandra have this connection- i think at the foundation of it theres something very visceral rather than the plain brain equation we seem to be presuming. first of all, it is important to dispel our disbelieve in helena; chandra and chanakya may have seen her crude side but they know that shes trustworthy and not just because of her cause but because she has the capability to take calculated risk. being against your nation and people and going against your people enslaving and conquering foreign lands are two VERY different deals. helena knows that chandra would NEVER harm her country, that is NOT his goal. furthermore, she also knows that her father will come out unharmed from this and probably be in an advantageous position if chandra conquers magadh. seleucus wouldve been at a disadvantage in india given his position with alexander's army scattered and unstable. eventually they wouldve been wiped off by some force or the other but atleast this way she can ensure the best possible deal for her father in the process of getting revenge as well. therefore, at that point what she does is takes a calculated risk, she does not blindly commit them to death. and chanakya and through him chandra recognise that. her betrayal is not foolish but rather much more intelligent than the alternate couldve been.

now coming to the visceral connection, i dont think the why part is explainable or in need of explanation- its divine but i can try. i think theres a very explicit level of trust and comfort and confidence in each other that has nothing to do with helena's revenge or chandra's revenge. the revenge saga may have started it but the progression of human emotions is a lot more complex- you never know what one moment in a set of rationally willed events leaves a strong footprint in our heart. firstly, chandra has seen helena at her worst. he doesnt feel that pressure of having to maintain himself in front of her same way that he has to with chanakya his exemplary guru. so in that way its already easy to break down infront of her. helena and chandra both have taken COUNTLESS risk on each other without any solid reason. chanakya trusts (is confident in) chandra because he raised him, durdhara adores chandra because he grew up with her, chandra's friends the same. but helena neither knew him nor had any guarantee of her trust, but she takes that leap of faith anyways. chandra recognizes that. and there is an immense comfort derived from having someone believe in you like that, thats what makes him believe in himself. its not just that shes the same age or that shes his comrade, shes his friend, his wife- ofcourse all of that plays a role. but above and beyond because helena sees the future in him, without having any of the deep rooted reasons that the other characters have.
as for helena and what chandra means for her and why she instinctively knows how to get him out of depression- chandra was the ONE person who, at her lowest, soothed her in the same way i imagine hes soothed himself over the past years of a relatively lonely life- by giving her anger a channel and her wounds a purpose and reassures that she will get her vengeance. to helena, that mustve translated as confidence in her- something women back then didnt get much of. so when he's at his lowest, she knows what to say BUT it is the TONE that makes this scene so iconic. at that moment she alternated between a confident and assertive partner, a nurturer and an attentive friend- not to judge but to listen. inspire him to get back up not reprimand him for quitting, give him that space to feel defeat whilst fanning the fervor to win. that was a part of helena's brilliant mind mixed in with that visceral connection they already have. i think today's episode furthers my point. she feels his pain, its not amar prem but its not just friendship, their connection is a lot more heart than i think either realize and it couldve been any one of the calculated moments spent in each others company, but theyve both left an emotional stamp on the other. nandini may control his heart but for his sake, i hope helena is the one controlling the mind.

and lol today bharat mata gayi thi tel lene when her pyaari beti nandini was taunting moora for what possible reason idk. if in the future, she ever presumes to give anyone a lecture, i do hope that moora and helena double team kick her right in the face, since durdhara will probs be her fellow bharatiya wife and number one fan and will say- only you can teach him to love nandini, dont let helena brainwash him- on her death bed. i can see the scene so clearly in my head its nauseating.

Edited by shailusri1983 - 9 years ago
tejaswiniwenham thumbnail
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Posted: 9 years ago

Originally posted by: shailusri1983

I have been making the very same points about Helena ever since her character was introduced. Betraying your country for your selfishness, and betraying somebody else's imperialistic ambitions of conquest (Alexander's dream of conquering India) for the sake of your own ambitions or priorities are two different things. You can't judge both these decisions on the same scale of justice. It would be erroneous to do so.

Similarly, after Alexander's death, Helena just took a calculated risk. She knew its implications and outcome. But it is really surprising that she took this leap of faith on Chandra after a very short acquaintance with him. Perhaps it shows the extent to which Chandra's character and personality was able to inspire confidence and trust in her. She seems to have been ready to willingly throw in her lot with Chandra.

I still find it problematic why people think two individuals come together because they love each other. Love is not the only thing under the Sun which makes a personal equation between two people worth their while. At times, you would prize that relationship which gives inner peace to your troubled soul and fills the wounds that time and circumstance have caused by the soothing balm of comfort, care and affection.

Such a relationship is much better than an angst-ridden or poisonous and suffocating kind of love. Chandra and Helena give each other this inner peace, happiness and comfort with themselves. They care for each other and soothe the wounds of one another with the balm of solace. A relationship which keeps you balanced and grounded and is your secure anchor in life, isn't it as good as a relationship of love or on some cases even better than a relationship of love?


nope one needs to be in blazing love all the time. arre pyaar mein agar ek do murder nahi ki toh kya kiya? 😆 but even by that standard chandra ne toh pura yudh lar liya for helena's revenge (in addition to other motivations) 😆 lol and also i dont understand why ppl assume that somehow love or hate becomes a pyre of blazing glory at first sight. passionate love can also grow between couples and get only stronger over time. its definitely not a requirement but a friendship and partnership doesnt auto mean your going to have a 'boring' love story and neither does the alternative imply a constantly scintillating relationship. its just bs that our hindi tv cvs and cosmo girl perpetuates. chandra and helena are by far better suited to each other than either the self righteous shrew nandini or the sweet durdhara (i am sure she will be a great wife and shes clearly a smart girl but just not for chandra who clearly needs someone with more ambition and practicality)
shailusri1983 thumbnail
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Posted: 9 years ago
Tejaswini it is good that both of us are of the same mind. I have added a postscript to my previous post. Please do look up whenever you are free. The spectacle you described is swimming before my eyes. I feel if such a calamity is going to befall CN, would it not be better to run for cover before that?
sashashyam thumbnail
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Posted: 9 years ago
My dear Shreya,

This is perhaps the most telling and eloquent summing up of what Helena is all about at this point in time. Lovely, my dear, and very perceptive. I am so glad to have found someone who sees her as I do, which is as she really is. Unfortunately, our CVs are not likely to be skilled enough to keep this up, and develop her, and her relationship with Chandra consistently. the latter on solid but not necessarily romantic lines.

But I have not lost hope as yet, after seeing the very subtle and appealing way in which they explained tonight why Chandra agrees to marry Durdhara. It was really very clever and plausible. So maybe they will think of something good for Helena as well.

Yes, Shweta was not bad in that scene, but one feels so only because she is so flat in general. My dear, she is belying her reputation. Watch her in tonight's episode, in the scene with Mura. Papita Sengupta just eats her up!


Shyamala Aunty

Originally posted by: sp108

Dear Aunty,

I loved your take on Helena. I am happy that you chose Helena as the title of your post. And hats-off to you for keeping up the bi-weekly timelines despite your ailing fingers.

Chandra-Helena is proving to be one of the best jodis I have seen in a long time. I do feel that there has been a change in Helena her journey from being Chandra's mentor to Chandra's wife. Her goal is revenge and that remains constant. But when she decided to marry Chandra, she willingly became part of Chandra's struggles. She is wise enough to know that taking on Magadh is no mean feat. Yet, she is willing to tread the difficult path with him. Earlier she was using Chandra as a means to gain Magadh, and now she has become a part of his struggle, not the one to abandon it or abandon Chandra if he fails. And I completely agree with you that - "No man could have asked for a stronger, more determined, more effective and supportive partner".

Aunty, I was surprised when the CVs showed Chandra and Helena discussing Magadh on their wedding night. Surprised because I always thought that this is how the two would spend their wedding night 😛. And now I am scared at the thought of my thinking matching those of our CVs. 😉

I agree, it was a delightful scene, but would have lost all its impact had either of the actors not performed well.

I too was amused by Chandra's words - Aaj tak aisi koyi stree bani hi nahin jo mera dhyan apni or kheench sake! We know the kind of fate that awaits him! The three wives will ensure that all his attention is always on them. No wonder this guy renounced his kingdom and became a monk.

I liked Shweta in the scene where Chandra imagined Nandni taunting him. She did quite well.

sashashyam thumbnail
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Posted: 9 years ago
Beautifully put, my little Shailaja, and full of distilled wisdom. You go about referring to my younger friends as if you are my age, which I find very funny,😉 but the fact is that those here who are prone to sweeping, judgemental takes on Helena could learn a lot from this post of yours, not just about her psyche but about life in general.

Do also see a lovely take on Helena by Shreya, which I have highlighted in my response to her above.

One should never let oneself be spoonfed by the CVs, to be precise by Bharatmata's irritating homilies, and repeat whatever she dishes out.

A bit that shows once more how often we think alike, you and I. When Pakhi asked me yesterday exactly the same question as the one you have cited:


Both are full of revenge... It's revenge which is uniting them.. What next?

My response was literally the same as yours here.

Empire building.Helena will enjoy that. And being married partners will become a habit that soon smoothens out the rough edges. For both.

Shyamala Aunty


Originally posted by: shailusri1983

I really feel many of my younger friends are reading too much into this Helena's revenge motto and her and Chandra staying together for the sake of a mutual and common aim. What will happen when the very purpose for this connection gets exhausted with the conquest of Magadh and the death of Malayketu. Will the connection snap?

I feel that marriage in itself is a connection. If the original aim or purpose of the marriage gets exhausted, it does not mean that the marriage has to or will end. I think when that happens, both Helena and Chandra will try new reasons to connect them and tie them up to this bond of marriage. And it need not be forced. They could willingly make that decision. This time round, it could be empire building or Akhand Bharat Nirman, or their child, or a close bond of friendship and togetherness which makes them want to stay together.

Which marriage comes in fully with all the reasons and background history of memories to stay in it together? I suppose love marriages may happen like that. Mine was an arranged marriage. I met my husband just two times before our marriage. All the same we created a unique bond between ourselves and discovered our own reasons for happily and blissfully staying in it together.

Any arranged marriage is built up brick by brick with mutual support, trust, and contribution from both the married partners. I can't see why two sensible individuals like Chandra and Helena who have supported each other in their highs and lows cannot manage this successfully! They at least have some solid connection to begin with. Not every marriage begins and ends out of love and with love. There are a myriad of human emotions like friendship, care, trust, affection, etc which connect one individual with another in a successful marriage.

pakhiv. thumbnail
Posted: 9 years ago
Actually the rest of the star cast is doing so marvelous a job that this nandini is an eyesore.
Be it Arpit as Mahapadmanand , Avantika and Sunanda and tuntun bhabhi too are performing to the T
Same with Helena and Chanakya infact t I'm liking their scenes
Helena has blended so well with him that she discusses everything with Acharya from strategy to politics.
Loving Helena and both Tanu Khan
Shweta needs to grow as well as nandini. Even durdhara was also a relief today.
I think they should dedicate an episode to nandini now to atleast make her a little tolerable
Her entire revenge with a corset drama will be so meaningless 😆
pakhiv. thumbnail
Posted: 9 years ago

Originally posted by: shailusri1983

I really feel many of my younger friends are reading too much into this Helena's revenge motto and her and Chandra staying together for the sake of a mutual and common aim. What will happen when the very purpose for this connection gets exhausted with the conquest of Magadh and the death of Malayketu. Will the connection snap?

I feel that marriage in itself is a connection. If the original aim or purpose of the marriage gets exhausted, it does not mean that the marriage has to or will end. I think when that happens, both Helena and Chandra will try new reasons to connect them and tie them up to this bond of marriage. And it need not be forced. They could willingly make that decision. This time round, it could be empire building or Akhand Bharat Nirman, or their child, or a close bond of friendship and togetherness which makes them want to stay together.

Which marriage comes in fully with all the reasons and background history of memories to stay in it together? I suppose love marriages may happen like that. Mine was an arranged marriage. I met my husband just two times before our marriage. All the same we created a unique bond between ourselves and discovered our own reasons for happily and blissfully staying in it together.

Any arranged marriage is built up brick by brick with mutual support, trust, and contribution from both the married partners. I can't see why two sensible individuals like Chandra and Helena who have supported each other in their highs and lows cannot manage this successfully! They at least have some solid connection to begin with. Not every marriage begins and ends out of love and with love. There are a myriad of human emotions like friendship, care, trust, affection, etc which connect one individual with another in a successful marriage.

kudos 👏 I hope marriage brings the same to me otherwise it will be a brick for brick..
sashashyam thumbnail
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Posted: 9 years ago
My dear Tejaswini,

A very astute and persuasive answer to my questions about the Helena-Chandra bond. I have highlighted the parts in your post that I liked the best, and among them, I specially appreciated your fine distinction between what the true impact and consequences of Helena's scheme for Chandra really amounted to vis a vis her father and her fellow Macedonians, and what they were not. Some of this I had touched on in this post in my opening section on Helena.

She knows full well that Chandra and Chanakya will, in their own interest, minimize the human losses among the Greek troops when they attack them, and that they will treat her father well. Which is precisely what happens.

But you have taken this line much further.

Shyamala Aunty

Originally posted by: tejaswiniwenham

wow this discussion is fascinating. But if i may, throw in my 2 cents as to why Helena and Chandra have this connection- i think at the foundation of it theres something very visceral rather than the plain brain equation we seem to be presuming.

first of all, it is important to dispel our disbelieve in helena; chandra and chanakya may have seen her crude side but they know that shes trustworthy and not just because of her cause but because she has the capability to take calculated risk. being against your nation and people and going against your people enslaving and conquering foreign lands are two VERY different deals. helena knows that chandra would NEVER harm her country, that is NOT his goal. furthermore, she also knows that her father will come out unharmed from this and probably be in an advantageous position if chandra conquers magadh. seleucus wouldve been at a disadvantage in india given his position with alexander's army scattered and unstable. eventually they wouldve been wiped off by some force or the other but atleast this way she can ensure the best possible deal for her father in the process of getting revenge as well. therefore, at that point what she does is takes a calculated risk, she does not blindly commit them to death. and chanakya and through him chandra recognise that. her betrayal is not foolish but rather much more intelligent than the alternate couldve been.

now coming to the visceral connection, i dont think the why part is explainable or in need of explanation- its divine but i can try. i think theres a very explicit level of trust and comfort and confidence in each other that has nothing to do with helena's revenge or chandra's revenge. the revenge saga may have started it but the progression of human emotions is a lot more complex- you never know what one moment in a set of rationally willed events leaves a strong footprint in our heart.

This is exactly what I meant when I said:

The power of one human being to connect so deeply with another is always a mystery. It cannot be dissected and explained, not always, and never fully. Like love, it just exists, that is all.


firstly, chandra has seen helena at her worst. he doesnt feel that pressure of having to maintain himself in front of her same way that he has to with chanakya his exemplary guru. so in that way its already easy to break down infront of her.

helena and chandra both have taken COUNTLESS risk on each other without any solid reason. chanakya trusts (is confident in) chandra because he raised him, durdhara adores chandra because he grew up with her, chandra's friends the same. but helena neither knew him nor had any guarantee of her trust, but she takes that leap of faith anyways. chandra recognizes that. and there is an immense comfort derived from having someone believe in you like that, thats what makes him believe in himself.

its not just that shes the same age or that shes his comrade, shes his friend, his wife- ofcourse all of that plays a role. but above and beyond because helena sees the future in him, without having any of the deep rooted reasons that the other characters have.

as for helena and what chandra means for her and why she instinctively knows how to get him out of depression- chandra was the ONE person who, at her lowest, soothed her in the same way i imagine hes soothed himself over the past years of a relatively lonely life- by giving her anger a channel and her wounds a purpose and reassures that she will get her vengeance. to helena, that mustve translated as confidence in her- something women back then didnt get much of.

so when he's at his lowest, she knows what to say BUT it is the TONE that makes this scene so iconic. at that moment she alternated between a confident and assertive partner, a nurturer and an attentive friend- not to judge but to listen. inspire him to get back up not reprimand him for quitting, give him that space to feel defeat whilst fanning the fervor to win. that was a part of helena's brilliant mind mixed in with that visceral connection they already have.

i think today's episode furthers my point. she feels his pain, its not amar prem but its not just friendship, their connection is a lot more heart than i think either realize and it couldve been any one of the calculated moments spent in each others company, but theyve both left an emotional stamp on the other. nandini may control his heart but for his sake, i hope helena is the one controlling the mind.

and lol today bharat mata gayi thi tel lene when her pyaari beti nandini was taunting moora for what possible reason idk. if in the future, she ever presumes to give anyone a lecture, i do hope that moora and helena double team kick her right in the face, since durdhara will probs be her fellow bharatiya wife and number one fan and will say- only you can teach him to love nandini, dont let helena brainwash him- on her death bed. i can see the scene so clearly in my head its nauseating.

Nandini blackened her character comprehensively in that ugly, unnecessary scene. It will now be tough for her apologists to explain how their kind, gentle, compassionate Nandini could behave in such a vicious manner.

I am not very sure about Durdhara either, and not just because she is almost sure to become Nandini's chamchi. How do we know she is telling the truth about that unpleasant groom she says her father is getting for her? I found that very difficult to believe. It might just as well be an astute lie meant to force Chandra's hand and get him to agree to marry her. I might be overly cynical, but that spiel of hers sounded very odd to me.

sashashyam thumbnail
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Posted: 9 years ago
It is not only all this, Pakhi, Nandini's scene with Mura tonight was so ugly and vicious that in one fell sweep, it literally destroyed her character as it was built up till now.

Shyamala Aunty

Originally posted by: pakhiv.

Actually the rest of the star cast is doing so marvelous a job that this nandini is an eyesore.
Be it Arpit as Mahapadmanand , Avantika and Sunanda and tuntun bhabhi too are performing to the T
Same with Helena and Chanakya infact t I'm liking their scenes
Helena has blended so well with him that she discusses everything with Acharya from strategy to politics.
Loving Helena and both Tanu Khan
Shweta needs to grow as well as nandini. Even durdhara was also a relief today.
I think they should dedicate an episode to nandini now to atleast make her a little tolerable
Her entire revenge with a corset drama will be so meaningless 😆

pakhiv. thumbnail
Posted: 9 years ago

Originally posted by: sashashyam

<font face="Georgia, Times New Roman, Times, serif">My dear Tejaswini,</font>

<font face="Georgia, Times New Roman, Times, serif">A very astute and persuasive answer to my questions about the Helena-Chandra bond. I have highlighted the parts in your post that I liked the best, and among them, I specially appreciated your fine distinction between what the true impact and consequences of Helena's scheme for Chandra really amounted to vis a vis her father and her fellow Macedonians, and what they were not. Some of this I had touched on in this post in my opening section on Helena.</font>

<font face="Georgia, Times New Roman, Times, serif">She knows full well that Chandra and Chanakya
will, in their own interest, minimize the human losses among the Greek
troops when they attack them, and that they will treat her father well. Which
is precisely what happens.</font>

<font face="Georgia, Times New Roman, Times, serif">But you have taken this line much further.</font>

<font color="#333333" face="Georgia, Times New Roman, Times, serif">Shyamala Aunty</font>

<font face="Georgia, Times New Roman, Times, serif">
</font>

you know aunt I feel the same vibes about durdhara
She has tacts though of a different style.
She just managed to sneak in as the opportunity was there
Fair is foul, foul is fair.
Hover through the fog and filthy air.
Bharatmata should say this
Atmosphere at magadh smells of blood
And yes karma bites for Nandas's...

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