HUGE RDB and Rafi discussion on orkut - Page 2

Ali

Has anyone noticed that this thread was made to discuss the songs of RD-Rafi but so far after so many comments, there hasn't been a single discussion on their songs, rather if this combo deserves a discussion, or if it should be mentioned etc.

I find that quite amusing lol :P

C'mon folks, this combo has given many excellent songs, how about the waltz "Aa raat jaati hai" from Benaam, RD never composed anything like that before or after.

If other Rafi combo's can be discussed here, then this combo surely deserves a discussion too, but then I understand if some do not want to participate due to their own reasons.

Is anyone not fond of Caravan, Teesri Manzil, Baharon Ke Sapne, Pyar Ka Mausam, The Train, Hum Kisise Kum Nahin, Abdullah, Waris, The Burning Train, Raton Ka Raja etc. ?. I am sure many are, but why hold back ?.

My comments are not any criticism of any sort, just general curious comments. Has this forum stayed away from discussing RD with Rafi ?.

Harpreet

@Ali bhai, what would u discuss sachin tendulkar cracking century against austailia or him against kenya ;)...films that you have just mentioned of rafi-RD combo are miniatures against the work of rafi sahab with naushad, SJ, OPnayyar, MM and others..and you are putting this combo in the league of these master pieces.....

come on yaar..ab to maan jaayo..u seem to have good music knowledge...why stuck up with RD? :)

Harpreet

And @Ali bhai, look at the response of people to the thread started by kharoos on SJ-rafi combo..everybody is having difficulty in finding their fav song of this great combo...as each song is better than other.."ek se badke ek".......as i said before work of RD(u mentioned before pyar ka mausam, burning train etc ...) is miniature against these greats...

these are the combos to be discussed...

i will again say..come on man..why stuck with RD??open your eyes to these greats "naushad, SJ, OP, MM, "..and I am 110% sure you will be bigger fan of rafi sahab after that.. :)

Kharoos

My 10 year old son was bombarded with the cacophony of Himesh, Preetam and Vishal Shekhar group, when I selectively started making him acquainted with the old jewels of HFM.. He has now got stuck up with RD Burman... Although, I personally wanted him to be more inclined towards SD Burman, Salil Chowdhury, Naushad or Madan Mohan, still, I think RD is far far far better option for today's youth than those Himesh and other buggers!!

RD was a great composer and I respect him for his trendsetting music arrangements and popularizing taboo instruments like Saxophone( Thanks to Manohari Singh) and traditional instruments like flute into beautiful innovation... Also, queer use of sound effects with bottles(O Majhi Re), wine glasses( Chura Liya Hai), Bhopu of Rickshawala( Chand koi hoga), are some of his pathbreaking thinking in musical instrumentation which nobody could think of before his time!

But, everyone has his limitations,, He was the best in 70s and cannot be put into the same league of his father or Naushadsaab ,, had we started the topic with only "discussing" his works with Rafi rather than "proving his best was with Rafi", the topic would have gained more responses rather than slightly drifting away its focus in the later stages...Again, Ali bhai is a great music knowledgable and genuine music lover, he has his opinions which he expressed, but, personally, I don't find much to talk about RD-Rafi apart from the naseer hussain movies and a couple of more,, When RD himself never said Rafi was best for him(Remember 1983 Filmfare function? RD coming to stage and audaciously declaring KK as the best singer, not only for his songs, but amongst all of his contemporaries), why we should be even "BOTHERED"??

Harpreet

As you mentioned saxophone the song that come to my mind is .... "hai duniya usi ki jamana usi ka..."(from kashmir ki kali)...what a use of this instrument in that song....wah wah,,,

Kharoos

Harpreet

That saxophone in "Hai duniya usi ki" was also played by Manohari Singh!! And do you know, whenever in any song of 60s and 70s, you hear a saxophone, be assured that it was Manohari Singh who played it.. I was fortunate enough to have met this great soul alongwith Mr. Sebastian,,, It is really a pleasure to talk with them,, The gentleman is so humble.. They are the real unsung heroes of our HFM...

I salute them!!

nitish

82 posts in just four days!

It is really disgusting seeing so much posts in a thread related to a music director whose contribution to HFM is almost nil in comparision to the front line music directors like Naushad Saab, Nayyar jee, Shankar Jaikishan,Madan Mohan sahab, kalyan jee Anandjee, Laxmi Pyare, Ravi Jee and many more.

@Kharoos bhai..

I think every Song from hindi is based on some raga or another. 'sochenge tumhe pyar kare ke nahi' sung by kumar shanu is purely based KALYAN. could we called this singer a classical one?

or alap in the song "pag ghunghru baandh..? is this a classical rendition?

same is true with "mere nayna sawn bhado".

However , As rightly said by super Sahab, this thread has been touching its limit.there i am avoiding such discussions. discussing other singers capability or incapabilities should be avoided here.

no more such things please.

Aseer...........

super bro

i have deleted my controversial post. and i think me n kharoos also have settled the issue between us. so plz be lenient on this thread.

himesh

phew

so many posts!!! this rdb is an intense subject eh?

Ali

Harpreet:

I wouldn't say RD's work is minature against other greats, RD has a lot of fine work, including a lot with Rafi. I would certainly put Teesri Manzil, PKM, HKKN, Caravan, Chandan Ka Palna, Chhote Nawab etc. among Rafi's (and RD's) best. Apart from albums with Rafi songs, RD has other fine work in Amar Prem, Kati Patang, MJS, Kinara, Mehbooba etc. Ofcourse he also has his share of duds, but then every MD has that. I would never compare RD to others such as S-J, MM, Naushad, SDB etc. but the fact is RD was one of the greats.

I am definitely not stuck on RD, I am just wondering why is anyone here not discussing this combo, when elsewhere I know of many Rafians and many Pancham fans who discuss songs of this combo. Trust me bro, I am as HUGE a fan of Rafi-saab as anyone (the biggest Rafi fan that I know is my Father), and my eyes are wide open to the other greats like S-J, MM, Ravi, Roshan, Naushad etc. with Rafi (and in general), as those MD's are also among my favourites. The fact that I am a huge Rafi-fan (and old music fan), how could I possibly not open my eyes to the other greats ?. By discussing RD, it does not in any way diminish other greats. This is just one topic, there is ofcourse time and enough space on this forum for other greats and their songs with the Badshah.

Ali

RD-Rafi have many excellent songs together. I think those who are not too fond of RD, would have a difference of opinion if RD gave Rafi an Aandhi or a Mehbooba or a Kinara etc. Then again, if that's not the case, then its just personal tastes etc. regardless of what RD gave Rafi which is fine. However RD still gave Rafi many of his best songs, which is why I don't understand why the shying away from the topic. If its anything to do with tastes etc. then its absolutely fine, but to shy away based on reasons such as RD didn't think too highly of Rafi (which btw is not true), or that RD suuposedly didn't give Rafi his best (again not true), or because RD was against Rafi (which I doubt), then I think that should not be the case, but if that's how others feel, it is fine. I don't see any reason to ignore this combo considering the great songs they have given us. I see people on other forums discussing Salil, Jaidev, Khayyam, Iqbal Qureshi etc. with Rafi, and forgetting the one Bengali composer Rafi sang the most with was RD (not that it has anything to do with RD being Bengali, just added that as a fact). Add to that, they have twice as many songs as the other combo's discussed.

I love Rafi's songs with every composer, and RD is one of them (besides the fact RD is one of my favourite composers). As I mentioned, my Father is the biggest and greatest Rafi fan (and music fan) that I know, and I am also a huge Rafi fan (and music fan) as well (as you all know), and I am happy that I have met other huge Rafi fans and music fans on this forum with great knowledge, such as Kharoos, Harpreet, Super Returns, Aseer, Himesh etc.

Ali

Harpreet, you mentioned people having difficulty in ranking their top or favourite songs of SJ-Rafi, I think the same can be said about any combo with Rafi-saab (including RD-Rafi). I think if we actually discussed the RD-Rafi combo, there are many great songs where one would find difficult in choosing for a top or favourites list. It's not as if RD-Rafi have very few great songs that one could count on fingertips (IMO).

--------------------------------

Kharoos,

If RD did declare KK as the best, for his songs, and among all his contemporaries, it should not bother us, as he also has mentioned many great things about Rafi as well. There are many interviews where RD praised Rafi-saab sky high. RD also mentioned that he gave his "prized composition" to Rafi from Chandan Ka Palna. We all know RD had a soft spot for KK so his comments are not surprising, but if he did rate KK over all his contemporaries, we know it was an exaggeration and we know RD knew (like everyone else knew) that Rafi was head and shoulders above all.

Regardless of all that, I don't think we should stay away from discussing RD-Rafi, unless ofcourse one is not fond of this combo (as I mentioned) but if one likes songs from this combo, but is just staying away due to other reasons (as I mentioned as well), then I think they are missing out. You have stated you don't think too highly of the combo which is fine, not everyone is expected to like everything and everyone ofcourse has different musical tastes, opinions, likes, dislikes etc. which is absolutely fine and great.

Ali

Kharoos:

Adding to what I mentioned about RD praising Rafi-saab, just an example, in one of his interviews, RD said that Rafi was the one and only singer who could polish an uncut diamond (he meant a song) to make it dazzling.

deviprasad

I have now gone through that Raju Bharathan piece on RD-Rafi. It surprised me to know that Rafi had trouble picking up that A Aa Aaja bit in that Hit Teesri Manzil song.

Surprised, because If Rafi could have crooned A Ja Re Aa Jara or Aa Gale Lag Jaa under SJ so apparently effortlessly, and should I say it, sexily, then A Aa Aaja should have been a cakewalk. How far can Raju Bharatan be relied upon then? Was it a way to spice up his article?

Ali

Deviprasad:

I wouldn't pay too much attention to that article. I don't think RD said those things. Why would he keep on going back to Rafi for songs if he thought that of him ?. It's totally illogical.

To those who do not want to discuss the RD-Rafi combo, I totally respect your views, I know you have your reasons, and I have mentioned things along these lines in my recent posts.

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Kharoos:

You wrote:

"had we started the topic with only "discussing" his works with Rafi rather than "proving his best was with Rafi", the topic would have gained more responses rather than slightly drifting away its focus in the later stages"

You're spot on. I think the topic has gained a lot of responses, but "off-focus" responses.

Kharoos

deviprasad

Ya,, Raju Bharathan was not an ever-relying figure... Do you remember his "tribute" to Mahendra Kapoor?? Well,, I am still confused, whether it was a tribute or an article to show the great singer down!! absolutely disgusting!!

As far as "aa ja aaaa ja" of Teesri Manzil is concerned, if Sapan Chakraborty-a long and close associate of RD is to be believed- it was only that RD like Asha's rendition more in that duet than Rafi's, which is quite natural... It was never like being "unhappy" with Rafi but rather being " overwhelmed" by Asha... I hope, you get the point...

Thank you!!

Kharoos

Himesh

That is what I like about RD yaar, love him or hate him but you can never "ignore" him!! This forum is the biggest example of that:))

Lol..

himesh

lol i love his music lolzz kharoos ji anyway what exactly happened in raju bhartans tribute to mahendra kapoor?

Harpreet

Ya we dont like him, but we are irritated by continuous references/felicitations about him by media and above that continuous avoidance/insult/non-description by media of the actual greats like "Naiushad, SJ, MM, OPnayyar.."

Kharoos:

Himesh,

Go through that"great" piece of article by Raju Bharathan in the following link:

http://www.rediff.com/movies/2008/oct/01kapoor.htm

You will yourself come to know..

Do share your feedbacks also

lol..

Harpreet

I was about to post the link here, but you beat me kharoos :)

but look at the audacity of keeping the title of his article as

"The man who kept Rafi on his toes"

Even Mahendra Kapoor would not have liked this, sorry for distracting from actual subject of the topic...

very engaging discussion , i must say,

i make a prediction that if people don't read this message of mine, there'll be more comments on length of the discussion than the content😆

Originally posted by: Babumoshaai

Finished! 👍🏼

Originally posted by: wats-in-da-name

Thank GODDDD!!!!🤢

Originally posted by: Babumoshaai

so u'll read it now? 😃

Originally posted by: wats-in-da-name

MEH!!!!! forget it😛

Originally posted by: Babumoshaai

plzzzz 😳

Originally posted by: wats-in-da-name

LOL😆

it's hecka long....so, NOPE!!! not my cup of tea😆

i guess Rafi Fans will surely read them......😃

Originally posted by: Babumoshaai

atleast read this:
http://www.mohdrafi.com/newspapers/rafis-last-interview.html

its short