Ram and Krushna & Ramayan & Mahabharat-Comparison - Page 2

Originally posted by: rajnish_here

2. Rama and Krushna

1. Birth

A. Lineage- Rama to Ikshvaku and Krushna to Yadu

C. Wife/Companion

1. Number- Ram had only one wife whereas Krushna had 16108

2. Relationship- Rama and Sita were husband and wife whereas Krushna and the gopis shared a Guru-disciple relationship.[/quote]

Looks like an asymetrical comparison to me. Apples to apples would be Krishna's relationship with Satyabhama or Rukmini.

Also, sons: Rama was succeeded by his sons (and nephews), who survived him, while Krishna had to watch all his sons perish in the brawl that took place started by Satyaki. In fact, it was Krishna's great-grandson Vajra who succeeded not Krishna, but Ugrasena as the ruler of the Vrisnis. Meaning about SIX generations of separation between the 2 rulers.

Sisters - Rama had an older sister (born to Kaushalya?) Shanta, who was adapted out and married before he was born. Krishna had an younger sister Subhadra who stayed in the family until she was married to Arjun.

Better comparison: In Treta Yug, Lakshmi avatar Sita was abducted by Jaya avatar Ravan after she was married, whereas in Dwapar Yug, Lakshmi avatar Rukmini was protected from being abducted from Jaya avatar Shishupala before she got married.

Another comparison - Rama was in line to succeed his father, while Krishna was the next that his maternal grandfather had. Incidentally, any idea whether Ugrasena had any yuvaraj after Kamsa's death? Also, even if Devaki's sons were next in line to succeed Ugrasena, by the age rules, Balarama, rather than Krishna, would have been the ruler, no? The whole succession issue was neatly sidesteped, and once all the Yadavas were massacred in their fracticide, the default choice was the sole family survivor, Vajra.

Another factoid - despite being the grandson of Shura, neither Krishna nor Vasudev ever stood to inherit the kingdom of Shura or Devmidha.

Great point!!!👏👏👏

P.S. Your points got re-numbered by my inserting my comments in between. My apologies, but I can't restore the numbering without damaging the formatting.

Another major difference - Rama was unaware of the fact that he was an incarnation of Vishnu, until the killing of Ravan. Krishna was aware of this fact from day 1.

Similarity in the passing of Lakshman & Balarama - Lakshman went to the bank of the Sarayu, sat in an yogic pose, and Indra took him to Vaikuntha. Balarama sat at the sea shore and a huge serpent emerged from his mouth and merged into the sea, signifying the return of Sesha-nag to Vaikuntha

Originally posted by: Chandraketu

nice comparison👍🏼

I used here gopis as people often use gopis and raashleela as a spiritual love relationship and as gopis were related to krshna as companion ( u can say frnd having mAdhura-bhakti (Devotion through Love)) and Ram has none such companion other than his wife sita so i used this comparison

shishupal was not abducting Rukmini, Rukmini was asked to marry shishupal forcibly by his father and brother on proposal by jarashandha. she was asked to choose shishupal in swamvaar which was about to happen.

but you can also call it abduction as force marriage is also comes under Rakhshasha-marriage ( a type of marriage under our shashtras) and marriage after abdution is also Rakhshasha-marriage. so this may be abduction as rukmini was being forced to marry shishupal

sorry no idea

and as Balram was drown from devki to rohini womb and was born as son of rohini so this age rules doen't apply here , or what?😕

No worries, I wrote this part in ms word using buttons so it is appearing here in that way😆

yes great major difference

thanks for pointing out this comparison as well👍🏼😛

Originally posted by: rajnish_here

shishupal was not abducting Rukmini, Rukmini was asked to marry shishupal forcibly by his father and brother on proposal by jarashandha. she was asked to choose shishupal in swamvaar which was about to happen.

but you can also call it abduction as force marriage is also comes under Rakhshasha-marriage ( a type of marriage under our shashtras) and marriage after abdution is also Rakhshasha-marriage. so this may be abduction as rukmini was being forced to marry shishupal

Actually, Rukmi sold Shishupal on the idea of marrying Rukmini by assuring him that there was going to be no swayamvara. Rukmi knew that had there been a swayamvara, Rukmini would undoubtedly choose Krishna, so the swayamvara was eliminated. The idea was that Rukmini would be married to Shishupala, and the armies of Jarasandha, Shalva, Dantavakra, Purandhara Vasudeva, the ruler of Kashi and other vassals of Jarasandha surrounded Vidharbha in order to prevent Krishna from disrupting the ceremony. Another factoid was that while Rukmi was enthusiastic about this proposed marriage, Bhishmaka (father of Rukmi & Rukmini) wasn't.

Yeah, it would have been a Rakshasha-style marriage had it occurred, but remember, Ravan wanted to pull off the same thing with Sita, but desisted due to Nalkubera's curse.

Originally posted by: rajnish_here

sorry no idea

and as Balram was drown from devki to rohini womb and was born as son of rohini so this age rules doen't apply here , or what?😕

Somehow, I'm missing your point 😕 Are you saying that Krishna had seniority as a result of Devaki being married to Vasudev before Rohini (I'm not even sure that was true)? Balarama has always been recognized as the elder of Krishna, even though Krishna got to overrule him on many things. So if the question came of Krishna being crowned a king, surely Balaram would have been given priority, no?

Shura was the birth father of Kunti, Vasudev, and Shishupala's mother Shrutashava. He had 5 sons & 10 daughters, which might explain why Vasudev wasn't his successor. He gave Kunti for adaption to Kuntibhoja, who was at the time childless (Kuntibhoj later begat Purujit). Shura was to Krishna what Raghu was to Dasharath, but Krishna was never in the line of succession to Shura, but to his maternal grandfather Ugrasena, which was somewhat unconventional given the practice in those days.

Originally posted by: rajnish_here

yes you are right both cannot be compaired in same light, I posted this topic to bring some differencs, similarity based on comparision here the difference in two abduction can be seen

1- In sita abduction by Ravan lakshmi is being separated from lord whereas in rukmani abduction from krushna lord and lakshmi being united

2-Both the abduction has inner purpose of welfare of world, Sita abduction led to death of Ravan and Rukmani abduction led to death of shisupala as shishupala was about to marry rukmani and her abuction by krushna led hatred which was one of the reason why he humiliated krushna and krushna killed him

just depends on what you want to pronounce ,as santan sanshtha also use krushna, the book which i refered used krushna instead of krishna so i used krushna this time, in most of my earlier post i used krshna as by iscon( sometimes krishna )

Originally posted by: Chandraketu

Actually, Rukmi sold Shishupal on the idea of marrying Rukmini by assuring him that there was going to be no swayamvara. Rukmi knew that had there been a swayamvara, Rukmini would undoubtedly choose Krishna, so the swayamvara was eliminated. The idea was that Rukmini would be married to Shishupala, and the armies of Jarasandha, Shalva, Dantavakra, Purandhara Vasudeva, the ruler of Kashi and other vassals of Jarasandha surrounded Vidharbha in order to prevent Krishna from disrupting the ceremony. Another factoid was that while Rukmi was enthusiastic about this proposed marriage, Bhishmaka (father of Rukmi & Rukmini) wasn't.

Yeah, it would have been a Rakshasha-style marriage had it occurred, but remember, Ravan wanted to pull off the same thing with Sita, but desisted due to Nalkubera's curse.

oops, thanks for correcting me here😳, yes bhishmaka too wanted krushna to marry his daughter but love his son rukmi so much that he could not deny his decision.

Originally posted by: Chandraketu

Somehow, I'm missing your point 😕 Are you saying that Krishna had seniority as a result of Devaki being married to Vasudev before Rohini (I'm not even sure that was true)? Balarama has always been recognized as the elder of Krishna, even though Krishna got to overrule him on many things. So if the question came of Krishna being crowned a king, surely Balaram would have been given priority, no?

Shura was the birth father of Kunti, Vasudev, and Shishupala's mother Shrutashava. He had 5 sons & 10 daughters, which might explain why Vasudev wasn't his successor. He gave Kunti for adaption to Kuntibhoja, who was at the time childless (Kuntibhoj later begat Purujit). Shura was to Krishna what Raghu was to Dasharath, but Krishna was never in the line of succession to Shura, but to his maternal grandfather Ugrasena, which was somewhat unconventional given the practice in those days.