Public opinion on Kerala Story. - Page 2

Originally posted by: Bollydolly

I honestly think conversion has nothing to do with patriarchy and everything to do with the setup of Abrahamic religions. Mostly Islam and Christinity and to a lesser extent Judaism.

Now coming to your mom's friend. 99.9% Christians will not convert for the sake of a marriage. Men or women. They will usually have the other party convert. If the non Christian spouse does not convert then sometimes it is alright but the children will be brought up as Christians and baptised in the Church.

My own sister married a Catholic, did not convert but was made to sign a paper by the Church that she will bring her child up as a Catholic and have it baptised.
I have a friend who married a Hindu man who did not convert at the time of marriage but her children were brought up in the Catholic church and baptised. They have absolutely nothing to do with Hinduism.

That is just the way it is.

Your mom knows this and is a lot more worldly wise than you give her credit for. She is just having a little fun because she knows her friend will not give her the real answer.

@bold - now I see 👍

Originally posted by: NatkhatPyare

Differentiating genuine conversion from targeted conversion is difficult when one person is hiding their Identity or faking their Identity to trap another one into conversion. But when the person is not hiding their religious identity and yet targeting for conversion there are certain tell tale signs like - denigrating Gods of other religion, instilling fear or persuading through desirable things or pleasures.

People say adults are not dumb for making certain choices. And then same people question them for choosing a certain party or PM. First make up your mind whether u want to say adult people cannot be made (through presuation or fear) to make certain choices or whether they CAN be brainwashed to make certain choices. When u say - "But lets say a small portion of women are really dumb and can get brainwashed." Then that means bjp brainwashing and polarising such a large population based on religion is not possible since so many adult people cannot be brainwashed right? First decide on one thing whether a large number of adults can be brainwashed or not. Then we will continue this argument.

The real reason why conversion of Hindu women is so easy now because parents don't care to educate their children about Hinduism like people of other religions do about their own religion. When the roots are weak it's easier to dislocate a plant (convert a person).

I'm sorry what? Dude I didn't say anything about BJP or them brainwashing Indians. Please don't mix up arguments you had with other members in other threads. This is why I was thinking whether I should talk about this movie and subject matter in this forum or not. People here get too defensive in their arguments especially when religion is involved.

Well then Hindu parents should teach their kids about their religion. Again its their choice though, whether they want to teach their children about it or not. Religion is not mandatory.

Originally posted by: Bollydolly

Why are you assuming it is patriarchy?

Maybe the mom agrees with Hindu fundamnetals but did not change due to her family commitments.

Converting out of Christianity is not easy either.

Sure. Are we giving same benefit of doubt to Islam?

Originally posted by: PangaNaLe

I'm sorry what? Dude I didn't say anything about BJP or them brainwashing Indians. Please don't mix up arguments you had with other members in other threads. This is why I was thinking whether I should talk about this movie and subject matter in this forum or not. People here get too defensive in their arguments especially when religion is involved.

Well then Hindu parents should teach their kids about their religion. Again its their choice though, whether they want to teach their children about it or not. Religion is not mandatory.

Don't get agitated and worked up. I'm not attacking you. ☯️

I don't always keep the record of what everyone says. If u didn't say anything about BJP brainwashing Indians then i will not contradict you. That is why i asked for your opinion on this matter first. Now that u say u don't believe BJP didn't brainwash such a large population let's continue with ur argument that only a small number of adult girls can be brainwashed and the only solution is to give them more freedom.

No it's not. Rather Hindus should educate their children into their culture and religion from childhood. Muslims go to madrasas and mosque on Friday. Learn quran from childhood. Christians go to church on Sunday attend masses, read Bible. But Hindus think going to temple is outdated. Rama and Krishna are myths and Hinduism is not scientific. Hence conversion is much easier in Hindus. How will giving more freedom solve this? Educating them into their religion from childhood would! After they become adult they will be able to make an informed choice whether to convert or not.

Originally posted by: NatkhatPyare

Don't get agitated and worked up. I'm not attacking you. ☯️

I don't always keep the record of what everyone says. If u didn't say anything about BJP brainwashing Indians then i will not contradict you. That is why i asked for your opinion on this matter first. Now that u say u don't believe BJP didn't brainwash such a large population let's continue with ur argument that only a small number of adult girls can be brainwashed and the only solution is to give them more freedom.

No it's not. Rather Hindus should educate their children into their culture and religion from childhood. Muslims go to madrasas and mosque on Friday. Learn quran from childhood. Christians go to church on Sunday attend masses, read Bible. But Hindus think going to temple is outdated. Rama and Krishna are myths and Hinduism is not scientific. Hence conversion is much easier in Hindus. How will giving more freedom solve this? Educating them into their religion from childhood would! After they become adult they will be able to make an informed choice whether to convert or not.

No I don't think BJP brainwashed Indians. Whether right or wrong Indians are responsible for their own choices on whose government they want.

Giving more freedom would make the girls more self aware of their surroundings. They could more easily see if a guy is trying to trap her or truly loves her. Experience teaches people more than anything. When people don't have enough life experiences, they end up becoming naive and can easily be fooled.

Yes teaching about Hinduism would result in less conversions. But whether parents want to teach their kids about their religion or not is a personal choice, and any outside person can't have a say in it. Also I know many Christians who don't read Bible or go to church. Not everyone here is religious.

Ok, I watched the first few minutes of the video. So far not a single person has addressed how the parents have failed in creating more awareness about their own religion and how it is important to raise their children with strong basics about their religion. As usual the whole conversation was drifting towards how we can restrict the girls more and how we should or shouldn’t give them freedom. Basically in a way victim shaming the girls. Is this what the movie was aiming to do?

Originally posted by: PangaNaLe

Sure. Are we giving same benefit of doubt to Islam?

I am sure in some cases girls convert willingly.
It is beyond my understanding as to why but I think it is the concept Hindus grow up with that all religions are the same and does not matter who or what you pray to that is the main reason and not patriarchy.

However, disregarding the many cases of deception that happen is like being an ostrich. Whether you see it or not these cases are happening.

Originally posted by: PangaNaLe

No I don't think BJP brainwashed Indians. Whether right or wrong Indians are responsible for their own choices on whose government they want.

Giving more freedom would make the girls more self aware of their surroundings. They could more easily see if a guy is trying to trap her or truly loves her. Experience teaches people more than anything. When people don't have enough life experiences, they end up becoming naive and can easily be fooled.

Yes teaching about Hinduism would result in less conversions. But whether parents want to teach their kids about their religion or not is a personal choice, and any outside person can't have a say in it. Also I know many Christians who don't read Bible or go to church. Not everyone here is religious.

Making someone self aware would protect from internal dangers like ego, overconfidence, anger, self control etc. However to protect from external dangers you need to make them aware of the external environment too for ex. Even when we choose a house to rent or buy we consider many external points into account like whether the locality is safe, whether it's safe to walk at night there, whether it's safe for women to walk alone at night, whether that area is prone to theft & robbery etc. Similarly it's necessary to make the girls aware of tricks employed by those targeting them for conversion or other ulterior motives. The movie tks certainly increases this awareness.

Ofcourse teaching or not teaching religion is a personal choice but every choice has its consequences or repurcussions. Being religious or not is not important. Important is to be a good human that doesn't consider followers of other religion or even atheists etc. as inferior. Live and let live is what i believe in.

Originally posted by: PangaNaLe

No I don't think BJP brainwashed Indians. Whether right or wrong Indians are responsible for their own choices on whose government they want.

Giving more freedom would make the girls more self aware of their surroundings. They could more easily see if a guy is trying to trap her or truly loves her. Experience teaches people more than anything. When people don't have enough life experiences, they end up becoming naive and can easily be fooled.

Yes teaching about Hinduism would result in less conversions. But whether parents want to teach their kids about their religion or not is a personal choice, and any outside person can't have a say in it. Also I know many Christians who don't read Bible or go to church. Not everyone here is religious.

Bold; When hormones are running amok reality is out of the window. 😳

First: It is impossible to convert an apple into a banana...yet it is possible to convert a predilection for apples into a predilection for bananas.

And that's the point for every conversion...conversion brings change (social, situational, physical, mental, spiritual).

Each attempt of conversion, each conversion itself has its own history, because it deals with an individual decision and change).

But there are methods to convert a belief, an opinion, a mode of life, if a person doesn't have an interest for conversion out of her-/himself. These methods are taught to those whose objectif will be to convert as many people as possible in a specific direction.

I assume, that in the movie TKS, only one method was shown: through lies.

PangaNaLe has a very valid point: the more you know about the world around you, the more you are reflective over what you see, read, hear, learn, the more you get a feeling for manipulation. The own insecurity is the best fertile soil for strategic attempts of conversion - especially whith no proper communication possibilities that deal with these attempts in a critical & experienced way.

That goes for religions, politics, sales methods, dating methods, people smuggling, drug using,, brainwashing, education & re-education, opinion making, edtc...

In the movie, to the lies, a lot of violence is added...and isolation.

I want to add, that the movie has more than one purpose (correct me if I'm wrong):

purpose to caution

purpose to point a finger to a certain religion

purpose to show the conversion method of a terror group (ISIS)

purpose to shock (especially through explicit violence)

purpose to cater to a political program (beware of Muslims!)

purpose to incite compassion

purpose to incite ire

purpose to incite mistrust

purpose to incite the wish that this problem get solved (no matter how)

purpose to made a quick buck with a low budget film supported by propaganda and controversies...