Laksmi not at fault :) - Page 2

rainabow....
😆 interesting discussion....can't resist replying although lets wait and see is correct.
The fact that karan did not bother to see sufficient EVIDENCE is being held against him . Now you tell me one thing....a ten year old boy , stands with his mother on the doorstep of his employer , is unable to meet him, is insulted by the relation and employee of that employer , comes back with a crying mom, to see his father unable to handle the badnaami and committing sucide . when he has gone somewhere out, his mom has gone in a state of shock and does not talk to him for years.he loses both....his mom and dad ....and has to fend for himself in the bad world .
Now u tell me....even if our dads are fired by a company we as children feel angry with that institution called company . here , the boy had heard the name suryakant garodia constantly being discussed between his parents. The fact that Suryakant Garodia didnt give Raman Mathur a fair hearing still remains rainabow. He fired an employee and didnt talk to him before he fired him ?? It is as foolish as the fact that he signs papers randomly....bad businessman ! All that the Mathurs wanted was for him to hear their side of the story .....which Karan witnessed . And they didnt get that till the end ! This excuse today that it happened that way because Surya listened to Rasik...is this any excuse rainabow ? If Surya didnt bother to interact with the employees who helped to flourish his business and depended wholly on middle men to sack them although they were clearly demanding to be heard ....even in special cases like this, the moral responsibility of that man's suicide does go on his head rainabow !
Ok , let all this go. After hearing of Raman Mathur's sucide , what did Surya do ? Nothing ! Did he even bother to find out what happened to his wife and kids with some sense of social responsibility ? Nope ! So tell me....how is Karan supposed to feel ?
And honestly speaking....from where is this boy who grew up into a man later supposed to find this so called evidence ? In such cases....is evidence really left around for cases to be proved ? In Suryas own case when his son tricked him , did he have any evidence to give to the court that his son tricked him when the signature on the papers was his ? So what evidence do u guys keep talking about that is gonna be left around ? Trickery is trickery and in cases of trickery there is no evidence to support the truth and hence anger turns to rage....which happened with Karan !
I dont think he didnt get his mom treated by doctor....we saw the serial from a point when all doctors efforts have failed and all his money cud still not give his mom back to him ...so his rage increased.
But yes, our favorite heroine Lax definetely didnt get her dad treated by a doctor saying she'll win money in dance competition....then we will get him treated ![ how does this sound ??}
Karans rage made him mentally torture Lax....only on this point do i concede that yes it was wrong. But he was a victim of tragic circumstances.Lax made stupid
secret plans and festered the issue .I have already gone into that.
She has forgiven her horrid brother , she is responsible for Suryas condition and recently the doc even clearly stated that delay in treatment endangered Suryas life. And this is the girl u guys keep saying is the heroine of this serial ? Flawed yes....but so stupid ?? All the time she talks....this beti will do it now..just hear her ! It is clear that more than love for Father or understanding of a situation what matters to this character is...I do it ...I I I ! Ye beti karke dikhayegi....insufferable ego....just like once her dad had !
Yes we all know this track is temporary...but even when it ends....we hope that writer finds some real good excuse to redeem Laxmis character . The irritation we have with this character simply wont go for a long time to come otherwise !

Good points, Rainabow. There's a reason why they say patience is a virtue. It always was elusive for me. I enjoy arguing and concurring about the scenes, characters, and issues.

On the piece about K's mom, the doctors said there was nothing they could do (remember that it was a psychological reaction that led to the impairment).

And yes, both K and L are wrong in the way they've treated each other. To be brief, L's behavior now is NOT due to what K. did to her. At the party where Rasik was exposed, she did not chew K. out. It's ego, ego, ego and to some degree hurt. Maybe she's taking her own guilt out on Karan. That it was him, not me.

You know when we say Karan should have gotten proof, that we would have done it, I think we say that in hindsight and by being in an older, 3rd party position. Believe it or not, based on some stuff I've read and doctor friends, many children when traumatized are never the same, though noone can see it. Seeing your father dad and mom become a "zombie", and you becoming a caregiver at a young age is too much. These kids tend to get angry/enraged easily, have recurring memories that they can't control or handle appropriately. Hence with K., I'm not too surprised. He saw it with his own eyes, and was convinced that that is what happened.
I know if I was in his shoes and traumatized, there'd be a proverbial bullseye on Suryakant's head, and I would bring him and everything he values down.
We're people after all--not perfect.

Originally posted by: gp00

Good points, Rainabow. There's a reason why they say patience is a virtue. It always was elusive for me. I enjoy arguing and concurring about the scenes, characters, and issues.

On the piece about K's mom, the doctors said there was nothing they could do (remember that it was a psychological reaction that led to the impairment).

And yes, both K and L are wrong in the way they've treated each other. To be brief, L's behavior now is NOT due to what K. did to her. At the party where Rasik was exposed, she did not chew K. out. It's ego, ego, ego and to some degree hurt. Maybe she's taking her own guilt out on Karan. That it was him, not me.

You know when we say Karan should have gotten proof, that we would have done it, I think we say that in hindsight and by being in an older, 3rd party position. Believe it or not, based on some stuff I've read and doctor friends, many children when traumatized are never the same, though noone can see it. Seeing your father dad and mom become a "zombie", and you becoming a caregiver at a young age is too much. These kids tend to get angry/enraged easily, have recurring memories that they can't control or handle appropriately. Hence with K., I'm not too surprised. He saw it with his own eyes, and was convinced that that is what happened.
I know if I was in his shoes and traumatized, there'd be a proverbial bullseye on Suryakant's head, and I would bring him and everything he values down.
We're people after all--not perfect.

I guess I missed the episode with the doctors' visit. My mistake! Disregard whatever I said then.

All your arguments are valid and true, but can also be made for Laxmi. Women in abusive situations often react the same way as she did...hoping their husbands will change, constantly trying to please them, making excuses for them, etc. Remember how Saras was screaming for Bhav even after he brutally beat her at the hotel? Now of course Karan did not physically hurt her, but mental torture is just as bad. It's extremely common for battered women, whether physically or mentally, to react in ways that are totally illogical to the rest of us. Also, if you recall, she was terrified of how her dad would react. Remember her imagining him getting a heart attack and feeling guilty over ruining his daughters' lives? Her reasoning was totally flawed and absurd, but no more or less so than Karan's.

And your final sentence says it all: We are people and not perfect. And neither is Lax. I am not going to defend her actions, but I don't think Karan is any worse or better, so I'm simply a bit confused as to why people are defending him while chastising her. I think they have both made countless mistakes.

As Karan grew older he should have realized that there were some holes in whatever "evidence" he saw as a child. If we can dismiss that due to his mental state, than I think it's only fair to do the same for Laxmi. I personally think they both behaved foolishly. Even if Karan wanted to take revenge on Suryakant, there was absolutely no excuse for treating Laxmi that way. She had nothing to do with whatever happened all those years ago.

Whiile Karan was doing all these monstrous things, I don't recall any discussions like this happening. In fact people still thought they were a great couple, which I found astonishing. Yet when Laxmi makes mistakes and behaves like a fool, everyone is so quick to berate her. I don't quite understand that. However angry I was with Karan in the past is how angry I am with Laxmi now. I think they both fell from grace.

The only sentence i agree with u on is that there is absolutely no excuse for treating Lax that way....she had nothing to do with what happened many years ago. Bas...this is the only point on which I agree with all those who advocate lax. That is the only point that Karan , blinded by revenge , did not give a thought to. His purpose was to return some of the pain to Suryakant....albeit by hurting his daughter , who really , had no hand in all this.
I dont agree with any other argument advocating her behaviour. The way she and her sisters forgave Yuvraj for his terrible crimes is unthinkable and unacceptable.The message her entire behaviour has sent is that she is a partial girl....with a blood is thicker than anything philosophy .My Bapuji is the only important thing is getting pretty irritating now. She was the one who sent him in state of shock and later, by delaying treatment, endangered his life, just the way Yuvraj once did by almost getting him shot.
She is too judgemental with outsiders and this she has no right to do so especially when the full Garodia clan is a flawed pack....most of all , her Bapuji...who really did mess up many peoples lives.
And yes, I do feel this character has been pampered enough and needs another character to pull her down , either with a slap or a real good dose of words.
About not berating Karan then...at that point I was not posting my views so often. Still I had posted saying his treatment of her is shameful...and she taking it is even a distortion of her image. That I remember. Now we watch this with so much interest that my posts will be regular....it was no way supporting Karan as such then. I hope this track ends in reconcilation soon...but I doubt I will respect this character again . What puts us off rainabow is the Ye Beti ab Kar ke dikhayegi thing....Ego , that rose even above humanity [ getting her dad treated ] !

KoolSadhu, I also think it was obscene for her and her sisters to forgive Yuvraj. I always believe in forgiveness, but first the person has to apologize and repent, which Yuv never did. He never thought he had done anything wrong. How could they forgive a mistake that he never even acknowledged he made? Stupidity at its finest.

I am not "advocating" Laxmi or saying what she is doing is good, right, or excusable. I am simply saying that I don't consider her a bigger sinner than Karan. Like I said, both fell from grace. Remember that it was Laxmi who gave Karan his mother back, when even he and Kavita could not.

When this discussion first started some time ago I wrote that Laxmi could not be trusted in her current mental state, and I stand by that. She was making all kinds of ridiculous declarations and decisions. I think the stupid Garodia clan is just as much to blame for Surya's condition as she is. She is the youngest member of the family (aside from Yuv), and she is making all these crucial decisions? Hello? Savitri? Meneka? Baa? Halki? Hasmukh? Durga, Gauri, Saraswati? Where are all of you? One of these characters should have just told her "No Laxmi, Suryakant's treatment is more important than your ego or getting even with Karan. Get over yourself." What's most telling is that she was ready to forgive Karan until Surya went missing, and that wasn't his fault. If anything, it was Surya's fault for ambling like an idiot in the middle of traffic. So I agree that Lax made a number of awful decisions, but how stupid is her family to give her that level of control? If my parents just gave me free reign over everything, I would have made some dumb decisions too. But I can't say I'll never respect her character again. I don't think anything she has done is less forgivable than what many of the other characters on the show have done in the past.

Agreed....what she has done is no way less forgivable than what other characters on the show have done.
But , like Yuvraj will have to....it had better be something really worthwhile as she irritated us a lot.See...no one can forgive Yuvraj easily today ....his mistakes r too many. So r Laxmis. Karans were too...but he underwent real repentance and brot Surya back when his own kith and kin gave up on him....offered 50 lacs [ a huge amount and no one seems to notice this] arranged for the best specialist , followed her to Bombay with a sense of responsibility and did the human thig by saving her. How this girl is going to resurrect her own mistakes....which like Yuvraj she isnt even aware of till this point , will be worth watching . Till then , I am afraid , she will have our irritation . Her worst MISTAKE will be going back to Karan at her BApuji's behest....that will be something we irritated viewers wont be able to digest .And I have a gut feeling that this is gonna happen....lets hope we r proved wrong ! This discussion has been most interesting and I enjoyed it.

okay, this is a very interesting post so i thought why not give my views..........well, i m on both sides and here is why:well its my personal opinion so dont get mad...m bad at arguing
frist i wud like to get in between the argument of yuvrag........well lets face it, guys are jerks(no offence to any guys) they are very insensitive at times, especially when we need there support. yuvi is bad, i agree but dont forget he is their bro. i mean my brother say mean things to me and we stop talking but there are certain times that we just cant wait anymore and forget about the ego and self respect and so say sorry to them eventhough its not our fault. they grew up with him so and he acted all nice in front of them so Lakshimi probably believe in her brother more than karan at times like right now. if u seen some epis, i notice that yuvi actually cares a lot about the family, remember when he heard everything from gauri, he was about to go and give them money but was stopped by kajri........his only mistake was to fell in love with kajri but as other says "love is blind" so when u fell in love, u believe the person blindly right? and kajri acts nice in front of him so he think his wife is goody goody but he doesnt know the reality yet.........my point is that he does care for his family eventhough kajri tried to separate him completely so thats why lakshimi wants her brother cuz she knows he will come to her easily since he jus doesnt knoew the truth yet, i guess cuz i wud want my bro to come to cuz i wud miss all the fun we used to have together............guys lets face it guys r ego maniacs. 😆
secondly, yeah i personally think wat lakshimi is doing is wrong and right cuz see first when she fell in love, the person died, next she fell in love, she find out later that the person was jus actin with her for getting back at their family for wut happened to his family and he actually verbally harrassed her but still she stood by his side............she wanted him to get out of the dark too jus like she want yuvi to get out of darkness.....but the prob is that he thought that it was hr father's fault....well i wud too if the insident happened in front of me............well anyways, he shouldnt have jus came to the conclusion like shahruk did in baazigar. it was not lakshimis fault but he was acting like a big jerk but still she told him that it was not her father and she stood by him taking all his badmouthing AND later on even acted with the other girl just to give pain to lakshimi, the nerve he had to mess with jhansi ki rani😡😆.......trust me if i were her, i wud slap and smack and boom that guys.........i wudnt stand anyone thinking i m crap 😡 neways, she got mad at him when suryakant was reported died, i mean comeon, give it a break, u know i wud kill that guy who my dad died because of. she jus send him a divorce notice and refused his help but HELLO relaity check, it was karans fault that they got into this mess anyays, remember if karan acted a little more sensible then her father wud be well. i thought she was stupid too at the beginning but 1 noght i closed my eyes and thought what wud i do if i was in her place, i mean hello she tried to warn him but he ignored her so suffer the wrath of ignoring jhansi ki rani 😆
finally, i think karan is a very sweet guy, he should just tell her that if they got in this mess cuz of him he wud get them ouut of it too by giving her the money.......give her a nice shake.....slap her hard if needed 😆 i just want my fav couple to b togetha again 😉
GUYS JUST MY OPINION SO DONT ARGUE ABOUT IT CUZ I M VERY SHORT TEMPERED AND VERY BAD AT ARGUMENTS I DIDNT SEE SOME OF THE RECENT EPIS SO PLZ FORGET THE MISTAKE ON THAT PART🤡

act21, don't even worry about anyone being mad at you. I and many others here like to debate the points and interpretations, not debate the person writing them.

You threw me a line, and now I have to respond. I understand your perspective on Lakshmi. And it was good because I started thinking about other things as well. But you should know that I love Karan's character and I'm not all that happy with Lakshmi's. Oh, who am I fooling? I despise Lakshmi. 😡 😡 😡

I agree with pretty much everyone when I say both Karan and Lakshmi have done terrible things to each other. The fact that they still love each other is remarkable. But you have to look at hurt in the proper context, and impact in the proper context. For example, Karan caused her unbearable pain after the wedding and destroyed dreams of and with him. Lakshmi served him divorce papers. Which would cause you more pain?

It hasn't missed anyone's attention that what L is going through to this day is an exact copy of Karan's conflict, but it is in a different context now. Karan has changed and has done more than anybody in that family has. L also knows K loves her and he's proven that time and again. She wants no part of it. She wants to cause him pain over what happened to her dad, just like K did with her. However, K never blamed Lakshmi, he knew she was the innocent victim. L blames Karan for her father's coma, for global warming, and anything her little deranged brain can think of. She IS wrong, and yes, what she is doing IS worse than what Karan did. I think that's why people feel so strongly one way or the other and write wonderful, thought out posts.

I agree with koolsadhu when she says Lakshmi's character turns her off. L causes unhappiness and pain, no matter the context. That Karan was there at the hospital--she gave him a "look" (nazar) and walked away--you know her way of saying thank you for saving me from being raped. When she came to eavesdrop on Karan's call with his mom, Karan merely said that he felt God wanted them to be together still. She, of course, transforms--her horns come out at her temples, and fire out of her mouth. 😈 And she says to him, no matter what you do, you can't make up for the bad that you did. After trying to help you, saving you, loving you? Neither can you, Lakshmi, but Karan will forgive you because he IS better than her. Savitri should have opened her mouth in the past 20+ years and taught her girls compassion for others (non-family of course) how to be ladies.

I want to see and experience Lakshmi's character's fall. Why not Karan? Because she is judgemental, a hypocrite, and a genuinely mean person inside. (I'm not saying she's not nice inside too, but there is that side to her).

Sorry for my discourse on-line. I just love the topic!!!

Originally posted by: gp00

act21, don't even worry about anyone being mad at you. I and many others here like to debate the points and interpretations, not debate the person writing them.

You threw me a line, and now I have to respond. I understand your perspective on Lakshmi. And it was good because I started thinking about other things as well. But you should know that I love Karan's character and I'm not all that happy with Lakshmi's. Oh, who am I fooling? I despise Lakshmi. 😡 😡 😡

I agree with pretty much everyone when I say both Karan and Lakshmi have done terrible things to each other. The fact that they still love each other is remarkable. But you have to look at hurt in the proper context, and impact in the proper context. For example, Karan caused her unbearable pain after the wedding and destroyed dreams of and with him. Lakshmi served him divorce papers. Which would cause you more pain?

It hasn't missed anyone's attention that what L is going through to this day is an exact copy of Karan's conflict, but it is in a different context now. Karan has changed and has done more than anybody in that family has. L also knows K loves her and he's proven that time and again. She wants no part of it. She wants to cause him pain over what happened to her dad, just like K did with her. However, K never blamed Lakshmi, he knew she was the innocent victim. L blames Karan for her father's coma, for global warming, and anything her little deranged brain can think of. She IS wrong, and yes, what she is doing IS worse than what Karan did. I think that's why people feel so strongly one way or the other and write wonderful, thought out posts.

I agree with koolsadhu when she says Lakshmi's character turns her off. L causes unhappiness and pain, no matter the context. That Karan was there at the hospital--she gave him a "look" (nazar) and walked away--you know her way of saying thank you for saving me from being raped. When she came to eavesdrop on Karan's call with his mom, Karan merely said that he felt God wanted them to be together still. She, of course, transforms--her horns come out at her temples, and fire out of her mouth. 😈 And she says to him, no matter what you do, you can't make up for the bad that you did. After trying to help you, saving you, loving you? Neither can you, Lakshmi, but Karan will forgive you because he IS better than her. Savitri should have opened her mouth in the past 20+ years and taught her girls compassion for others (non-family of course) how to be ladies.

I want to see and experience Lakshmi's character's fall. Why not Karan? Because she is judgemental, a hypocrite, and a genuinely mean person inside. (I'm not saying she's not nice inside too, but there is that side to her).

Sorry for my discourse on-line. I just love the topic!!!

ok, u r right but everyone should know that when trust is broken once, it cannot be build again or it will be very hard to built..........right now she still have a doubt about him cuz he broke her trust once...she thinks that he might be toying with them again................and yeah about the divorce, u r right its worst than abuses but he brought a girl home, eventhough they were nothing to eachother, i think she was getting paid but still lakshimi didnt know that and it hurt her trust and faith in him............he tried real hard to break the trust😆.......again it was not fully his fault but still and yeh i wud rather get a divorce and getaway than see my husband with someone else eventhough its jus him makin me jealous but that wud mean that he is trying to make fun of my love for him so i think they both are even................sorry no hard feelings but if u dispise her, u r jus bringing ur feelings in the way, u should look at the big picture😉

ANYWAYS, I WASNT TRYING TO BRING THAT UP BUT I THINK THEY BOTH ARE PRETTY EVEN SO I JUS WANT THEN TOGHETHER ARREDY