PR this week: Arjun turning negative? NO!! - Page 2

Hello Shyamala ( hope you dont mind me addressing you by the first name, I find that easier. In case you forgot, mine is Priya and call me by that anyway).
I am an intermittent PR watcher although not at all invested in any of the characters. I do like the complexities in PR. They are fun...I have been keeping up with the last few months pretty well so feel like I can comment on the state.
As for Arjun, I think he has been thoroughly blindsided by Purvi. He is in shock and yet to recover from it. His relationship with her died a sudden and unforeseen death. He just hasnt come to terms with it yet. Its only been a month and so much else has happened around them that they should be forgiven for not having dwelt on it.
I think Arjun loves Purvi wholeheartedly and more than that, admires her immensely. Arjun knows that Purvi gave their relationship up for a higher cause. To Purvi, Arjun was the only thing she had of her own to give for Aayi as the eternal thank you. In that it was a very personal thing she asked him. He was hers and she asked him to go be someone else's for her. I kind of get it. I can also buy that he is living with Ovi to fulfill Purvi's word. Arjun has to prove to Purvi how much he loves Purvi by putting up with Ovi. This is Purvi's demand.
Purvi is the child no one wanted or needs anymore. She has no place to be. She has given everything she had and more until her presence needs to be snuffed out as we see. She will make herself scarce soon.
The worst of this unholy triangle is Ovi. See Ovi knew Purvi wouldnt ever not give everything for her mother. She knew Purvi relationship with Arjun didnt stand a chance. In fact if Ovi went to Arjun for the same thing, he would have done the same too. Ovi has inserted herself into the relationship between Purvi and Arjun. Purvi and Arjun are helplessly bound in this for two people. Ovi and Archana. More than any one else, Ovi is answerable to her mother for ruining Purvi's life because Ovi put a condition that unless Purvi gives her back her toy (husband), Ovi wont talk to her own mother.

As to how this should unravel, Archana should confront Ovi and make her file for the divorce. Purvi should walk away and make herself useful in a different town until that is done and Arjun should make how miserable he is in his marriage apparent to all and sundry.

IMHO it has nothing to do with being an adult or otherwise, one can get manipulated at any age by the people who have leverage.

Thanks a lot, Ashi. I especially agree with your comments in deep blue. Thanks to all this ill-considered do-gooding by Purvi, when it all falls apart, Arjun is going to end up looking like a double-dealing Casanova, which he most emphatically is not, no matter that he is so very stupid.

As for me, I do not at all like being so continuously negative about characters, especially Arjun, whom I was so fond of, but it is all an unholy mess right now, and it seems likely to get worse.

Shyamala B.Cowsik

Originally posted by: Ashi22

Very Nice Post, It always pleasure to read your Ideas about the show, Well I dont know about Arjun whats his future plan, but I would like to talk about Purvi. Why she is lying to Everyone

She lied to Manav about her Job, She lied to Archana about Arjun is over her she could tell her that I forced him to celebrate one month anniversary,

She lied to Arjun she is over him (but in reality she still misses him)

and last but not least she is dragging Ovi in the false and wrong relation ship that her husband has start loving her,and thats really a very big mistake the more Ovi will stay in this relationship the more it will hurt her,

Arjun cant divorce Ovi bcose he knows then after that Purvi will never forgive him, but Purvi can tell Ovi that Arjun still love me,so Purvi is the most negative character in the show at the moment.

PS ( I m still die hard fan of Purvi and Arjun)

Shyamala Aunty,

Dear Priya,

Yes of course I remember you and all those very interesting exchanges we had, on much of which, if I am not wrong, we agreed to disagree. And no, I do not at all mind your calling me Shyamala.

As for this post of yours, it is characteristically well done, and the arguments flow smoothly. But my reaction to the core thesis is pretty much the same as before. Your line of argument is solid provided one accepts the basic hypothesis @red , that it is all right for someone to give away a loved one to someone else, even if it means consigning him to a life of misery, for the sake of another person whom the donor loves more or to whom she feels she owes her life, i.e for the ' higher cause'.

I am afraid I do not accept that hypothesis at all, and this irrespective of whether the donation (here Arjun) accepts his fate or not. To me, it is a tauheen of love itself, and a blatant display of control and manipulation. She caught the poor fool completely unawares, lied to him till the last minute, and then blindsided him. It was unforgivable, and that he was stupid enough to go along with it changes nothing in this.

And no, I do not think Arjun is happy or even resigned to the fact that, as you put it so well, "Purvi gave their relationship up for a higher cause". If this was the case, he should be content in having furthered her noble purpose. He would not be trying to hang around Purvi and complaining bitterly and angrily to her about how stupid he had been to have married Ovi at her bidding, and asking her whether she was happy now that she had "ruined three lives for the sake of your happiness'. He knows full well that he has been had, and now he does not know how to get out of it. Still, he cannot escape Purvi's overweening pull, like a marionette on a string, or like one of the swine that Circe used to turn brave men into.

As for your comment that one can get manipulated at any age by the people who have leverage, that is true, What I said was that an adult has to be responsible, and once he has made a decision, under manipulation or not, he has to live with it and meet that responsibility. A child has no such obligation.

As for the comparative guilt for this mess, if Purvi can be allowed treat Arjun like a commodity, I see no difference between her and Ovi. Purvi is in fact worse. I am afraid I do not buy this 'higher cause' argument.

As I had noted in my earlier post of October 30: " Why then do we blame Ovi for selfishness, when Purvi is just as selfish or worse? Does it make it better that she dumps Arjun for her mother, whereas Ovi buys him for herself? I am reminded of what Vijay(Amitabh)'s mother in Deewaar tells him: The others who committed all those wrongs, what were they to me? Nothing. But you were my son. How then did you commit the same sins?". One expected more from Purvi because she was Arjun's beloved, and she owed Arjun for loving her so deeply - and she let him and us down big time".

Then again, Ovi at least gave Purvi, in return for Arjun,, something that Purvi desperately wanted. What did Purvi give Arjun in return for his agreeing to commit emotional suicide? Nothing, and she keeps asking for more and more. If this is love, God save men from such love!

I am sure you will not agree with any of the above, and I accept that. To each her own. We should just agree to disagree.

All this apart, I find that I am no longer taken up with these characters the way I used to be. They irritate me acutely, and Purvi the most of all. I posted this today on a whim, after seeing that oddly named thread, and my earlier post of Oct 30 was after 6 weeks. At one time, I used to post 3 times a week, but my heart is not in it any more. It is perhaps just as well, for I am sure the mess is going to get a lot worse. And yet here I am falling into the same old trap of arguing at length about characters who are not worth it. Well, I shall desist in the future. A plague on all their houses!

In conclusion (if I have not bored you stiff by now), thanks for having taken the trouble to respond to my post, and once again, my warm good wishes to you and your family for a wonderful Deepavali.

Shyamala

Originally posted by: Punarvivah

Hello Shyamala ( hope you dont mind me addressing you by the first name, I find that easier. In case you forgot, mine is Priya and call me by that anyway).
I am an intermittent PR watcher although not at all invested in any of the characters. I do like the complexities in PR. They are fun...I have been keeping up with the last few months pretty well so feel like I can comment on the state.

As for Arjun, I think he has been thoroughly blindsided by Purvi. He is in shock and yet to recover from it. His relationship with her died a sudden and unforeseen death. He just hasnt come to terms with it yet. Its only been a month and so much else has happened around them that they should be forgiven for not having dwelt on it.

I think Arjun loves Purvi wholeheartedly and more than that, admires her immensely. Arjun knows that Purvi gave their relationship up for a higher cause. To Purvi, Arjun was the only thing she had of her own to give for Aayi as the eternal thank you. In that it was a very personal thing she asked him. He was hers and she asked him to go be someone else's for her. I kind of get it. I can also buy that he is living with Ovi to fulfill Purvi's word. Arjun has to prove to Purvi how much he loves Purvi by putting up with Ovi. This is Purvi's demand.

Purvi is the child no one wanted or needs any more. She has no place to be. She has given everything she had and more until her presence needs to be snuffed out as we see. She will make herself scarce soon.

The worst of this unholy triangle is Ovi. See Ovi knew Purvi wouldnt ever not give everything for her mother. She knew Purvi relationship with Arjun didnt stand a chance. In fact if Ovi went to Arjun for the same thing, he would have done the same too. Ovi has inserted herself into the relationship between Purvi and Arjun. Purvi and Arjun are helplessly bound in this for two people. Ovi and Archana. More than any one else, Ovi is answerable to her mother for ruining Purvi's life because Ovi put a condition that unless Purvi gives her back her toy (husband), Ovi wont talk to her own mother.

As to how this should unravel, Archana should confront Ovi and make her file for the divorce. Purvi should walk away and make herself useful in a different town until that is done and Arjun should make how miserable he is in his marriage apparent to all and sundry.

IMHO it has nothing to do with being an adult or otherwise, one can get manipulated at any age by the people who have leverage.

My dear Ash,

Thanks a lot, my dear, and as I said to Jyothi on my last thread, all we of the PAP can do now is to mourn together, and hope against hope that those ugly rumours do not turn out to be true. I miss you all very much too.

Take care, Ash, and do not let any of this get under your skin. It is simply not worth it. Instead, come and join me in the Ramayana forum. There is one tale that will never go to the dogs like this one!

Shyamala Aunty

Originally posted by: Ashlaika

Shyamala Aunty,

Good to see you up and about in the forum. Even if it is briefly.

I too sure do miss those days of the PAP and APP. Was very happy when I was inducted :D. LOL. We all know how much you had loved Arjun and so did we and you have every right to criticise him.

They have made a mess out of this story... and I dont know how they can fix it. Its very disappointing :-(.

Anyway... I read what u said to Janhvi about ur wrist and hope it will be better very soon. Do take it easy and all the best.

Miss u tonnes,

Ash

Dear Shyamala,

Hi Shyamala,
Thank you for the eloquent response and generous praise (not sure if well deserved).
As for the 'higher cause' I am sorry I didnt inject enough indications of sarcasm to really show how I felt about it. I disagree hotly with the higher cause being high at all. I do understand where the characters are coming from(I think) though.
You are right, Arjun is neither happy or resigned. That is the biggest problem with the cause. If Arjun was a car, this would be moot. My point is Arjun knows that inherently Purvi gave him up not because she didnt love him but she thought enough of their closeness together to ask him to sacrifice for her. She asked him to give up his happiness for her instead of his life which he was willing to. Arjun agreed to that in principle and is moving with the motions to make that happen. However, it just is not possible in real life. This giving up of happiness unlike that of life is a constant ask. Neither Purvi nor Arjun realized this and that is where it is important that Arjun communicate his misery to everyone. That he is indeed giving up every moment's joy in his life for Purvi.
Purvi is Arjun's and only Arjun's offender. She gave him nothing to live by in return for his sacrifice. Having said that, what can she give him? She can love him from afar but that only makes him more miserable. Truth is, Purvi has nothing to offer Arjun anymore in their current relationship. If she so much as glanced at him, she will be persecuted by everyone.
My point really is not about how much Ovi loves Arjun. She may very well love him more than Purvi. However, Ovi, like Varsha is keeping Arjun around to satisfy her mental equation that she has the company of the man she loves. She has not deciphered yet that in order to get that company she is cutting him off from where he would rather be. This is where Purvi and Ovi differ. Both are making Arjun miserable but Purvi did it for her mother who gave her a life but Ovi is doing it for herself. Both have wronged Arjun but in case of Purvi, Archana has unwittingly been the cause that Arjun was sacrificed for and specifically, Archana's relationship with Manav and their kids.
In a very warped way, this is akin to Purvi undergoing a heart transplant for Ovi so Ovi can then pursuade Manav to be nice to Archana. Of course it is complicated because the heart itself would rather not be transplanted and is holding a grouse against her..sort of like its rejecting the transplantee Ovi which is making her more miserable. This is wrong on so many levels.
1. I think Manav and Archana are wrong fundamentally for making their mistakes so pathetic that other people feel the need to fix them.
2. Manav is solely to blame for letting his daughter hold his relationship with his wife as leverage to blackmail another innocent person.
3. Archana and Manav are to be blamed for not demanding this marriage be annulled on the day of based on the premise it was built.
4. Ovi is culpable of blackmailing Purvi.
5. Purvi is accountable to Arjun for making him do the impossible for her when she is clearly unhappy with the proceedings.

To reiterate, I dont agree with their rationale at all (anybody's), just am not frustrated by it.

Shyamala dearest,

I am not even sure how to tell this anymore, but will try. Say, in a real world, a guy married to a sister is eyeing his SIL, what does society think of that guy's character? I ask my mother, and she goes 'Chee cheee'. So, I am in agreement you dear mom (my warm regards again to her) and her extremely soft and well spoken words ... I am, of course, very harsh. As for me, the boots aren't enough anymore...he needs a...

Now, my take Arjun's case. Loved one sister and got married to another. This character is a 20+yr successful businessman from Canada (and in Canada sex education starts in Grade 4). He took, I am assuming many decisions in his life, but as soon as Purvi came into his life, he starts taking all wrong decisions. Is that what love should do? No, love should empower both.

He marries Ovi on his own accord and then start eyeing Purvi, his SIL again. Confused, how? What is the confusion? Is he a 5 yr old? No, a MBA from a reputed institution I assume, with a track record of being a successful businessman. But, he is confused and so runs after Purvi after marriage? Confused, yeah, right? 21^st century confusion, I am assuming.

No dear, he isn't confused. He is 2 timing both the girls again as he has done before. Please don't say, he is unsure of the law (being the maalik of a few companies and more, that doesn't suit his characterization anymore) and his right to divorce, or with his money he can't try and get one. But, no, he runs after Purvi, besides giving mix signals to Ovi and defending himself of his trustworthiness when faced with Ovi's question. What does he do, he just defend some more...guilty yes, confused really? If his love for Purvi has made him so, is this true love? Not in my dictionary.

Hmm...not a negative character, but that of a confused soul? No, dear, I can't accept this explanation. Sure, it exempt him of his wrongdoings towards both girls, but, it is a conscious choice he is making and so it turns him negative in my eyes. Maybe, he doesn't want to decide one way or the other. You know there are plenty of men like that too. There is a reason, why we say, "Saali adi-ghar bali". And sadly, these aren't rare events either...it happens in reality...who says PR doesn't show reality, they sure do...

No society accepts a Jeeju/saali relationship and this, if it happens, will come with a price. And, if this is how Arjun plans to stay, the price will be more for Purvi to pay.

As for, to sacrifice is to love - Sorry, don't agree with that concept either. To love is to either get married or love the other person from afar without disturbing his/her kamana (desire). If there are oppositions in a love affair, one needs to work on getting the consent and blessing of elders in the family. Anything other than marriage and done under the pretext of love or whatever, is considered illegitimate. What Purvi and Arjun did were wrong for themselves and other too (I am not saying Ovi isn't wrong, but her mistake in my eyes are different and is truly getting a karmic punishment for her stupidity). The wrong was carried on and fulfilled by Purvi and Arjun accepted it and now is carrying on another farce and falsely leading on Ovi. You might not agree with me, if I say, Ovi is being the nave one here and is being lead on both by Arjun and Purvi (and Archana too with her lecturing on trust), but then perhaps, that is her Karmic punishment (her blindly trusting Arjun and Archana)...such, a karmic punishment for sheer stupidity..

Btw, I loved your humor in the PS, economical shaardha and well on Purvi (apt 😉)

Originally posted by: Punarvivah

Hello Shyamala ( hope you dont mind me addressing you by the first name, I find that easier. In case you forgot, mine is Priya and call me by that anyway).
I am an intermittent PR watcher although not at all invested in any of the characters. I do like the complexities in PR. They are fun...I have been keeping up with the last few months pretty well so feel like I can comment on the state.
As for Arjun, I think he has been thoroughly blindsided by Purvi. He is in shock and yet to recover from it. His relationship with her died a sudden and unforeseen death. He just hasnt come to terms with it yet. Its only been a month and so much else has happened around them that they should be forgiven for not having dwelt on it.
I think Arjun loves Purvi wholeheartedly and more than that, admires her immensely. Arjun knows that Purvi gave their relationship up for a higher cause. To Purvi, Arjun was the only thing she had of her own to give for Aayi as the eternal thank you. In that it was a very personal thing she asked him. He was hers and she asked him to go be someone else's for her. I kind of get it. I can also buy that he is living with Ovi to fulfill Purvi's word. Arjun has to prove to Purvi how much he loves Purvi by putting up with Ovi. This is Purvi's demand.
Purvi is the child no one wanted or needs anymore. She has no place to be. She has given everything she had and more until her presence needs to be snuffed out as we see. She will make herself scarce soon.
The worst of this unholy triangle is Ovi. See Ovi knew Purvi wouldnt ever not give everything for her mother. She knew Purvi relationship with Arjun didnt stand a chance. In fact if Ovi went to Arjun for the same thing, he would have done the same too. Ovi has inserted herself into the relationship between Purvi and Arjun. Purvi and Arjun are helplessly bound in this for two people. Ovi and Archana. More than any one else, Ovi is answerable to her mother for ruining Purvi's life because Ovi put a condition that unless Purvi gives her back her toy (husband), Ovi wont talk to her own mother.

As to how this should unravel, Archana should confront Ovi and make her file for the divorce. Purvi should walk away and make herself useful in a different town until that is done and Arjun should make how miserable he is in his marriage apparent to all and sundry.

IMHO it has nothing to do with being an adult or otherwise, one can get manipulated at any age by the people who have leverage.

Punarvivah,
Completely agree with you. This is what I think too, but I wouldn't have done such a good job as you, with this one and the next post of yours with much explanation.
It feels glad to read something that it is in your head and of hundreds of posts find one that exactly says it out. Thank You.

Dear Shyamala,
Don't know what the hullabaloo was it in the thread you mentioned, but to simply answer or to add to yours, I would say the same - Arjun hasn't turned negative.

If he had, he wouldn't have tried to stick with this marriage with Ovi and also do what Purvi asked/asks him to do all the time, whether he likes it, or whether it makes him happy or not.

He has always been a good person, did not mean ill of anyone and he is still the same. If being a good person he gets to be called foolish or whatever else, so be it.

Hope you are taking good care of your wrist.
Happy Deepavali to you too.