Do you think the Ramayan and Mahabharat are real? - Page 2

Of course they are real! I believe in Mahabharat and Ramayan both with my heart, soul, and any other body part~!

Originally posted by: MusicalAiswarya

Of course they are real! I believe in Mahabharat and Ramayan both with my heart, soul, and any other body part~!

Good point.. but believing in these epics is not tantamount to trusting their historicity.. You also believe in many other Gods whose historical presence on Earth is never ever determined (e.g. Devi Sarasvati, Lord Brahma).. So, these two are very different things.. Our faith in these epics doesn't prove their historicity.. Here, we are trying to find out the historical existence of Lord Ram and Krishna without questioning our faith in them.. 😊

Originally posted by: godisone

What's the need of praying to fictional characters? (------) Why is Diwali celebrated? Why is Ram-Navami celebrated? Or Krishna Jayanti? Why to we pray to Mata Sita and Rama if they are purely fictional characters?

(------)

Why would all of our Hindu festivals exist if Rama and Krishna were not real? Don't say they were real, but the Ramayana and Mahabharat were not, because that does not make sense at all. Shri Ram came from the Ramayana, and Shri Krishna came from the Mahabharata. Without those epics, they don't exist.

Historical existence is not the basis of my faith in God.. There are many other Gods whose historical existence is never ever determined and who exists in our mythology and faith only (e.g. Lord Brahma, Goddess Saraswati etc.). From your point of view, we should not pray these gods just because they are not historical.. Is that you want to say?

@shyam.rathi

I wasn't questioning your faith. Rather, I was asking a rhetorical question. And I understand your explanation, but believing in Vishnu, Shiva, Brahma, Saraswati, Lakshmi, Ganesh, etc. is different from believing in Ram and Krishna, because while the above listed names are fully Gods, Ram and Krishna were incarnations of Gods.
Many people say Ramayana and Mahabharata were fictional fairy tales. I'm just saying that if they were (which I don't believe as you know), wouldn't that make Ram and Krishna fictional characters? Why do people in general pray to Ramji and Krishnaji?
Because they were incarnations of Gods who were born on Earth to rid the world of evil. It is different praying to Vishnu from praying to Ram, because if a foreigner asks you, "Who is Vishnu?" You will say, "He is one of the divine trinity who is one of our most prayed to Gods."
But if someone asks you, "Who is Ram?" You will say, "He is the son of Dasharath, the husband of Sita, the brother of Lakshman, and the slayer of Ravan."
Do you get my train of thought? Basically, what I'm saying is, if the Ramayana is not real, what would that make Ram? Who would he be? You can't say, "He is an incarnation of Vishnu, the son of Dasharath, the wife of Sita, the brother of Lakshman, and the slayer of Ravan," while also saying, "The Ramayana never happened because science does not prove it."
You can easily answer when someone asks you who is Vishnu, Shiva, Brahma, Lakshmi, Saraswati, Parvathi, Ganesha, etc, because they are only Gods, and they have more of a background than life on Earth, but Ram was not only a God like Vishnu. He was also a human, and he never knew he was a God until after he killed Ravan, when the Devtas told him. Until then, he always thought of himself as the son of Dasharath and Kaushalya.
What I'm saying is, it is meaningless to say you that the Ramayana and Mahabharata never happened, but Ram and Krishna are real and Gods. The Ramayana and Mahabharata are not only history, they are the life stories of Ram and Krishna.
Let's say someone from the very far future said you exist, but your life story doesn't. (I know it's a bad example). How is that possible? How can Ram and Krishna exist without the Ramayana and Mahabharata. They didn't just appear in heaven. They appeared on Earth, and their story took place on Earth.

Again, I never questioned your faith. I was just asking a rhetorical question.
Ram Navami was the birth of Ram, and Krishna Jayanthi is the birth of Krishna. If you believe that Ram and Krishna were born, and if you celebrate these holidays, that means you believe the Ramayana and Mahabharata happened.
You say God doesn't need science to prove him. Okay, I agree. But what if that God got reborn on Earth? Either way, history is history. No matter who takes place on Earth: God or our soul reborn, whatever happens is history. Science doesn't need to prove the God in heaven, but science can very well proove the God that's on Earth. Science doesn't need to proove Vishnu or Shiva, but it can/will proove Ram and Krishna, because they were incarnations of Gods born as humans.

One more thing: are you saying that only everything science prooves is real? Is science really that dependent? Why do people put so much importance on science? The world itself is a mystery, and there are billions of mysteries in it. Some of them, science prooved, but the rest of them, it may proove them in the future, or it may never proove them. There is only so much that science can do, and there is only so much that scientists can do. Think about now. Even you know that there are so many things out there that still need discovering. Does that make them unreal for now, because science didn't proove them?

I think the mindset of some people should change (I'm not talking about you😳), because they are not ready to let go of the age old theory of when the world was created, or when the first human being came on Earth. They could be wrong.
You say science doesn't need to proove God, and for some people, it doesn't, because some are very strong in their faith that God is real, and our Hindu epics are real. They don't need science to proove them, but others only believe what is prooven or seen. Let alone the Ramayana and Mahabharata, many people don't believe in God because science doesn't proove him. At least for those kind of people, science needs to proove that Ramayana and Mahabharata are real, because if the believe in Ram and Krishna, they will automatically believe in the other Gods.

Again, I will try my best to find "proof" for you, but it will take time, b/c I am still v.v. busy.

I think this is an open ended discussion ..Lalitha, scientists don't indulge too much in religious issues just like Ram sethu issue and dwarka issue..Acc. to the believers, Sri Lanka was the Lanka of Ramayan but therez no proof...i know i've heard a lot of documentries like they've found the corpse of Ravan and they've found Sanjivani booti parbat n all...but is there any scientific proof? i mean has anybody dated them to be of that era? nobody can bec. religious sentiments are attached to it..

Originally posted by: luv_khwaish

I think this is an open ended discussion ..Lalitha, scientists don't indulge too much in religious issues just like Ram sethu issue and dwarka issue..Acc. to the believers, Sri Lanka was the Lanka of Ramayan but therez no proof...i know i've heard a lot of documentries like they've found the corpse of Ravan and they've found Sanjivani booti parbat n all...but is there any scientific proof? i mean has anybody dated them to be of that era? nobody can bec. religious sentiments are attached to it..

i saw the documentry of Ravan's corpse..it said that nobody could reach that place but it's there! whatz the proof that it's Ravan's corpse? it can be any person from the past right? just like egyptian mummies..

Shyam is right..we must take it that these epics are an integral part of our culture , of our religion but we must not try to prove that this was history....If someone tries to find out more about these geographical evidences , others won't allow him to do so bec. if it's proved otherwise, nobody would accept it n they will take it as an insult.....that's why in past NASA backed out of Ram sethu project...anything in India which is of religious significance becomes a touchy topic.....tht Shiv Sena will start it's protests!! where was this Shiv Sena when Mumbai was attacked by the terrorists? they are not holding any protests now...they r only interested in diverting people's mind to useless matters ..BJP's hindutva agenda makes sure people are not educated in our relgion , they want us to have blind faith.....

i'm sorry i went off the topic but i hate it when religion is mixed with politics ..No person is interested in finding out the truth!!

Thanks Charu! hats off to you.. Please keep contributing to this discussion.. I hope that others also join us.. seems that only I, you and Lalitha are active in this discussion..

Originally posted by: luv_khwaish

I think this is an open ended discussion ..Lalitha, scientists don't indulge too much in religious issues just like Ram sethu issue and dwarka issue..Acc. to the believers, Sri Lanka was the Lanka of Ramayan but therez no proof...i know i've heard a lot of documentries like they've found the corpse of Ravan and they've found Sanjivani booti parbat n all...but is there any scientific proof? i mean has anybody dated them to be of that era? nobody can bec. religious sentiments are attached to it..

i saw the documentry of Ravan's corpse..it said that nobody could reach that place but it's there! whatz the proof that it's Ravan's corpse? it can be any person from the past right? just like egyptian mummies..

Shyam is right..we must take it that these epics are an integral part of our culture , of our religion but we must not try to prove that this was history....If someone tries to find out more about these geographical evidences , others won't allow him to do so bec. if it's proved otherwise, nobody would accept it n they will take it as an insult.....that's why in past NASA backed out of Ram sethu project...anything in India which is of religious significance becomes a touchy topic.....tht Shiv Sena will start it's protests!! where was this Shiv Sena when Mumbai was attacked by the terrorists? they are not holding any protests now...they r only interested in diverting people's mind to useless matters ..BJP's hindutva agenda makes sure people are not educated in our relgion , they want us to have blind faith.....

i'm sorry i went off the topic but i hate it when religion is mixed with politics ..No person is interested in finding out the truth!!

Yeah, where is everyone? Only Charu, Shyam, and I are discussing. Some fresh opinions and explanations would be nice, but for me personally, this discussion has become boring, just like the Draupadi issue became boring a while back.😊

I believe that some parts are real. But later interpolations happened and people added stories. So everything is not real.

Originally posted by: godisone

so we might as well call it a tie or whatever...

Tie?? We were not playing a game yar... 😳

Originally posted by: godisone

I will continue to believe Ramayan and Mahabharat are history, and if others don't, it doesn't matter

WIth this thinking, you should have never started this discussion.. you only started the poll asking people about the historicity of MB and Ramayana.. then how can you say that if others don't agree with you, it doesn't matter to you.. ?
I guess you can't indulge in a discussion with this mindset.. thats why i keep saying, if you have faith in something, never ever bring it in public.. faith is purely an internal matter.. 😛