Akbar - MUZ Kids :: Part-6 : JA is NOT Fiction - Page 15

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Arieltabi thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago

Originally posted by: Sandhya.A


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While Akbar cared for every relative of his, even the evil and worthless ones, his successors were power hungry and ruthless indeed. Salim revolted against his doting father as he wanted the throne soon, and blinded his own son Khusrau as he sought power and revolted against him. Shah Jahan and Aurangazeb did killed a whole bunch of family members to claim the throne. 😔
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Really its a shame that none of his successors were like him
PutijaChalhov thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
^^^

very interesting discussion I feel Akbar worked very hard to put in place his legacy and he suffered from when he was a kid he was the one who built the empire had a vision learnt to overcome his narrow thinking developed himself as a liberal human being he missed his parents was far away from them and had to win back his empire expand

His children Jehangir got so much on a silver plate they did not face any hardships like Akbar probably all spoilt and indulged them including Akbar I dont mean to say they did not undergo rigrous training they went through that including studies but they are treading on the path their father Akbar the great made actually the concept of secularism mansabs (small states or districts with mansabdars to rule is something which is still being followed in India maybe the form changed a bit ) using the local kings Rajas as heads thus getting the locals as loyals ,collecting taxes allocating some to them and some to him all these as a concept attributed to Akbar.
And the Children behaved with jealousy wanted power indulged themselves with wine women money and power lesser degree in Akbar's children but detoriated as the generations went by worse was Aurangzeb who killed/disabled /imprisoned most of his able sons grandsons or whoever he perceived as threat to him as a heir thus brought inglory to the glorious rule and peak the Mughal empire which Akbar built up.

There is a saying in our region that no other tree can grow under a large banyan tree so probably Akbar was to great for his sons to raise above him.

None had a wife like Jodha who was a soulmate who had great principals in life hence we always think of only Akbar the great who is high on a pedastal had he not left such wealth we would not have had Tajmahal or Shahjahanbad or Red fort etc and other architerctural wonders of the mughal era.
Edited by PutijaChalhov - 11 years ago
Arieltabi thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago

Originally posted by: ann2012



Shah Jahan killed Khusrau in 1922-23. Shahryar just after he ascended the throne. Also, sons of Daniyal (Shah Jahan's uncle) were put to death for supporting Shahryar. All these murders were carried out by Asaf Khan.

Parviz died in 1626. His daughter was married to Dara Shikoh, Shah Jahan's eldest son.


So that mean he let the daughters live. As they can't seat on throne.
ann2012 thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago

Originally posted by: Arieltabi


So that mean he let the daughters live. As they can't seat on throne.


Exactly. He killed his chief rivals, no matter how close in relation they were, and allowed the daughters to live.
Edited by ann2012 - 11 years ago
Sandhya.A thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago

Originally posted by: PutijaChalhov

^^^

very interesting discussion I feel Akbar worked very hard to put in place his legacy and he suffered from when he was a kid he was the one who built the empire had a vision learnt to overcome his narrow thinking developed himself as a liberal human being he missed his parents was far away from them and had to win back his empire expand

His children Jehangir got so much on a silver plate they did not face any hardships like Akbar probably all spoilt and indulged them including Akbar I dont mean to say they did not undergo rigrous training they went through that including studies but they are treading on the path their father Akbar the great made actually the concept of secularism mansabs (small states or districts with mansabdars to rule is something which is still being followed in India maybe the form changed a bit ) using the local kings Rajas as heads thus getting the locals as loyals ,collecting taxes allocating some to them and some to him all these as a concept attributed to Akbar.
And the Children behaved with jealousy wanted power indulged themselves with wine women money and power lesser degree in Akbar's children but detoriated as the generations went by worse was Aurangzeb who killed/disabled /imprisoned most of his able sons grandsons or whoever he perceived as threat to him as a heir thus brought inglory to the glorious rule and peak the Mughal empire which Akbar built up.

There is a saying in our region that no other tree can grow under a large banyan tree so probably Akbar was to great for his sons to raise above him.

None had a wife like Jodha who was a soulmate who had great principals in life hence we always think of only Akbar the great who is high on a pedastal had he not left such wealth we would not have had Tajmahal or Shahjahanbad or Red fort etc and other architerctural wonders of the mughal era.

Oh Please, don't zero in everything on the romantic angle please. Just as Kaana rightly said earlier, upbringing alone doesn't make a person. Neither does birth or spouse or soulmate. A person is what he makes himself. All other factors are only influences.
PutijaChalhov thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago

Originally posted by: Sandhya.A

Oh Please, don't zero in everything on the romantic angle please. Just as Kaana rightly said earlier, upbringing alone doesn't make a person. Neither does birth or spouse or soulmate. A person is what he makes himself. All other factors are only influences.



There is no romantic part there it is a fact that Akbar had a wide range of personal experiences/hardships/ situations and history itself tells he changed a lot in his later life I feel Jodha was an allrounder she had love compassion humanity politics soildier everything my POV she did not ever want power or rule like Nurjahan or just an eternal sweetheart like Mumtaz mahal for whom Shahjahan built Tajmahal it is the whole an all in one woman that she is so if you see only romance you feel it is that but if see in another angle its beyond a far superior all in one woman a perfect soulmate.

Akbar is the one who is broadminded person who learnt accepted lot of others guidance and usually he came up with his own unique ideas I am reading a lot of books papers on him and this is my POV
Edited by PutijaChalhov - 11 years ago
adiana12 thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
lively discussion Sandhya. I had sent you a Buddy request. Will send you a link of some published research papers by some of the foremost historians of India on Akbar. It will make you fall in love with this man all over again!!!!!
Kaana thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago

Originally posted by: PutijaChalhov



There is no romantic part there it is a fact that Akbar had a wide range of personal experiences/hardships/ situations and history itself tells he changed a lot in his later life I feel Jodha was an allrounder she had love compassion humanity politics soildier everything my POV she did not ever want power or rule like Nurjahan or just an eternal sweetheart like Mumtaz mahal for whom Shahjahan built Tajmahal it is the whole an all in one woman that she is so if you see only romance you feel it is that but if see in another angle its beyond a far superior all in one woman a perfect soulmate.

Akbar is the one who is broadminded person who learnt accepted lot of others guidance and usually he came up with his own unique ideas I am reading a lot of books papers on him and this is my POV

Guys, again sorry to come in between your conversation. But as I was quoted, I thought would clarify and contribute what little I could.
I am with Sandhya of the view that a person is made more of himself. But this does not underestimate the influence of others. The influencers are the catalyst who deserve the credit for bringing about the change, while I do agree that the change could not have been possible if the person had not allowed himself to be influenced.
Example: Despite the advise of Mandodari, the chaste, noble and intellignet wife of Ravana, Ravana still continued his bad deed.
So, Akbar was great enough to listen to and learn from others. To me this is his most adorable quality. But, this does not mean Jodha's role in this can be written off. If Jodha had not been there, Akbar would not had the opportunity for the transformation. As if it was otherwise, he would have anyway been so. So, due credits to Jodha as well for all the good that has happened. The fact that he loved, more than that, valued Jodha so much is evident from the posts and power that he had given her. Akbar is no fool to blindly give away so much power and place trust on someone who is just beautiful or he lusts over. He appreciates her capabilities, her intelligence, the effective role she plays and values and honours it as well. And this also in turn points to Akbar's maturity and magnanimity.
While a dull student learns from the teacher, who coaches him with heart and soul sincerely wishing the student well and excels in the exam takes credit for his best effort and performance, the role of the teacher cannot be ignored. Now, don't pounce on that I called Akbar dull - pl, don't stretch the example 😊
Our own great tradition, places the Guru on such a high pedestal. Though the individual has to put his own effort for the ultimate knowledge, without the Guru's grace and knowledge from him, the sishya cannot attain the highest state. Now, is it meaningful to argue which role is better. Both are required, as one without the other cannot yield the result. Neither can Guru's grace without individual's effort nor effort alone can produce the result.
Likewise, according to me , both the role of Jalal and Jodha are imperative in the making of Akbar the Great.
adiana12 thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
I am not of the opinion that if Jodha had not been there Akbar's 'transformation' would not have happened - that is giving undue importance in the life of on 'human' to another 'human', when the doer and the one doing, both happen to be the Universe - if not Jodha it would have been another - and if not in his life as Akbar then it would have been another - Jodha was a key that the Universe presented to Akbar - and Akbar responded becoz he had evolved to the stage where he was ready to move to the next level - infact Jodha was not the only key in Akbar's life - there were many others - and only a soul which is the state of 'Being' can recognize these keys and utilize them to open the doors of evolution - infact if one reads thru every event of Akbar's life one would realise that everyone who touched his life - whether good or evil - was a key - and Akbar was one such soul who realised this and used all these keys to open all the locked doors of his soul.
Kaana thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago

Originally posted by: adianasr

I am not of the opinion that if Jodha had not been there Akbar's 'transformation' would not have happened - that is giving undue importance in the life of on 'human' to another 'human', when the doer and the one doing, both happen to be the Universe - if not Jodha it would have been another - and if not in his life as Akbar then it would have been another - Jodha was a key that the Universe presented to Akbar - and Akbar responded becoz he had evolved to the stage where he was ready to move to the next level - infact Jodha was not the only key in Akbar's life - there were many others - and only a soul which is the state of 'Being' can recognize these keys and utilize them to open the doors of evolution - infact if one reads thru every event of Akbar's life one would realise that everyone who touched his life - whether good or evil - was a key - and Akbar was one such soul who realised this and used all these keys to open all the locked doors of his soul.

Hey Adia., awesome to hear from you. As this seem more of a response to my post, let me take the liberty to share my thoughts on this. Just my POV, no offence or defense meant😊 While I agree that it need not have been Jodha and could have been anyone else who could have brought about the change, it could also be that it could have been none else who could have brought about it too, for arugments sake😊
As the history itself is debatable now and as the serial is also debatable now, we all seem to rely on what we seem to believe in based on what we want to believe in. So, I would not want to discuss this based on the history or the serial, while I could also do so if anyone would also based on these, as hereagain it is my views based on what I believe just the other's belief, and neither can be questioned.
So, from a general perspective, all I am saying is that influencers cannot be ignored, while the fact remains that the receipient is the key to putting it into action. There could be many influencers in one's life but that cannot belittle the role any of the influencer as they had their own share as well.
On the doership, for that matter, i would even go beyond and even question the doership? Who is the doer really? And who causes the action as well? Even if one was used as instrument, where someone else could have been instead, the fact that this one is used as an instrument instead of another, can still be given credit. Just as Akbar, a part of the Universe, can be credited for evolving, the Jodha that was presented as the key, can also be credited for being so. It is all the Universe's doing ultimately, but it also about the standpoint from which it is being looked at. If I can quote, the paramartic and vyavaharic standpoint cannot be mixed. If it is viewed from the Universal standpoint, then where is the question of Akbar or Jodha entities, let alone their individual role. And if one of their role can be accepted, the other's can also be, would be my humble view.

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