How love at the tarazu helped Jalal forgive Bakshi! - Page 9

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ShadeOfWhite thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#81
Mansi, as usual beautifully explained.😳 I agree with you completely. And yes, I liked the episode unlike many of the members here.😊
"I do not know about all of you friends, but I thought it was so significant that Jalal had his face turned away from Jodha for all the rest of the arguments, but when she said that last sentence about her own pain, he felt compelled to turn and look at her and her pain was reflected in his eyes. I think the rest of the arguments gave him his rationalizations, but it was his love of Jodha that really won him over. He couldn't bear to see her in pain!This is my feeling!"

no, you are not alone. I am with you in this. I even wrote about this in other threads. As soon as Jodha talked about her pain, Jalal seemed moved. It was the last blow to him. He cannot see Jodha in pain. Jodha knows Jalal's nerves very well. She knows Jalal will seek for logic as being a Shehenshah and as a brother emotions will work. Jodha stated her points rationally. She hit the right chord of Jalal. She hit him with both logic and emotions. Logic that convinced the Shehenshah Jalal, emotions that melted the brother and a husband Jalal. Jodha pointed out the unborn child's would be troubled childhood with Jalal's one decision. Jalal also had a trouble childhood. He is very well aware of the pain. He was almost convinced then she comes with her own pain seeing BB in pain and those tears of hers were enough for Jalal to forgive BB. He simply cannot see his Jodha in pain.❤️
Edited by tamy267 - 11 years ago
surjyotapa thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#82

Originally posted by: Sandhya.A

Maddy,
Your two streams of justice is a hard reality indeed. The peasant will be sar kalmofied for even making such a suggestion.
Jodha can forgive BB and Shariffu as she is the prime offended in the case. The argument should end there and Jalal could let Shariffu and BB out due to Jodha's request like he consented to Ruqaiya's and Mirza Hakim's request.
But no! It will leave it equal to Ruqaiya forgiving Adham. There had to be something more to Jodha's forgivance. So this nirdosh baalak bhaashan. The CVs have tried to make it sound as though she has appealed to the brother and not the king...but the whole part of the argument came out hollow. As Kajri, she shined with the man in Jalal and not the king. Was that not enough? Couldn't they have extended that. They don't have to ' appeal to the man, appeal to the brother...not the king' everytime, because it is ultimately the king that has to forgive in all these cases.
I was just quoting AK as an example. But forgiving any criminal, rich or poor, just because their children will be affected is far from justice.


I am following this debate and this is really interesting one. When jodha gave the 'nirdosh balak' explanation that was not 100% correct, but remembering that punishment scene I can say that Jodha's argument was right.

In DEK jalal gave Jodha the responsibility to punish bakshi banu, as a king his verdict was given. HB told that brother won over shahenshah, so jalal gave jodha this responsibility. Jodha pardoned her.

After that Jalal said , "bakshi hamara bhi gunehgar hay,aur aaj se un ke saath hamara koi rishta nehi hay ... etc" ... this punishment was given by Bakshi's brother not by the shahenshah. A brother was hurt that day, his broken heart could not forgive his sisters's 'beimani'. He was bleeding inside, jodha understood that and she was trying to heal that brother inside him, brother and shahenshah fight was on.

Jodha knew that ... so today she appealed to that brother, told him that justice has been done long before, brother should forgive his sister now for that unborn child. Those dialogues were really well written.

What no one can see, Jodha can see, jodha can feel his hurt,his conflict, his inside battle. So jodha helped him, she will do it every time when jalal will be in pain ... she was doing everything because of jalal, not for bakshi, knowingly or unknowingly.

skanda12 thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#83

Originally posted by: sweet_diksha

very beautiful analysis , Mansi... very positive...

but one complaint i have to make, and that too only abt urself, and u only have to answer it...

u know, it's only coz of u we r getting the same precap, repeated one more day... remember in ur last post, u had said that u r so 'captivated' (my word for u) by the precap, that u can watch it for the full day... and ur connection with Balaji is so strong, that they give in to ur wish, and gave u one more day to watch it... so keep enjoying...😉😆😆

Diksha, I didn't know they will grant all my wishes, next time I will be careful not to praise the precap so much that they give the same precap every day!😆😆😆😆😆😆

just kidding... but yest after watching the same precap, i first remembered u and said to myself, why Mansi wished it???

ok...so abt the episode...yes, the episode was good if not very beautiful... and it certainly Jo capivating Jalal's mind and life... and yes, MA have guessed it right... hope Ruku doesn't understand it so soon, before AkDha exchange those words of love for eachother... which i m hoping next week..

did u noticed the expressions in his eyes while he gets BB back to her room, and makes her sit carefully and then turns to look at Jo... that time the look , he gives her... mindblowing... it has every expression in it, which Jalal wants to share with Jo, but can't say it...
Yes, indeed, Diksha what an awesome shot that was!

i loved their scene together... even without touching eachother , they were together all the time...and Jo all the time looked like Jalal's Begum and not a rajvanshi shehzaadi... perfectly tuned to Mughal laws, and using it perfectly... i m sure, Just as he was moved by his words, he will be once again impressed by her forgiving nature and her purity that she puts others above herself, that she didn't care that Jalal might punish her for meeting BB, and even managed to make him understand /accept his own feelings... i m sure, in coming episode, we will see him talking to her abt it, once again testing her for her actions and her words... and that will be interesting to see.
Diksha, actually more than these hand holdings and food feedings, I love this kind of silent eye-speaking romance. So yes, I loved all the silent byplay of love yesterday, even though some people legitimately feel that overt romance was missing ... and even some people have said Jodha's bhashan was too long but I didn't think so. I thought it was loaded with meaning and very beautifully sequenced.

abt precap, hope we don't get to see it again for tomorrow...

skanda12 thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#84

Originally posted by: tamy267

Mansi, as usual beautifully explained.😳 I agree with you completely. And yes, I liked the episode unlike many of the members here.😊

"I do not know about all of you friends, but I thought it was so significant that Jalal had his face turned away from Jodha for all the rest of the arguments, but when she said that last sentence about her own pain, he felt compelled to turn and look at her and her pain was reflected in his eyes. I think the rest of the arguments gave him his rationalizations, but it was his love of Jodha that really won him over. He couldn't bear to see her in pain!This is my feeling!"

no, you are not alone. I am with you in this. I even wrote about this in other threads. As soon as Jodha talked about her pain, Jalal seemed moved. It was the last blow to him. He cannot see Jodha in pain. Jodha knows Jalal's nerves very well. She knows Jalal will seek for logic as being a Shehenshah and as a brother emotions will work. Jodha stated her points rationally. She hit the right chord of Jalal. She hit him with both logic and emotions. Logic that convinced the Shehenshah Jalal, emotions that melted the brother and a husband Jalal. Jodha pointed out the unborn child's would be troubled childhood with Jalal's one decision. Jalal also had a trouble childhood. He is very well aware of the pain. He was almost convinced then she comes with her own pain seeing BB in pain and those tears of hers were enough for Jalal to forgive BB. He simply cannot see his Jodha in pain.❤️

Tamy, its lovely that you also enjoyed that scene as much as I did!😃😃
sweet_diksha thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#85


abt 'Jo's Bhashan', even my sister said, WOW , today Jo gave him Bhashan without the word 'Ghrina' in it... may be that's why Jalal is more happy, that no ghrina from Jo, and so he forgave BB.. ok , she too was joking... coz while watching these soaps together, all three of us (me , my sis and my bro) , keep cracking few jokes ... and so when she said bhashan without ghrina word, i too laughed for a min.

yes, i loved her every word, just like i had loved Jalal talking to his subjects after Jo was saved... it just showed how much she is getting involved in all Mughal laws, and customs and the way she is accepting everything 'RELATED TO JALAL'... coz yest while talking to him, all those things, she took proper care that he remains connected either way she says abt his criminal, his sister, the mother to unborn child , and makes him understand his responsibility towards every relation...

and finally the unspoken connection btw them...
Edited by sweet_diksha - 11 years ago
fatma201 thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#86

Originally posted by: Sandhya.A


</div>
<div>
<font face="Georgia, Times New Roman, Times, serif">Maddy</font>

<font face="Georgia, Times New Roman, Times, serif">The first reason is very valid. Being the prime offended, she had the right to forgive BB and Shariffu, just like Ruqaiya and Mirza Hakim had.</font>


<font face="Georgia, Times New Roman, Times, serif">I also agree with Mansi that Jodha's pain moved Jalal, the way it did when she spoke for Bharmal to him.</font>


<font face="Georgia, Times New Roman, Times, serif">But the second reason is totally unacceptable. So if Javeda is pregnant when AK kills Atga, does he stand to be pardoned as his nirdosh unborn child will miss his parents and thus be harmed. For that matter all criminals and offenders and gaddars will have family and children who will miss their father and suffer when the father is punished. Can all criminals with born and unborn children go scott free then? As otherwise their nirdosh baalaks will question Jalal 'hamara aparadh kya hai'.</font>



Thanks Sandhya, you wrote the exact points that I had in mind
deejagi thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#87
Mansi, sorry for the late response and thanks for the lovely update.
For a change I liked even the Ruqu & Maham scene. it had lots of message.
Loved the way Ruqu retorted him that if he had already decided to not to pardan BB, then why did he ask their opinions? Even though every one pointyed about the crime and the law of the nation, they still insisted in their own way, why BB should be pardaned. That was qquite nice.
Jodha had felt that she lost her ground in getting forgiveness for BB from Jalal and Salima Begum's words gave her the ray of hope and she caught it tight like a drwoing man gets hold of a floating starw for his help. Immediately she appealed to HB about her mindset that she will try her luck yet again by approacing Bakshi Banu's brother. Now she was clear that, Jalaluddin Mohammad, the Emperor is too strong and his will is much more styronger than his outer shell. Hence she thought of sneaking through that outer shell and reach the brother and convince him to help her in bringing some hope and happiness to her SIL. Despite the discouragement from Ruqu & Maham, she marched back with the blessings of HB and silent support from SB.
The sulking brother was near the weighing machine as he was unable to weigh the justice to WOMAN who happens to be his brother and yet a traitor, who happens to be a pregnant and yet had played dirty games on someone using teh same theame, who happens to be lonely and yet who affected a lonely new comers with henious crime, who happened to pray for his wife's health and yet unfortunately who was the one who betreyed the same wife by belittling her.
He was unable to weigh the 2 women in his life one who was his life and the one who was affected by her is his life. The one who was affected is advocating for the one who affected her was killing him. He wa sunable to weigh his love for his sister v/s his love for his wife. He was covered with guilt, if he accept his sister back to his folds, will it do unjustice to his wife? If he doesn't, wont he do unjustice to his siter and what about the coming guest, wont he welcome him with hs open arms and enfold him ith affection? But at what cost? The cost is high, it is his wife's honour, her feminity and her integrity. he was LOST.
The came the angel in the right moment when he was unable to decide on who weighs more, a sister or a wife. She came and explained him well that by forgiving his sister he is not faulting his wife as they hold different position in a man's life. To safe guard his wife's integrity, he need not have to hurt his sister and there by himself for not taking care of that unfortunate sister who is all alone now in this world despite having a whole lot of people to call as her own. Because of her (wife), he should not depirve her husban dthe happiness of welcoming his nephew who happens to be the first child of the family. Who happens to be the miniature of his lovely sister. WHo happens to bring the happiness and laughter in teh family which had been deprived of it with the evil effect of dirty people. Who can bring out the softer side of her husband from his coconed dry and hard shell of a shehenshah.
In all her reasoning, I could see her caring for her husband who was grieing for his inability to hug, console congratullate his sister just because his hands are tied in the rope of Justice. She wanted to free him from that bond, so that he can enjoy the life with his beloved sister.
Though it was in the bad taste, but she did felt what it feels to be alone during those days, how a lady long to be with her family, with her brother, sisters, mother and offcourse a caring husband. Under those circumstances, Jodha was deprived of those joy, but she knows how a lady wants all her loved one round her. The memory od those moments had made her eyes moist and in those moistr eyes she asked him (the brother of the accused) to forgive the sister and relieve her husband form the guilt, so taht he can enjoy his life.
I really don't know, whether Jalal forgave Jodha because of her love for BB, or his love for BB or his love for Jodha or did he really saw that immense love for him in Jodha's eyes which was covered behind the stream of tears and accute pain. But end of the day, he was relieved from the big boulder which had been on his shoulder for a long time and had rushed to his sister in right time to save her from teh great fall. Should I presume this as an indication to the future where he saves her from fall into the trap of Shareef and the supposed to be the loss (wither her child, if she really is pregnant now, or from betreying them again unknowingly with her foolish love for her husband by showing her the true face of SD).
I would have watched it with great interest even if Jodha had talked for few more minutes also as each an dvery word she spoke had volumes of meaning.
MaddyO thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#88

Originally posted by: surjyotapa


I am following this debate and this is really interesting one. When jodha gave the 'nirdosh balak' explanation that was not 100% correct, but remembering that punishment scene I can say that Jodha's argument was right.

In DEK jalal gave Jodha the responsibility to punish bakshi banu, as a king his verdict was given. HB told that brother won over shahenshah, so jalal gave jodha this responsibility. Jodha pardoned her.

After that Jalal said , "bakshi hamara bhi gunehgar hay,aur aaj se un ke saath hamara koi rishta nehi hay ... etc" ... this punishment was given by Bakshi's brother not by the shahenshah. A brother was hurt that day, his broken heart could not forgive his sisters's 'beimani'. He was bleeding inside, jodha understood that and she was trying to heal that brother inside him, brother and shahenshah fight was on.

Jodha knew that ... so today she appealed to that brother, told him that justice has been done long before, brother should forgive his sister now for that unborn child. Those dialogues were really well written.

What no one can see, Jodha can see, jodha can feel his hurt,his conflict, his inside battle. So jodha helped him, she will do it every time when jalal will be in pain ... she was doing everything because of jalal, not for bakshi, knowingly or unknowingly.



Line in bold agree totally.
BTW I have again replied to Sandhya for the above, did you read my 2nd reply too?

Glad to see you here, have you seen I copied your post in my reply, page 8 I think

deejagi thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#89

Originally posted by: Sandhya.A

Maddy,
Your two streams of justice is a hard reality indeed. Ouch The peasant will be sar kalmofied for even making such a suggestion.
Jodha can forgive BB and Shariffu as she is the prime offended in the case. The argument should end there and Jalal could let Shariffu and BB out due to Jodha's request like he consented to Ruqaiya's and Mirza Hakim's request.
But no! It will leave it equal to Ruqaiya forgiving Adham. There had to be something more to Jodha's forgivance. So this nirdosh baalak bhaashan. The CVs have tried to make it sound as though she has appealed to the brother and not the king...but the whole part of the argument came out hollow. As Kajri, she shined with the man in Jalal and not the king. Was that not enough? Couldn't they have extended that. They don't have to ' appeal to the man, appeal to the brother...not the king' everytime, because it is ultimately the king that has to forgive in all these cases.
I was just quoting AK as an example. But forgiving any criminal, rich or poor, just because their children will be affected is far from justice.

This is not the first time Jalal pardaned a parent because of the child, even in the initial episodes where the parents were ordered to be jailed had been released since the child had asked him, where will he go as both his parents have been jailed. He had told he knows how difficult it is for a child to live on its own without the support of parents. So it is not because BB is is sister, he pardaned her but as a rule, he did it.
MaddyO thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#90
A final word about the precap:

If I see that precap yet again ... three times in a row ... I'll blow a fuse!

I am wondering if the Shivani Tej track is delayed for a reason? Maybe Shivani will be shown pregnant. So this entire BB track and Jodha's concern for BB will make Jalal remember all this when he considers Shivani-Tej acts.

There seems to be no reason why Jalal can otherwise pardon Tej. If Mayhem part in Shivani elopment comes out Jalal may not punish Shivani but HOW will that not make him punish Tej? Cos what he did was of his own will and he caused harm to Mugal empire ijjat.

This is just my imagination - but that that might make Jalal treat them both differently.

I am not sure what the Shivani Tejwant pardon will entail. I don't think it will be exactly similar to Sharif-BB case!

ABHAY - Thanks for replying to my question about Sharif-BB children. I read your reply and some other posts later which said she gave birth to stillborn child - I guess you will answer soon enough about this new information.



I am just guessing, yes they will not show exactly similar but just as Jodha drew parallel with Ruk-Adham, MH-Bharmal and her-BB then Jalal will be compelled to think about all this, since Shivani Tej will be HIS and MH's culprits, ONLY they have right to pardon them

I cannot think of a reason why he would pardon Tej, (he might pardon Shivani after Shivani tells about Mayhem but I guess Jodha will still ask why Shivani did not trust her) Jalal will think about Jodha-BB equation, what she did for his sister for sure when now Shivani-Tej come before him

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