Jodha Akbar 67: Changing equations? - Page 3

Thanks a lot, dear Ela.

I agree that Jodha is becoming protective of her vivekheen patidev,if not why rail against those who do not love him and are out only to exploit his power? But I do not agree that Jalal is cooling off her. His earlier obsession was shallow and would have been fleeting if she had been just another pretty face. Now it will, once he realises that, as she puts it, she is his shubhchintak, be different. He will begin to trust her again and to lean on her, over time,for emotional support.

But if she is sensible,she should lay off the Mahaam track for a while. It is an emotional minefield.

Hafiz once wrote It is as dangerous to take an illusion from a woman as it is to take a cub from a tigress, That piece of wisdom also applies to the illusions that a man like Jalal cherishes. Plus Jodha has to understand the terrible toll the loss of his illusions re: his Badiammi will take on Jalal, and she has to be ready and able to help him cope with that. Right now, I do not think she understands that part at all.

Shyamala

Originally posted by: elasingh

Shyamala lovely post...

I feel Jodha is falling in love with Jalal whereas Jalal no longer seem as obsessed with her as before...

Jodha doesnt act like a woman whose husband had passed death sentence against her...She doesnt look atall angry with him ...

She is hurt that Jalal didnt believe her not angry...

Yes I agree how she looks at angry Jalal with clear eyes...

Even Moti has started pointing it that she thinks too much abt Jalaal...

The confrontation scene was not as bad as it looked in precap...

I am sad at what they have done to MA's character ...they have deviated from history and taken a dangerous route...

But creatives should not have done this as this story was going to be interesting without this stupidity...

I just hope they show AK's death the way it was and nolonger take a different route...

That, Tripti. is what she is afraid of.

Shyamala Aunty

Originally posted by: Mallika-E-Bhais

Jodha's silliness at times is such, I don't know whether to laugh at it, or want to throw something at her😆. She accuses the Shahenshaah of being "Kaan ke kacche" when she should be the last person saying so!

She's exactly like a horse in a race! She sees only her goal, and her goal is only to hate Jalal.

Thus Jalal's good qualities, his softness with children (barring the MC debacle) treating her family with overt respect & the sad apology that lay in his eyes & body language she refuses to see. Because she doesn't want to see.

Sometimes I get the feeling that deep inside she does see it. But the minute that she does, she might go beyond only being a "shubhchintak" of her husband's; and might start loving him.

great post as always 👏
thank u 😊

nice post, aunty. the basic problem btw both is Jalal has worst childhood, whereas Jodha has blissful life till she met Jalal. and till the time she is not attached to Jalal even a bit, she won't understand him. later she will stand by him every minute.

Originally posted by: sashashyam

Angry about what, Megha? About my last thread's growing and growing and growing thanks to you gals? What nonsense!

Of course Jalal's past was as bad as this and worse. They showed part of it in that Diwan-e-Aam scene with that little Hindu boy. Read the thread by smile.sara yesterday, and one other that I cannot remember the name of. It was just as bad for Elizabeth I of England, the daughter of Henry VIII.

I did not see anything funny about his hugging Mahaam. He is appalled at this unexpected attack from Jodha on his Badiammi, and he feels that he has to reassure her in the face of what he believes is a horrendous accusation. Jalal is really very emotional, remember how he reacted to the news that his Khan baba had been murdered?

As for 'blind trust' Megha, it is pointless to imitate the unthinking Jodha. How do you know what is blind trust and what is not? How would Jodha have reacted if Mynavati had been similarly accused? How does she react when Moti is accused? She says: She could never have done it. Which is what Jalal says, about a mother figure to whom he owes much, much more than Jodha does to Moti.

Megha, you must be able to think from the other's point of view if you are to become a good analyst, not behave like Jodha, or repeat what she parrots. Jalal has a long way to go before he becomes Akbar, true. So has Jodha before she becomes a sensible, supportive, caring and loving spouse. So does each of us as we work towards the best that we can each make of ourselves.

Shyamala Aunty

omg aunty🤗...i cant believe i am now one of those lucky girls(though i am a woman now 😉)
you mentioned in your atti uttam post😃
🥳🥳

First let me do what is necessary -

👏👏👏

Just your style of writing enthralls me even if your POV doesn't always match... you should have been a writer.😃

I was in splits reading some of your lines. 😆

Rajat in his tirade against Jodha was just fantastic! 😳👍🏼 His voice modulations were superb - the hint of pain in his voice can melt any person😭 and his facial expressions was pitch perfect! But his eyes? His eyes always speaks of the wrath, anger, love, happiness, curiosity, smirk that the character Jalal feels - somehow I could not see the pain in his eyes which was in his voice.😕

Jodha's one liner related to "shubhchintak" reveals a lot if not everything 😉

But have you heard the two lines previously?

Moti : Shahanshah won't believe any statement against Mahamanga without proof.

Jodha: But he believed that my brothers and I were criminal.

This two lines basically switched on my dimag ki batti! 😎 Just like Jalal was hurt not only for the loss of baby but also because he felt betrayed by Jodha, similarly Jodha was not only angered for the insult and false accusations but the hurt ran deep for being not trusted by Jalal.💔

You explained it in one of your replies to my post, but today I realized it properly.

Today I liked when Jodha again went to Jalal with RAhim😊 ...I know she is not acting very intelligently but what else could she have done? She has already committed the blunder of making her intentions clear to MA. I liked that she is doing her best with whatever resources she has in her hand right now to show Jalal the real picture instead of sulking at her room or spewing her ghrina at him. This straightforward, brave, transparent as a glass Jodha - I like ! 👏

She is doing it definitely for proving herself to be right in front of Jalal but she knows that she might pay a bigger price of facing Jalal's wrath. Then what was the need to do so? there is another reason which even Jodha is unaware - she is his shuvchintak. 😉

Btw, you have raised a very important point in your post -

I often wonder about how well Jalal/Jodha each understands what the other says, for their lingo is as far apart as can be. This must have been a contributory factor to their perennial mutual misunderstandings!


Do you remember that I have asked exactly SIMILAR question in your Mallika-e-Akdhaistan post but I didn't get a reply😭

Originally posted by: doyelpakhi

First let me do what is necessary -

👏👏👏

Just your style of writing enthralls me even if your POV doesn't always match... you should have been a writer.😃

I was in splits reading some of your lines. 😆

Rajat in his tirade against Jodha was just fantastic! 😳👍🏼 His voice modulations were superb - the hint of pain in his voice can melt any person😭 and his facial expressions was pitch perfect! But his eyes? His eyes always speaks of the wrath, anger, love, happiness, curiosity, smirk that the character Jalal feels - somehow I could not see the pain in his eyes which was in his voice.😕

Jodha's one liner related to "shubhchintak" reveals a lot if not everything 😉

But have you heard the two lines previously?

Moti : Shahanshah won't believe any statement against Mahamanga without proof.

Jodha: But he believed that my brothers and I were criminal.

This two lines basically switched on my dimag ki batti! 😎 Just like Jalal was hurt not only for the loss of baby but also because he felt betrayed by Jodha, similarly Jodha was not only angered for the insult and false accusations but the hurt ran deep for being not trusted by Jalal.💔

You explained it in one of your replies to my post, but today I realized it properly.

Today I liked when Jodha again went to Jalal with RAhim😊 ...I know she is not acting very intelligently but what else could she have done? She has already committed the blunder of making her intentions clear to MA. I liked that she is doing her best with whatever resources she has in her hand right now to show Jalal the real picture instead of sulking at her room or spewing her ghrina at him. This straightforward, brave, transparent as a glass Jodha - I like ! 👏

She is doing it definitely for proving herself to be right in front of Jalal but she knows that she might pay a bigger price of facing Jalal's wrath. Then what was the need to do so? there is another reason which even Jodha is unaware - she is his shuvchintak. 😉

Btw, you have raised a very important point in your post -

I often wonder about how well Jalal/Jodha each understands what the other says, for their lingo is as far apart as can be. This must have been a contributory factor to their perennial mutual misunderstandings!


Do you remember that I have asked exactly SIMILAR question in your Mallika-e-Akdhaistan post but I didn't get a reply😭

Doyel I agree completely on ur take on Jodha...I like her going again to Jalal...I like her transparancy and her wish to fight for truth..she has very little or no resouces in hand...And yes she is hurt and feels let down by Jalal...

Dear Shyamala Aunty, another fantastic post! Though I've been too busy to reply of late (finally finished the thesis!), I've been keeping up with all your brilliant posts. They are just too insightful, witty and interesting to pass up even for a day.

As usual I agree with much of your take on this topic, though I do think there might be some other motives for MA's serial feoticide than just Adham Khan's feelings or some delusion he might rise in the ranks--so don't lose hope yet. I would argue, that her motivation has more to do with protecting her own standing with Jalal. With Ruq's pregnancy it was clear that Ruq would use the pregnancy to try to oust MA from power, so that was a decidedly immediate threat to her power. But in the case of the other pregnancies which were not such obvious direct threats to her power, I think she still felt threatened as she knew that Jalal's affection for his child would change him in various ways (the dreaded growing of his heart that was talked about) but also just in terms of now MA who occupies the top spot will be bumped by the baby. She feeds off of Jalal's emotional attachment to her. A kid, especially for one as eager to be a father as Jalal, is a game-changer in many predictable and unpredictable ways. If MA was fearful of Jodha's potential hold on his heart, then most certainly the child's hold on Jalal is exponentially worse to my thinking. At the very least, I think of Adham's drunken tirade to MA about how he would have to spend his life bowing down to Jalal's heir--well the same could be said for MA.

So all of that just to hopefully 'redeem' MA as a worthy villain, rather than a delusional one who would try to put her moronic son on the throne.

I also think Mallika-e-Bhal's point is very well said: Whenever I see Maham Anga with Jalal I see a woman who in her schizophrenic mind does care a lot about her Imperial son, might love him too & yet there is a certain resentment. And I feel the resentment exists because of all the time that was taken away from her own flesh & blood useless son, Adham Khan, and given to the future Emperor Jalal, to secure her shining future in the Mughal Sultanate that that 6 year old she cradled from arrows , is shaping today.

I have been thinking the same thing--especially based on the scene on Friday where she finally cops to the crime. She's totally like a Jekyll and Hyde--even referring to the evil MA in third person. I kept wondering if the CV's intended to portray her as someone with a split personality. So even resentment to Jalal's future children might add to her motivations to force miscarriages in the harem.

Re: Jodha, I long ago wrote a post about Jodha's need to "other" Jalal--that is to define him as completely different from herself and thus, not have to admit he's human just like her. By painting him as so awful and inhuman, she can then tell herself she doesn't have to apply all her high principles, ideals and manners to him and more importantly she can keep up her defenses against feeling something for him. So all her annoying ranting about how horrid he is and her grinha is all just a defense mechanism on her part. She tries to keep her image of him as "other," as inhuman and barbaric in tact, so that she won't develop feelings for him. But of course, as many have already noted, we all know that's not really working. The more she gets to see of his human side, especially the suffering 6 year old (she loves children after all) it becomes more and more impossible for her to do that.

Why is she resisting feelings for him? I think given all that has happened between them, she obviously still doesn't trust him. But more than that, as Ruq, MA, and Jalal himself have hammered into her, she doesn't believe he will ever return her affections in kind. That she doesn't want to fall in love with him, someone who will never love her back (as she believes) in the same way is now I think what is mainly motivating her to try to keep up her defenses against showing even the smallest amount of feeling towards him--even compassion for a man grieving over a lost child or for the scared little child that man once was. Given all she's seen and heard, she's justified in that belief.

Also, her own identity I think plays into this as well. Another huge reason for "othering" is in order to define yourself. She's very attached to Amer and her identity as the epitome of Ameri ideals and sanskars. For anyone marrying someone of a different religion and/or culture, their own religious and cultural values are going to come into question to some greater or lesser degree. That is to say, as she learns about the Mughal traditions and customs, some of which she now has to adopt, they may contradict or (even worse for Jodha) coincide with what her own beliefs and traditions. Cultural clashes might bring about some questions about one's own beliefs (though they can just as easily entrench each party); but the areas in which the cultures share similarities, serve to remind Jodha once more that "hmm, these folks are not that different than me.' And that makes seeing them as different and other, much harder, which in turn, also blurs the lines of her own identity to some greater or lesser extent. Greater if most of her identity is wrapped up in her Ameri identity; Lesser if she has a stronger sense of self that is understood as taking from Ameri culture but not comprised solely by it... Hope that makes sense.

In any case, I prefer to see Jodha in that light, as it makes all her seemingly callous refusal to spare even the slightest bit of compassion or warmth to Jalal a defense mechanism which is not truly indicative of what she truly feels. It gives her character much more depth; I feel like we've gotten a lot of depth of character to Jalal but not as much for Jodha lately, so she really does seem to appear as the unimaginative, unempathetic, obstinate woman you characterize her as unfortunately!

Thanks again for another lovely post--and really for weeks of wonderful posts that provided much needed breaks in the past months!

Sangeeta

@SmileTherapy: Your every word is what I wanted to type down too, but you said it so very eloquently!⭐️

Originally posted by: elasingh

Doyel I agree completely on ur take on Jodha...I like her going again to Jalal...I like her transparancy and her wish to fight for truth..she has very little or no resouces in hand...And yes she is hurt and feels let down by Jalal...

Thanks Ela 😊 You see I felt that Jodha should not have such expectation from Jalal as she has not done anything to win Jalal's trust or showed any concern/ feelings for him in any way.


Most importantly, she always claimed to have no attachment with Jalal except of hatred.

So why such expectation from person you hate?

I was irritated because Jodha was not even admitting to herself about her attachment with the relationship with Jalal and her feelings of concern ( i won't call it love, just concern which one human being feels for one another )that she has for him,

But today's Jodha betrayed herself and did let slip her innermost feelings which she herself denies vehemently.