Give me a BREAK! [DT note Pg. 16] - Page 16

Originally posted by: U-No-Poo

Lastly, like I have been reiterating ever since this show started, just because you say that you performed 'bollywood' or 'afro jazz' or 'bachata' on paper, does not mean that you actually did. And yes, I can say that because I'm a trained dancer (and a very experienced one) and am credible enough to make a distinction for myself, thankyou (before someone jumps at me for not having any 'knowledge') The truth is that Salman-Isha had not even scratched the surface of these forms, and inspite of rehashing old steps on different songs, they received endless praise. I'm sorry, but that simply does not sit well with me.

WORD...it really is amusing how self righteous some ppl in here are about "repetitive" topics and ppl not providing enough 'proof' to back up their arguments about Isha's acrobatics and then ppl continue to IGNORE this OBVIOUS point that you've highlighted here in the underlined bit...just cuz the label on the bottom of the screen says that she did a certain dance form doesn't mean she ACTUALLY did it...99% of it is acrobatia most of the time even then...so if you're doing acrobatics more than ACTUAL tango or bachata or bollywood, that is something to WOW about?😆

This and the fact that Salman-Isha NEVER LISTEN to the MUSIC for their acts is another thing that makes their acts pointless in my eyes...really how can you call something a DANCE act when music becomes INCIDENTAL in it? When it's all about pulling your acrobatic routines regardless of the rhythm, the beat, the LYRICS, the MOOD of a song?



@Kavya: I'm late to the party it seems😆...but fab topic👏...in one line I'd say though...this is like bhains ke aage been bajaana😛...pointless exercise seeing the "high level" of "discourse" that usually happens in this place😆

Originally posted by: U-No-Poo

I feel Salman-Isha fans openly indulge in selective reading/understanding. We so-called 'Salman-Isha' haters do not get a kick out of riling up the fans and nor are we 'insecure' of them in any way (How did that logic come about anyway). I'm pretty sure that everyone (and I can vouch for this) has a valid reason to dislike them as performers. I can point out a hundred different reasons to support my opinion and claim. The thing is, we do not have a problem with Salman-Isha making mistakes, the problem is with the judges giving them marks chhappar phaad ke when in all honesty they deserved criticism. Second problem is how they have been epitomized as the ultimate dance gurus, while in actuality every form that they have ever attempted looks very different. (Which brings me back to point one, that it is okay to make a complete goo out of a form as long as that is being pointed out, instead of being praised to ceaseless heights)

It's just that Isha is naturally aided by her flexibility in adding 'OMG-that's-so-mindboggling' moments in her piece - which, actually, the piece is pretty much all about: gimmicks. Infact this is a problem I have with all dance reality shows in India, they rely way too much on gimmicks, tricks and unnecessary props to increase the entertainment value. It really detracts from the actual dancing. If you actually do some research on dance, watch videos on youtube and other websites (and this includes Indian/bollywood choreographies also btw), or simply just go watch SYTYCD, you would see the drastic difference.

Lastly, like I have been reiterating ever since this show started, just because you say that you performed 'bollywood' or 'afro jazz' or 'bachata' on paper, does not mean that you actually did. And yes, I can say that because I'm a trained dancer (and a very experienced one) and am credible enough to make a distinction for myself, thankyou (before someone jumps at me for not having any 'knowledge') The truth is that Salman-Isha had not even scratched the surface of these forms, and inspite of rehashing old steps on different songs, they received endless praise. I'm sorry, but that simply does not sit well with me.

Originally posted by: chocolover89

Neetz, can I just hug you for this post? Especially the bits in bold? 🤗🤗😆

Yes @ bold and italicized... that is the problem. Perhaps all us "haters" haven't put it in such simple and clear terms before. Honestly it doesn't even matter that much if Salman-Isha make mistakes. It's expected, especially if they're trying something "new." But it really bugs me to see none of them ever pointed out and then to see the performaces that are full of mistakes get praised like they're the best dance performances we've seen since Michael Jackson 😕...Such blatant partiality is simply annoying to watch. It's unfair to the other contestants whose every mistake is pointed out immediately, and it's actually also unfair to Salman-Isha themselves. They're working hard to "wow" the judges and audience week after week..they do deserve to get some genuine feedback on what's working and what's not. Otherwise how will they ever improve as dancers, choreographers?

Second, all of Isha's acts look the same more or less because at the end of the day they have very similar movements in them, the gimmicks to "wow" the audience are all there... even if the styles they supposedly are doing are different. And word at the bottom bit..just because it says Isha is doing a bachata, paso doble, bollywood, tango doesn't mean she actually did. Just because there's a bollywood step at 0:55, or a tango sharp movement at 1:02, or a hip-shaking movement at 1:32 but the rest is all lifts and stretching like a rubber band doesn't mean they did justice do the dance style on the whole. Also, Salman-Isha don't even begin to get the FEEL, the MOOD of most of those styles right, let's forget the dance steps themselves. THAT'S why people can't differentiate between their dances and everything looks the same.

Also despite the similarities, there are distinct differences between the Latin dance styles. A good and knowledgeable choreographer can choreograph those different Latin American/ Ballroom styles and you will never think the routines are exactly the same. Unfortunately, Salman is not of them. He clearly needs to brush up on his research skills.

And I love the bit you pointed out about Indian Reality shows and their obsession with gimmicks. It really is sooo annoying...as if aaj kal pure, unhibited dance ki toh kadar hi nahin rehgayi. You have to just rely on those gimmicks and tricks to "wow" the audience because pure dance is simply "boring" and not enough 😕🥱

There are bits and pieces which I agree with you especially the blue part.

What I don't agree with is that for a general audience like me who hasn't watched many dance shows or has knowledge about dancing and it's technicalities, it's all about what feels good and looks good on the screen. And yes "wow" factor as you have put it does play a role whether I like the performance or not, simply because I watch it for the sake of entertainment and such tactics, whether you think they are good or bad, works with people or at least with those who are on the same boat as me. Also, since I do not have the knowledge or experience to differentiate between dance forms, I depend on what i see and what is told to me by the judges.

If I really wanted to watch the real dance, I would choose to watch DID or Boogie Woogie or some other show which depends completely on dancing. But you are forgetting JDJ doesn't promise anything like it, now if you are expecting them to, then your choice. But for me the performances include costumes, lighting, make up , camera, music, dancing, all in one and when combined together we get to see what we are seeing on JDJ. And when it comes to Isha and Salman I find they do a good job with all the above aspect and may be that's why they are excelling for me and even judges. And even other contestants bring very creative and unique concept on the stage which are liked by many even if they aren't technically correct.

So the gist of what I was trying to say is that may be there is a reason why reality shows like JDJ depend so much on gimmicks as you like to put it.

P.S: This is merely my take on it, so please don't ask me to watch some videos on YT and learn about different dance forms. Though I love dancing, I am not very seen in learning the technicalities. For me dose of entertainment is enough.

Wow...and here I was thinking Isha was the favourite for most people. lol Obviously not!

Originally posted by: -Chandramukhi-

There are bits and pieces which I agree with you especially the blue part. Yayy we agree on something! *hi-five*

What I don't agree with is that for a general audience like me who hasn't watched many dance shows or has knowledge about dancing and it's technicalities, it's all about what feels good and looks good on the screen. And yes "wow" factor as you have put it does play a role whether I like the performance or not, simply because I watch it for the sake of entertainment and such tactics, whether you think they are good or bad, works with people or at least with those who are on the same boat as me. Also, since I do not have the knowledge or experience to differentiate between dance forms, I depend on what i see and what is told to me by the judges.

If I really wanted to watch the real dance, I would choose to watch DID or Boogie Woogie or some other show which depends completely on dancing. But you are forgetting JDJ doesn't promise anything like it, now if you are expecting them to, then your choice. But for me the performances include costumes, lighting, make up , camera, music, dancing, all in one and when combined together we get to see what we are seeing on JDJ. And when it comes to Isha and Salman I find they do a good job with all the above aspect and may be that's why they are excelling for me and even judges. And even other contestants bring very creative and unique concept on the stage which are liked by many even if they aren't technically correct.

So the gist of what I was trying to say is that may be there is a reason why reality shows like JDJ depend so much on gimmicks as you like to put it.

P.S: This is merely my take on it, so please don't ask me to watch some videos on YT and learn about different dance forms. Though I love dancing, I am not very seen in learning the technicalities. For me dose of entertainment is enough.

Originally posted by: chocolover89

Okay, I do understand that the majority of the audience judges based on what entertains them. Yes at the end of the day, you have to connect to the dance you're seeing and it has to entertain you in some way at least. I also understand quite well that "wow" factors attracts the audiences. I don't actually have a problem with that... my problem is that choreographers on the desi dance reality shows, including DID, seem to believe that only lifts, acrobatics, or some crazy stunt/gimmick is the only "wow" factor that there is. They forget that a "wow" factor can be just a perfectly and smoothly step done to the lyrics, a simple expression even. I used to find the sheer energy and passion Avneet danced with the "Wow" factor of her performances ...she didn't even need to do any crazy step to capture me. I hope this is making some sense? I would gladly show you a performance that really captures what I mean, but since it's not from JDJ..I don't think you're interested 😆

@ your bold bit

See that's the problem I have with the judging. I totally understand that there are many people who simply love to watch dance but have no technical knowledge ( I am one of them..besides some training in Kathak and Bollywood, the rest of what I have learned is from watching shows like SYTYCD, DWTS, DID, BW, etc only). So my point is, I think it's the judges' responsibility to at least try to explain the different dance styles properly, point out what is right and wrong ..to try to educate the audience because honestly I'm sure they also want to know about the styles na? Plus I think it shows basic respect towards your craft. I expect Remo to do this more, but it disappoints me when he hails dances that don't even "scratch the surface level" of the style they're doing as U-No-Poo put it as the bestest things ever. I dunno, if I was a dancer in a competition, I would want people to know more about what I was doing..just simply knowing more will allow them to judge better also because then they can really decide if I did justice or not?

I don't expect the JDJ performances to be SYTYCD level, or even DID level. But is it wrong for me to expect the choreographers to atleast do justice to the style they're attempting...just the basic character of the style?

@bold, yes I am definitely open to watching it, can't say I'll be pro at judging based on one performance 😆 (You can PM me the video)

@blue, I can see why it might be frustrating to some who might have knowledge about dancing. But what gets irritating is why all the focus and technical criticism only for Isha and Salman. It's ok to be more critical towards Isha, being a dancer and all, but every time I see a post pointing out mistakes, it's mostly revolves around her. I am sure if you all have issues with her, then you would have issues with others as well. But do I see others being judged for their technical errors, not as much. And I am not saying you should do it, you're free to criticize whom you like. I am simply pointing out the disparity here and why a fan base can get agitated because of it.

Now talking about judges, I agree with that bit. I also find judges politically correct every time, their terminology is very vague and repetitive, I would appreciate them taking out 2 mins for each act and let Remo explain at least the basic of each dance form. That would make the show a bit more educational, but then I don't know if that's what JDJ is aiming at. Remo simply points out few mistakes here and there. This makes audience have no sorta pointers to judge a performance. Thus, because of the lack of proper guidance, people will follow and like what looks good to them.

@ red, Critics like you get overwhelmed because you are used to seeing a better platform in terms of dancing and thus the obvious comparison. But someone who doesn't follow such dancing show, for them JDJ is the only platform of dancing. So you can expect all you want, but are you sure JDJ is the right platform for that, I'll say yes and no.

That's it from my end 😃

Yay, okay I shall PM the video to you..

Bookmarking.