Why do ITV audiences like toxicity and aggressive MLs? - Page 3

Originally posted by: missFiesty_69

On a separate note not related to the ongoing topic, Adolescence was too good!! It was like holding up a mirror to the society, I liked how even they revealed that he had killed her, they went about showing how much psychology plays a part. He did not even have a typical troubled childhood or abusive, neglectful parents which usually are cited as the cause for bad behavior. It was chilling and to good. How delicate is one's ego that rejections can push people to take someone's life in the heat of the moment. Especially the part with his counsellor in jail, uff!

Yes. I was scared the whole while as it almost hit me the gut due to its sheer relatability. I am a mid GenZ per say, and I have seen these ideas floating around me in reality. The series almost felt so close to the world I am seeing right now. There's hate against a certain gender from another one and the fault lines getting deeper due these venomous ideas.

Also, the fact that every episode was filmed in one shot made it so convincing and compelling. It's as if we were a part of the crime that took place. Which I feel was the intent of the series. It wanted to make us feel as culprits in the whole situation as we hadn't and still haven't prevented children and youngsters from getting horribly influenced. The counsellor episode was my favourite too. It revealed so much into the psyche of Jamie's character. A stellar series truly.

Very nice post yaar!! I can only think of one thing- is the mindset of people. Earlier people watched shows to get entertained and now they watch to see if they are only ones suffering or are there others. Jiss rang ka chasma pehnoge usi rang ka zamana dikhega. They want to watch suffering because either they too are suffering or due to sadistic nature.

Otherwise there was a time when Sasural Genda Phool jaise shows bhi the top par. Where the sasural as a whole makes the girl respect her husband. Regressive shows are trending now and like I said earlier ITV had become "watch at your own risk" now.

Originally posted by: Autumn09

ASR and Randhir were insufferable (though I never liked Sanyukta as well. Sadda Haq is one of my most hated shows.) and ASR was so dull and feeka. Randhir was all show, no substance. Though Raman Bhalla had a good enough backstory and I liked his jodi with Ishita. See that's the issue no? People think only wooden feeka characters like ASR or meaninglessly angry guys like Randhir are strong characters. Even Sanyukta-Randhir's angst was so forced and so was ASR's love for Khushi. Before 2013, we used to have characters with both shades (Remember charming jock Samrat with a heart of gold and nerd topper Mayank with a superiority complex in Miley Jab Ham Tum?) Characters should be like real people not caricatures.

As for strong leads, I find Roshni from Channel V Paanch, Durga Thakur from Ek Haseena Thi, Sameera from Main Na Bhoolungi, Mohan Bhatnagar from Na Boley Tum Na Maine Kucch Kahaa, Captain Rajveer Shekhawat, Amardeep Hudda from Left Right Left, even post leap Ranveer in Meri Aashiqui Tumse Hi to be strong characters.

ASR was pheeka?? Baapre

I slightly agree and strongly disagree with some points.

Not every toxic ml is successful and not every soft ml is rejected in ITV.

Good or bad it's about execution of the character.

Itv gave soft heroes like Ishaan from sgp, mohan from na bole na, neil from naamkaran, suraj from DABH. They all are still get celebrated.

When it comes to toxic mls. Currently there are many shows with toxic mls. They are not getting praised. Reason they are straight up two timers or self victimized characters with no layers.

Old toxic mls are not like that. When their characters get introduced, they get introduced as wrong & toxic. We are supposed to know what to expect from such characters. If their story is interesting they get click otherwise not.

While neil is dislikable for many reasons not because he is not toxic or masculine. It's because he is being projected as something which he is not.

First he was shown as good boy who loves everyone. Who will love fl sincerely.

But what we got is 30+ year old man acting as a Nibba, not taking firm stand for himself, insulting other woman for no reason, justifying cheating, most importantly marrying a woman without her CONSENT.

He doesn't fall under soft heroes category after whatever he did. Yes whatever he did might come under human category.

But did his actions presented as his wrong? Did he get called out for his actions? Instead fl kind of got villanised for not liking the man who married her without consent. The show narrative was how teju will understand great Neil's worth and forget other guy not how neil will realise his creepiness and repent.

That's the problem. Tagging you guys.

Originally posted by: Sparkle232

I slightly agree and strongly disagree with some points.

Not every toxic ml is successful and not every soft ml is rejected in ITV.

Good or bad it's about execution of the character.

Itv gave soft heroes like Ishaan from sgp, mohan from na bole na, neil from naamkaran, suraj from DABH. They all are still get celebrated.

When it comes to toxic mls. Currently there are many shows with toxic mls. They are not getting praised. Reason they are straight up two timers or self victimized characters with no layers.

Old toxic mls are not like that. When their characters get introduced, they get introduced as wrong & toxic. We are supposed to know what to expect from such characters. If their story is interesting they get click otherwise not.

While neil is dislikable for many reasons not because he is not toxic or masculine. It's because he is being projected as something which he is not.

First he was shown as good boy who loves everyone. Who will love fl sincerely.

But what we got is 30+ year old man acting as a Nibba, not taking firm stand for himself, insulting other woman for no reason, justifying cheating, most importantly marrying a woman without her CONSENT.

He doesn't fall under soft heroes category after whatever he did. Yes whatever he did might come under human category.

But did his actions presented as his wrong? Did he get called out for his actions? Instead fl kind of got villanised for not liking the man who married her without consent. The show narrative was how teju will understand great Neil's worth and forget other guy not how neil will realise his creepiness and repent.

That's the problem. Tagging you guys.

Totally agree with you on this!!

Not all toxic MLs are well received by the audience, at the same time, not all soft guys are straightaway rejected by audience. It's all about how it was established

There's no hard & fast rule as to which ML , love-trope & show would be well-received & what all is sure-shot going to work well with TRP audience. It's highly unpredictable. It's all about what clicks well with audience at different points of time, mainly they love spicy drama. Samay samay ki baat hai, like for example, people say high voltage drama & wedding sequence churns out most TRP, but still many current shows are failing to garner ratings despite showing OTT dramatic elements

And regarding, why Neil Pradhan was being disliked, I agree with you on this again, Neil was being hyped as the GREEN FLAG, the man of integrity since the inception of this season, but he disastrously turned out to be merely a simp... The great downfall of both character & show began with the desperate justification of problematic stuff like bigamy, disregarding a girl-his supposedly love of life's consent to marry her at any cost, no consideration of her feeling, all acts of creep yet being portrayed as the ideal man by writers. All this was a major disappointment. Ghum makers' trying to justify bigamy by hook or crook was in a very bad taste.

The first & the major blow to NEIL's character was when he literally justified the immoral act of BIGAMY of Mohit Chavan, this was the point from where show couldn't recover. Tell me, had that two-timer bigamist Mohit Chavan not been the father of his love "Tejaswini", would Neil still be supporting Mohit's immoral act. Answer is-NO, he wouldn't, he did all this so as to not upset his lady, so Neil compromised his ethics for simping. Even TOXIC MLs never justify bigamy & condemns & fumes at it with full force

Also, the most CRUCIAL reason why Ghum Season 3 suffered low ratings & audience didn't turn out was that the core loyal audience of Ghum was fed up with wicked Ganja PH's crazy acrobatics of abruptly changing leads, cast, when the lead couple's story was still at its pre-matured stage, yet to be explored to its potential. The core audience has gotten enraged becz of PH's unprofessionalism & nastiness, they don't trust Ganja anymore, so they've totally abandoned Ghum for taking them for granted, and it's the PRIME REASON of downfall....

And it's a great lesson for the haughty Producers of Ghum who thought they had created a brand in the form of Ghum & they are now mighty, invincible like Rajan Shahi, so they have unchecked authority to throw any crap, pull any nasty stunt & TRP audience would keep on buying it becz of legacy They were too arrogant to think that, since they got away even after brutally destroying Sairat , and even after Shakti's eviction the show worked, toh they had got the license to be nasty every time, but audience showed their wrath.

And, people say, once the trust of the core audience of a show is lost, it's extremely difficult to gain it back. The show is bound to doom. PHs can't get away scot free every time after fooling the audience

100% agree with everything you said, especially about Neil's character.

I'm not even gonna go off about him again 'cause I already made a big-a** separate thread on why he isn't a green flag-so yeah, fully agree there.

But, this whole show feels like it's written by some bipolar person and that bipolar person is Leena Mata herself. Like Rutu was the only sane man in this circus, and they ruined him too-made him a full-blown villain for what? and every character got meh energy.

And the fact that Teju got more hate than Neil for all his creepy behavior? Wild. I literally called it out here-dude was being mad disrespectful to Juhi but everyone was blaming Juhi for not backing off the marriage?? Saying Neil was not "forcing" her never disrespect Juhi? What do you call him pulling up at her house just to say "I don't love you, f*** off, I'm gonna love Teju" every 3rd scene? Or him going to meet Teju behind her back and then telling his fiancée "Yeah I went to meet your sister." Like he's not only disrespecting Juhi, he's violating basic decency. Even then when Juhi don't backout he in hospital says "I'll always love Teju, never you" and people go "aww he's just being honest." Nah, he's being a prick.

Even Teju's character is mad problematic. Like girl fell for Rutu in two meetings, and then Neil fell in love with her at first glance too?? Where's the build-up? Where's the spark? Teju asked Rutu to marry her after barely two meeting. And Rutu didn't even reject her-he just said he wanted to focus on his career and wanted to help her grow her career too, push her to stand up to her toxic fam. But what does Teju do? She gets all passive-aggressive with him.

Then Neil's mom-she's been holding a grudge since some man rejected her 30+ years ago and made it her life mission to mentally torture his daughter.

Neil's sister Manjari-who was introduced as blunt, truth-speaking, victim of forced marriage, When Teju explains what Neil did, how he disrespected her, and why she doesn't want this marriage. But Manjari becomes passive-aggressive and starts lecturing her to "accept Neil as her husband." HUH?? Wasn't SHE out of all people should get her trauma. Teju literally lost her right to consent. Her agency was snatched away by her family and Neil who married her against her will after multiple pleadings.

Then at party scene-Teju standing up, exposing Neil in front of guests, saying how much she hates him.👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻. But like TWO HOURS LATER, Neil's family is teasing him about his suhaag raat??? "Ohh vahini is waiting for you, enjoy"?? ENJOY WHAT? She just said she hates him and why y'all planning honeymoon jokes? It's giving tone deaf.

No wonder audience dipped. Loyal viewers out. The PH pissed off the whole ghum base, They ended Ishvi's prematurely just 'cause they didn't want to pay actors. They did the same with Saraj. How many times will you pull this leap-and-replace stunt before people stop trusting you?

After removing Shakti, Saraj actually ran, so the ph got overconfident. Thought they were Shahi 2.0 and audience would eat whatever they serve. They didn't.

Shahi wasn't that much of an idiot-he knew his serials were dog pile garbage but at least he never disrespected the legacy. Every gen leap would start with some dramatic FL rajkumari entry on a boat with flowers, and he'd throw in gen 1, 2, 3, 4 FLs together for the hype and people would eat it up. Now gen 5 is coming with Maahira from Abhimaan, I can already see it. And you know what? Sure, he's not pulling 3.5 trp like before, but he ain't losing money like Ghum ph did.

Originally posted by: Bibliophiles

Totally agree with you on this!!

Not all toxic MLs are well received by the audience, at the same time, not all soft guys are straightaway rejected by audience. It's all about how it was established

There's no hard & fast rule as to which ML , love-trope & show would be well-received & what all is sure-shot going to work well with TRP audience. It's highly unpredictable. It's all about what clicks well with audience at different points of time, mainly they love spicy drama. Samay samay ki baat hai, like for example, people say high voltage drama & wedding sequence churns out most TRP, but still many current shows are failing to garner ratings despite showing OTT dramatic elements

And regarding, why Neil Pradhan was being disliked, I agree with you on this again, Neil was being hyped as the GREEN FLAG, the man of integrity since the inception of this season, but he disastrously turned out to be merely a simp... The great downfall of both character & show began with the desperate justification of problematic stuff like bigamy, disregarding a girl-his supposedly love of life's consent to marry her at any cost, no consideration of her feeling, all acts of creep yet being portrayed as the ideal man by writers. All this was a major disappointment. Ghum makers' trying to justify bigamy by hook or crook was in a very bad taste.

The first & the major blow to NEIL's character was when he literally justified the immoral act of BIGAMY of Mohit Chavan, this was the point from where show couldn't recover. Tell me, had that two-timer bigamist Mohit Chavan not been the father of his love "Tejaswini", would Neil still be supporting Mohit's immoral act. Answer is-NO, he wouldn't, he did all this so as to not upset his lady, so Neil compromised his ethics for simping. Even TOXIC MLs never justify bigamy & condemns & fumes at it with full force

Also, the most CRUCIAL reason why Ghum Season 3 suffered low ratings & audience didn't turn out was that the core loyal audience of Ghum was fed up with wicked Ganja PH's crazy acrobatics of abruptly changing leads, cast, when the lead couple's story was still at its pre-matured stage, yet to explored to its potential. The core audience has gotten enraged becz of PH's unprofessionalism & nastiness, they don't trust Ganja anymore, so they've totally abandoned Ghum for taking them for granted, and it's the PRIME REASON of downfall....

And it's a great lesson for the haughty Producers of Ghum who thought they had created a brand in the form of Ghum & they are now mighty, invincible like Rajan Shahi, so they have unchecked authority to throw any crap, pull any nasty stunt & TRP audience would keep on buying it becz of legacy They were too arrogant to think that, since they got away even after brutally destroying Sairat , and even after Shakti's eviction the show worked, toh they had got the license to be nasty every time, but audience showed their wrath.

And, people say, once the trust of the core audience of a show is lost, it's extremely difficult to gain it back. The show is bound to doom. PHs can't get away scot free every time after fooling the audience

Everything said here 💯. You know I saw many praising posts on reddit for neil character until he started justifying cheating then acted as creep. So he didn't get unwarranted hate.

Originally posted by: Randomlurker

100% agree with everything you said, especially about Neil's character.

I'm not even gonna go off about him again 'cause I already made a big-a** separate thread on why he isn't a green flag-so yeah, fully agree there.

But, this whole show feels like it's written by some bipolar person and that bipolar person is Leena Mata herself. Like Rutu was the only sane man in this circus, and they ruined him too-made him a full-blown villain for what? and every character got meh energy.

And the fact that Teju got more hate than Neil for all his creepy behavior? Wild. I literally called it out here-dude was being mad disrespectful to Juhi but everyone was blaming Juhi for not backing off the marriage?? Saying Neil was not "forcing" her never disrespect Juhi? What do you call him pulling up at her house just to say "I don't love you, f*** off, I'm gonna love Teju" every 3rd scene? Or him going to meet Teju behind her back and then telling his fiancée "Yeah I went to meet your sister." Like he's not only disrespecting Juhi, he's violating basic decency. Even then when Juhi don't backout he in hospital says "I'll always love Teju, never you" and people go "aww he's just being honest." Nah, he's being a prick.

Even Teju's character is mad problematic. Like girl fell for Rutu in two meetings, and then Neil fell in love with her at first glance too?? Where's the build-up? Where's the spark? Teju asked Rutu to marry her after barely two meeting. And Rutu didn't even reject her-he just said he wanted to focus on his career and wanted to help her grow her career too, push her to stand up to her toxic fam. But what does Teju do? She gets all passive-aggressive with him.

Then Neil's mom-she's been holding a grudge since some man rejected her 30+ years ago and made it her life mission to mentally torture his daughter.

Neil's sister Manjari-who was introduced as blunt, truth-speaking, victim of forced marriage, When Teju explains what Neil did, how he disrespected her, and why she doesn't want this marriage. But Manjari becomes passive-aggressive and starts lecturing her to "accept Neil as her husband." HUH?? Wasn't SHE out of all people should get her trauma. Teju literally lost her right to consent. Her agency was snatched away by her family and Neil who married her against her will after multiple pleadings.

Then at party scene-Teju standing up, exposing Neil in front of guests, saying how much she hates him. Respect. But like TWO HOURS LATER, Neil's family is teasing him about his suhaag raat??? "Ohh vahini is waiting for you, enjoy"?? ENJOY WHAT? She just said she hates him and why y'all planning honeymoon jokes? It's giving tone deaf.

No wonder audience dipped. Loyal viewers out. The PH pissed off the whole ghum base, They ended Ishvi's prematurely just 'cause they didn't want to pay actors. They did the same with Saraj. How many times will you pull this leap-and-replace stunt before people stop trusting you?

After removing Shakti, Saraj actually ran, so the ph got overconfident. Thought they were Shahi 2.0 and audience would eat whatever they serve. They didn't.

Shahi wasn't that much of an idiot-he knew his serials were dog pile garbage but at least he never disrespected the legacy. Every gen leap would start with some dramatic FL rajkumari entry on a boat with flowers, and he'd throw in gen 1, 2, 3, 4 FLs together for the hype and people would eat it up. Now gen 5 is coming with Maahira from Abhimaan, I can already see it. And you know what? Sure, he's not pulling 3.5 trp like before, but he ain't losing money like Ghum ph did.

Exactly almost every character is unlikable. Ghum ph making me remember over confidence of sasural genda phool makers.

After giving happy ending in first season. They killed suhana (the heart of the show) in second season and thought people will accept ml and show with new fl. They even used ragini khanna in promos to promote that show. Everyone know the results.

Honestly savi and neil would be the most unwatchable pair to me. Even if ganja makers magically give them good story, I won't be able to like them. Savi character became a joke with shift of men and career in her life.

A woman who falls in love multiple times - A man who acts like nibba by having love at first sight. Both characters individual personality is unlikable. Just feeling bad for actors. No one else.

Originally posted by: Randomlurker

100% agree with everything you said, especially about Neil's character.

I'm not even gonna go off about him again 'cause I already made a big-a** separate thread on why he isn't a green flag-so yeah, fully agree there.

But, this whole show feels like it's written by some bipolar person and that bipolar person is Leena Mata herself. Like Rutu was the only sane man in this circus, and they ruined him too-made him a full-blown villain for what? and every character got meh energy.

And the fact that Teju got more hate than Neil for all his creepy behavior? Wild. I literally called it out here-dude was being mad disrespectful to Juhi but everyone was blaming Juhi for not backing off the marriage?? Saying Neil was not "forcing" her never disrespect Juhi? What do you call him pulling up at her house just to say "I don't love you, f*** off, I'm gonna love Teju" every 3rd scene? Or him going to meet Teju behind her back and then telling his fiancée "Yeah I went to meet your sister." Like he's not only disrespecting Juhi, he's violating basic decency. Even then when Juhi don't backout he in hospital says "I'll always love Teju, never you" and people go "aww he's just being honest." Nah, he's being a prick.

Even Teju's character is mad problematic. Like girl fell for Rutu in two meetings, and then Neil fell in love with her at first glance too?? Where's the build-up? Where's the spark? Teju asked Rutu to marry her after barely two meeting. And Rutu didn't even reject her-he just said he wanted to focus on his career and wanted to help her grow her career too, push her to stand up to her toxic fam. But what does Teju do? She gets all passive-aggressive with him.

Then Neil's mom-she's been holding a grudge since some man rejected her 30+ years ago and made it her life mission to mentally torture his daughter.

Neil's sister Manjari-who was introduced as blunt, truth-speaking, victim of forced marriage, When Teju explains what Neil did, how he disrespected her, and why she doesn't want this marriage. But Manjari becomes passive-aggressive and starts lecturing her to "accept Neil as her husband." HUH?? Wasn't SHE out of all people should get her trauma. Teju literally lost her right to consent. Her agency was snatched away by her family and Neil who married her against her will after multiple pleadings.

Then at party scene-Teju standing up, exposing Neil in front of guests, saying how much she hates him.👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻. But like TWO HOURS LATER, Neil's family is teasing him about his suhaag raat??? "Ohh vahini is waiting for you, enjoy"?? ENJOY WHAT? She just said she hates him and why y'all planning honeymoon jokes? It's giving tone deaf.

No wonder audience dipped. Loyal viewers out. The PH pissed off the whole ghum base, They ended Ishvi's prematurely just 'cause they didn't want to pay actors. They did the same with Saraj. How many times will you pull this leap-and-replace stunt before people stop trusting you?

After removing Shakti, Saraj actually ran, so the ph got overconfident. Thought they were Shahi 2.0 and audience would eat whatever they serve. They didn't.

Shahi wasn't that much of an idiot-he knew his serials were dog pile garbage but at least he never disrespected the legacy. Every gen leap would start with some dramatic FL rajkumari entry on a boat with flowers, and he'd throw in gen 1, 2, 3, 4 FLs together for the hype and people would eat it up. Now gen 5 is coming with Maahira from Abhimaan, I can already see it. And you know what? Sure, he's not pulling 3.5 trp like before, but he ain't losing money like Ghum ph did.

Yep. We discussed in the other thread about how all the characters in the show are unjustified in their actions. I totally agree as I have said it a hundred times on the EDT that the writers are bipolar. They themselves have no idea what characteristics they wish to give their characters.

Originally posted by: ThaneOfElsinore

Yep. We discussed in the other thread about how all the characters in the show are unjustified in their actions. I totally agree as I have said it a hundred times on the EDT that the writers are bipolar. They themselves have no idea what characteristics they wish to give their characters.

I was literally the first person here who said Mukta is selfish af. She didn’t care about Juhi at all—just wanted to get Teju married, even if it meant messing up Juhi’s life. And then Many came in like " Mukta is bichari, she’s all alone and just thinking about her daughter’s happiness”, and boom—three episodes later, she’s was actively pushing Teju to marry Juhi.I was proven right again. Smh.

Characters written by Leena honestly feel like they’re coming from someone with bipolar disorder or something, cuz nothing ever adds up. She’s so weird for always writing mentally challenged girls getting married?? LIKE WHY is that her obsession?? Thank god Aditi got saved in this show. Because in Jhanak, Ani’s older sister Appu—who’s is mentally challenged and—is now pregnant?? LIKE HOW IS THAT EVEN OKAY?! Her brain is like a child..I swear to God, Sitara needs to stop copy-pasting Leena’s scripts. She writes straight up GARBAGE.🤢🤢🤢