Dance of Time and Illusion- New Thread Part 89 updated page 143 - Page 24

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.Aayushi. thumbnail
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Posted: 8 years ago

Originally posted by: sunithi

whatever she has done,she accepts but balming others for pushing her into darkness..Arjun blame the same,world didn't give her a chance..but what she did is wrong she knows that..that's what I am calling her she owns her actions..every one of them Callas Maya pagal and expecting her do the right things.she says u r all pushing me again to be a pagal to do pagal pan..but I agree I am pagal so did that it's Maya take ..


For me, no she does not.

Let's just agree to disagree.😊
shruthiravi thumbnail
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Posted: 8 years ago
@aditi Jhanvi says Ashwin was right, you are mad. So even for Jhanvi Ashwin is right not Maya. I guess I had told in one of my earlier posts words affect Maya. Ashwin had repeatedly harassed her ( I dont think sexual assault involved like Tell me Your Dreams) physically by telling her again and again she is mad.
Ashwin had done a very big psychological attack on Maya. She herself believes she is mad. She herself thinks she is bad and the actions stem out of that. You are what your thoughts are. The first step towards her correction is understanding the source of her madness, then make her realize she is mad, allow the madness to do what it wants or create the illusion of the madness achieving what it wants and then bring her out. Source is 9th birthday.

I always love the dialogue of Mohanlal in Manichitrathazhu with Tilakan who tells him tell Nakulan to stay away from Ganga. You cant avoid one death.

Then Mohanlal tells " To save my friend and his wife I have to disagree with all my teachers, I have to disagree with all the principles I have learned so far, I have to travel in the way no one else has traveled. I dont know whether I will win or lose. But I will travel and I need your support and prayers. And the first step towards is making Ganga realize she is mad. She has to know it from her husband. Death can happen. But if she survive the moment I can hope. "

Dr Sunny was one of the best performed characters of Mohanlal and Manichitrathazhu( Bhool Bhulaiyya in Hindi ) an iconic cult classic. The point where the doctor becomes the friend for the dearest people in his life was the high point of the movie.

When I started analysis itself I had told Saanjh will have to do that. She will have to disagree with all the laws known far and cut a path for her friend and his wife and most importantly for their child. Path of the heart, path of love which only she can.
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Posted: 8 years ago

Originally posted by: shruthiravi

@aditi Jhanvi says Ashwin was right, you are mad. So even for Jhanvi Ashwin is right not Maya. I guess I had told in one of my earlier posts words affect Maya. Ashwin had repeatedly harassed her ( I dont think sexual assault involved like Tell me Your Dreams) physically by telling her again and again she is mad.

Ashwin had done a very big psychological attack on Maya. She herself believes she is mad. She herself thinks she is bad and the actions stem out of that. You are what your thoughts are. The first step towards her correction is understanding the source of her madness, then make her realize she is mad, allow the madness to do what it wants or create the illusion of the madness achieving what it wants and then bring her out. Source is 9th birthday.

I always love the dialogue of Mohanlal in Manichitrathazhu with Tilakan who tells him tell Nakulan to stay away from Ganga. You cant avoid one death.

Then Mohanlal tells " To save my friend and his wife I have to disagree with all my teachers, I have to disagree with all the principles I have learned so far, I have to travel in the way no one else has traveled. I dont know whether I will win or lose. But I will travel and I need your support and prayers. And the first step towards is making Ganga realize she is mad. She has to know it from her husband. Death can happen. But if she survive the moment I can hope. "

Dr Sunny was one of the best performed characters of Mohanlal and Manichitrathazhu( Bhool Bhulaiyya in Hindi ) an iconic cult classic. The point where the doctor becomes the friend for the dearest people in his life was the high point of the movie.

When I started analysis itself I had told Saanjh will have to do that. She will have to disagree with all the laws known far and cut a path for her friend and his wife and most importantly for their child. Path of the heart, path of love which only she can.


But Shruti, you have always placed Saanjh as morally very low...that is where I have differed with you mainly...

...I have always placed Saanjh a a high morals person with a few human flaws...whereas you have always labelled her as a low morals person who is only after Maya's husband...

You are now contradicting your analysis so far...or are you now admitting that you have judged Saanjh wrongly so far?
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Posted: 8 years ago

Originally posted by: shruthiravi

@aditi Jhanvi says Ashwin was right, you are mad. So even for Jhanvi Ashwin is right not Maya. I guess I had told in one of my earlier posts words affect Maya. Ashwin had repeatedly harassed her ( I dont think sexual assault involved like Tell me Your Dreams) physically by telling her again and again she is mad.

Ashwin had done a very big psychological attack on Maya. She herself believes she is mad. She herself thinks she is bad and the actions stem out of that. You are what your thoughts are. The first step towards her correction is understanding the source of her madness, then make her realize she is mad, allow the madness to do what it wants or create the illusion of the madness achieving what it wants and then bring her out. Source is 9th birthday.

I always love the dialogue of Mohanlal in Manichitrathazhu with Tilakan who tells him tell Nakulan to stay away from Ganga. You cant avoid one death.

Then Mohanlal tells " To save my friend and his wife I have to disagree with all my teachers, I have to disagree with all the principles I have learned so far, I have to travel in the way no one else has traveled. I dont know whether I will win or lose. But I will travel and I need your support and prayers. And the first step towards is making Ganga realize she is mad. She has to know it from her husband. Death can happen. But if she survive the moment I can hope. "

Dr Sunny was one of the best performed characters of Mohanlal and Manichitrathazhu( Bhool Bhulaiyya in Hindi ) an iconic cult classic. The point where the doctor becomes the friend for the dearest people in his life was the high point of the movie.

When I started analysis itself I had told Saanjh will have to do that. She will have to disagree with all the laws known far and cut a path for her friend and his wife and most importantly for their child. Path of the heart, path of love which only she can.


Yes that's where Jhanvi has always failed as a mother by being a doormat wife. I think it could be sexual assault too, something big happened on her ninth birthday. And maybe for self defense she did some crime, n to cover that up she kept doing many other crimes, which can send her to jail for a long time. I really want to hear what's Maya ke Sach

I do believe that some part of Maya's mind might believe that's she's wrong, and to prove herself right, she blames others. But that's where she's wrong! Her enemy is 'Maya'. Which she knows very well, but covers it up by blaming the world.

Saanjh is right now, neither like Radha or Dr Aditya of Bhooolbhuliyaa. She might be doing everything to save Ayaan, but she also wants to separate Arjun from mad Maya unlike Radha who was willing to be proved mad to save Avni...
But can we expect her to become one? In a way Maya has Prem's blood in her hand. Can someone be so forgiving?
shruthiravi thumbnail
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Posted: 8 years ago
@Khushi I analyze the present, check on the symbolisms to predict the future. Saanjh's present actions doesnt show any morality I will stick to it. Her dialogues have high morals and actions have low morals and they dont match. But she has the potential to become the paragon of ethics with her actions, which I had believed will happen once she burns, once she understands what life is, once Prem goes from her life. If you go back to many of my analysis I have put this potential in many posts. It is potential, not what is present.
All the symbolisms has indicated towards this part. Saanjh is the medium through which Arjun and Maya will unite in true sense. And when she says to Vandana why are you putting me Saanjh, keep my name as Savera, it answered one of my questions also. Saanjh is destructive or medium or destruction as after Dusk comes darkness. But savera that early morning darkness post which we see the sun on the horizon, it brings the light. She has to realize her path. She can burn herself to give light.

Also you can compare Maya and Saanjh in real terms only when life throws unfairness to Saanjh in true sense. What Maya has done, burn and burn others, what Saanjh has to do burn and give light.

In nutshell her present actions are the delusional actions of a girl who didnt get her love and is morally not correct, but she can grow into a woman who will be a path breaker. The journey of Saanjh from girl to woman has to be that. Morals for me doesnt come from words, they come from actions in the most diring situations.
That's why I had loved the portrayal of Shivgami the most in Bahubali. A highly ethical person in words and actions, falls to mistake and then crime due to the Misunderstandings and perceptions and then redeems herself once again with her actions. Shivgami was a woman of action and one of the best written female characters in Indian Cinema in the last 10 years. Devasena also is that, but I had loved Shivgami more that too with Ramya Krishnan giving one of her career best performance.

@aditi both women can do anything for Arjun. In that lies the key whether Saanjh can forgive or not. Currently both of them are at opposite sides fighting with each other with Arjun as the bread crumb between them. Samay will take Arjun as it happens in all such cases where bread crumb goes to the third person😆😆. Then both the ladies have to be united for him, just like how they stood when the investigation happened for Ashwin murder.
Edited by shruthiravi - 8 years ago
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Posted: 8 years ago

Originally posted by: ---Khushi---


But Shruti, you have always placed Saanjh as morally very low...that is where I have differed with you mainly...

...I have always placed Saanjh a a high morals person with a few human flaws...whereas you have always labelled her as a low morals person who is only after Maya's husband...

You are now contradicting your analysis so far...or are you now admitting that you have judged Saanjh wrongly so far?


I beg to differ here. I don't think Shruthi di has placed her as a girl with low morals. Neither she has ever blindly hated her, read her analysis during ArYa wedding. She said she loved Saanjh the most during the wedding. (When most of the audience hated her)

If one says Saanjh wants to separate Arjun from Maya , and that's her main aim, I don't think that's Saanjh bashing in any way. It's a critical way of talking about the Character.
Because she can't aim to separate Arjun from Maya just because she's mad or a criminal. It's finally Arjun's call to leave her or stay with the criminal, waiting for her till she spends her time in jail.
Saanjh herself said this to Samay. That she wanna bring out the truth b4 Arjun, after that arjun knows n his wife.
But when she went to announce her victory over Maya, boast abt that n saying that Maya will be put to asylum. So in a way contradicted herself.
Also in the court case, Saanjh's preachy n cocky behavior led to her down fall,
And in a way this overconfidence is always making her lose.
Saanjh has knowledge, but Maya has experience, which always works in Maya's favor. If Saanjh doesn't have any weakness then Maya couldn't have ever used those human flaws in her favor n projected them as crimes.

That's what Shruthi di has always meant by saying Saanjh doesn't know abt life or hasn't seen life n then questions others. U can't just read one post of hers n say she's bashing Saanjh. U should read all her posts to form opinion about her.

Long time back she had said that Saanjh might lose her father as she blindly loves Arjun. After which she will grow. And even now she's saying the same.
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Posted: 8 years ago
Shruti, will respond to your this reply later...meanwhile, if u can, please reply to my previous post, about murders by Maya...
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Posted: 8 years ago

Originally posted by: shruthiravi



@aditi both women can do anything for Arjun. In that lies the key whether Saanjh can forgive or not. Currently both of them are at opposite sides fighting with each other with Arjun as the bread crumb between them. Samay will take Arjun as it happens in all such cases where bread crumb goes to the third person😆😆. Then both the ladies have to be united for him, just like how they stood when the investigation happened for Ashwin murder.


That's right! She can do anything for Arjun. 😊
But forgiving Maya for this thing is way too much, let's see. But yeah she might join hands with Maya to save Arjun from Samay. Also Maya is very wrong when she says only she can protect Arjun
Saanjh is Arjun's shield if Maya is his love. She has to give that place to Saanjh if she wants Arjun to love her.

Btw Shruthi di do u feel now we can compare Saanjh to Maya in terms of suffering? She lost her dad. She will suffer betrayal from Samay (she trusts him as much as she did Prem n Arjun )



shruthiravi thumbnail
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Posted: 8 years ago
@Khushi I have never negated Maya's past. No where I had told she might not have done the murders. If I remember right I had even put my comment on your MPD analysis that Maya's alter ego can do the murders.
My only point was when Maya came down that stairs that day she wanted to start afresh. She was asking Jhanvi whether everything will go fine to which Jhanvi replied yes everything will be fine.

Now comes Vandana with higher than mightly attitude and takes Arjun from the mandap. Maya is destabilized. Yes she is. My problem was when Vandana comes even if some FB of what Maya told in the press conference come to her and then she made the decision I would have told mother instinct or whatever. But she listened to the one sided story of Ashwin that went with her perception of Maya is bad, which suited her she decided to interfere. Then happens Ashwin's murder. Maya telling you wanted to kill Arjun. Maya needs to justify her crime to herself. Arjun is that justification, just like she telling yesterday you are a mother die for me, I am going to be mother I am killing for my child. Did yesterday's action happened for the child. No. It happened to get love from Arjun. That's the motive. Ashwin's murder happened because he has spoiled once chance for her to turn a new leaf, which happened because of Vandana taking Arjun from mandap. If I remember right in that episode analysis I had put if Saanjh had come she would have stopped Vandana, if Ayan had not taken that mobile from Arjun Saanjh would have come and hungama and screaming by Vandana could have been stopped. Saanjh came late, not very late, still late and for that Ayan was responsible who took that phone from Arjun. That screen play showed Saanjh is the key if she stays within limit she brings things together, she becomes life. When she overstays she becomes destructive where Arjun goes behind her and then mandap catching fire.

Now again I will tell why I say Vandana carried Ashwin is because during Prem's funeral CVs have showed Arjun carries forward Prem. That scene was a beauty I would say. Where Arjun negates Vandana. Vandana who was going to give the right to light the funeral pyre of Prem to his killer based on her judgement and Arjun telling that is not his right and giving it to Saanjh and standing in between bringing Shubham also. Vandana's judgements are wrong. CVs very clearly showed it subtly in Prem's funeral and Arjun with the support of Saanjh will negate each of her judgement. He will defeat Ashwin with Prem.
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Posted: 8 years ago

Originally posted by: aditi97



I beg to differ here. I don't think Shruthi di has placed her as a girl with low morals. Neither she has ever blindly hated her, read her analysis during ArYa wedding. She said she loved Saanjh the most during the wedding. (When most of the audience hated her)

If one says Saanjh wants to separate Arjun from Maya , and that's her main aim, I don't think that's Saanjh bashing in any way. It's a critical way of talking about the Character.



Shruti feels that Saanjh's main aim is to separate ArYa and have Arjun for herself- that's where most of her judgements on the character seem to come from, and where we appear to differ.

She mentioned in a previous thread that she judged Saanjh and Vandana as Gods, essentially people who cannot make mistakes and can't be afforded the chance to do one, even inadvertently.

My $0.02 on that.

Saanjh accepted ArYa, albeit with a heavy heart (perfectly human, I'd say), for Arjun's sake.

She supported ArYa and even went against Vandana in the initial episodes after ArYa's marriage, and even went so far as to decorate the house and arrange honeymoon tickets out of her own money.

Maya has orchestrated plenty of situations to create misunderstandings between Saanjh and Arjun- the e-mail fiasco, the whole bit about promotions, knowing that Saanjh's level-headedness and Arjun's duffergiri would easily clash. I've not seen Saanjh create a single misunderstanding deliberately between ArYa. Even in the brinjal episode, where Saanjh understands that Maya loves Arjun, she immediately goes to Arjun and conveys the message, rather than hide it and plan a way to get Arjun for herself before Maya catches him.

Till the day Maya orchestrates the Bhaang fiasco, Saanjh is relatively pro-Maya and turns on her only when she knows what Maya's done, and realises what Vandana had been saying about her all along was true.

Maya then plays the miscarriage card (one I believe to be fake), and gets Arjun to banish Saanjh from their lives.

Maya then plants Samay in Saanjh's life, despite having Arjun all to herself for three years.

Saanjh's ethics are pretty sound- she could have had a moment of weakness when Arjun leant in for a kiss at the bar, but she realises that he is Maya's, and stops herself perfectly in time.

Finally, should ArYa separate- Saanjh will not force Arjun to marry her. Should Arjun say no, she will respect his wishes. Saanjh's aim is Arjun's happiness, even if it comes at the cost of her own.

My replies in blue- can't get the quote thingy to function properly on this forum at times.
Edited by aekiel - 8 years ago

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