I'm Not a Feminist, I Believe in Equality: Kareena Kapoor Khan

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Posted: 7 years ago

#101

Originally posted by: return_to_hades

Not just a voice of reason. You are the light that is brighter than a billion stars in the darkness that is humanity. ⭐️

😆

Edited by BlackPanther7 - 7 years ago

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1098676

Suspended

Posted: 7 years ago

#102

Originally posted by: --Pro.vo.King--

You have been trying to escape your generalization & it isn't happening <--- that's what I meant ...

If someone is attracted to same sex but doesn't want to be labelled as gay or lesbian , that is completely up to the individual .. Some just identify as "queer" or want nothing to do with labels at all .. You can't forcefully label someone against someone's wishes for your own convenience.. You or I don't have any authority over how someone wishes to be identified .. Existence of terms & their definitions is one thing but putting people in a box is a completely different thing ..

And thankyou for forcefully branding me a Muslim .. Thats exactly my point .. I am not a Muslim by a long shot .. 😆

Feminazis ( not you especially) need to understand that not everybody who strongly believes in equality identifies as a feminist .. This is a very simple fact which feminazis refuse to accept .. When there is such a crazed fanaticism , no wonder feminism is looked down upon .. Most sane people want nothing to do with feminism (<---- not a generalization , right ? 😆 )

Lolz, now you just want to force your point on me without backing up any facts.😆 What was my original comment?

Movie is coming, and I think it's not upto the mark, so time to give W*F statements trend. Kareena is just following that. Few months ago she was saying that women are superior to men. Now she believes in equality, and still not a feminist.

I can never believe that these celebs don't know the meaning of feminism. Feminism is seen as something bad mostly by people who live in backward class,and since most of those people are fans or fanatics of these celebrities, they don't want to be labeled as feminists.

You have a problem with my words in bold and italics part,right? Now what did I say? I said that it's mostly Backward class people who see feminism as something bad. Now you comprehended completely something else from this part, and when I explained you what I actually meant, you just don't want to understand it as you've already made up your mind.

First, you are not in the place of those backward class people. You are in place of celebs who don't want to be labeled as feminists, just because it has got a bad reputation.

Secondly, Yes, some people like gays or lesbians don't want to be labeled as such, but why? Is it a bad thing to be one? Why not accept your identity and own up to it? Doesn't mean you have to tell the world that you are homosexual, just accept the reality yourself first.

Same with you equalists, why don't you show yourself as a feminist,(if you are), and tell the world it's not a bad thing, but a misunderstood term. You completely ignored my point that the term "equalists" basically brings all types of people under one umbrella, and then it becomes less about men and women(something for which the word feminism is)

Again, I'm not labeling someone, these all terms are pre-defined, I didn't create them. If you are a guy, you are a guy, can you change it?(unless you go under sex change operation)

You are talking about labels but in your first reply to me, you yourself labeled me as a radical feminist? Where did your logic went at that time?

And didn't you also made a generalization by calling Salman fans as illiterate and uneducated?(btw, this is a question)

Thankyou to you too, for AGAIN putting words in my mouth. I never called you a Muslim, and I knew you weren't one. I just told who is a true Muslim. Again, this is a pre-defined term. I didn't create it.

I don't even want to talk about the word feminazi. Feminism is about equality, dear...Don't want to be identified with it...it's your choice of course, just like it's the gays and lesbians choice to come out in the open or not. But accepting or not accepting doesn't change the reality or definitions of words.

"Most sane people want nothing to do with feminism", yes it's not a generalization. I'm saying it myself, but not generalizing doesn't make this statement true.

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--Pro.vo.King--

@--Pro.vo.King--

Dazzler

Posted: 7 years ago

#103

@ Luna46

I am breaking the tower quote .. 😆

You seem to be going round & round about your first post whilst making little to no sense in an attempt to justify your generalization .. Now you are hell bent in grouping me with the celebs who don't identify as feminists instead of the "backward class" as claimed by you in your original post ..

I see you have brought up two points to show me the so called " mirror " .. First , labelling your very first post as "radical feminism" .. I am sorry dear but if you go as far as judging people & calling them backward class just because they dont identify as feminists , it is radical feminism .. Secondly , calling Salman fans "backward class" .. Its no secret that I dislike Salman , but that is neither here nor there in the current context .. When I said Kareena's fanbase is different & that she is no Salman Khan .. I meant her fanbase now is mostly restricted to online fangirls , she doesn't enjoy the stardom or reach Salman has today & her fangirls would be royally pissed at her statement .. The fact that you seem to have taken it as dig at Salman fans instead of Kareena fans qualifies as reading what's not written ( which ironically you have been accusing me of from the get go 😆)..

I asked you if you will brand me Muslim just because I believe in peace .. You said yes , that makes me Muslim .. Now , you are accusing me of putting words into your mouth ? ..

It is not my responsibility as an equalist to make people understand the misunderstood feminism .. Especially when I myself have lost all my faith in feminism .. In my opinion , feminism is no good .. Best to stay away from it .. And i didn't distance myself from feminism just because it has got a bad reputation , I truly believe the concept has lost all its meaning & as such has no place in the modern world .. Instead of promoting the misunderstood feminism , i can put that time & effort into actually promoting equality ..

Being gay/ lesbian & owning up to it is that individual's own business .. You or I do not get a say in it and we certainly aren't entitled to force anyone to label themselves .. How are you still not getting it ? .. Nobody said being gay is bad .. We are talking about labels & how an individual chooses to label himself/herself ..

If you are a guy , you are a guy .. Says who ? .. You really believe that without sex change operation gender identity is predefined for an individual ? .. Well , that settles it then .. 😆

Edited by --Pro.vo.King-- - 7 years ago

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Somebody

@BebaakBegum

Stunner

+ 6

Posted: 7 years ago

#104

@--Pro.vo.King--
I totally agree with whatever you have written. Personally, I do not believe in labels which is why the hate for Kareena in this topic confused me coz how does it matter? If the intention is the same/similar then why is it taken negatively. Let's say someone calls himself an Equalist and works for the equal rights of men and women extensively. Equalism, which like many here mentioned is an umbrella term for equal rights for not just men and women but everyone, even animals but that same person enjoys meat then should that person be bashed for the label even though he might have worked for the cause more than you and me ever will? Not everyone needs to identify with everything people consider ideal. As long as the intention is clear and not harmful, how does it matter what the said term is?
Also, the Gay/Queer example is great. It is nobody's business to be interested in anyone's sexual orientation than their own. It's not about the fear of coming out of the closet or being ashamed of it but just the need of minding their own business.

Edited by -BebaakBegum- - 7 years ago

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storminateacup

@storminateacup

Explorer

Posted: 7 years ago

#105

Everyone is missing the most important part, how did Kareena go from this:

"Women Are Way More Superior Than Men: Kareena Kapoor Khan

http://www.koimoi.com/bollywood-news/women-are-way-more-superior-than-men-kareena-kapoor-khan-on-zaira-wasim-incident/

To this? :

I'm Not a Feminist, I Believe in Equality: Kareena Kapoor Khan

😆😆😆 She is so confused! Wonder why such a debate has been stretched out from what she says. But anything to hate on feminism..🤔

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--Pro.vo.King--

@--Pro.vo.King--

Dazzler

Posted: 7 years ago

#106

Originally posted by: Biscuit-
Everyone is missing the most important part, how did Kareena go from this:
"Women Are Way More Superior Than Men: Kareena Kapoor Khan

http://www.koimoi.com/bollywood-news/women-are-way-more-superior-than-men-kareena-kapoor-khan-on-zaira-wasim-incident/

To this? :

I'm Not a Feminist, I Believe in Equality: Kareena Kapoor Khan

😆😆😆 She is so confused! Wonder why such a debate has been stretched out from what she says. But anything to hate on feminism..🤔

If you see the first page you ll get a gist of what the debate is about & why it has been stretched so far .. The debate is no longer about Kareena .. But I guess anything to defend radical feminism .. 😆

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storminateacup

@storminateacup

Explorer

Posted: 7 years ago

#107

Originally posted by: --Pro.vo.King--

If you see the first page you ll get a gist of what the debate is about & why it has been stretched so far .. The debate is no longer about Kareena .. But I guess anything to defend radical feminism .. 😆

I'd rather not engage with the likes of people who use 'feminazi' 😳

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Karenina

@Karenina

Inactive

Posted: 7 years ago

#108

My two words.

Feminism, of course, stems from unequal rights for women. If you look into literature, feminism as a movement had begun as early as the 1850s in England. In India, most of our literary and mythic texts empower women. In the USA, feminism is a rather newer phenomenon. Just look into some of the most sexist and derogatory adverts from as late as the 70s to realize how America was at the fore of this inequality among all developed countries in the world.

That said, today feminism has also taken a connotative meaning. That is what's causing all this debate. Feminism, in isolation, is about women empowerment and equal rights. But connotatively, we have people increasingly exploiting the gender dynamics in the name of feminism.

This is what Kareena was most likely alluding to - even though I wouldn't be surprised if she were being her usual stupid self.

Nonetheless, when you have pseudo-feminists like Swara Bhaskar who analyzes every text through the lens of feminism, you only end up tainting the image because feminism is not about distorting reality, or simply creating texts that critic abuses/human rights violations imposed on women by largely patriarchal societies in the past.

Feminism is a way forward and is one of the movements that originally intended to put men and women on equal footing. And be aware that the gender war, in most developed countries, has been won by women. The constitution, labor laws, social laws, ethics, norms, and the most important of them all - perception, human sympathy, and media support - are all with women in most developed countries. Sweden's feminist model of government is one of the examples.

Today, there is an increasing gulf between the connotative and denotative meaning of feminism - and that's why even top-class scholars who champion women's rights and are experts in gender studies (read Camille Paglia) shy away from feminism as it is today because the original motive has far been lost in its way from authentic to a hotchpotch of politicization and vendetta.

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1098676

Suspended

Posted: 7 years ago

#109

Originally posted by: --Pro.vo.King--
@ Luna46
I am breaking the tower quote .. 😆

You seem to be going round & round about your first porst whilst making little to no sense in an attempt to justify your generalization .. Now you are hell bent in grouping me with the celebs who don't identify as feminists instead of the "backward class" as claimed by you in your original post ..

I see you have brought up two points to show me the so called " mirror " .. First , labelling your very first post as "radical feminism" .. I am sorry dear but if you go as far as judging people & calling them backward class just because they dont identify as feminists , it is radical feminism .. Secondly , calling Salman fans "backward class" .. Its no secret that I dislike Salman , but that is neither here nor there in the current context .. When I said Kareena's fanbase is different & that she is no Salman Khan .. I meant her fanbase now is mostly restricted to online fangirls , she doesn't enjoy the stardom or reach Salman has today & her fangirls would be royally pissed at her statement .. The fact that you seem to have taken it as dig at Salman fans instead of Kareena fans qualifies as reading what's not written ( which ironically you have been accusing me of from the get go 😆)..

I asked you if you will brand me Muslim just because I believe in peace .. You said yes , that makes me Muslim .. Now , you are accusing me of putting words into your mouth ? ..

It is not my responsibility as an equalist to make people understand the misunderstood feminism .. Especially when I myself have lost all my faith in feminism .. In my opinion , feminism is no good .. Best to stay away from it .. And i didn't distance myself from feminism just because it has got a bad reputation , I truly believe the concept has lost all its meaning & as such has no place in the modern world .. Instead of promoting the misunderstood feminism , i can use that time & effort into actually promoting equality ..

Being gay/ lesbian & owning up to it is that individual's own business .. You or I do not get a say in it and we certainly aren't entitled to force anyone to label themselves .. How are you still not getting it ? .. Nobody said being gay is bad .. We are talking about labels & how an individual chooses to label himself/herself ..

If you are a guy , you are a guy .. Says who ? .. You really believe that without sex change operation gender identity is predefined for an individual ? .. Well , that settles it then .. 😆

I'm going round and round?😆 And what are exactly you doing? Again, you are just twisting my words. You don't want to believe that I didn't call you equalists as backward class? Prove it!!!! Show me the words which proves it directly, instead of just writing statements like "backtracking won't help" or What I've written is black and white", blah blah blah..What exactly proves that it's black and white? I'm going round and round about my original post because you are accusing me of writing something which I didn't.

I'm making little to no sense? Maybe you don't want to make any sense out of my post. You know na what is feminism? You know that textbook feminism meaning is not bad? So, how do you become backward class? Feminism has not lost it's true meaning, it just has got a bad reputation. Feminism is still a movement about equality. Again I repeat, feminism is feminism, doesn't matter if it's modern or old age, it's meaning will not change.

So you are going to DIRECTLY label me as a radical feminist?😆 I don't identify myself as a radical feminist.😆Who are you to decide that? 😆Did I call you backward class directly? Why don't you understand my post first before labeling me as something, and it seems like you have understood my post, but don't want to accept it.

Let's see what you've written about fans...

The celeb in question here is Kareena whose current fanbase I doubt belongs to the category mentioned by you ... She is no Salman Khan.. In fact a majority of her fanbase must be pissed with her statement ( go figure which fanbase I am talking about ) ..

What should I make out with the underlined part? I can actually make out anything with that underlined statement. What is this category btw? You think Kareena fans can't be uneducated about feminism? You took the name Salman Khan first, not me, and I took the dig?lmao...Still I've asked about this statement, as a question. I could've pointed this out then and there when you made that reply.

Let me write it again, what I said about Islam and Muslims.

If you completely believe in what Islam says and follow it, then yes, you are a Muslim.

I didn't just say YES you are Muslim, because you said Islam is peace. But as usual, you were putting words in my mouth.

It's their individual business if they want to own up to it or not. Of course it is. I'm writing again and again that you can call yourself anything, BUT IT DOESN'T CHANGE REALITY. And as for Kareena, you know that all celebs are judged on this forum? You too will be judged, I too will be judged for our posts. People will not say directly but they will judge in their mind. it's a human tendency to judge people. Kareena says she believes in equality, but not a feminist, she'll be judged for that. Just like you judged me for my post.

Again you ignored about my point, that the equalist term will bring people from all class, status, caste, religion, country etc. under one roof, and it'll not be about men and women anymore.

A boy is a boy. Can you change that you aren't a boy. So gender and sexual identity isn't predefined? Am I missing something, or are you just comprehending else from my statement as usual.

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807116

Hibernated

Posted: 7 years ago

#110

Please educate me. What extra does "feminism" cover, which is not covered by "human rights" (which campaigns for equal rights to all and equal opportunities for all)?