The Other side of SRGMP: Game behind the - Page 8

Originally posted by: soulsoup

Skud bhai - I will just say one word - "YOU ARE GREAT"
Highlighted the points I liked most.

Thanks soulsoup for the compliments. I am too lazy to start a thread of my own so whenever I find some nice thread in the forum, I just come in and shoot off my ideas ... in this case, I only re-iterated what you analysed so well and objectively ....

😉 😉 😉

Excellent work SoulSoup:

Here is my take and I have read everyone's comments so far. I am a Chemical Engineer who makes a living by marketing so I have street smarts and no Book smarts. I was involved with Debu on brainstorming some of these ideas and was picking up on HR's weaknesses and strengths. We knew HR was a politician and ID was too transparent (Total opposite personalities). HR had a weak hand; ID had a strong hand (Blue Diamond – my branding of NJ). This was not about music – obvious – all # 1 and # 2 picks (boys and girls) did not show up in the finals. Now, with my own prelude done, I will comment point by point to your post

Enough of prelude – let's get into SRGMP. What HR ji did right to promote Vinit?

1. Identify the right product. To be honest – unfortunately, he didn't have much choice, I must say he had the weakest team overall. HR ji identified Vinit as the best singer from his gharana – that's a first step to success. (He focused very well – big +)

2. Find 'sticky' stories. To much talk about this already, but this time I am saying this with great appreciation of HR s marketing strategy. Vinit's love affair, His Sanskar, His Maa – ka – Payar – all are well articulated and well marketed sticky stories.

1. NB: To start with Vinit had to 'inbuilt' sticky stories with him. One his middleclass background and his age – both are great for associating the audience (target market / voter) with him.(Good strategy –poor execution – dragged it to much)

3. Brand Signature: Vinit's Topi. No joke here- I am serious. Every person, even from the enemy-camp associate Vinit with his Topi. That's a brand signature of Vinit. .(Good strategy –poor execution – dragged it to much)

4. Consistent Messaging: Can you identify these terms – 'consistence performance', '8-9-10', well… I can go on – but I think you got the point. HR never changed the terminologies – classic marketing 101! .(Good strategy for Brand building –good execution. Actually, this is where Debu was failing the most due to poor internal campaigning by ID)

So what went wrong with Vinit/HR – why they lost in the final? Now Vinit supporters -you can always brag about the fact of "<ST1:COUNTRY-REGIoN w:st="on">Assam</ST1:COUNTRY-REGIoN>'s Votes" – but there is a particular reason of the immense support from the home-ground of Debu. Also he got enough vote from other parts of <ST1:COUNTRY-REGIoN w:st="on">India</ST1:COUNTRY-REGIoN> too (not as much as Vinit) apart from East zone. Why that happened?

I can identify couple of reasons here.

1. When Zee started showing the regional voting pattern – Debu reached the 'Tipping Point' (Zee started to qualify votes, we had no control, so we let AS and HR get emotional about it)

2. HR, despite of his great knowledge of marketing, violated a golden rule of Marketing 101 – NEVR TALK BAD ABOUT THE COMPETETOR. By bragging about the '<ST1:COUNTRY-REGIoN w:st="on">Assam</ST1:COUNTRY-REGIoN>'s Votes' – he actually helped Debu a lot. Adesh ji was his partner in crime in this. More he (as well as Vinit) bragged about this issue – 2 things went wrong – 1^st NE people got more angry (naturally it hurt their ego) and voted more for Debu, 2^nd people from other parts of India who thought it's unfair got pissed off too and voted for Debu. (Debu kept telling me: "I do not know why the other mentors are scoring me down". My answer: "It hurts but it builds public sympathy for you bcoz of the injustice being done". It polarized neutral folks to vote for Debu.

Now for Debojit. I must say – for him it's a classic example of Marketing 2.0, where evangelists take the control instead of marketing strategies. His mentor, Ismail ji, is not a great strategist. (AGREED – BIG TIME. Infact ID started listening to us only after the Blue Diamond got booted) But luck favored him a lot. (It was not luck but NJ's departure. NJ was going to go out the way the system was. She refused to play the game taking the moral high ground. I tried to convince her otherwise but of no avail – It was her leaving that got ID listening to the people around him that IT WAS NOT about music but votes – politics/marketing, etc.)

1. Two of the main points I mentioned before : gifts from HR to Debu! (That was observed and noted by us)
2. He got 'filtered down' votes from Nihira and Hemu fans. That's my theory – got this impression from the this forum posts (I think Hema votes got split. More of NJ came to Debu because of ID gharana)
3. His modest attitude grabbed lots of votes. Many people actually liked him as a person more than as a singer. (This where Debu excelled – I kept telling him: "Take the beating, keep on ticking, do not let it distract you. ID repeated my words in one of the key episodes)
4. He also had some 'installed sticky stories' to start with

1. His middleclass background

2. His wife Bandana/ Their struggle at Mumbai (AGREED)

5. Now here comes the most interesting part – but this requires a little theoretical prelude. In his book 'The Tipping Point" Malcom Gladwell identified some required factors to reach the tipping point for an Idea / Person / Fashion statement / trend. Most important 2 things are –

1. Sticky 'Compelling' Stories

2. 3 types of people supporting the Person / Idea

i. Maven – who collect all the useful information / positive points about the person or idea

ii. Connectors – who have a tightly knit social network to spread the idea

iii. Sales person – no explanation required.

Now – if you look at Debu – he got all 3 in form of evangelists. Forget others – in this forum only many people volunteered for Debu as Maven/Connector/Salesperson. Why they did it? Not for any vested interest. (Common man will tend to support the underdog ) Many were mesmerized by Debu's attitude, others were tired of Himesh ji's 'Overselling'. Whatever it is it worked. (HR oversold – classic error; HR ignored his main competitor, Debu, from day one – classic error; HR openly played politics – nailed the coffin)

Now the last part – why Debu and Vinit reached the final? First – they were most controversial of all (Vinit for HR, Debu for Asaam). That's another great mind boggling part of what reaches the tipping point. CoThis is getting too long – let me cut short by just pointing out a diagram by Kathy Sierra. (I had been telling Debu since mid Dec it would be Vinit versus him and to plan for that day – not knowing all this Sierra stuff – my gut told me that Debu had to use every episode to get one notch up on Vinit – the Kishore Da songs helped as VS was viewed to be very poor in that arena)

Final Comment: we all learned here including me. I knew from day one that there was a Game behind the Game and the people involved in the Game were not realizing it but HR. He was the man to beat !!

Very good analysis! I tip my hat to you. Look forward to doing a similar one for the next challenge. The players will change but the game goes on.

Nicely put, Surpremiji ...

BTW, any comments on my annexure to soulsoup's post .... do refer to page 9

😉 😉 😉

Skud: Excellent remarks - my comments in red

Brilliant article, SoulSoup.

If we have followed the show closely enough, all the inbuilt / external marketing strategies for any contestant came to the forefront only when the AgniPariksha round began ... basically when the choice was put to the public (aka, the customer here). Before that, it was more on the grounds of the previous SRGMP versions.

Let's not get into a debate with Gajji's role in the show and making it open to public voting. He was asked by zee mgmt. to boost the TRP ratings. Thanks to all the dramas and his brilliant editings, the channel (Zee) upstaged Sony as the number two channel next only to Star. Apart from the ratings, let's not forget the amount of money that he raked in from the show itself. Now with the show coming to an end, Zee is marketing the contestants in all the zee sponsored shows and award shows for even more money. (AGREED: Money TALKS – REST WALKS)

Ok. Enough with Gajji and Zee ... Let's get back to the marketing game that started with the AgniPariksha round. Remember, right from the time when the show started people were asked to poll in for the best mentor(as they felt). HR was simply brilliant in playing his card ... he praised the other mentors around and often accepted them as his senior and better musicians. Aishwarya's exit(unceremoniusly) and HR's behaviour ensured that he shot to the top of the books in the mind of the audience. (HR, the politician that he is, was trying to seek public sympathy as the "Bechara" with whom injustice was done – public fell for it - Hook, Line and Sinker)

Round 1 to HR. Result : HR being given the Brahmastra. (absolutely: Good Strategy – Good execution – Good follow thru – HR didn't care who came in – he was already focused on his Ace of Spades – who he would keep secured – He used this Bumbasthra round to gain his peer's love and well wishes but did not distract from his Focus: Vinit)

HR played his cards right once again. He brought in few contestants from other gharanas and hit the pulse of audience yet again. It didn't make any difference to him that Paresh and Ujjaini enetered the show again. For him, he had made his mark with the audience yet again by portraying his generous nature.

Round 2 to HR. Result : HR had already won a fair share of audience even before the AgniPariksha began. (HR was out to oust NJ as early as he could – she was his biggest threat – remember 10th std ki ladki 5th std ki class main, etc…)

As the AgniPariksha rounds ran and Raktima (classically trained), Swananda and Sharib made early exits, HR by then was sure what was working with the audience(it wasn't music, it was how the singer was marketed to the target audience). Then came his marketing schemes out of his hat : Vinit's love, Maa ka pyar, DeshBhakti, consistency and so on.

Round n(next few) to HR. Brilliant strategist and marketing genius. (I disagree here – he downplayed Debu openly and that was acting against him – he was up hyping VS too much and it was hurting him – he loved his product too much – cannot fall in love here – it was a WAR)

Like SoulSoup pointed out, HR went wrong in few areas: Directly disapproving of another contestant when he himself ascertained he didn't like Debojit's singing and brought out the regional bias in Debojit's share of votes. This angered the public(as they felt that their choice or judgement was being ridiculed ... never ever ridicule the voter ... you're bound to lose support). Hype gets you the market, overhype makes you lose a share of the market you had gained because of your hype ... the same happened to HR. He lost because he went overboard in promoting Vinit. Last but not the least, the contestants walkout episode blew his marketing gimmicks to shambles. (THIS CAME AS A BLOW TO HR – PROBABLY STRATEGIZED BY AS I AM SURE - THIS WAS THE ONE BIGGEST ERROR OF THIS GAME – WHERE EVEN GS OPENLY ON CAMERA YELLED AT HK, HEMA AND VS – I KNEW THEN AND THERE DEBU WAS TO WIN IT ALL BCOZ DEBU HAD NOT WALKED OUT ON GS – REMEMBER GS COUNTED THE VOTES ….) Once that happened courtesy one of the mentors(we still aren't sure if it was AS or HR), (My Bet : AS and a big failure in strategy messed up HR big time to the point that even he lost his cool: ABhi NJ ko koi yaad nahin kareyga) people sympathized and empathized with Debojit. ID's walkout, his deafening silence added further support for the underdog and the voting favour completely changed hands. HR blew his own lid off in the final rounds ....

Final round to ID. A lesson for HR about where his strategies went wrong. (ID just did what his heart said. Amitjee to SRK in KHKG "kya soch kar yeh pyaar kiya tuney." SRK "Mainey tho kuch socha hee nahin, bus pyaar hogayaa" ID is just like that – does what his heart says and is transparent as hell – we finally chgd him around)

Let's not forget SRGMP's reach/audience. It chiefly comprises of TV addicts(housewifes who get tired of watching soap operas,kids and teenagers who have quite a lot of spare time and musical enthusiasts) and few offbeat TV viewers. Of the three the first two (housewives, kids and teenagers) are the ones who spend the maximum on sms or voting (remember a lower middle class housewife in MP spent over a lakh and half in sms for Qazi in FG). Infact because of the female element in the audience, female contestants get eliminated earlier than their male counterparts inspite of the talent. II, SRGMP, FG, II2 ... all illustrious examples.
HR had the audience in his mind all along .. he very well knew what kind of drama/strategy catered to this niche target ... and he played his 'masala' elements to the perfection. Unfortunately, he blew his own strategy off and brought in a huge dose of regional support for his opponent contestant ... I AM REALLY NOT SURE IF AT THE END THE VOTE COUNT WAS GENUINE – GS AND ZEE HAD DECIDED TO GIVE IT TO DEBU – PERIOD – I BELIEVE THIS VOTING BUSINESS IN THE FINAL ROUND WAS A REVENUE GENERATOR -- PERIOD.

Thanks Surpremi. Appreciate your post and constructive remarks regarding mine.

😊 😊 😊

SURPREMIG- loved going through the personal aspects of the Game and for the perspective from one of the camps- particularly useful when it is from the winning camp and from a street smart marketer such as yourself. lot we can learn from it.

SOULSOUP- yes, simplyskud brings up the different market segments ie. housewives, teens. Wonder which is the largest- gives an inbuilt advantage to whoever goes after that segment. Let's say we had a new round, which segment shld one go after, the housewives? the teens? Are there areas of overlap between the different segments or are they mutually exclusive...

where does the product come in? cld a debo be marketed to the teens, and a vinit to the housewives. was it all the marketing strategy or was there something inherent abt the products which told at least HR that he wld have better luck with the teen market? BOTTOM LINE, WOULD HR HAVE USED THE SAME STRATEGY AND TACTICS IF HE WAS MARKETING DEBO?

i think HR understands the teen market well- his professional success is built around that. i think this was also a case of COMPETENCE, understanding your own market and the product that you could sell into it.. Pretty hard to fit a square peg in a round hole..

again, excellent paper, soulsoup. special strength in my opinion on the STRATEGY part.

SIMPLYSKUD- great way of showing how things changed over time, of the ups and downs. its a historical approach giving us a blow-by-blow account of points scored. IT BRINGS OUT THE DYNAMIC NATURE OF THE GAME.

Thanks CB for the compliment.

😊

Soulsoup: that was excellent. you absolutely echoed my thoughts on why HR is a shrewd business man.

COMPARATIVE ADVERTISING truly did bring about HR/Vinit downfall (e.g. Debo = "Assami" vs. Vinit = "Hindustani").

What he forgot is that Comparative Advertising is not really appreciated in South Asia. It may have worked if he were in North America.

Great post 👏👏

Originally posted by: soulsoup

This post is nothing to do with Music. But if you really think – in SRGMP C2005 – there were many things which had nothing to do with music. This post is about conscious and unconscious marketing went behind the contestants, what worked, what didn't and implications of talent hunt on the 'mob' psychology. I don't know anyone related to Zee or contestants – all I got here are theories. I'll try to write this without any bias or prejudice.

For the readers – if you think this is not something of your choice – please move on – there plenty of great posts around, but please don't dilute the topic.

For the Moderators – I am perfectly aware of the fact that this post is nothing to do with Music – if you think digging the past is unhealthy for the forum – please close the topic – no hard feelings – I have complete faith on you people.

Where to start from? Let's start from Himesh-ji and Vinit (that's the only way for me to get some reader for this boring post). Now honestly – I am a big fan of Himesh ji in another perspective – as a great Marketing person (There is NO sarcasm here). The person who decides to produce TV serial to get into the music industry at the age of 18 – you must realize there is a great strategic and innovative thought process behind his every move. Look where is he right now. Ok – like many of you – I don't like his music and singing either – but we can't deny the way he moved forward within a very short span of time.

Enough of prelude – let's get into SRGMP. What HR ji did right to promote Vinit?

Identify the right product. To be honest – unfortunately, he didn't have much choice, I must say he had the weakest team overall. HR ji identified Vinit as the best singer from his gharana – that's a first step to success. Find 'sticky' stories. To much talk about this already, but this time I am saying this with great appreciation of HR s marketing strategy. Vinit's love affair, His Sanskar, His Maa – ka – Payar – all are well articulated and well marketed sticky stories.
1. NB: To start with Vinit had to 'inbuilt' sticky stories with him. One his middleclass background and his age – both are great for associating the audience (target market / voter) with him.
Brand Signature: Vinit's Topi. No joke here- I am serious. Every person, even from the enemy-camp associate Vinit with his Topi. That's a brand signature of Vinit.
1. Consistent Messaging: Can you identify these terms – 'consistence performance', '8-9-10', well… I can go on – but I think you got the point. HR never changed the terminologies – classic marketing 101!

So what went wrong with Vinit/HR – why they lost in the final? Now Vinit supporters -you can always brag about the fact of "Assam's Votes" – but there is a particular reason of the immense support from the home-ground of Debu. Also he got enough vote from other parts of India too (not as much as Vinit) apart from East zone. Why that happened?

I can identify couple of reasons here.

When Zee started showing the regional voting pattern – Debu reached the 'Tipping Point'
1. HR, despite of his great knowledge of marketing, violated a golden rule of Marketing 101 – NEVR TALK BAD ABOUT THE COMPETETOR. By bragging about the 'Assam's Votes' – he actually helped Debu a lot. Adesh ji was his partner in crime in this. More he (as well as Vinit) bragged about this issue – 2 things went wrong – 1^st NE people got more angry (naturally it hurt their ego) and voted more for Debu, 2^nd people from other parts of India who thought it's unfair got pissed off too and voted for Debu.

Now for Debojit. I must say – for him it's a classic example of Marketing 2.0, where evangelists take the control instead of marketing strategies. His mentor, Ismail ji, is not a great strategist. But luck favored him a lot.

Two of the main points I mentioned before : gifts from HR to Debu! He got 'filtered down' votes from Nihira and Hemu fans. That's my theory – got this impression from the this forum posts His modest attitude grabbed lots of votes. Many people actually liked him as a person more than as a singer. He also had some 'installed sticky stories' to start with
His middleclass background
1. His wife Bandana/ Their struggle at Mumbai
Now here comes the most interesting part – but this requires a little theoretical prelude. In his book 'The Tipping Point" Malcom Gladwell identified some required factors to reach the tipping point for an Idea / Person / Fashion statement / trend. Most important 2 things are –
1. Sticky 'Compelling' Stories
2. 3 types of people supporting the Person / Idea

<!--[if !supportLists]--> i. <!--[endif]-->Maven – who collect all the useful information / positive points about the person or idea

<!--[if !supportLists]--> ii. <!--[endif]-->Connectors – who have a tightly knit social network to spread the idea

<!--[if !supportLists]--> iii. <!--[endif]-->Sales person – no explanation required.

Now – if you look at Debu – he got all 3 in form of evangelists. Forget others – in this forum only many people volunteered for Debu as Maven/Connector/Salesperson. Why they did it? Not for any vested interest. Many were mesmerized by Debu's attitude, others were tired of Himesh ji's 'Overselling'. Whatever it is it worked.

Now the last part – why Debu and Vinit reached the final? First – they were most controversial of all (Vinit for HR, Debu for Asaam). That's another great mind boggling part of what reaches the tipping point. CoThis is getting too long – let me cut short by just pointing out a diagram by Kathy Sierra.

Morale of the whole story – If you need to find GREAT talent – use judges in the old format. (Don't get me wrong – I am not saying Debu or Vinit doesn't deserve to be in the final. At the same time I will refuse to accept if you want me to believe that they are better than Nihira – that's my opinion)

But if Zee / Gajendra ji needs to make money out of the show – voting is the only way to go. It's very easy for us to say – 'They should go back to the old format". But honestly – what you will do if you were in his shoes?

I whole heartly agree with the analysis made here. All have valid points here. I and others who enjoy this program have said at teh start that this is a show of great strategy. HR is a great marketer as U all pointed out here (that is why I have given him special honor here. I mean his music alone as surpassed any of the mentors. Right now anytime you go into the music news HR is at top so naturally all will analyze him the most. I have openly said I like his music not that it has any meaning just the upbeat rhythms. I mean Shaan, Sonu too are good yet HR won the award over them. So yes he is a great marketer!!!!!!!

Agree Ismail has given meaningful songs yet where is he in the market right now? Ismail as all have said plays with his heart I mean he publicily gave his treasured rupee to Vinet. He praised other participants and yelled at his own when they were not singing well (which went against him). It was not until his beloved Nihira was kicked out that he woke up and started his own strategies like walking out, and that too only afterdebo scored poorly. Ismail after the scores said something to his participant that U will never win with these mentors and aboutconsipirarcy. I am sure he was genuinely upset at Nihira leaving. Ifdebo was elminated prior to Nihria Ismail would have never said anything since hebelieved she was the winner only after that he realized he had todo something and he started to partake in the GAME!!!!!

Hence after Nihria was out he knew he had too something otherwise he was going out next after jatin-lalit. SO instead of gaji and public throwing him out he announced that he was leaving and said those words "goodbye" (though we all knew he was to return).

In my view that was the turning point in Ismail gharna!!!!!!anddebo got the not only the highest marks. I think he got the highest any participant got on the whole show and yes he probably got nihria's votes and symapthy votes and his home town voted like mad. This would havebeen a one time thing since I think that other people who like hema or vineet would have voted to keep them next time sincedebo was still teh underdog. However, somehow AS got wind that himani was out next so hedragged HR and hema into his politics and saying lookdebo got highest votes any of uscould get out next including U'r Vineet. (this is speculation on my part)

This is where the strategy of HR and AS hurt them. I think AS trying o save himani hurt hema inthe process. Since somehow ASknew prior to the show airing and envelope opening that himani was out (and AS treasured himani more than hema) .

A question that keeps puzzling me is why was it only aftrer Vineet was secured that the three walked out on stage why not afterdebo's result? ( I think this point hurt Vineet and HR) I mean people were tired of thelove stories and now this. I think Vineet wanted ot make sure he was in to point out see Iam in yet still upset on Nihira's outing. Whereas Hema wnet along and Himani knew she was out so to her the walkout would not affect her (and she thoght that gaji might ask all to stay since all three were to leave and how would the show run ? I mean they were not going to just give the trophy todebo at that point though legally should have.

However strategydid not work since Ismail said if someone is not thrown out han Nihiria shouldbeback and also that lady whobabbled on that we want India ki voice not assam ki voice and HR and AScheered her on also hurt them. people were angered. Than As wantedto throw out rregional voting which also angered people and HR going along with AS views hurt him

Ismail saying so walking out sincedebo got more marks? or using my strategy so next time U guys will get more marks? also hurt AS and HR's participants.

I think Ismails remarks went into publics hears and they were now more prodebo and a new sa re ga ma pa emerged...!!!!!!!!!!!

. So AS strategy hurt HR the most and than HR hurt himselfby going on with AS's points had he not supported AS's point of view Vineet would have not lost voters. The most hurt in all these games was HEMA( who until thant walkout seemed like a genuine guy).

If there was no walkout the results after Himani leaving The results would have notbeen the same. Though tabu kept talking about the south not watching much than howcome hema got high votesat times on the show? It was the walkout not the viewrshio that hurt him. If Hemadid not partake in that he probably would have lasted longer since I reallybelieve that he had more supporters and the last two would havebeen him and vineet or after nihria's elimination hema anddebo. We will never know now. Also Vineet got thebrunt since he acted immaturely and after knowin he was in he made his statement which hurt him until than he was also ok. Lot of Vineet and Hema supporter turned todebo so it was not all about regional voting only.

As I said we will never know!!!!!!!!

Again great anaysis soulsoup and others really great. Sorry if wrote too much though. Just wanted to add my thoughts in here as well.

I just wish Paresh had good marketing I know if I was his mentor I would have marketed him well lol.