and never the twain shall meet

my apologies for the long post in advance. I fully expect this not to be read / topic closed / ignored but had to have my say as today we argued about something v basic to human rights and human thought ..

"Monsieur l'abb, I detest what you write, but I would give my life to make it possible for you to continue to write" ("Monsieur l'abb, je dteste ce que vous crivez, mais je donnerai ma vie pour que vous puissiez continuer crire"). Attributed to Voltaire, french philosopher, writer, thinker in letter to M. le Riche (February 6, 1770)

Let me begin by saying that I recognise that the moderators have a tough job. They dont get paid to do nasty things and they seem to have to do it quite often. The owners are clear about what kind of site they want - and what kind of people they want to attract. It is also clear to me that the mods are not taking it upon themselves to take action - there are significant number of people for whom the ff is genuinely offensive. (hang on friends, I am not saying they are right to censor it... just that, strange as it may seem to many of us, its a genuine feeling of outrage for them - not a power play)

We have obviously had a very inflamed discussion and a lot of very sensible and wise people have reacted furiously to the censorship issue with some excellent points.

Overzealous of the mods perhaps but given the fact that I read up some old posts warning people about mature content in the past and that 345 people have actually liked that post, its clear to me that we have a looot of people who feel that the forum should be censored. and its not a surprise to me - for me, an IPKKND was a surprise. I never imagine I would be able to sit through an Hindi serial

I noticed the kind of comments Nayika's story got when she even hinted at a possible extra marital affair. the reactions were pretty scary - a woman being labelled of dubious character because she is portrayed as having relationships wtih some one outside of holy matrimony.

Clearly they don't have the shut down function in their computer or more importantly they like their life ordered in such a way that they don't wish to experience any thing that is outside their comfort zone. I assume that these people never trawl the net or explore places in the internet (Let's not even think about exploring the joys of experimentation in real life)

Sarcasm apart, the forum is a v diverse place but it also is a place where Indian serials are discussed. and an Indian serial or an Indian movie by it's v nature is all about being implicit, hidden, symbolic, repressed. Everything is to be understood but not stated.

IPKKND succeeded in creating the fan base it did because it operates on 2 layers. Those who can see Khushiji and Arnavji's delightful tom and jerry routine, her pom poms and her adherence to "Indian culture" and Arnav's transformation into "Indian man", the head to toe covered dresses with the back less cholis and the never ending puja sessions and those who watch it for the other layer - of two protogonists who are dueling for human values. Note Khushi's repudiation of the ritual of the wedding anniversary and her insistence on the content and the intent of a relationship - almost an antithesis to what normal Indian cultural norms are about - usually all about the ritual and less about the content. Note her standing up to a bully (dare i say this. Ouch ASR fans, I am one too) and her strength and courage before adversity. Note ASR's formidable will power, contrasting gentleness, his repressed passion for her, defying the status quo (ala Darcy ooo - sorry could not resist) - so essentially it is actually a repudiation of the status quo that attracts us, the feeling of ASR the mighty powerful controlled being, out of control...

I teach a bunch of kids of Indian origin here and I found when teaching them shloks and shrutis, that translating most of them makes no sense. They speak of value of cows and adding ghee to the fire etc. I am pretty good with metaphors and even if I used metaphors they still would not work - because guess what they were written in 2000 BC or so, and errr... some time has passed by since then, don't you think ? Yet we speak those shloks at every worship and most of us have no clue what we are saying. Some of these shloks make sense - like the wedding ones, I know that most of them at least made sense but quite a few did not...

So to come back to my point - this forum consists of a v diverse audience that largely (or at least a significant number) I would assume consists of people who are uncomfortable with overt sensuality, love "Indian culture" (how many times have I caught us speak about our culture and pan other cultures as if we are the only nation that has something unique), and translate Indian culture to mean certain things (pantheism, respect for family, knowing our place / community / caste in the world, community above individualism, modesty of a woman, the importance of preserving harmony at all costs, including self esteem and self determination). We forget that the Upanishads spoke of the immortal soul, that the caste system was not hereditary, that India is more than Aryan, vedic and Hindu, that questioning agnostism and atheism are a legitimate part of our vedic past, that it is the 21st century and greats of the religion movement have asked us to question and that even if they did not, we owe it to ourselves to question things.

I raise this, because I see this theme recurring all the time, not just on the FF, but also on other threads.

The forum consists of completely two diverse groups - not divided by where we live but how we think. In general our cultural values have not allowed us to accept that you can have explicit content anywhere but the trick is to build foundations and values that are strong enough for you to allow you to choose or not to choose to view it. the fundamental question that I would raise here is - not whether this forum is for family friendly audience or not, but that is there even a point in trying to have this dialogue. This is not an issue of censorship or mature content. It is really about an approach to life - whether you want someone else to take responsibility for what you are exposed to, or not. An audience that does not even have mature content on it's TV in 2012, and has a lifestyle where the entire family watches things together at all times, where the internet I assume is on a shared device, perhaps these realities are different?

Indian tv content is clearly changing but its going to be a long while before it will be able to have different things for different people, mainly because people still want someone else to decide for them, what is good for them or not... a fundamental difference in the way to think.

so my question to all those writers / thinkers / readers / community out there who like the 2nd layer -

Do you want to waste your time on this debate till the next reminder comes ? To use a terrible quote - the east is the east and the west is the west (nothing geographical about this) and never the twain shall meet.

or do you want to go out there and create a blog where I can read my next story? Put the links on the forum. I am sure the mods job will be done in that case.