Swara Bhaskar's insensitive remarks on Jauhar scene from Padmavat- Page 13

Why would you like to focus on Islamic countries and their glaring anti-women politics??? Everybody knows that, right?

However, to provide a brief overview:

The Organization of Islamic Cooperation (OIC) comprises 57 member states where Islam significantly shapes culture and society.

In many of these countries, legal and social structures result in the systematic discrimination of women. The global Women, Peace and Security Index (WPS) and the World Economic Forum's Global Gender Gap Report consistently rank several Muslim-majority countries among the worst places in the world for women (with Afghanistan and Iran representing the most extreme cases).

The situation for women is particularly dire in countries ravaged by civil war and political instability, where legal protections are absent and sexual violence is used as a weapon of war (e.g., Yemen, Syria, Sudan, and Somalia).

In the 2025 Global Gender Gap Index, Pakistan ranks last out of the 148 nations surveyed. The country is characterized by so-called "honor killings," forced marriages, extremely low female literacy rates, and negligible labor market participation.

Although Saudi Arabia has implemented reforms in recent years (women have been permitted to drive and travel since 2018), the patriarchal male guardianship system remains legally entrenched (women often still require a male relative's permission for major life decisions, such as marriage).

Misogyny in these countries is deeply intertwined with political interpretations of Islamic law and local patriarchal traditions. At the same time, however, there are significant differences within the Islamic world: in more secular Muslim-majority countries (such as Albania, Bosnia and Herzegovina, or parts of Indonesia), legal gender equality is much more advanced.

Does that suit you?

Originally posted by: Clochette

Why would you like to focus on Islamic countries and their glaring anti-women politics??? Everybody knows that, right?

However, to provide a brief overview:

The Organization of Islamic Cooperation (OIC) comprises 57 member states where Islam significantly shapes culture and society.

In many of these countries, legal and social structures result in the systematic discrimination of women. The global Women, Peace and Security Index (WPS) and the World Economic Forum's Global Gender Gap Report consistently rank several Muslim-majority countries among the worst places in the world for women (with Afghanistan and Iran representing the most extreme cases).

The situation for women is particularly dire in countries ravaged by civil war and political instability, where legal protections are absent and sexual violence is used as a weapon of war (e.g., Yemen, Syria, Sudan, and Somalia).

In the 2025 Global Gender Gap Index, Pakistan ranks last out of the 148 nations surveyed. The country is characterized by so-called "honor killings," forced marriages, extremely low female literacy rates, and negligible labor market participation.

Although Saudi Arabia has implemented reforms in recent years (women have been permitted to drive and travel since 2018), the patriarchal male guardianship system remains legally entrenched (women often still require a male relative's permission for major life decisions, such as marriage).

Misogyny in these countries is deeply intertwined with political interpretations of Islamic law and local patriarchal traditions. At the same time, however, there are significant differences within the Islamic world: in more secular Muslim-majority countries (such as Albania, Bosnia and Herzegovina, or parts of Indonesia), legal gender equality is much more advanced.

Does that suit you?

why are you going round and round. My reply to you was based on what you wrote. Why can't you answer my question. It was entirely based on what you wrote.

Instead of writing essays without answering my question, it is easier to answer them.

Originally posted by: NathuPaapi

... So... No! All religions are not the same, IMO.

Daily I thank God for giving me birth in a Hindu household.

Completely agree... when wanting to live in a religious belief, Hinduism is a very good place to be.

Btw, even though I do not belong to any religion, I also think that "all religions are not the same".

Originally posted by: D3VilsDex

I want to double check on this essay by you. Are you implying Quran is therefore not word of god as no god would create such laws for humanity or that allah is no God or both ?

Do you concur it has led to practices that should be number 1 priority for humanity to eliminate that you declare yourself in strong support of ?

How would I know which words of religious books are really "words of God"... Actually, it's a human's choice what it makes out of the words written in those books. God gives everybody a moral compass, but the influence on this compass starts with the birth. However, if you want a spiritual discussion, then you should make a new thread for that... here it isn't the right place, I think.

After all these long discussions if i had to sum up in one line it would be -

Practically, If I were a girl trapped in a situation that required offing myself or becoming a sex slave I'd blame that person or people causing me to be in that situation rather than blaming patriarchy or misogyny.

Originally posted by: NathuPaapi

After all these long discussions if i had to sum up in one line it would be -

Practically, If I were a girl trapped in a situation that required offing myself or becoming a sex slave I'd blame that person or people causing me to be in that situation rather than blaming patriarchy or misogyny.

That is the difference between talking/writing about a situation or living the situation... here, we talk... in different ways... and one member in an even extremely vile way relative to me as a person (a sad excess because of anonymity)...

However, neither patriarchy nor misogyny are 'abstract concepts'... they may have formed the person /people who force you to make that atrocious choice because they grew up in the respective environment...

Originally posted by: Clochette

That is the difference between talking/writing about a situation or living the situation... here, we talk... in different ways... and one member in an even extremely vile way relative to me as a person (a sad excess because of anonymity)...

However, neither patriarchy nor misogyny are 'abstract concepts'... they may have formed the person /people who force you to make that atrocious choice because they grew up in the respective environment...

So when living the situation it's actual people responsible but when talking/writing about the situation it becomes patriarchy or misogyny which is responsible.

Thankfully i don't engage in such double standards.

Even in current times if u file case it would be against a person or people not against patriarchy or misogyny.

Be practical sometimes.

Originally posted by: NathuPaapi

So when living the situation it's actual people responsible but when talking/writing about the situation it becomes patriarchy or misogyny which is responsible.

Thankfully i don't engage in such double standards.

Even in current times if u file case it would be against a person or people not against patriarchy or misogyny.

Be practical sometimes.

But Nathu, what kind of interpretation of what I wrote is t h a t???

Is there a difference between talking/writing about a situation and/or living it? Yes or no?

Did I deny that the respective people/persons who put the girl in such a situation are responsible? Yes or no?

Did the upbringing (parents, society, community) shaped the behaviour of the threatening people/person? Yes or no?

If the society/parents/community live in/with a patriarchal mindset, is then this mindset responsible for the kind of upbringing? Yes or no?

Where is there the double standard??? It's a chain of influences one can talk/write about whilst the girl has to live the outcome... that is logic, not double standard...

For double standard, please read the post of this fake Beginner who calls himself a "proud Hindu" and has nothing else to do as demeaning, insulting, accusing through blatant lies, misconstruing the written content because he/she had made an image in his/her mind that suits him/her... and even gets a like for that.

During my stays in India, I've lived for weeks with Hindus of very different way of life - from the poorest to wealthy people... none of them, absolutely none ever had such a shameful behaviour.

It has no effect whatsoever if I repeat what I stated so often... there are people who strive in twisting words, single out words, disrupt the context... I just wonder, how many of the members here put me in the same box as this utterly biased member does and feel entertained. His/her posts are so full of hate towards me that I decided to be practical by not replying... so, yes, sometimes I'm practical

Originally posted by: Clochette

But Nathu, what kind of interpretation of what I wrote is t h a t???

Is there a difference between talking/writing about a situation and/or living it? Yes or no?

From the first person perspective or third person perspective?

If from the first person perspective if he experiences fear in a situation he will write the experience as fear. But from the third person perspective that fear may appear or be written as cowardice. Like Jauhar for the ones committing Jauhar was defiance (while living it) but for some leftists writing about it, it may be cowardice or pressure of patriarchy.

Did I deny that the respective people/persons who put the girl in such a situation are responsible? Yes or no?

After a lot of to & fro you may have accepted (although i don't remember where) but i do remember your initial blame was on patriarchy rather than the Islamic barbarians.

Did the upbringing (parents, society, community) shaped the behaviour of the threatening people/person? Yes or no?

All of that plus most importantly the religious sanction of loot, plunder and sex slavery (keeping whom the right hands possess)

If the society/parents/community live in/with a patriarchal mindset, is then this mindset responsible for the kind of upbringing? Yes or no?

It may be one factor but other factors like religious beliefs, morals, education, spiritual development, distinction between right/wrong, financial & social status and many other factors effect upbringing not just the patriarchal mindset.

Where is there the double standard??? It's a chain of influences one can talk/write about whilst the girl has to live the outcome... that is logic, not double standard...

Double standard is when u use 7th century standards for judging mohammed's misogyny but use 21st century standards for judging cause of Jauhar.

For double standard, please read the post of this fake Beginner who calls himself a "proud Hindu" and has nothing else to do as demeaning, insulting, accusing through blatant lies, misconstruing the written content because he/she had made an image in his/her mind that suits him/her... and even gets a like for that.

I have no control over his/ her thoughts or opinions or the way that person replies to you. I'm sorry but you have to deal with them yourself in whichever way you feel apt.

Why do you get so affected by that person's posts?

Now don't think I'm blaming the victim like some people blame those husbands of patriarchy, who lost their lives as well as lives of their wives & families in Jauhar.

During my stays in India, I've lived for weeks with Hindus of very different way of life - from the poorest to wealthy people... none of them, absolutely none ever had such a shameful behaviour.

Again. Why are you getting so affected?

It has no effect whatsoever if I repeat what I stated so often... there are people who strive in twisting words, single out words, disrupt the context... I just wonder, how many of the members here put me in the same box as this utterly biased member does and feel entertained. His/her posts are so full of hate towards me that I decided to be practical by not replying... so, yes, sometimes I'm practical

Good. You should try being practical more. Always living in the mind is not good... Real world is much different and you need to be practical to survive the real world.

My replies in red

Originally posted by: Clochette

How would I know which words of religious books are really "words of God"... Actually, it's a human's choice what it makes out of the words written in those books. God gives everybody a moral compass, but the influence on this compass starts with the birth. However, if you want a spiritual discussion, then you should make a new thread for that... here it isn't the right place, I think.

You still have not answered my simple questions.

Why are you asking me to go to another thread when you are the one writing so many essays here ? Ranbhoomi appears more and more to be spot on here.