Resurgence | Arshi FF | Thread 2 | thread 3 link posted on page 150 - Page 88

Originally posted by: You-Know-Who

But he is not the partner in deed, is he? I mean I know you do not agree with that analysis. But that's what my stand is.

But just for the sake of argument, let us assume that since Arnav does not know he was violated, he thinks he is an equal partner in the mistake at the moment he made the choice to not be involved in the child's life. I still think that if he knows he is incapable of being a good father (the idea of a child not only terrifies him, but makes him rage), it is better he is not in its life. I would rather that child grow up with the idea that they were brought to the world by a nameless entity! I know a single parent (in India), and trust me her child is much much happier without a deadbeat/absent father in her life.

Also, since you agree that Lavanya and Arnav are equally responsible for the mistake, don't you think it is Lavanya's responsibility to think how her child's life would be if she brought it into the world? Especially after knowing how much the child's supposed father wants to be involved? I think what Arnav chose was the best he could possibly do knowing the facts he does. He did not abandon the kid. He was upfront about his intentions to the mother. He was ready to provide monetary support. I do not believe he was capable of anything more, anyway. At least he was aware of that.

Right 😊

Bringing a child should be equal choice from partners. Just because one person in relation want a kid and by hook ya crook bring it into to world then we can learn to love them is the general view. Believe me a full generation of trauma r hidden in there. Especially in India where arrange marriage and family, relative, parents and even neighbors poke their nose in someone's marriage. After marriage the most common question "any good news? After a child" when is the next in line? “ if childless after 1 year of marriage“ something wrong with wife or husband, if childless after 5 years they r tagged as infertile couple. That's how regressive is the society. If Lavanya can have choice of keeping the child, then Arnav too have the choice of being absent figure with financial support. If there is no divorce in picture how these things r fair to the pov of Wife?. I heard a news of woman who stole used condom of a millionaire from hotel room bin. Collect the sperm from the fluid and went to clinic got pregnant with his baby for fortune. How is that fare to the innocent man in question?

I am willing to bet our ages have something to do with our differences of opinion on what Arnav owes his unborn child. We know there is not really one but he didn’t know that for quite awhile.

I am pretty liberal and pro choice. But I don’t think your personal happiness always trumps (now I am hating that word) the happiness of others. In the US the younger generations seem to appreciate diversity and are empathetic to peoples choices because for them personal happiness is the aim. I love that quality of acceptance. But it also can absolve one of responsibility. Sometimes, unfairly, your life is altered and your personal happiness has to take a backseat because of an unwise choice you made. Now we know Arnav is a responsible man but I can not absolve him of the responsibility of caring for all facets of a child. He made a terrible mistake whether he was raped or not. I concede he was taken advantage of. The child bears no fault for the mistakes , misjudgments of the parents and should be given all the opportunities for a good life.

By the way I knew this would create a storm of backlash against me when I waded in on this discussion. But people are respectful so I did it anyway.

Originally posted by: BollyBabe75

You Know, of course I don’t expect him to be elated about a baby even if it’s his own, especially with the guilt he is carrying that is at the heart of the demise of his marriage. But to want no contact and take no interest in an innocent child that he fathered is heartless.

Even in the circles that Lavenya runs the child will have a hard time. It’s India. I am sure things are changing but not that rapidly. And the mother is a public figure so the child will be exposed to scrutiny all his growing up years. For the child to know the father abandoned him is just heartbreaking to me. And the irony is that Khushi ran a NGO for abandoned women and kids. I’m not saying marry Lavenya for God’s sake but he owes that innocent child emotional support. He screwed up big time and now in my estimation he needs to do the right thing and provide some emotional support to that innocent. Even in the US it’s not easy and it’s not that rare.

Somehow, I think this decision would make Arnav fall further in Khushi’s eyes. She will be heartbroken if he tells her the complete truth about the non existent pregnancy anyway. The thought that he could have fathered a child by another will gut her.

I wanted to respond..but stepped away for dinner. I agree with all the arguments made by You-know.

If a woman decides she wants to keep a child after a ONS. She can but to force the man to be part of it..because what society will think of the illegitimate child (this is exactly the argument given by Manali..that made him cave in to divorce) is let me have the cake and eat it too. You cannot have both ways.

Even in India..there are celebrities who are single parent...BTW. One cannot force emotional bonding

True, you can’t force emotional bonding but if he can show empathy for Lavenya, he could show some empathy for a child. Like I said, he doesn’t need to be a soccer dad but some involvement is warranted.

I’m sorry but his messed up decisions got him where he is now. And for me at this point he is still making messed up decisions. I wonder if his parents would accept his child as they have no grandchildren , at least in the picture? How would they feel knowing he has a child and he and probably by extension them would have no contact with his child? And as much as Khushi would be severely heartbroken I could see her loving and providing emotional support for the child. I think knowing he could be what I call cold and heartless would further weaken him in her eyes.

Originally posted by: BollyBabe75

I am willing to bet our ages have something to do with our differences of opinion on what Arnav owes his unborn child. We know there is not really one but he didn’t know that for quite awhile.

I am pretty liberal and pro choice. But I don’t think your personal happiness always trumps (now I am hating that word) the happiness of others. In the US the younger generations seem to appreciate diversity and are empathetic to peoples choices because for them personal happiness is the aim. I love that quality of acceptance. But it also can absolve one of responsibility. Sometimes, unfairly, your life is altered and your personal happiness has to take a backseat because of an unwise choice you made. Now we know Arnav is a responsible man but I can not absolve him of the responsibility of caring for all facets of a child. He made a terrible mistake whether he was raped or not. I concede he was taken advantage of. The child bears no fault for the mistakes , misjudgments of the parents and should be given all the opportunities for a good life.

By the way I knew this would create a storm of backlash against me when I waded in on this discussion. But people are respectful so I did it anyway.

On that grounds Khushi deserves to be a mother..it is her happiness right. So you would have been OK to her never be on a pill...and bring a child into this world !

To me you don't want a unwanted child into this world.

Originally posted by: BollyBabe75

I am willing to bet our ages have something to do with our differences of opinion on what Arnav owes his unborn child. We know there is not really one but he didn’t know that for quite awhile.

I am pretty liberal and pro choice. But I don’t think your personal happiness always trumps (now I am hating that word) the happiness of others. In the US the younger generations seem to appreciate diversity and are empathetic to peoples choices because for them personal happiness is the aim. I love that quality of acceptance. But it also can absolve one of responsibility. Sometimes, unfairly, your life is altered and your personal happiness has to take a backseat because of an unwise choice you made. Now we know Arnav is a responsible man but I can not absolve him of the responsibility of caring for all facets of a child. He made a terrible mistake whether he was raped or not. I concede he was taken advantage of. The child bears no fault for the mistakes , misjudgments of the parents and should be given all the opportunities for a good life.

By the way I knew this would create a storm of backlash against me when I waded in on this discussion. But people are respect so I did it anyway.

I agree with the bold line and I am saying this again, arnav agrees with you too.

Arnav said to Lavanya thank god she doesn’t run in a society where being a single mother is a taboo. He went to the extent of putting her worst fears to end that this child will not be the worst kind of b*stard because he is getting divorced. He did not need to tell her that. I have said in my previous comment. If Arnav was single and Lavanya was a gaon ki chori, he probably would have married her.

In the prologue call when Lavanya says he won’t have to bear the scrutiny he rages. He is aware of the double standards. He knows he could get away with a lot and yet he was an upstanding man for a near stranger (Lavanya).

But emotional connect is not a switch that he can just turn on right? He is not somebody who is doubtful of it. He is somebody who is 200% sure he never wants kids because he will not have an emotional attachment with it. I write earlier. He can hire an army of servants to take care of his kid with Khushi but chooses not to do because he would not be a good father and he knows that. In Khushi’s cas ether were fighting/arguing. In Lavanya’s case he is also not being given the choice.

He was surprised despite this Lavanya chose to keep the baby. In that case, she bears more responsibility of meeting this child’s emotional need. I am sorry if I sound like anti woman right now but Arnav was ready to fulfil every single responsibility except the one which he KNOWS he is incapable of.

And he feared the same thing. Lavanya was doing exactly what you’re saying. She did believe that he will eventually give in. Even said in future you will want to have a contact with your child (that I want to keep despite you telling me you will not be around emotionally) This is wishful thinking and pressuring a man into something that he has a very clear stance on. This was her using a baby to emotionally blackmail him. Plain and simple. And he was the only honourable party to tell her of his stand beforehand so she could make a decision. And he was going to be a support system to her in either of the choice she would’ve made.

Edit - all POVs are respected here bollybabe. I hope you’re understanding where we are coming from also :)

Originally posted by: BollyBabe75

True, you can’t force emotional bonding but if he can show empathy for Lavenya, he could show some empathy for a child. Like I said, he doesn’t need to be a soccer dad but some involvement is warranted.

He is honest and said he will provide financial support. But her response was that is not enough. She wants him. That is BS!

I think your logic is clouded..because a child is involved. By that logic there never should be a abortion. La wants the child..so take on the responsibility. You cannot cherry pick to be traditional sometimes and modern other times

Originally posted by: BollyBabe75

I am willing to bet our ages have something to do with our differences of opinion on what Arnav owes his unborn child. We know there is not really one but he didn’t know that for quite awhile.

I am pretty liberal and pro choice. But I don’t think your personal happiness always trumps (now I am hating that word) the happiness of others. In the US the younger generations seem to appreciate diversity and are empathetic to peoples choices because for them personal happiness is the aim. I love that quality of acceptance. But it also can absolve one of responsibility. Sometimes, unfairly, your life is altered and your personal happiness has to take a backseat because of an unwise choice you made. Now we know Arnav is a responsible man but I can not absolve him of the responsibility of caring for all facets of a child. He made a terrible mistake whether he was raped or not. I concede he was taken advantage of. The child bears no fault for the mistakes , misjudgments of the parents and should be given all the opportunities for a good life.

By the way I knew this would create a storm of backlash against me when I waded in on this discussion. But people are respectful so I did it anyway.

No do not worry about backlash, and we respect your point of view. This is not a backlash, but healthy debate. One which is the very ground on which society thrives :)

On that note, a question: How would the kid's life be if the dad forces himself to be there for the kid, (has panic attacks in the bedroom when the kid asks if the dad loves him), and the kid eventually figures out that the dad did not want to be there? Is it fair on the kid then? I believe an absent/unknown father, is better than this betrayal but thats my take.

I think some form of the assumption that Arnav is not taking "enough responsibility" comes from the idea that his inability to emotionally connect with the kid is a "solvable problem". That he is just not trying hard enough. That he is not willing to sacrifice. But I do not believe it is that simple. This is an out an out mental health issue! The decisions he makes while suffering from this issue should be treated with the same sympathy as if he was suffering from a physical health issue. Say for example, Arnav has a rare genetic disorder that guarantees the child would not have a good life!

Originally posted by: You-Know-Who

I think some form of the assumption that Arnav is not taking "enough responsibility" comes from the idea that his inability to emotionally connect with the kid is a "solvable problem". That he is just not trying hard enough. That he is not willing to sacrifice. But I do not believe it is that simple. This is an out an out mental health issue! The decisions he makes while suffering from this issue should be treated with the same sympathy as if he was suffering from a physical health issue. Say for example, Arnav has a rare genetic disorder that guarantees the child would not have a good life!

Even if we keep aside whatever is the reason that he does not want kids

(It will rightfully open the can of worms that he should have shared with Khushi...she is his wife. My neighbour a lesbian couple broke up because one wanted kids others did not. )

Some folks don't want kids . And yes you are right..that is not a solvable problem. Personal choice or something else.

Plus I cannot fathom how does one force bonding because it is your flesh and blood