Draupadi: Responsible For The War, Really? - Page 6

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Sabhayata thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#51

Originally posted by: amritat


In fact the Pandavas refused to kill millions for the sake of their wife's dignity but ironically found land n throne to be a more plausible reason for the same.

Its quite unfortunate for Draupadi that her humiliation did not motivate her husbands enough to wage war, but 'land' did it.



actually fighting for land was very normal in those days

we are viewing this war from kal yug so fighting for land seems wrong but it wasn't wrong in dwapar yug

land represented their inheritance and their irght for which pandavs had to fight

and this wasn't the first time pandavaas or kauravs had fought a war for land

During Rajsuya yajna pandavs had fought many wars to subjugate the kings

The later karna under dury's name had fought many war to subjugate kings

The thing i am trying to say is that panadvas did fight for land yes but dont think it was wrong in any way since it was dwapar yug what i do hate is when the reason is unnecessary glorified
Sabhayata thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#52

Originally posted by: -TomNJerry-

@amritat... hey
by motivation i am talking about ... esp the years during the exile .. there was pain and fire in her eyes, taunts in her words, her open hair never let her and others forget the horrendous day of the dyut sabha!

for me she was a woman substance, a fighter ... who kept motivating the pandavas to fight for justice ... and not settle for anything less!


and who doesn't want peace! ... i think we all strive for it deep down in our hearts! ... like poets love to say peace is the smile of the hearts!


regarding the motivation i would say that once pandavas decided to wage the war then yes she was their motivation or let me say then they did want to give her justice

there are instances in the epic when Bhima used to fight more fiercely after remembering panchali's insults

He even killed dusashan in a horrible manner to punish him

Even Arjuna wanted to punish Karna for what he said to Drauapdi

so i would say she was never their motivation for the war but once the war was happening in any case then yes pandavas did avenge her

Bhima tore dushy's hands solely to avenge panchali
amritat thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#53

Originally posted by: Sabhayata


actually fighting for land was very normal in those days

we are viewing this war from kal yug so fighting for land seems wrong but it wasn't wrong in dwapar yug

land represented their inheritance and their irght for which pandavs had to fight

and this wasn't the first time pandavaas or kauravs had fought a war for land

During Rajsuya yajna pandavs had fought many wars to subjugate the kings

The later karna under dury's name had fought many war to subjugate kings

The thing i am trying to say is that panadvas did fight for land yes but dont think it was wrong in any way since it was dwapar yug what i do hate is when the reason is unnecessary glorified

Sabhayata, I was wondering about this yesterday.
U see, if we see the whole things from the point of view of the Pandavas, then they were not exactly wrong. They refused to kill millions for the sake of one woman, which I feel is quite logical.
They also wanted their land back, which they thought were rightfully their's.
Even they followed the standard procedure, by sending a peace proposal. They genuinely wanted to avoid war, and go for peace. So, even that is not wrong.
Once the war started, they did remember their wife's insult n punish her tormentors.
So, they were not wrong there either.
However, this question on their morality rises, bcoz of the involvement of Draupadi's insult.
Granted in those days, people fought for land...but wat happened to Draupadi was extreme.
So, the fact that Yudisthir was ready to even "forgive and forget", in return for land, makes their nobility somewat questionable.
If Draupadi had not been involved in any way, then the war had been only for land, and throne, just like most wars in the history of mankind.
It is the involvement of Draupadi n her humiliation, that makes us question the intentions of the Pandavas for waging war.
amritat thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#54

Originally posted by: Sabhayata

Yudhishtir himslef admits in vana parva that he will only fight if his kingdom isnt returned to him rest everything is forgiven

! Give not way to thy wrath! Our grandsire, the son of Santanu, will worship peace; Krishna, the son of Devaki, will worship peace; the preceptor (Drona) and Vidura called Kshatri will both speak of peace; Kripa and Sanjaya also will preach peace. And Somadatta and Yuyutshu and Drona's son and our grandsire Vyasa, every one of them speaketh always of peace. Ever urged by these towards peace, the king (Dhritarashtra) will, I think, return us our kingdom. If however, he yieldeth to temptation, he will meet with destruction. O lady, a crisis hath come in the history of Bharatas for plunging them into calamity! This hath been my certain conclusion from some time before! Suyodhana deserveth not the kingdom. Therefore hath he been unable to acquire forgiveness. I, however, deserve the sovereignty and therefore is it that forgiveness hath taken possession of me. Forgiveness and gentleness are the qualities of the self-possessed. They represent eternal virtue. I shall, therefore, truly adopt those qualities

Here the ever truthful Yudhsishtir who never lies himself is saying that if Dhritrashhtra doesn't return back the kingdom then only will war take place

Yudhishtir himself is admitting the reason for the war so why should there be interpretation of any other reason

I guess, this other reason for war, comes up with lack of knowledge.
Draupadi's urge for revenge had nothing to do with the declaration of war.
Some people were punished bcoz of their participation in Draupadi's Vastraharan.
But the rest was simply political.
alovi_21 thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#55
I never post anything in forums just read some post ,first time posting, but unable to stop myself on this topic.what I felt here,
If anybody fav char getting hurt or something they blame other without thinking good n bad n logic, also ppl ready to forget what char is considered good , they even can blame God. So I never read such post, if they will keep themself in drau position just once or for some sec they Can feel her condition, they would have given curse to all, if they would have such power like she was having ,after VH, sati ke sharp se usi time , ppl would have burnt alive, but she stopped due to gandhari, as that time respect, dharm effect good ppl. How can being a women ppl can even justify VH with dury n Karan insult, I m too much.

Regarding VH it was like Ghada Bhar chuka tha to chalak gaya from Pandav side it was unbearable pain n insult for them n their wife that is also in front of their love once, I mean water was overflowing. I mean since childhood Pandav has tolerated, bad behave, insult, kheer main vish, lakhshgrah, I mean think if somebody will try to burn you alive with your bros n mother what u will feel, all these thing they have tolerated, even left thier home ,ash aram sabkuch just for peace n Mother order , van-van bhatke before getting marriad with her, even after VH, they were capable to take revenge, still they went for vanwas for 13 yr u can say, der der bhatke n still ready to take 5 Goan just for piece to avoid war, what more ppl we're expecting from them. Are these ppl wanted, pandav should have gone vanwas again n again , forget everything n should have left dury n dushy type person to do VH of another women. Dury got lusty on gandharv kanya too. Don't forget , they were not in piece even in van too, dury was trying to harm them there too, drau haran in forest. She got insulted again n again still she don't have right for justice after being capable of it.
I will say with multiple reason she became last n one more reason. Jisne Pandavon ke sabra ka baandh tod diya still they tried to avoid war but dury rejection n driti moan on Shanti proposal was the reason.

Ppl are forgetting main reason , this mahayudh was for dharm ki sthapna for which God came on earth that is why he was with Pandav n he want to punish all evils who were opposite side to dharm even they were good ppl got punish like bhishm n drone n somewhere like Karan, no body is ready Understand basic cause of it. God tried to make ppl understand what is real dharm to bhishm Karan n drona even drist ,but no body was ready to understood but when God tried to make understand Pandav, they followed him blindly as they gave importance to samaj kalyaan n understood that is basic first darm for everyone ,above their personal dharm , like Arjun did without asking question. But now a days ppl laugh on samaj Kalyan topic how they will understand such thing but that time that was consider first good thing.
Edited by alovi_21 - 11 years ago
luv_sakshi thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#56
Thank You Sangeeta for this Wonderfully Written Post!👏👏👏

This topic has been one of the most commonly debated and talked about, whenever one picks up the subject of Mahabharata. I guess anyone writing on this topic will be prepared for some kind of onslaught or even total disagreement of the argument put in favour of the topic. However, I firmly believe in what I'm putting forth here. No offence meant to anyone..😳

Draupadi was unique right from her birth. She was not conceived in a mother's womb. She was born from fire and it is said that she was born young not infant. Just imagine all the genetic qualities that she might have inherited! Imagine how she would have developed any filial feelings towards her parents. Yet she was very respectful, caring towards her father.

She was the darling princess of one of most prominent and powerful kingdoms of that time. She was the daughter of a mighty king whose life's mission was only to defeat Guru Drona. She was also the sister of a man who was, like her, born out of fire. She was sister to Shikhandini as well, who once was a girl and later changed her gender to a boy. Draupadi had such a complex childhood unlike any other princess..

Draupadi then became the wife of Pandavas. She got divided between 5 husbands, which was very unconventional for any time-period. As she entered her in-laws' house, she came to know of her husbands being under constant threat. Finally, when she became the queen, she was given a piece of land that was almost barren! Panchali bore a son to every husband and became mother to 5 sons. However, in her duty towards her husbands, and bearing the dictates of her destiny, she got away from all of them and lived in exile for 12 years. And yet in the end, all of her sons were killed mercilessly by Ashwatthama. She never really enjoyed the beauty of motherhood completely.

She was a dear friend of Lord Krishna. In fact, her name was also Krishnaa. She earned the grace of the Lord with her devotion and steadfastness to righteousness. Yet, Draupadi is the one who is accused most, for bringing about the war..

We all know that she refused to marry Karna during the Swayamvara. Let's acknowledge that she spoke harsh words, in respect of Karna's Lower Birth. But were they wrong? Till then, nobody (in public sense) knew who Karna really was. So, actually, she had blurted out nothing but the truth..very frankly at that! Even if those words were hurting, were they enough to cause a war in which all warriors of a country would fight to death? Are all men fools that they would fight over mere words of a woman? Does Karna's insult call for death of everybody..the Kuru Vansh at large? Isn't that totally illogical an idea?

Later, Draupadi was accused of calling Duryodhna, son of the blind. This was a fact, yet it hurt. Duryodhna was vengeful. But does this call for war again?? If yes, who would participate? All great warriors and kings of the country? Why would they do so for personal insult of some king? There definitely needs to be a bigger reason for war as Magnanimous as the Kurukshetra!!.

There is nothing more humiliating for a woman than losing her modesty. Draupadi was humiliated..worse, disrobed in an open court where ladies simply did not go. Duryodhna had his day and left no stone unturned to insult Draupadi in whatever way possible. Similarly, Karna did not desist from calling her a wh**e and prompting Duryodhna to denude her. Dusshasana did not take a minute after Duryodhna's command, to disrobe her in public & none of the Elders present therein intervened to stop the insulting act! Wasn't that act Gory in Nature? Was it acceptable to Society?

Indian psyche is highly male-dominant and they quickly come to a point where they can declare a female, the kingpin of everything evil. In India, the still existant male-dominant society wants to accuse women (the so called weaker sex) as they are easy targets. That's exactly what happened with Draupadi as well!

What then was the actual cause of the Mahabharata? Why did everyone have to die in order to restore Dharma?

Krishna had gone to Hastinapur as an emissary of peace way before the war was decided upon. He had told the entire court that Pandavas will not reject whatever Krishna promises here. He asked for just 5 villages to be given to them. There was no demand of war or reinstatement of Draupadi's honor. So Draupadi has nothing to do with the war!! The offer was rejected outright. Duryodhna was eager to have war & didn't want to part with even 5 villages, leave alone a part of his kingdom as promised. He was amply supported by Karna, & never stopped or questioned by his father. But the Pandavas had submitted their will, to the will of Krishna..so nobody had sought for war from the end of the Pandavas..

In the capital of Kingdom Virata named Upaplavaya, where the allies of Pandavas sat and discussed all the possibilities, Krishna had rejected all claims of war. He declared that for personal revenges, one can't ask every other person to die.

The reason for war was the greed of Duryodhna...The unmindful support of Karna...The blind act played by Dhritrashtra in support of his son, irrespective of whether it was Dharma or Adharma. The reason for the Kurukshetra war was the poisonous role of Shakuni..the Incapability of Stalwarts like Bhishma & Drona to stop Duryodhna's Adharmi actions right from the start. They were probably too bound by Promises & Indecisiveness. Draupadi's words only bore insult, (which again was situational), & definitely not war!!

I strongly feel that Draupadi didn't have any role to play in this Big & Destructive war. Her Humiliation was reminisced by the Pandavas during the war as that was a part of the Adharma that was done by the Kauravas.

Very sad that people term Draupadi as the main cause of the war, which is totally illogical and without any consideration of the bigger picture on what had actually happened, which eventually led to the war!
bheegi thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#57

Originally posted by: Sabhayata


actually fighting for land was very normal in those days

we are viewing this war from kal yug so fighting for land seems wrong but it wasn't wrong in dwapar yug

land represented their inheritance and their irght for which pandavs had to fight

and this wasn't the first time pandavaas or kauravs had fought a war for land

During Rajsuya yajna pandavs had fought many wars to subjugate the kings

The later karna under dury's name had fought many war to subjugate kings

The thing i am trying to say is that panadvas did fight for land yes but dont think it was wrong in any way since it was dwapar yug what i do hate is when the reason is unnecessary glorified


Thanks for the citation from KMG Sabhyata...it's so clear that the kingdom was the main motivating factor for Yudi at that point

Even in this day age, brothers fight over property, so it's not only a dvapar yug issue. It's just that these are not kingdoms, just houses and ancestral land but nothing has changed, has it?
bheegi thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#58

Originally posted by: alovi_21

I never post anything in forums just read some post ,first time posting, but unable to stop myself on this topic.what I felt here,

If anybody fav char getting hurt or something they blame other without thinking good n bad n logic, also ppl ready to forget what char is considered good , they even can blame God. So I never read such post, if they will keep themself in drau position just once or for some sec they Can feel her condition, they would have given curse to all, if they would have such power like she was having ,after VH, sati ke sharp se usi time , ppl would have burnt alive, but she stopped due to gandhari, as that time respect, dharm effect good ppl. How can being a women ppl can even justify VH with dury n Karan insult, I m too much.

Regarding VH it was like Ghada Bhar chuka tha to chalak gaya from Pandav side it was unbearable pain n insult for them n their wife that is also in front of their love once, I mean water was overflowing. I mean since childhood Pandav has tolerated, bad behave, insult, kheer main vish, lakhshgrah, I mean think if somebody will try to burn you alive with your bros n mother what u will feel, all these thing they have tolerated, even left thier home ,ash aram sabkuch just for peace n Mother order , van-van bhatke before getting marriad with her, even after VH, they were capable to take revenge, still they went for vanwas for 13 yr u can say, der der bhatke n still ready to take 5 Goan just for piece to avoid war, what more ppl we're expecting from them. Are these ppl wanted, pandav should have gone vanwas again n again , forget everything n should have left dury n dushy type person to do VH of another women. Dury got lusty on gandharv kanya too. Don't forget , they were not in piece even in van too, dury was trying to harm them there too, drau haran in forest. She got insulted again n again still she don't have right for justice after being capable of it.
I will say with multiple reason she became last n one more reason. Jisne Pandavon ke sabra ka baandh tod diya still they tried to avoid war but dury rejection n driti moan on Shanti proposal was the reason.

Ppl are forgetting main reason , this mahayudh was for dharm ki sthapna for which God came on earth that is why he was with Pandav n he want to punish all evils who were opposite side to dharm even they were good ppl got punish like bhishm n drone n somewhere like Karan, no body is ready Understand basic cause of it. God tried to make ppl understand what is real dharm to bhishm Karan n drona even drist ,but no body was ready to understood but when God tried to make understand Pandav, they followed him blindly as they gave importance to samaj kalyaan n understood that is basic first darm for everyone ,above their personal dharm , like Arjun did without asking question. But now a days ppl laugh on samaj Kalyan topic how they will understand such thing but that time that was consider first good thing.


Thanks Alovi. I'm glad you've made a post on the forum😊

You know, another thing that strikes me, if they really thought Draupadi's insult was their primary reason to wage the war, they would've done it right away. The fact they waited 13 years despite so many protests by Draupadi, her near rape and molestation twice in that period, shows that she was not a priority in their decision making regarding the war.
bheegi thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#59

Thanks Raksha😊
bheegi thumbnail
19th Anniversary Thumbnail Stunner Thumbnail + 5
Posted: 11 years ago
#60

Originally posted by: luv_sakshi

Thank You Sangeeta for this Wonderfully Written Post!👏👏👏

This topic has been one of the most commonly debated and talked about, whenever one picks up the subject of Mahabharata. I guess anyone writing on this topic will be prepared for some kind of onslaught or even total disagreement of the argument put in favour of the topic. However, I firmly believe in what I'm putting forth here. No offence meant to anyone..😳

Draupadi was unique right from her birth. She was not conceived in a mother's womb. She was born from fire and it is said that she was born young not infant. Just imagine all the genetic qualities that she might have inherited! Imagine how she would have developed any filial feelings towards her parents. Yet she was very respectful, caring towards her father.

She was the darling princess of one of most prominent and powerful kingdoms of that time. She was the daughter of a mighty king whose life's mission was only to defeat Guru Drona. She was also the sister of a man who was, like her, born out of fire. She was sister to Shikhandini as well, who once was a girl and later changed her gender to a boy. Draupadi had such a complex childhood unlike any other princess..

Draupadi then became the wife of Pandavas. She got divided between 5 husbands, which was very unconventional for any time-period. As she entered her in-laws' house, she came to know of her husbands being under constant threat. Finally, when she became the queen, she was given a piece of land that was almost barren! Panchali bore a son to every husband and became mother to 5 sons. However, in her duty towards her husbands, and bearing the dictates of her destiny, she got away from all of them and lived in exile for 12 years. And yet in the end, all of her sons were killed mercilessly by Ashwatthama. She never really enjoyed the beauty of motherhood completely.

She was a dear friend of Lord Krishna. In fact, her name was also Krishnaa. She earned the grace of the Lord with her devotion and steadfastness to righteousness. Yet, Draupadi is the one who is accused most, for bringing about the war..

We all know that she refused to marry Karna during the Swayamvara. Let's acknowledge that she spoke harsh words, in respect of Karna's Lower Birth. But were they wrong? Till then, nobody (in public sense) knew who Karna really was. So, actually, she had blurted out nothing but the truth..very frankly at that! Even if those words were hurting, were they enough to cause a war in which all warriors of a country would fight to death? Are all men fools that they would fight over mere words of a woman? Does Karna's insult call for death of everybody..the Kuru Vansh at large? Isn't that totally illogical an idea?

Later, Draupadi was accused of calling Duryodhna, son of the blind. This was a fact, yet it hurt. Duryodhna was vengeful. But does this call for war again?? If yes, who would participate? All great warriors and kings of the country? Why would they do so for personal insult of some king? There definitely needs to be a bigger reason for war as Magnanimous as the Kurukshetra!!.

There is nothing more humiliating for a woman than losing her modesty. Draupadi was humiliated..worse, disrobed in an open court where ladies simply did not go. Duryodhna had his day and left no stone unturned to insult Draupadi in whatever way possible. Similarly, Karna did not desist from calling her a wh**e and prompting Duryodhna to denude her. Dusshasana did not take a minute after Duryodhna's command, to disrobe her in public & none of the Elders present therein intervened to stop the insulting act! Wasn't that act Gory in Nature? Was it acceptable to Society?

Indian psyche is highly male-dominant and they quickly come to a point where they can declare a female, the kingpin of everything evil. In India, the still existant male-dominant society wants to accuse women (the so called weaker sex) as they are easy targets. That's exactly what happened with Draupadi as well!

What then was the actual cause of the Mahabharata? Why did everyone have to die in order to restore Dharma?

Krishna had gone to Hastinapur as an emissary of peace way before the war was decided upon. He had told the entire court that Pandavas will not reject whatever Krishna promises here. He asked for just 5 villages to be given to them. There was no demand of war or reinstatement of Draupadi's honor. So Draupadi has nothing to do with the war!! The offer was rejected outright. Duryodhna was eager to have war & didn't want to part with even 5 villages, leave alone a part of his kingdom as promised. He was amply supported by Karna, & never stopped or questioned by his father. But the Pandavas had submitted their will, to the will of Krishna..so nobody had sought for war from the end of the Pandavas..

In the capital of Kingdom Virata named Upaplavaya, where the allies of Pandavas sat and discussed all the possibilities, Krishna had rejected all claims of war. He declared that for personal revenges, one can't ask every other person to die.

The reason for war was the greed of Duryodhna...The unmindful support of Karna...The blind act played by Dhritrashtra in support of his son, irrespective of whether it was Dharma or Adharma. The reason for the Kurukshetra war was the poisonous role of Shakuni..the Incapability of Stalwarts like Bhishma & Drona to stop Duryodhna's Adharmi actions right from the start. They were probably too bound by Promises & Indecisiveness. Draupadi's words only bore insult, (which again was situational), & definitely not war!!

I strongly feel that Draupadi didn't have any role to play in this Big & Destructive war. Her Humiliation was reminisced by the Pandavas during the war as that was a part of the Adharma that was done by the Kauravas.

Very sad that people term Draupadi as the main cause of the war, which is totally illogical and without any consideration of the bigger picture on what had actually happened, which eventually led to the war!


Thanks Sakshi. Very well summarized. There were so many people, like Krishna has reminded us through his freeze gyan in SP, who contributed to the vidhwans in Kurukshetra. Draupadi was the offering in this sacrificial fire- kinda like ghee in the fire but she didn't light the fire. It was lit generations ago by Shantanu and his lust and then it was just a downhill slope.

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